Hernando's Hideaway. Another Thread "almost certainly not for you."

a reply to: guohua

Oh boy, could I please have a drink? Some of this is beyond me, but I'll make a start and leave the heavy work to those more qualified than I.

As difficult as Chinese is for me to understand, so too is the language of spiritual things for me to understand. The word "religion" has many different meanings according to who the speaker is. Allow me to guess that your husband sees "religion" to mean any relationship with, or discussion about, God that is supported by an organization. I am guessing that he sees "religion" to be a personal thing between a man and his God.

Please remember that I'm only guessing about your husband. "Speaking in tongues" is accepted by the Catholic Church, but like other things it can be and has been abused. Was your minister's translation correct? It's hard to tell, but if your husband didn't have that call in his own heart, it really shouldn't have been forced on him. That is why I suspect it was not valid in this case.

Leaving the church and the Bible after being forced to study it, is only natural. I did not see combat during Viet Nam, but I don't know how anyone could go through that without having at least serious questions about humanity, God, and the world. The evil, death, and destruction he probably saw must have had a massive effect on him.

Jesus cried over what was happening and would happen to the world and His children. Often, crying and anger are the only natural responses.

Where to go from here? I have ideas, but I don't know your husband well and I have no right to simply walk uninvited into something that personal. Why in the world would Mr. G want to listen to me? Who am I?

But I have love for you and your husband, as well as for those here at Hernando's and for those watching us.

Blast! I've been talking too much. Could I have a drink to shut me up for awhile?

Of course you could stay for a month, the Northern US is wonderful in, say, February.

a reply to: charles1952
Yes, I would, I Would Like That Very Much!
BUT!
I have to finish my classes and get my Masters degree, that should be completed by next Summer and then I'll take my Board Exam and get my Lic.

Then we're looking to move, we are looking at land in N. Carolina in an area call Arrowhead Beach waterfront community on the Chowan River in Edenton, North Carolina.
Or, some place else close to the water where my husband can fish and I can open my Clinic and Herbal store.

a reply to: guohua

All right, I'll excuse you this time. Has he ever gone ice fishing? (No, I haven't. You think I'm nuts?)

a reply to: charles1952
Why yes, of-course you can have a drink, You can have an Ice Cold, Yes Straight from the Ice Cold River of Harbin, A Harbin Beer or you can have a Virgin Mary, ( appropriate sense we're talking religion ) or How About,,,,,,, A Harvey Wallbanger!

As far as you stepping in and helping me or any one. You Being A Friend, Is All That's Necessary.
Actually you know as much as me if not more, yes, I'm married to him, but we don't discuss religion and if it's brought up at some one home,,,,, he just sets quietly until the subject is changed.

No, you have our respect and I really do value your opinion.
I also know even if and when my husband reads these post and he will, he'll not be angry, he's just not like that.
He knows, I have questions and I know we really doesn't want to talk about it.

But, I also know, he doesn't mind me asking about religion or there being a discussion about him and religion.
He'll just ignore it.

Thank You and I understood every word you said.

originally posted by: charles1952
a reply to: guohua

All right, I'll excuse you this time. Has he ever gone ice fishing? (No, I haven't. You think I'm nuts?)

Yes he has and he totally enjoyed it!

If your 1700 miles away, then that puts us in your neighborhood.
You're a little further North, I understand that, But, we wanted to visit the North wooded area of New York State and Main some time.

Did you enjoy the pictures of my swimming pool in Harbin and the Ice Festival?

The Bible has something in it that says, roughly, "It's pretty bad if you foul up. God doesn't like that. But if you put someone you're teaching on the wrong path, boy, are you going to get your rear end kicked like you can't even imagine."

But, if you realize that I'm only a guy walking through life just like you are, maybe my thoughts might help break the boredom if nothing else.

Accepting the image of God as depicted by a religion, and accepting the teachings of a religion, were pretty big giant steps for me. I couldn't take those steps, and since I assume everyone in the world is just like me, I don't understand how anyone else can either. (Including you and your dearly beloved.)

My training, the way I think, my personality, all lead me to ask "where is the simplest, easiest place to start?" If I can take a step or two along the trail, maybe I'll see something that makes the trail easier. I started with the surprising fact that I'm here. Or, rather, that anything's here.

I started with the question "How did this get started?" I'd heard all about the Big Bang theory, how the Cosmic Egg exploded in an incredible explosion sending mass and energy out in all directions which led to the formation of planets and everything else. The "Egg" had all of the matter of the Universe crammed into it. It was under great pressure, and when it blew, it was the largest explosion imaginable.

If I understand correctly, there are still scientists that think this is the best explanation available, although new ones are being explored.

After awhile, the question entered my head "And just where did this "Egg" come from? What "Cosmic Chicken" produced this "Cosmic Egg?" That's when I got the answer from science that completely convinced me of the limitations of science and opened all sorts of new doors to another world. Science said "We can tell you what happened one hundred billionth of a second after the Big Bang, but we can't tell you anything about what was there before the Big Bang."

Here was the problem for me. How did the first particle, the first tiny bit of energy, come into the Universe. I was convinced that there was a time when there was absolutely nothing. No energy, no matter, nothing. Then, there was something.

I can't tell you how big a shock to me that was. Visualizing it is very difficult, if not impossible. There was no space, no time, anything you can think of, wasn't there. More barren and empty than any desert, or piece of space. There was no nature, no laws of physics or mathematics, the emptiness was more complete than we can imagine.

And from that vast nothing, came something. Can you see that that violates every rule we have? There was nothing to cause that particular something to come into being, and without a cause, things don't happen. The rule: matter can not be created or destroyed was instantly violated.

But those rules can't be violated, so another conclusion was drawn. We didn't have those rules until something came into being. How can there be laws of physics when there are no particles moving or stationary. The idea that matter cannot be created or destroyed was waiting for there to be some matter that it could apply to.

Through similar kinds of thoughts, I came to the conclusion that the cause for the Universe had to come from outside the Universe. Nature can't create itself. The Universe can't create itself. And as far as parallel or multiple Universes go, none of those Universes could have created themselves. Something had to start things going.

Can you see how big this is? There is "something" completely outside any existence we can imagine in our Universe or any Universe.

Well, I'm thirsty again, even if I didn't say a word about religion. I just talk to much. More later, if this sort of thing is of any value.

a reply to: guohua

I was wrong. I went to another website that said I'm 1600 miles from phoenix by road.

I have seen a few ice sculptures and palaces, but nothing as intricate and beautiful as those. How fortunate are the people who can see that. What could be better than to be young and in love, looking at that fantasy land and trying to keep each other warm?

The swimming pool? Very nice. We just chop a hole in the lake ice and dive in. When I say "we," I mean a very small number of people with something to prove. I am not among them.

a reply to: guohua

Question, do any of you believe in these Speaking in Tongues?

I do not. Linguistic studies have shown that modern manifestations of "speaking in tongues" are nonsensical -- they not only are not a language, they cannot be a language.

Speaking in tongues in the Apostolic age was a tool used to spread the Gospel -- the disciples could speak languages that they did not know, in order to preach to Jews from other countries who did not speak Greek or Aramaic.

The demand on some sects' parts that converts speak in tongues arises from their belief that "true faith" has to manifest itself in some demonstrable way, and speaking in tongues is the most predominant way. It is unlikely that most of those who do it do so knowing that they're faking it, there is a psychological effect in play, as well.

Anyone who tells you that you must "be baptized in the Holy Spirit and speak in tongues" in order to be saved is preaching salvation by works, and works alone, which is completely contrary to Christianity.

Look, G, when it comes to religion, I say I'm religious in that I was raised a Methodist, but if I go out and look at the basic tenants of most beliefs nowadays, I fall in line most closely with Evangelical ... Yikes! I never would have guessed I'd end up there. They scare me with their attitude toward everyone else at times. Some of them can be beautiful people, but then you have those others ...

To me, most church religion tends to be about 10% what God needs from you and about 90% what the rest of the congregation needs to make us all feel better about ourselves. It's in that 90% that the differences creep in, IMO, but since I am in NO WAY an expert don't take my word for anything.

I know what I believe and what my husband believes and it works quite well for the two of us.

a reply to: adjensen

Hey there, adjensen. My head is spinning and I need you to set it straight. I think I might have a different understanding of guohua's question. It's probably just a question of semantics, or vocabulary, or usage, or definition, or whatever it is.

I agree completely that speaking in tongues is not a requirement for salvation. I also agree that believers don't have to (and usually don't) speak in tongues at their baptism or any other time. In looking for an analogy, I wonder if painting can do.

Anyone can put a mark on a piece of paper, maybe some lines and some color. If they're told they have to do that to show they've become an artist (or saved), then they will, and the results will almost always be horrible. But there will, on rare occasion be someone who creates museum quality pieces right away. Of that person it may truly be said that he is an artist and has an amazing gift.

I have two objections to discarding all instances of speaking in tongues, but for all I know you weren't rejecting ALL examples of it. Please let me plug along and you can straighten me out as I go.

First is Paragraph 2003 of the current Catechism:

2003 Grace is first and foremost the gift of the Spirit who justifies and sanctifies us. But grace also includes the gifts that the Spirit grants us to associate us with his work, to enable us to collaborate in the salvation of others and in the growth of the Body of Christ, the Church.

There are sacramental graces, gifts proper to the different sacraments. There are furthermore special graces, also called charisms after the Greek term used by St. Paul and meaning “favor,” “gratuitous gift,” “benefit.” Whatever their character—sometimes it is extraordinary, such as the gift of miracles or of tongues—charisms are oriented toward sanctifying grace and are intended for the common good of the Church. They are at the service of charity which builds up the Church.

While the first argument appeals to the mind, the second appeals to the heart. Remember that I turned 18 in 1970, so my music is the really old stuff. Throw your own mind back and recall the words "Oh, baby." Those six letters were used over and over again, sometimes once with a particular emphasis, sometimes half a dozen to take up time in a song. They could mean many different things. Sometimes the singer was a big brother, some times a suitor, some times a very successful suitor, indeed.

The meaning wasn't in the words, but it was clearly expressed. Scientists given a transcript of the song in an untranslatable language, would probably conclude that "Oh, baby" didn't really carry any meaning at all.

Frankly, I don't think that was a very good argument of mine. Feel free to throw it out, I include it as a reminder that scientific analysis has some shortcomings which we sometimes overlook.

Anyway, I haven't had lunch here in quite a while, care for a bite? I like the omelettes, but pick what you'd like.

a reply to: adjensen

Yes, well, science also says that ghosts don't exist because it can't definitively prove they're there, but I'd swear I grew up in a haunted house.

I wouldn't have said that not so long ago, but it turns out that my sister, whom I never spoke to about the "thing" in our house, also had exactly the same types of experiences there as I did, and we didn't know it until we spoke about them years later after having moved out of the place. And she wasn't just echoing me. She brought the subject up! So I'm pretty sure she had the same experiences in that place.

So either we both had exactly the same imaginations/hallucinations/whatever -or- there was something very not right in the house we grew up in and science just hasn't figured out how to measure paranormal activity.

Tongues may be the same.

Frankly, the world gets a lot less interesting if we learn how to explain everything that happens. I like a little mystery.



It might be why I get so fascinated with prophecy as a general topic of conversation.

This is to the Following Very Dear Friends of Mine.
@ charles1952, @ adjensen and of-course @ ketsuko.

You know, I spoke to my husband this morning over his coffee and my tea.
I looked at him and he smiled and asked me, "Baby, what are you thinking? "

So, I asked him about this speaking in tongues.
You know I'll tell you what he told me after this, Each and every one of you are correct in a way.
This is what my husband said.
Speaking in tongues is a very special act, that only a person who is Felled with the Holy Spirit of Our Lord and Creator.
You must be a Born Again Christian with GOD in Your Heart.
Normally when a person is over come by the Holy Spirit and speaks in the Language of our Lord, it is because they have be praying and believe with all their Heart and Soul That GOD, will come in to their Mind and Soul and talk through them.
My mother was So very religious she Believed all the way to her death bed with Liver Cancer, a Woman who'd never drank a drop of Alcohol in her Life, died of cancer.
Vietnam proved to me, there is no God, if God can not see it in himself to save Children from having their arms cut off for getting a shot or their mothers and father disemboweled for giving comfort to a soldier and so many other dying for no good reason. Then he's no God of Mine.
That was That and my husband continued to drink his coffee.

My husbands father died of as Stroke after being Paralyzed on the entire left side of his body 3 months ago, he was 93 yrs old.
I remember my husband was holding his hand and his father mumbled to him, " Son, Why didn't God Just Take Me?"
My husband said to me, because there is No God!

Does this help you all to understand a little better?

Well at any rate, let't all relax and have a nice bowl of soup. I'm making beef, mushroom and barley for dinner tonight.

Hi everyone, miss me? Bet you thought I ran away. No such luck.

Actually much more mundane than that. Had to move and been w/o internet since I was last here. Actually had "almost-internet" where I could occasionally keep an eye on what went on here but couldn't get logged on to add stuff.

So after all that packing, moving and other misery I could really really use a drink. What's the happy hour special today?

So I see the topic has sort of been religion. I don't have a lot to add to that though I've been the whole catholic, protestant,evangelical and (yep) pentecostal route.

Just good to say hi to everyone again!

a reply to: Bassago
It's So Very Good to seer you come back to us, and yes, I was wondering about you.
I thought maybe you and Expat ran off together!!

No, I'll get you that drink and you can talk about any thing you want, Some of our friends was answering a question for me, that's all.
You see what we're having tonight don't you, ketsuko makes the Very Best meals,,,,,, I have to tell you, I've gained 5 ponds eating her meals, Just Soooooooooooooo, Delicious!!
Thank You ketsuko

a reply to: Bassago

So, if we may ask, where are you now?
Who would you be closer to?

Oh, I have to agree about the Religion thing, You know, our friends here, Helped me a lot.
I understand more now after putting all there answers together and thinking about it.
But, I must say.
I agree with my husband, Religion is not for me.
Sorry folks, but Yes, ketsuko, I believe in Spirits and Ghost and my Ancestors.

OK, that's it my husband is saying, GOD is Burnt Out.
Let's Eat Drink and Be Merry!!!
Anyone care to go Swimming in My Home Land?

Oh, don't worry the Ebola topic will have exploded all over the place like a plague before long.

a reply to: guohua

Hmm, this new inet connection is terrible. This is my 4th attempt to reply, hopefully it will work this time.

Where am I now? Not where I want to be or should be but not living on the streets either so that's something. Much that needs to be resolved before I will have anything resembling a normal life again. Not holding my breath.

Yeah the religion thing.. I spent years, decades studying that stuff and come to the same conclusion as your husband. A good father does not let so many horrible things happen to his children. If he does then he is not a good father.

a reply to: Bassago

At the same time, parents who protect their children from everything aren't good parents either.

Ah, well.

a reply to: charles1952
What you popped in With Out Comment?
You Sick Or Something?

Just teasing!!