the green flame

a reply to: MystikMushroom

They do have those but they too can be tracked by foreign powers. By international law anything that gets launched into space via rocket needs to be announced to everyone else that can detect and possibly mistake it for an ICBM and launch a full counter strike.
Bass is right that it would be much harder to track/find micro sats that are launched in from a clandestine space plane. I think though they could still get stuff into space by piggy backing them onto another traditionally launched sat. When they launch spy sats. they don't really tell us what the sat is or even how many sats there are at the top of the rocket.

a reply to: Sammamishman

To me that's still too risky. Another agency might get a peek. I would imagine they would want full control and maximum secrecy. Do it all in house. To me that says no public rocket flights and a sneakier way to get the job done.

a reply to: BASSPLYR

Once it's in the VAB they can put anything in there, and only the technicians will see what it is. And if it's in a sheath, they won't have any idea about it. With them going to microsats now, they could put a couple dozen onto an Atlas V, and no one would be the wiser.

a reply to: Zaphod58

I get you. And I agree thats probably what they do most of the time. But to me, thats still pretty risky. I would want to have it all in house, one stop shop, a turn key operation and ability to get things into space. No loss of control over launch times and widows, no getting ousted due to politics as to when you can and can't put your payload on the communal express. No outsiders period. No questions, no anything. clandestine. Thats what I would do if I was in charge. I'd be surprised if they didn't attempt to do that and if they haven't already succeeded in doing just that to some degree.

a reply to: BASSPLYR

Yeah, but they do it all the time with no problems. Just look at how many classified satellites are launched in a year,where we only know the logo, or the number or whatever.

a reply to: Zaphod58

I feel ya. But if one really wanted to go big time into this whole space dominance thing I'd imagine one would want their own ride. And their own garage. And their own technicians. I wouldn't even want them to weigh the thing and even get ideas from that. Just leave them completely in the dark. Surely there is stuff thats so secretive they don't even want to take the normal risks for when they try to get it into orbit. But that could be an capability they would never, ever, ever admit to.

originally posted by: Sammamishman
Remember, there are still a number of KC-135T models in active service out there.

Fascinating to say the least, eh?

originally posted by: MystikMushroom
Areospike engines...

More than aerospike engines, i'd say aerospike nozzles. That's why i posted a pic of the LASRE a couple of pages ago

originally posted by: Sammamishman
a reply to: MystikMushroom

...By international law anything that gets launched into space via rocket needs to be announced to everyone else that can detect and possibly mistake it for an ICBM and launch a full counter strike.

I guess if you have a "runway-to-orbit" platform that is not powered by rocket engines, then it would not be a violation of the treaty? Hmmmmm......< Spock voice > Fascinating < / Spock voice >

Seems to be an awful lot of news lately involving green fireballs. How many would we speculate are aircraft related? Or should I ask, how common are green meteors? I myself saw a green fireball over Chicago this summer, but just assumed it was a meteor. Never seen anything quite like that before. It was right around dusk and moving due east very quickly.

a reply to: DichroChrono

Green fireballs are actually fairly common, especially around this time of year. There are 3 meteor showers, Orionids, Leonids and the Geminids that occure from Oct. 21 to Dec. 13th.
Not all of the green streaks are meteors though.

a reply to: Sammamishman

How convenient that the other green streaks will be airborne during this timeframe ;-)

Is it possible that the green girl have space capability ?

a reply to: darksidius

I don't believe so. I think it's still an air breather.

a reply to: Zaphod58
Zaphod58.
I sent you a U2U.
Please respond.
Thank you

1956 DECLASSIFIED NACA REPORT

The appearance of a boric oxide exhaust cloud from a turbojet engine operating on trimethyl- borate fuel (August 10, 1956)

archive.org...

a reply to: mbkennel

The first rule of The Green Flame is DON'T TALK ABOUT THE GREEN FLAME

-sorry guys, I just had to

originally posted by: drwire
1956 DECLASSIFIED NACA REPORT

The appearance of a boric oxide exhaust cloud from a turbojet engine operating on trimethyl- borate fuel (August 10, 1956)

Hm. If oxides don't work, then maybe they carry some other oxidizer along...

originally posted by: Bedlam

originally posted by: drwire
1956 DECLASSIFIED NACA REPORT

The appearance of a boric oxide exhaust cloud from a turbojet engine operating on trimethyl- borate fuel (August 10, 1956)

Hm. If oxides don't work, then maybe they carry some other oxidizer along...

Hmmm - www.reactionengines.co.uk...

I remember that a few years ago there are several commerciall pilot reports of a "ufo" that had a green exhaust.
I found this transcript of such an encounter.

National UFO Reporting Center Case Brief
off Long Island, NY
November 17, 1995

NUFORC Home Page

TEXT OF RADIO COMMUNICATIONS BETWEEN FAA AND TWO COMMERCIAL AIRCRAFT IN THE VICINTY OF LONG ISLAND, NEW YORK, ON NOVEMBER 17, 1995, at 2220 hrs. (EST).

LUFT: Uh, Boston, Lufthansa 405/Heavy.

FAA: Lufthansa 405, go ahead.

LUFT: Uh, we just passed traffic on the left wing, uh, about 2,000 to 3,000 feet above us. What traffic was it?

FAA Is this Lufthansa 405?

LUFT: Affirmative, Lufthansa 405. We had opposite traffic on the left wing. Can you confirm this?

FAA: Lufthansa 405, negative. I show no traffic in your area within, uh, 20 or 30 miles.

LUFT: It should be now on our tail, about 10 miles... We passed it just one minute ago, and it was looking strange.

BRIT: Speed Bird 226 confirms that. It was just above us on our left-hand side about 3 minutes ago.

FAA What altitude does it appear to be at, Lufthansa 405?

LUFT: It was only 2 or 3 thousand feet above us. We are now passing (Flight) Level 260. That's confirmed, or not? Lufthansa.

FAA: Lufthansa 405, roger.

BRIT: Speed Bird 226, we confirm that. We had something go past us about two, well...about one to two thousand feet above on the left hand side. Uh, looked like a green trail on it, and a very bright light on the front of it. We assumed it was an opposite traffic.

FAA: Speed Bird 226, roger that.

LUFT: ((Garbled))..Lufthansa 405/Heavy. we are right now about 26 miles east of "Hotel Tango Oscar ((Hampton??))." And the Speed Bird is now ahead, or behind us ((or where))?

FAA: Lufthansa 405, the Speed Bird is in your 12:00 o'clock, and about 30 miles, 40 miles.

LUFT: That was not our traffic. Lufthansa 405 Heavy.

FAA: Lufthansa 405, roger. And the heading of the traffic, was it the same direction, or opposite direction?

LUFT: Exactly opposite. Lufthansa 405/Heavy.

FAA: Roger. Did it pass off your right side?

LUFT: Uh, left side.

FAA: Roger.

BRIT: Yea, Speed Bird 226 confirms that. We saw the same thing. It certainly looked like an aircraft initially, but it may not have been one.

LUFT: ((We can't tell then??)) It was looking very strange, with a long, uh, light, in the tail.

BRIT: Yea, a big bright white light on the front, and a greenish tail coming out the back.

LUFT: Can you confirm this, Lufthansa 405/Heavy.

FAA: OK, Lufthansa 405, Speed Bird 226. Thanks, we'll look into it.

??? ((Garbled transmissions))

FAA: Speed Bird 226, did it go over...did it go overhead. The traffic go overhead you, or was it below you?

BRIT: It was overhead and off to the left, much the same as ((garbled)). It actually looked about...opposite traffic, 2000 feet above. That's what it initially looked like. But then it did have a very strong trail to it...a vapor trail, which looked more like smoke. And the light on the front was very, very bright, and as it went past us, it seemed to ((just?)) disappear and ((went)) 5 miles behind us.

FAA: Speed Bird, 226, roger. Were you level at 29 at that time?

BRIT: Yea, affirmative.

FAA: Roger. Lufthansa 405, how far off to your side did that pass, the traffic pass?

LUFT: It was pretty close, and like Speed Bird said, it looked like ((four??)) or three thousand feet above on the left wing, just one mile and, uh, on opposite track... It doesn't have, ...it didn't have any uh, lights...((normal)) lights, beacon lights, or red or green lights. Only a white light in the front, and with a long green light. It looked like a U-F-O.

FAA: Lufthansa 405, roger that. Like I said, we had nothing flying in the area. You are just north of a military operating area, but the traffic shouldn't have varied out that far out,...out of the area.

LUFT: Must have been a military. Lufthansa 405/Heavy.

FAA: Roger. Giant Killer, ((garbled)) 59.

GK: Giant Killer.

FAA: Hey, you got anything flying out in the area?

GK: Negative, ((105 is??)) turned over. 0300.

FAA: Well, I just received a couple of UFO reports.

GK: Oh, is that right?

FAA? Yea, I had a couple of guys that reported lights, just moved all over their heads. I have no traffic whatsoever in the area. They said it passed within a mile of them, like at 2-3 thousand feet above them, opposite direction. ((Garbled)) green trail out the back.

GK: It could have been a meteor, or something.

FAA: ((Garbled--Yea, it could have been that.....it passed within a mile of them.))

GK: Who reported that?

FAA: Well, I got Speed Bird and Lufthansa.

GK: No, we don't have any aircraft out there.

FAA: OK.

END TEXT

a reply to: punkinworks10

Sunday night, December 22 around 10:30 pm, I was walking to my car in a well lit parking lot in a city in central Florida. The weather was clear. I looked up and saw a bright green meteor with a small yellowish tail making serious speed to the west. The green was remarkably bright, almost neon looking.

Anyone have any reason to think what I saw was anything other than a "normal" everyday super bright green meteorite? Just curious; it was cool to see either way.