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It's over... The balance has tipped and the welfare state has won... For now...

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posted on Aug, 20 2014 @ 03:11 PM
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a reply to: intrepid


In other words you have nothing to back up your statement. Got it.


[ going through census stats -- time consuming ]


In the meantime, we can study some of these claims as well.

Are Welfare Recipients mostly Republican?

The Myth of Red State Welfare

The politics and demographics of food stamp recipients

'Welfar e State' Doesn't Adequately Describe How Much America's Poor Control Your Wallet


It's a progressive quagmire.





posted on Aug, 20 2014 @ 03:11 PM
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a reply to: Mirthful Me
Well the Government and their buddies Bankers and Piggies, Hedge Funds and CEO's have created this dung pile, I can't blame the outcome on the people.

Corporations setting up Camp in other Countries to avoid paying Taxes, Presidential Candidates (F'ing Romney) hiding their money in the Cayman Islands after Harvesting Companies and putting hard working people out on the Streets and still Smiling like the Sociopath he is. Thinking he is a good person. (F' Tagg too)

Elected Officials doing the dirty Job for the Piggies w/o remorse or reserve.

# the USA, I played the Game their way and just lost my job because the Giant Corporations Investors wanted higher returns and some people have to go, so they can re-hire at 1/2 off. Where is this mentality leading us too? All out War, Ferguson style and they are practicing now.




posted on Aug, 20 2014 @ 03:12 PM
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a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Government "sharing" and government "spending"

They're the same thing.



posted on Aug, 20 2014 @ 03:14 PM
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a reply to: buster2010


And why are people willing to work low? Because there are no other jobs available or the companies refuse to pay a livable wage.


But if companies can in fact "afford" to pay better, then why do people still work low ?

Self-Standardization is a dilemma.




posted on Aug, 20 2014 @ 03:15 PM
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a reply to: xuenchen

Blogs. Thanks. That clears things up.



posted on Aug, 20 2014 @ 03:16 PM
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originally posted by: buster2010
a reply to: Gozer



You want manufacturing jobs to come back to America? Elect politicians that lower the cost of doing business and incentivize businesses/manufacturers to stay in the US via competitive tax rates/regulations.

Obama offered to lower the taxes for companies to bring jobs back but the Republicans stopped it. It is the free trade agreement that helped to kill our economy.


Then why doesn't Obama move to cancel the free trade agreement ?

I wonder why the 2009 - 2010 Congress didn't do that?




posted on Aug, 20 2014 @ 03:17 PM
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a reply to: Pants3204


Government "sharing" and government "spending"

They're the same thing.


No, they aren't the 'same thing'. One is when people realize they don't need 50bejillion dollars in the bank, and pay their workers a decent wage, so that those people can SHOP and feed the economy.

I think the problem is Corporate "hoarding" and Corporate "welfare" forced on the citizenry due to greed. The government wouldn't have to "spend" if they had more revenue from the corporations (taxes - SHARING) to work with.

Okay - that's it for me, really. See ya tomorrow.



posted on Aug, 20 2014 @ 03:18 PM
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originally posted by: xuenchen

originally posted by: buster2010
a reply to: Gozer



You want manufacturing jobs to come back to America? Elect politicians that lower the cost of doing business and incentivize businesses/manufacturers to stay in the US via competitive tax rates/regulations.

Obama offered to lower the taxes for companies to bring jobs back but the Republicans stopped it. It is the free trade agreement that helped to kill our economy.


Then why doesn't Obama move to cancel the free trade agreement ?

I wonder why the 2009 - 2010 Congress didn't do that?



Do you mean NAFTA? Canadians across the country would agree with that one.



posted on Aug, 20 2014 @ 03:19 PM
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This is a very emotional debate when it really shouldn't be. Money is money after all, and everything can be tallied up rather neatly. It's only a bit harder than budgeting your average household bills.

You count up what is coming in, and what is going out. Some people say that would be to simplistic, I disagree, it's the KISS rule.

I've seen this debate here for years before and after I joined ATS, and yet, even though many of the names have changed, the debate hasn't.

I've seen good ideas from both sides and some pretty idiotic ones as well, especially when emotion is involved.

My little conspiracy idea on the matter of benefits is that MediCare, MedicAid and the VA pretty much all cater to older people and constantly ill people. Most of who won't be around in ten to twenty years from now. Now roll the ACA into that as well and even more people won't be around. Kind of dastardly, don't you think?

In twenty years the benefits problem will still be as bad as it is now, because there arises another problem. Fewer people working, fewer people having families all equal even a lesser tax base.

Taking emotion out of the debate and concentrating on the actual problem would go a long way to fixing this.



posted on Aug, 20 2014 @ 03:19 PM
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originally posted by: Mirthful Me

originally posted by: Krazysh0t
a reply to: Mirthful Me

Ok fair enough. You got me. Usually I try to at least skim a whole article, but I let my emotions get the better of me when I read the veteran's benefits thing, being a veteran myself.


Thank you for your service and your sincere reply...


Same to you. I wanted to practice what I preach. I get rather annoyed when I debate with people on this site, show them they are wrong, and they STILL won't admit it. So I figured I can show by example when I am wrong.



posted on Aug, 20 2014 @ 03:20 PM
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originally posted by: intrepid
a reply to: xuenchen

Blogs. Thanks. That clears things up.




Fast reading leads to fast assumptions. I'm studying the census stats. They are long and complicated.

and, I'm still waiting for a factual explanation to the original claim.




posted on Aug, 20 2014 @ 03:21 PM
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originally posted by: intrepid
I'm off topic?
We're talking about welfare, right? AND I wasn't the one pointing at members and their "sources".


The topic of the thread is that the tipping point has been reached... That there are more "takers" than "givers" and given that fact, that the Liberal/Progressive/Democrat/Socialist candidates and agenda will prevail for the near future... It is inevitable... And terminal in nature... Much like a malignancy in the body, a tumor that contributes nothing to the body but saps the energy, the nutrients, the life blood from it's host... This dependent class that has been created and nurtured by the Liberal/Progressive/Democrat/Socialist political machine will grow to such dimensions, metastasize until the body can no longer support it's ravenous demands and finally succumbs to to it's parasitic nature and is left a husk... A withered shell no longer recognizable...

I do not wish to see this great republic perish from within, by a disease, a cancer of our own making... Yet the diagnosis is in, and the prognosis is bleak...



posted on Aug, 20 2014 @ 03:22 PM
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originally posted by: intrepid

originally posted by: xuenchen

originally posted by: buster2010
a reply to: Gozer



You want manufacturing jobs to come back to America? Elect politicians that lower the cost of doing business and incentivize businesses/manufacturers to stay in the US via competitive tax rates/regulations.

Obama offered to lower the taxes for companies to bring jobs back but the Republicans stopped it. It is the free trade agreement that helped to kill our economy.


Then why doesn't Obama move to cancel the free trade agreement ?

I wonder why the 2009 - 2010 Congress didn't do that?



Do you mean NAFTA? Canadians across the country would agree with that one.


I'm not sure what buster was referring to. He wasn't clear.

But yes NAFTA is a problem for everybody.




posted on Aug, 20 2014 @ 03:22 PM
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originally posted by: xuenchen

originally posted by: intrepid
a reply to: xuenchen

Blogs. Thanks. That clears things up.




Fast reading leads to fast assumptions. I'm studying the census stats. They are long and complicated.

and, I'm still waiting for a factual explanation to the original claim.



You don't have to be in a barn long to smell the BS. The Forbes one I was actually looking forward to. THAT might have been interesting but the link was dead.



posted on Aug, 20 2014 @ 03:25 PM
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a reply to: Mirthful Me

My friend, and I hope we can still be, is corporate welfare that you just disected. AND corporate welfare cost the taxpayer WAY more than what social welfare costs.



posted on Aug, 20 2014 @ 03:26 PM
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originally posted by: Mirthful Me

I do not wish to see this great republic perish from within, by a disease, a cancer of our own making... Yet the diagnosis is in, and the prognosis is bleak...


Thanks, Dr. Melodrama. Good the see the mods getting in on the game of heaping scorn upon the poor.


Say something against the 1%, 'no, no, you can't say that! Class warfare! Marxism! Progressive communist fascist!'

Say something against the poor, 'preach on, brother!'



posted on Aug, 20 2014 @ 03:27 PM
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a reply to: Mirthful Me

To piggy back off of your point, some of the causes of the decline and eventual fall of the Roman Empire was the consolidation of wealth to the super rich, mass unemployment, and welfare sucking the money from the public coffers. Not to mention their war machine benefited and was funded from constant war and plundering then when the Empire finally tried to achieve peace, that also drained them. Kind of funny how this aligns rather nicely with current events huh?

Keep in mind, there was never an official point in history when the Empire "fell". It just kind of broke apart because it couldn't afford to sustain itself anymore or protect its borders from invaders.



posted on Aug, 20 2014 @ 03:28 PM
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a reply to: Monger

What am I? Chopped liver?
This is a good example of how diverse the staff is. Many differing points of view.



posted on Aug, 20 2014 @ 03:30 PM
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give me welfare over warfare anytime. i know which of the two is BY FAR the greater financial drain and ultimate threat to the future of society.



posted on Aug, 20 2014 @ 03:34 PM
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originally posted by: mwood

originally posted by: jrod


Blaming poor people for the inequality of wealth is exactly what the puppet masters want YOU to do!




(snip)...It CAN be done, you just have to do it.


Great post. "Doing it" involves effort though. REAL effort. Most want to start at the top RIGHT NOW, or just do nothing and blame everyone else for putting forth more effort in life than they did. It starts in school and goes from there. Usually, if you do good in school and understand WHY it's important, then you'll have the effort to take care of yourself adequately through life. If not? Eh, sure, you can change, I did. I squeaked by all through high school, then graduated with honors in college once I put forth just a little more EFFORT than I always had. It's all about that dirty "E" word. Many people live in a delusional realm of existence where they seek to equate a lack of their OWN EFFORT in life with "social injustice."



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