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Ukraine crisis: T-72 tank shoots hole in Russian denial

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posted on Sep, 1 2014 @ 11:11 AM
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originally posted by: Whereismypassword
a reply to: tsurfer2000h

Yes America has sent Ukraine body armour,gear,communication set ups,medical stuff for the troops,night vision goggles and even army rations!

Officially no weapons but looking at the American embassy site I listed shows the goods they have sent and of course more will be sent

Let's also not forget the spooks we have over there


YOU said that the US had Given them stuff and started this whole conflict. BUT that stuff you mention above MOST CAME AFTER THE CONFLICT(except the cia advisors but they are in all countries)




posted on Sep, 1 2014 @ 11:16 AM
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originally posted by: yuppa

originally posted by: Whereismypassword
a reply to: tsurfer2000h

Yes America has sent Ukraine body armour,gear,communication set ups,medical stuff for the troops,night vision goggles and even army rations!

Officially no weapons but looking at the American embassy site I listed shows the goods they have sent and of course more will be sent

Let's also not forget the spooks we have over there


YOU said that the US had Given them stuff and started this whole conflict. BUT that stuff you mention above MOST CAME AFTER THE CONFLICT(except the cia advisors but they are in all countries)


Yeah he seems a little confused by chronology id say. Also notice the difference US sent things to keep people alive you know food clothes body armor while Russia sends rockets and tanks hmmmmmmmm.



posted on Sep, 1 2014 @ 12:10 PM
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a reply to: OccamsRazor04

Correct. The bottom photo is of the T-64BM "Bulat" tank. A serious upgrade to the T-64 MBT.



posted on Sep, 1 2014 @ 12:46 PM
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a reply to: _Del_

It says right at the link that they have many variants of that tank with kontakt-1 armour. So who is judging kontact-1 vs them having kontakt5? Ukraine was phasing these out for T80's apparently?

I don't know much about tanks, i'm more interested in propaganda and misinfo which I am not saying for sure this is.

Also, I honestly wouldn't be incredibly concerned with Russia arming these separatists. Not like what we've done in the mideast. I think in the end it will all be reabsorbed right back into Ukrainian and Russian arsenals. I'm not completely sold on the new Ukrainian government being completely organic. Stories of Nazis and burning buildings?



posted on Sep, 1 2014 @ 01:17 PM
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a reply to: Whereismypassword




Yes America has sent Ukraine body armour,gear,communication set ups,medical stuff for the troops,night vision goggles and even army rations!


That is what you would call aid as in humanitarian. Well at least that is what Russia would call it.


When most people talk military hardware they are discussing large weapons, tanks, planes you know things of that nature, but I guess technically they could be considered military hardware, but it is unlikely.



posted on Sep, 1 2014 @ 01:20 PM
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a reply to: dragonridr




Russia sends rockets and tanks hmmmmmmmm.


Humanitarian aid sure does have a different meaning in Russia that it does in pretty much everywhere else in the world.



posted on Sep, 1 2014 @ 01:27 PM
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Having a good communication chain is vital for any army,the night vision is also pretty handy!

Btw I'm not pro Russian if your thinking,I'm English and to be honest couldn't give a toss about Russia or any other country but I can't sit by and watch people mislead others here with twisted facts and downright lies

I'm pretty certain Russia is also supplying communication and other non lethal gear,but I realy do think a majority of the gear the rebels are using is taken from the Ukraine army bases after so many deserted

These rebels expected Russia to aid and supply them with weapons and men right after Crimea had it's elections,I personally think that was a mistake as Russia has Crimea and that's all they want



posted on Sep, 1 2014 @ 01:33 PM
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Anti Putin guys,don't forget if your American your national sport is dropping bombs on different skinned people

You also have the weapons trade sewn up with the UK putting in a respectable position as well arming nearly anyone who will pay and take back handers in the process

Non lethal aid and training can be a very big thing to unskilled fighters,you shouldn't underestimate this knowledge



posted on Sep, 1 2014 @ 01:46 PM
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This entire thread is such a joke.

A) There is no such thing as a T-72 BM, nor is there a NATO code T-72BM...The Russian Kontakt 5 equipped T-72 is a T-72B obr.1989g or a T-72 ob2.1990g...the NATO code is SMT M1990.

B) Ukraine absolutely has the same tank...from exterior looks anyways. The Ukrainian model is called the T-72AG. It uses the exact same Kontakt 5 bolt on kit as the Russian T-72B obr.1989g. The EXACT same. Not similar, not kind of close...exact same.

Short of the BBC reporter getting inside the tank, they would be indistinguishable.

Every Russian T-72 outside of those models carries Kontakt 1 (earlier models) or Relikt (newer models)...both of which are visually different from the Kontakt 5.



posted on Sep, 1 2014 @ 02:23 PM
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a reply to: peck420




A) There is no such thing as a T-72 BM, nor is there a NATO code T-72BM...The Russian Kontakt 5 equipped T-72 is a T-72B obr.1989g or a T-72 ob2.1990g...the NATO code is SMT M1990.


Are you sure about that?


T-72BM Rogatka. Upgraded version of the T-72B tanks. It is fitted with Relikt third generation explosive reactive armor, that is much more effective than the previous Kontakt-5. Upgraded tanks also have new main gun with muzzle reference system, upgraded fire control system and gunners thermal sight. It is powered by a V-92S2 engine, developing 1 000 hp. This tank was first revealed in 2006. Russian Army operates about 300 tanks upgraded to this standard;


www.military-today.com...



B) Ukraine absolutely has the same tank...from exterior looks anyways. The Ukrainian model is called the T-72AG. It uses the exact same Kontakt 5 bolt on kit as the Russian T-72B obr.1989g. The EXACT same. Not similar, not kind of close...exact same.


Yes they essentially are all the same as they use the T72 tank, but they have variants of them and the problem is Ukraine does not use that variant nor does anyone else as far as can be seen, but Russia is the only nation that uses that variant.

So no they aren't the same.



Every Russian T-72 outside of those models carries Kontakt 1 (earlier models) or Relikt (newer models)...both of which are visually different from the Kontakt 5.


Which is why that is so telling, because the T72 BM does use Kontakt-5, but are in the process of upgrading the protection to those tanks. As I have shown posted above.



posted on Sep, 1 2014 @ 02:35 PM
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a reply to: tsurfer2000h




posted on Sep, 1 2014 @ 02:37 PM
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originally posted by: tsurfer2000h
Are you sure about that?

Absolutely. The "Rogatka' is officially known as the T-72B2 obr.2006g, Not a T-72BM. The closest would be a T-72B3M...but, I highly doubt that hte Russians would send in a one off.

Not to mention that the Rogatka is equipped (as your source noted) with Relikt, which looks nothing like Kontakt 5



Yes they essentially are all the same as they use the T72 tank, but they have variants of them and the problem is Ukraine does not use that variant nor does anyone else as far as can be seen, but Russia is the only nation that uses that variant.

So no they aren't the same.


They are, from the exterior, identical. The only differences between the T-72B obr.1989g/obr.1990g and the T-72AG are internal...not external.




Which is why that is so telling, because the T72 BM does use Kontakt-5, but are in the process of upgrading the protection to those tanks. As I have shown posted above.

Your source validated my statement. The T-72B2 is equipped with Relikt...which is nothing like Kontact 5 in appearance.

The only thing that is telling is that you will believe anything you are told without doing any of your own research.

The simple fact that the 'expert' couldn't give the correct Russian or NATO designations should have been a tip off. The fact that he claimed that Ukraine has no versions that look anything like it (when they have many T-72 AG's, using the exact same bolt on armor kit) should have tipped you off even further.

The fact that you are now trying to claim a different model as the the T-72BM, when none exist...is even more telling.

Fine. Russia has no idea what their own tank codes are, and neither does NATO...BBC, on the other hand...yup, they know.
edit on 1-9-2014 by peck420 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 1 2014 @ 03:26 PM
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a reply to: peck420




Absolutely. The "Rogatka' is officially known as the T-72B2 obr.2006g, Not a T-72BM. The closest would be a T-72B3M...but, I highly doubt that hte Russians would send in a one off.


Well for a tank that doesn't exist there sure are some people that talk about it...


There was a new variant of the T-72 known as T-72BM introduced in 2006 armed with 2A46M main gun and Relikt ERA which is the most advanced ERA available from Russia also has new FCS and engine.There isn't much info available on the T-72BM but it is the last production model.


defence.pk...

Notice it says the most advanced ERA available, so what did they use before they came up with it...Kontakt-5.

Which was shown here...


T-72BM Rogatka. Upgraded version of the T-72B tanks. It is fitted with Relikt third generation explosive reactive armor, that is much more effective than the previous Kontakt-5


www.military-today.com...

Here you go 5th picture down...

www.armyrecognition.com...


Russia
Still operates 800 T-72BA ERA, 300 BM ERA, 3000 B ERA, and 1000 others in upgrade stage to the BM standard (Kontakt 5 ERA) plus 4000 in active reserve.


www.tanks-encyclopedia.com...



www.defencetalk.com...



The only thing that is telling is that you will believe anything you are told without doing any of your own research.


Wow, imagine what I could find if I did some research...


Can you provide a source that says the T72BM is not in the Russian tank arsenal/



edit on 1-9-2014 by tsurfer2000h because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 1 2014 @ 11:40 PM
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originally posted by: tadaman
a reply to: OccamsRazor04

I hope the Ukraine becomes a full member of NATO and requests troops to secure its borders.



Then I hope those troops get lost and end up in Crimea.

Judging by how often Russian troops get lost it's apparently quite common and plausible for that to happen. And since all the tanks and equipment come from Russia, why would we not think we are just fighting the rebels?



posted on Sep, 1 2014 @ 11:43 PM
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a reply to: tsurfer2000h

thats a beast.

screw being anywhere near that if its out to kill you!!!



posted on Sep, 2 2014 @ 12:25 AM
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a reply to: OccamsRazor04

Honestly I'm surprised that is all they can find. If I was Putin, the second the pro NATO leadership assumed control of Ukraine, I would have sent boatloads of military gear to the pro Russian forces.

The USA does it all the time.

We are ready to go to war over one tank?
edit on 2-9-2014 by sacgamer25 because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 2 2014 @ 12:29 AM
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originally posted by: sacgamer25
a reply to: OccamsRazor04

Honestly I'm surprised that is all they can find. If I was Putin, the second the pro NATO leadership assumed control of Ukraine, I would have sent boatloads of military gear to the pro Russian forces.

The USA does it all the time.

We are ready to go to war over one tank?


no one cares about the tank they care what it does, while its presence is a problem its only when it kills people that really matters to us.

you can drive a tank anywhere but its when you actually attack the world gives a #



posted on Sep, 2 2014 @ 12:31 AM
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originally posted by: sacgamer25
a reply to: OccamsRazor04

Honestly I'm surprised that is all they can find. If I was Putin, the second the pro NATO leadership assumed control of Ukraine, I would have sent boatloads of military gear to the pro Russian forces.

The USA does it all the time.

We are ready to go to war over one tank?

No pro NATO leadership took control. The former leader ordered citizens killed, and then ran to Russia after stealing tons of money. After he left Parliament legally voted him out of office, and then elections took place with a new President voted in by the people .. including East Ukraine where the rebels allowed people to vote.



posted on Sep, 2 2014 @ 01:48 AM
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a reply to: OccamsRazor04

The Kiev Junta financed by western bankers can scream all they want.
Russia will not be bullied and Russia will not allow NATO and US rope to slowly strangle them at some point.

Red line is Ukraine.



posted on Sep, 2 2014 @ 01:51 AM
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a reply to: BaconNeggs2

Kiev Junta. Interesting. Can you highlight the force that was used to take the country?



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