WTF? Electric shock devices used in US courts???

Ty that's very kind. I'm healthy just odd Ekg's run in my family. Must mean we're all heartless or something!

I really hope this gets more media attention and stops. I agree with the articles, this action could have prevented this man from speaking up.

a reply to: Domo1

I couldn't help but notice that the defendant is Black.

Are the Authorities trying to start a Race War?

I am absolutely shocked (albeit not as shocked as the guy who got shocked). The thing I am shocked about is that people here seem to be shocked that this happened. There are those who will not be happy until they have prisoners or maybe even citizens all wearing explosive control collars like in the movie Running Man.



Seriously you guys didn't see this coming? Honestly I am shocked they have only pushed it as far as they have but I am absolutely sure they will push it even further.

a reply to: LDragonFire

This is ridiculous and obviously shouldn't be happening in any courtroom, especially with every officer armed and ready for their type of action packed, violent response... The picture is a perfectly fat, idiot caught at just the right moment, love it!!

a reply to: Grimpachi

I don't know. Maybe it's an age related thing.

I can remember a time when we were the paragon of liberty and justice- that is, at least we tried to be.

originally posted by: resistanceisfutile
I don't understand.

1 - the man was at that point innocent as he had not yet been proven guilty.

2 - he can use any legal defense he wants. That's his right.

I fail to see how even having this device on him is constitutional. Let alone SHOCKING someone because you don't like what there saying....He should have been treated like any lawyer in the court .

This.

I can understand, if a defendant is deemed a flight/danger risk, having SOME means of containing that risk, but this is just unacceptable.

originally posted by: loam
a reply to: Grimpachi

I don't know. Maybe it's an age related thing.

I can remember a time when we were the paragon of liberty and justice- that is, at least we tried to be.

It isn't your age. I remember a time as well but this country as been heading in this direction for a while.

No wait...let me rephrase that and clarify. When I was a child and was ignorant of our history and government I "thought " we were paradigm of liberty but we haven't truly lived up to that if you look at our history such as McCarthyism, Trail of Tears or in general how we treated the Indians and continue to, medical experiments on US citizens for bio weapons unbeknownst to them, we ran internment camps for Japanese Americans during WW2 that were not even close to the quality of life we gave German POWs in their camps, Jim Crow laws, slavery, and there are far more examples way to many to list really. The ones I used are before my time but I did that to show we didn't live up to what many claim or think we did back then and we haven't really progressed as far as we claim either.

Honestly there is a reason our founding fathers made speeches on how the government should be reigned in unfortunately far to many people became complacent and the monster that is or government has attained so much power if it can ever be achieved it will be unlike anything the world has witnessed before. Don't get me wrong the US has been a great country comparatively to most others and still is compared to many others still but IMHO I have been to countries that now put us to shame or should I say we have shamed ourselves.

A general dissolution of principles and manners will more surely overthrow the liberties of America than the whole force of the common enemy. While the people are virtuous they cannot be subdued; but when once they lose their virtue then will be ready to surrender their liberties to the first external or internal invader.

Samuel Adams, letter to James Warren, February 12, 1779


The jaws of power are always open to devour, and her arm is always stretched out, if possible, to destroy the freedom of thinking, speaking, and writing.
John Adams


Remember, democracy never lasts long. It soon wastes, exhausts, and murders itself.
John Adams

If ever time should come, when vain and aspiring men shall possess the highest seats in Government, our country will stand in need of its experienced patriots to prevent its ruin.
Samuel Adams


The liberties of a people never were, nor ever will be, secure, when the transactions of their rulers may be concealed from them.
Patrick Henry, American colonial revolutionary


The Constitution is not an instrument for the government to restrain the people, it is an instrument for the people to restrain the government — lest it come to dominate our lives and interests.
Patrick Henry

a reply to: loam

sounds like they are taking a leaf out of the milgram experiments book

psych.answers.com...

a reply to: Domo1

Just a quick question, is it illegal to fake a heart attack when you've been tased/shocked? I wouldn't think it would be but then again who knows.

originally posted by: charles1952
a reply to: eriktheawful and James1982

Are you surprised to learn that I agree with you completely? I've always said the shocks were too much, I have no problem punishing the judge. I'm not familiar with how widespread those shockers are, but I can see some purpose in them if the defendant goes crazy. You certainly don't want somebody spraying bullets or mace in a crowded room.

I have no trouble with people speaking out about it. it was a failure in the system that should be repaired.

But it is not part of a conspiracy to deprive Americans of their rights until we are slaves.

Does that help clear things up between us?

If you are implying the systematic removal of our rights and securities as American citizens was an accident, I don't know if "clear" is really a possibility.

I swear we are being pushed to the brink of revolution. I think they want a fight. They are fully prepared for armed insurrection and its their only way out.

90% of our wages have been siphoned off since 1913. They see no way out. The 1% realizes there is simply not enough money in circulation for our economy to work but none will give a cent back until forced to do so.

The other thing this makes me think of are the charges of satanism amongst the 1%. An interview on C2C a couple of years ago with a police chaplain said innumerable judges belong to the cults and it makes it very difficult to prove, much less prosecute.

What could be more sadistic? What normal human being could be so cruel as to push that button?

A showdown is coming.

a reply to: th3dudeabides

originally posted by: charles1952
One of the things that is interesting to me is how ATS finds an example or five or twenty, then says "This is what the United States has become. We're losing all our freedoms. We need a revolution." When all that happened was that a crabby old judge was called out of retirement to hear a nut babble nonsense, and he lost it.

While your analysis is probably true, these sorts of things are happening on a consistent basis. We need some sort of accountability in the system. Judges have become untouchable in many senses. They are actually banning people from representing themselves in many courts now. Judges act with impunity knowingly and willfully blind to the misinterpretations and wrongfulness of their conduct. They do so to protect the institution and their fellow colleagues. But these moves, strangle the public and desecrate the courts in the perception of the public.

I'm shocked.
I've heard of restraining someone, I've even heard of gagging someone so they can't speak, I've heard of putting masks so they can't spit, but this is a little over the top, IMO. This isn't what's needed in American courtrooms. Common sense, fairness and decency is what's needed.

I have now mentioned the fact of these devices being used to several people I know and NONE of them knew we were using these in our courts.

How can this be?

Apparently courts are now using shock devices to control unruly defendants:
Sheriff's stun vest a hidden tool to stop unruly defendants in Saginaw County court

As this guy is a member of the sovereign movement, and they like to go off on bogus legalese tantrums, I actually find this sort of amusing. Guess that's one way to show these guys that the laws actually DO apply to them, regardless of what they read on the internet.

a reply to: defcon5

You're ok with this?

What I've been wondering is if you refuse to wear this...Then you are basically being refused your right to due process. So far we only see people effected after they allowed this to be put on themselves.

You can not make me wear something that has the possibility to hurt me. I'm not going to do it.

originally posted by: defcon5
Apparently courts are now using shock devices to control unruly defendants:
Sheriff's stun vest a hidden tool to stop unruly defendants in Saginaw County court

As this guy is a member of the sovereign movement, and they like to go off on bogus legalese tantrums, I actually find this sort of amusing. Guess that's one way to show these guys that the laws actually DO apply to them, regardless of what they read on the internet.

O.o

You find it amusing?

Another, less abusive way to "show these guys" that laws do apply to them, is to find them guilty of breaking said law (if indeed they are), and locking them up.

Not applying current to their bodies, so they end up screaming in pain, possibly had their heart or nervous system damaged.

You find it amusing?

Bet you won't find it amusing if you ever find yourself wearing one, and the judge decides he or she didn't like the look you gave them.

And before you or anyone else on here says: "Well I don't break laws", you'll find that there are many ways or times that you may have indeed broken some law and end up getting arrested and hauled in.....then find yourself wearing the vest awaiting a bail hearing.

Cop pulls you over, and he finds your license is suspended (unfortunately, you didn't get the registered letter yet..and they don't call to tell you), and that you are now under arrest for driving on a suspended license. Most states can and will do this. Not just give you a ticket.

a reply to: loam
Lets just say that "sovereign movement" folks have over the years frustrated me to the point that its annoying.

Actually it's very easy to prove if you had a heart attack.

Blood Tests

During a heart attack, heart muscle cells die and release proteins into the bloodstream. Blood tests can measure the amount of these proteins in the bloodstream. Higher than normal levels of these proteins suggest a heart attack.

Commonly used blood tests include troponin tests, CK or CK–MB tests, and serum myoglobin tests. Blood tests often are repeated to check for changes over time.

A blood test would show you did not have one. I am not saying you would be in trouble, but it would be proved you did not have a heart attack.
www.nhlbi.nih.gov...