Ukraine crisis: T-72 tank shoots hole in Russian denial

originally posted by: GargIndia

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: GargIndia

So we only have an actual video and an actual expert Research Analyst. You are right, it really needs to have spraypainted T-72BM.

How do you know it is "actual" video.

Your news organizations and your leaders lie every minute. How difficult it is to use captured equipment and props?

Great, prove it's not. It looks like an actual video to me.

originally posted by: GargIndia

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: GargIndia

So we only have an actual video and an actual expert Research Analyst. You are right, it really needs to have spraypainted T-72BM.

How do you know it is "actual" video.

Your news organizations and your leaders lie every minute. How difficult it is to use captured equipment and props?

correct and looking through the rest of that source it is quite clearly bias against Putin and Russia...

what would be useful to know is how easily is this Armour bolted on to give the appearance of the modified t-72

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

originally posted by: GargIndia

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: GargIndia

So we only have an actual video and an actual expert Research Analyst. You are right, it really needs to have spraypainted T-72BM.

How do you know it is "actual" video.

Your news organizations and your leaders lie every minute. How difficult it is to use captured equipment and props?

correct and looking through the rest of that source it is quite clearly bias against Putin and Russia...

what would be useful to know is how easily is this Armour bolted on to give the appearance of the modified t-72

The Kontakt-5 Era armor is not what makes it a T-2BM. It's a logical fallacy that you guys keep saying that.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

originally posted by: GargIndia

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: GargIndia

So we only have an actual video and an actual expert Research Analyst. You are right, it really needs to have spraypainted T-72BM.

How do you know it is "actual" video.

Your news organizations and your leaders lie every minute. How difficult it is to use captured equipment and props?

correct and looking through the rest of that source it is quite clearly bias against Putin and Russia...

what would be useful to know is how easily is this Armour bolted on to give the appearance of the modified t-72

The Kontakt-5 Era armor is not what makes it a T-2BM. It's a logical fallacy that you guys keep saying that.

wtf do you mean by you guys ?...im asking a question a simple answer would suffice

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

originally posted by: GargIndia

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: GargIndia

So we only have an actual video and an actual expert Research Analyst. You are right, it really needs to have spraypainted T-72BM.

How do you know it is "actual" video.

Your news organizations and your leaders lie every minute. How difficult it is to use captured equipment and props?

correct and looking through the rest of that source it is quite clearly bias against Putin and Russia...

what would be useful to know is how easily is this Armour bolted on to give the appearance of the modified t-72

The Kontakt-5 Era armor is not what makes it a T-2BM. It's a logical fallacy that you guys keep saying that.

wtf do you mean by you guys ?...im asking a question a simple answer would suffice

You are not the first person to say this, that is why I said you guys. A T-72BM doesn't have to have armor, and there are many tanks that use the armor, not just T-72's.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

originally posted by: GargIndia

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: GargIndia

So we only have an actual video and an actual expert Research Analyst. You are right, it really needs to have spraypainted T-72BM.

How do you know it is "actual" video.

Your news organizations and your leaders lie every minute. How difficult it is to use captured equipment and props?

correct and looking through the rest of that source it is quite clearly bias against Putin and Russia...

what would be useful to know is how easily is this Armour bolted on to give the appearance of the modified t-72

The Kontakt-5 Era armor is not what makes it a T-2BM. It's a logical fallacy that you guys keep saying that.

wtf do you mean by you guys ?...im asking a question a simple answer would suffice

You are not the first person to say this, that is why I said you guys. A T-72BM doesn't have to have armor, and there are many tanks that use the armor, not just T-72's.

righteo then....firstly i am more a boobs guy than a tank guy....secondly one can be forgiven for not having a full comprehension of the T series tanks as there are many....cmon there are 3 series of the damn things T-72,T-80s and T-90 and all of these tanks have variants throughout the range

a reply to: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

I agree. It's not me saying it's a T-72BM, it's a Research Analyst from IISS who specializes in this.

www.iiss.org...

What a moronic continued defense of Russia. Of course they are supplying rebels... and have probably sent their own troops in as well. Their interest is obviously retaking countries they had lost in the past.. Ukraine is a great one to take back, since much of their gas runs through it. The unrest there, plus the # of pro Russian inhabitants made it even easier.

Still doesn't make what they did right. I still don't get this righteous defense of Russia and Putin. Just because their particular brand of thuggery is more blatant and in-you-face really doesn't make it "better" than what the U.S. or any other country does in that regards. I can think of many countries I could support.. and Russia isn't one of them. Why so many people feel that their personal hate of the U.S. means they should automatically support Russia baffles me. They really -aren't- any better. Your man-crush on Putin is bizarre.. he is a thug. He has helped his country quite a bit.. but he is still a thug and a crook.

a reply to: fleabit

My guess? Blind, mindless, loyalty. Not just "My country right or wrong," but "There can be only one."

originally posted by: fleabit
What a moronic continued defense of Russia. Of course they are supplying rebels... and have probably sent their own troops in as well.

Mothers of missing soldiers who questioned where there sons went have been labeled as "foreign agents" because they want the truth about where their children are.

Ukraine crisis: T-72 tank shoots hole in Russian denial (OccamsRazor04 link)

Whilst date and location are unconfirmed

Don't overlook that part of the story that OccamsRazor04 left out.


Secondly, what is this that I'm hearing that Hungary sold 58 T-72s to Ukraine, weeks prior?


So did ukraine buy junk T-72s to pass them off as Russian?

originally posted by: GargIndia

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: GargIndia

So we only have an actual video and an actual expert Research Analyst. You are right, it really needs to have spraypainted T-72BM.

How do you know it is "actual" video.

Your news organizations and your leaders lie every minute. How difficult it is to use captured equipment and props?

Really thats the best you got? See there is also corroborating evidence to back it up as well for one. But most importantly even Russian media knows Russian troops are in eastern Ukraine, In fact mothers in Russia arent happy there sons are dying in Ukraine. Than there is the whole prisoner swap of captured Russians the pretense is over. Russia has indeed invaded Ukraine just the fact they rolled armor and troops across the border to prevent there troops from being destroyed proves that. At this point no one with any brains could believe Putin hasnt sent troops into Ukraine. even the separatists admitted Russian troops where there to continue to deny facts is well never mind i know why certain people do it.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

originally posted by: hopenotfeariswhatweneed

originally posted by: GargIndia

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
a reply to: GargIndia

So we only have an actual video and an actual expert Research Analyst. You are right, it really needs to have spraypainted T-72BM.

How do you know it is "actual" video.

Your news organizations and your leaders lie every minute. How difficult it is to use captured equipment and props?

correct and looking through the rest of that source it is quite clearly bias against Putin and Russia...

what would be useful to know is how easily is this Armour bolted on to give the appearance of the modified t-72

The Kontakt-5 Era armor is not what makes it a T-2BM. It's a logical fallacy that you guys keep saying that.

wtf do you mean by you guys ?...im asking a question a simple answer would suffice

You are not the first person to say this, that is why I said you guys. A T-72BM doesn't have to have armor, and there are many tanks that use the armor, not just T-72's.

He was referring to me, and I never said that is what made it a T-72BM, I said Ukraine has K-5 armour and it could put on any tank. The differences between the tanks is equipment related (radar, IR, guns, engine, etc).

I am not trying to say the tank itself is not Russian, I am trying to run through all possibilities. Personally, I do think it is Russian. However, I have seen, been witness, party, and participant in military experts debating back and forth if a specific piece of equipment was a specific type/model with more clear pictures of naval equipment...so he could be wrong. But knowing Russia as Russia...he is probably right.

originally posted by: SurrenderingAmerica
Ukraine crisis: T-72 tank shoots hole in Russian denial (OccamsRazor04 link)

Whilst date and location are unconfirmed

Don't overlook that part of the story that OccamsRazor04 left out.


Secondly, what is this that I'm hearing that Hungary sold 58 T-72s to Ukraine, weeks prior?


So did ukraine buy junk T-72s to pass them off as Russian?

No one is missing anything, except you missing the fact you are bringing up points already raised and proven invalid. These are not T-72, they are T-72BM.

The vehicle in question is Russian, and is part of a Rebel convoy of military vehicles. Date and location doesn't need to be confirmed at that point.

a reply to: AllSourceIntel

If any experts say it's wrong I will gladly listen to what they say. It's not my claim what the tank is, it's an expert's claim.

a reply to: OccamsRazor04

Your argument is that it's part of the Rebel convoy. . . yet your source that you started your thread on clearly states:

"Whilst date and location are unconfirmed"


So now that after Ukraine, US, EU, NATO have ALL been caught w/ their pants down in lying - NOW you want me to go off your word that it's legit, even though your source says: UNCONFIRMED

originally posted by: SurrenderingAmerica
a reply to: OccamsRazor04

Your argument is that it is part of the Rebel convoy. . . yet your source that you started your thread on clearly states:

"Whilst date and location are unconfirmed"


So now that after Ukraine, US, EU, NATO have ALL been caught w/ their pants down in lying - NOW you want me to go off your word that it's legit, even though your source says: UNCONFIRMED

Why do you reply to a thread you did not read the source or the thread? It just ends with you looking foolish.

Whilst date and location are unconfirmed, he says the operator of the convoy is apparent: flags associated with the separatist movement are clearly displayed and some vehicles feature bright green areas, a common feature of separatist armour.

Please give your post more thought next time.

a reply to: OccamsRazor04

Is there anything that you can confirm that its there? Besides unconfirmed.

just curious.

the operator of the convoy is apparent: flags associated with the separatist movement are clearly displayed and some vehicles feature bright green areas, a common feature of separatist armour.

Haha I can say all of that & NONE of it would even be True!!

You start bringing me something more concrete in a thread that YOU created on an article that states, again:

"Whilst date and location are unconfirmed"

I mean hell - was this during an Russian exercise, drills, biathlon, in another country back in 2013, etc. . .

a reply to: SurrenderingAmerica

Did you look at the video linked in the BBC report?

originally posted by: SurrenderingAmerica
I mean hell - was this during an Russian exercise, drills, biathlon, in another country back in 2013, etc. . .

So please show me those drills where Russian military equipment used Donetsk Rebel colors and flags. Do you have any idea how foolish you sound right now?

Russian drills using the flags of a Rebel army ... please ... stop ... before you lose all credibility as a poster.