Simply tell the cops your name...what is so wrong with this folks?

This is the latest in a long line of videos where things escalate quickly...

www.liveleak.com...

This is how these always start...

1. Someone is walking away or toward an officer or gets pulled over
2. Officer asks who they are
3. Person refuses to tell the officer their name
4. Person swears that they are not doing anything wrong
(In this case, how about that, he had some weed on him. (No big deal, but you were picking up your kids with)
5. You are doing this because I am black/young/dressed different.
6. You are racists/nothing better to do
This one even calls the cops homosexuals..

Yes, you did nothing wrong however you did nothing right but neither did the officer. All he had to do was give his name. Cops have done this for EVER!

In this case I laugh though he had some dope on him...and while picking up the kids. Hmmm....think that had something to do with not wanting to talk to the cops.....

a reply to: matafuchs

No, thank you.
No, thank you.

Bang

maybe a way to stop the problem is to not break the law.

why is it some people get stopped by the police so often? because they're black or because they're criminals?

i have had many black friends who never got questioned by the police.

if you don't act like a criminal you won't be treated like a criminal. (period.)

Identification is not required unless you are being detained. The article does not state why the man was stopped. Without that information I am forced to assume the officer had no probable cause to stop this man and detain him. If there was no probable cause this man, and his identification, are protected by the 4th amendment.

Are there any articles that discuss the probable cause for the stop?

originally posted by: XTexan
Identification is not required unless you are being detained. The article does not state why the man was stopped. Without that information I am forced to assume the officer had no probable cause to stop this man and detain him. If there was no probable cause this man, and his identification, are protected by the 4th amendment.

Are there any articles that discuss the probable cause for the stop?

Not sure where you live but in Arizona there is a law that you carry identification with you.

If you don't have ID the police can hold you until they figure out who you are.

originally posted by: minusinfinity

originally posted by: XTexan
Identification is not required unless you are being detained. The article does not state why the man was stopped. Without that information I am forced to assume the officer had no probable cause to stop this man and detain him. If there was no probable cause this man, and his identification, are protected by the 4th amendment.

Are there any articles that discuss the probable cause for the stop?

Not sure where you live but in Arizona there is a law that you carry identification with you.

If you don't have ID the police can hold you until they figure out who you are.

I live in Texas where police cannot ID you without first detaining you, I am unsure of the law in Minnesota where this occurred. According to wiki, Minnesota is not a stop and ID state. linky

In Arizona...cop asks for your name.

Illegal alien responds: Me llamo es "Juan Pablo Enrique Ricardo de Paco Valdez Martinez de Jesus"

Cop responds: ok you are free to go.

Result...another epic fail to enforce our borders.

a reply to: XTexan

Probable cause needed for an arrest.

Reasonable suspicion required for an investigative stop.

I suspect that Americans are tired of being trampled on by the administration, but there's nothing they can do about it, so they take out their frustrations on small things they can scream about without getting audited by the IRS.

originally posted by: minusinfinity if you don't act like a criminal you won't be treated like a criminal. (period.)

so how do criminals act again? do you mean street robber/mugger type criminals? or white-collar multi-billion dollar wall street criminals? or industrialist corporate fraud/illegal pollution criminals? maybe ignorant bad-cop criminals?

an observer needs to decide if somebody is 'acting like a criminal' based on their own standards. some observer's standards are askew.

a reply to: minusinfinity

Full List of Stop and Identify states

Alabama, Arizona, Arkansas, Colorado, Delaware, Florida, Georgia, Indiana, Kansas, Louisiana, Missouri (kansas city only) Montana, Nebraska, Neveda, New Hampshire, New Mexico, New York, North Dakota, Ohio, Rhode Island, Utah, Vermont and Wisconsin.

"Stop and identify" statutes are laws in the United States that authorize police[1] to detain persons and request such persons to identify themselves, and arrest them if they do not.

originally posted by: solarstorm
In Arizona...cop asks for your name.

Illegal alien responds: Me llamo es "Juan Pablo Enrique Ricardo de Paco Valdez Martinez de Jesus"

Cop responds: ok you are free to go.

Result...another epic fail to enforce our borders.

lol.

As I said police "can" hold you until they figure out who you are, of course cops don't want to work too hard.

a reply to: matafuchs

He was within his rights.

From the article you posted:

When walking (in Minnesota) no – “police can never compel you to identify yourself without reasonable suspicion to believe you’re involved in illegal activity.”
Read more at www.liveleak.com...

originally posted by: XTexan

originally posted by: minusinfinity

originally posted by: XTexan
Identification is not required unless you are being detained. The article does not state why the man was stopped. Without that information I am forced to assume the officer had no probable cause to stop this man and detain him. If there was no probable cause this man, and his identification, are protected by the 4th amendment.

Are there any articles that discuss the probable cause for the stop?

Not sure where you live but in Arizona there is a law that you carry identification with you.

If you don't have ID the police can hold you until they figure out who you are.

I live in Texas where police cannot ID you without first detaining you, I am unsure of the law in Minnesota where this occurred. According to wiki, Minnesota is not a stop and ID state. linky

In Minnesota you are not required to show ID or even give your name unless you are driving or actually being detained and/or arrested. Without further information on this case, it is hard to know; however, it sounds like he was loitering, an issue that would not lead to an arrest or detainment.

That aside, the actions the guy should have taken are 1) Am I being arrested? 2) Am I being detained? 3) Am I free to go? 4) Repeat and note, that unless you are detaining or arresting me, with reason to do so, I am not required to show identification or give you my name, are you arresting or detaining me and am I free to go?

He may have known his rights, but he did not know how to deal with being unjustifiably detained.

"Officer am I under arrest?"

"No"

"Then i must be free to go."

It's really not that hard.

In my state the cops ask who you are. They run your name for warrants. They say slow down sir or next time you will get a ticket, have a nice day.

originally posted by: Hoosierdaddy71
In my state the cops ask who you are. They run your name for warrants. They say slow down sir or next time you will get a ticket, have a nice day.

My home state also...MT...I am in MN right now.

I got pulled over once in MT for doing 95...the cop said..."watch for deer, there have been a lot of accidents around here lately, have a good night."

a reply to: matafuchs

As far as I am aware, in most states in the U.S. it is a legal requirement to give ones name to the police, if they should ask for it, so one is never going to be within ones rights to withold that information from a police officer. The laws vary, but none allow for a refusal to comply with such a request, without inviting arrest by various means.

Some states word their laws on this issue differently, but the end result is always the same. If you refuse to indentify yourself, you have not got a leg to stand on. That is the way I read it anyway. A simple search of the internet will give you plenty of links to state by state variations on the "stop and identify" laws in the U.S.

In the UK the situation, practically speaking, is the same.

originally posted by: kicked
He may have known his rights, but he did not know how to deal with being unjustifiably detained.

"Officer am I under arrest?"

"No"

"Then i must be free to go."

It looks like that's exactly what he did, but they continued to follow him and harass him about giving his name and when he didn't, they eventually physically detained him.

The police are overstepping their bounds all over the country.

a reply to: matafuchs
"Mr Innocent and the Bad Cops."
This fellow was staring in his own movie. He was his own hero. He wrote the plot as he went along.
As soon as he raises his voice and begins to act in any other than normal sheepish manner is displaying probable cause for,for,something, anything.
No, I don't like it either but it is now as simple as this.

My point is..why not? Look, I know that there are Rambo wanna be LEO's..I know some. However, he is not being detained. He is being asked a question. What is your name? Maybe he fit the description of someone who just stole some cigars nearby?

Point is, in this case, it shows perfectly why cops should be vigilant. This bonehead was picking up his kids with weed in his pocket. Save that for home when they are in bed. Maybe the cop walked by and smelt some "Dre" coming off of him. THAT is probable cause. We do not know.

He could have simply said my name is Bob Johnson. Comes back with no outstanding warrants and he could have picked up his kids and been on his way. It has happened to me.