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The SINGLE MOST IMPORTANT ANALYSIS of the events of 9/11.

page: 13
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posted on Sep, 6 2014 @ 10:40 PM
a reply to: douglas5

Architects and Engineers for 9/11 Truth will be unveiling a 45 foot video-billboard which shows footage of building 7′s free fall collapse on repeat, in one of the most high traffic areas in the world.

And just like a magician never reveals hit tricks, ae911 will never say how and where in the buildings charges were placed.

I predict this will offend more people rather than convert people.

posted on Sep, 8 2014 @ 02:07 AM
a reply to: LaBTop

Now lets see the North Tower was hit almost exactly mid elevation and high up, also because of how the core was positioned in that tower the core was hit almost mid elevation.

North Tower top on this graphic.

As the core was hit high up the sections of steel used in its construction were of a smaller section.

The North Tower although hit second fell first, it had a lower mass above the impact point.

Now it seems YOU seem to think all that mass dropping on the floor below would not be a problem, also do YOU actually KNOW why the towers were designed the way they were, and what parts of the structure supported the loads on it.

I suggest you look at that!
edit on 8-9-2014 by wmd_2008 because: (no reason given)

posted on Sep, 8 2014 @ 07:31 AM

originally posted by: LaBTop

An animated-gif from the video of the North Tower collapse :

An animated-gif from the video of the South Tower collapse :

Click this Evidence of Explosives In The Twin Tower Collapses.
Observe calmly and concentrated all those 18 frame-photos from the North Tower collapse,

the various animated gifs on that page for the South and the North Towers collapses,

and then read this evidence why a pancake theory is outrageous wrong, since the visual evidence proves it immediately wrong :

The above animated graphic alternates the first and 67th frames. It shows a classic controlled demolition of a 12 story building (the top 12 stories of the North Tower). Strange how the roofline collapses so evenly, I guess, that all the central core columns and all the perimeter wall columns collapsed simultaneously. Some coincidence eh ?

The first line of explosives detonated across the 98th floor (where the collapse began). The second line of detonations occurred across the 92nd floor (just above the lower red line) with large flashes of hot gas from the explosions, clearly visible. Initially, the second line's detonation is obscured by the dust cloud of the first. However, being much more powerful detonations, the second line's dust cloud quickly bursts into view.

A close look at the video/photos shows that the collapse begins at the 98th floor, then the 99th floor collapses onto the 98th, then the 100th floor collapses onto the 98th, then the 101th floor collapses onto the 98th, then the 102th floor collapses onto the 98th, etc until the second line of detonations initiates the final collapse. So once again, we have the disintegration of the tower above the impact floors, before the collapse of the tower below the impact floors.

Interestingly, this observation disproves the so called pancake theory, where one floor collapses onto the next lower floor, causing that floor to also collapse (not that the pancake theory made any sense anyway). Here, what we see is 5 or 6 floors in a row, all falling onto the 98th floor, which does not collapse (until the second line of explosives are detonated, taking out its support). The pancake theory would have the 98th floor collapsing onto the 97th, causing that to collapse onto the 96th, causing that to collapse onto the 95th, etc.

These very strange circumstances, mentioned above, have a very simple explanation: The twin towers were deliberately demolished. Occam's razor, suggests that the simplest explanation, a deliberate demolition, is probably also the correct explanation.

These explosives. They remained perfectly ok after the impact, the 1000degree fire? All the cords, detonators, initial and secondary charges? They were all ok? That's beyond incredible, and nobody noticed them. You've decided there were explosives. It's easier to believe that than to believe the chaos of incredible events that occurred that day.

posted on Sep, 8 2014 @ 12:24 PM
A reply to: wmd_2008

Thank you again, wmd_2008, for your direct, simplistic posting style.
We had 13 years to dissect the events of 9/11.

You seem to live in your own time-lapsed bubble, starting things all over again, as if you freshly enter the already extensively nitpicked, 9/11 discussion.
Totally ignoring the long experience and posting history of us, regarding every tiny detail of those events.

You only throw very old, very simple to understand facts around, till the cows come home.
While we already left those facts behind us, a long time ago, 13 years to be precise.
It's not worth our time to answer such stale subjects, generalities, idle subjects and small talk, we are after bigger meat.

Now it seems YOU seem to think all that mass dropping on the floor below would not be a problem

All your questions got answered in this 2012 serious explanation of the culprits in the official lies spread about 9/11 :

Title : 9/11: Explosive Evidence - Experts Speak Out (Free 1-hour version)

There's also a 1.5 hrs DVD-version, which you can order when you want to support and feel affiliation with their work. This 1 hr video is free to watch and save.

16:24 Into the video, Part 6, that "WTC-7 NE Floor System Near Column 79" diagram.
You see there the extra thick square stiffener plate, under that girder seat, both welded onto column 79. That girder is bolted onto that seat.

Can't read the photo-diagram date in the white block at the right bottom part.
See especially my point WTC-7 #5 post in this thread's page 9.

20:30 - 21:48 Part 2, Sudden Onset of Destruction.
You see that the upper block of WTC-1N its 12 stories self-destructs, the intact 98 stories high block under it does not move and does not destruct too, as should be expected in a natural collapse of that upper block.
Action = Reaction is not taking place, which means that upper block first got destructed, as I showed you here already (first video + fourth anim.gif) , then, the top floors of the still erect and still unaffected lower 98 floors part of the tower got blown out, followed by the next waves of destructive explosions, every third or fourth lower floors.
That was a 12 floors "French" demolition of that top part segment with no measurable deceleration effect, followed by a downward demolition sequence on every 3rd or 4th floor from the left over 98 floors high tower segment.

22:56 - 25:10 Part 3 Eyewitness Reports of explosions.

25:10 - 27:30 Part 4 Direct Evidence of Explosions.

Followed by lots of fast shown stills, some video parts, and the important parts of interviews with experienced engineers and architects. At the end an explanation by long time practicing psychologists about the denial effect : what these official stories truster's eyes can see is not accepted by their brains. Since the implications are too severely damaging their fixed world-view. They can't stand the truth, so they deny it instead.

posted on Sep, 8 2014 @ 04:35 PM

originally posted by: scottyirnbru
These explosives. They remained perfectly ok after the impact, the 1000degree fire? All the cords, detonators, initial and secondary charges? They were all ok? That's beyond incredible, and nobody noticed them. You've decided there were explosives. It's easier to believe that than to believe the chaos of incredible events that occurred that day.

The thermal behavior of many energetic compounds can be found in the Dupont Blasters Handbook. Or these data can be summarized from various handbooks, textbooks, and manufacturers’ technical data sheets. (MSDS's)
The critical temperature of thermal explosion for f.ex. PETN, Semtex, TNT, HMX, RDX etc can be found in there.

The heat-resistance ability of the common explosives, cyclotetramethylenetetranitramine (HMX), cyclotrimethylenetrinitramine (RDX), pentaerythritoltetranitrate (PETN) and Tetryl decreases in the same order : HMX > RDX > PETN > Tetryl.
Some of the common high explosives, such as HMX, have such high melting points that they cannot be cast and can be used only in a particulate form.

I can think of several methods to let my imagination create safe circumstances for my explosives in these WTC fires.

1. Two-component Explosives : These, as packaged in fire resistant boxes, can be placed by any means because each separate component is nonexplosive. Mixing, however, produces a class A explosive, which can be ignited by a high temp resistant radio-controlled det cap.
Or apply a pressure sensitive det cap. In essence a piezoelectric det cap. Or just use the amperage of the P-E crystal to ignite the in situ prepared mix.
The mixing mechanism could be temperature dependant, such as when the fires reach a certain threshold value, the mixer is activated.
Or pressure dependant, when parts of the steel construction begin to fail, the pressure measured in a little electrical circuit glued to it, decreases or increases, which triggers an electrical current to ignite the explosives.
Therefore the use of planes loaded with jet fuel, to make sure widespread fires are a certainty.
Or ignition by impact.

2. Thermobaric bombs : These are the perfect solution for the task at hand, since their containment vessels can be made from high temperature independant or resistant materials, that can even be double secured by spray-on fire retardents.
The first stage of igniting a TB is to crack open its container along pre-cut incissions.
The rest I have explained now so many times already, go Search ATS for "LaBTop thermobaric".

3. TB's with alpha, beta or gamma radiation triggers. Or simply, a strong radio-wave signal trigger
I have always asked myself why that helicopter hovered above the WTC-1N roof for a short while, and it had a long rope under it with something heavy at the end. Then suddenly it sped away. This happened shortly before collapse initiation.
Note that there were no victims on both roofs, they locked all roof entrance doors.
Note also, that chopper-pilots had been forbidden by the Port Authority and NYPD brass, to try to land on those roofs, since the heavy smoke could have been sucked up by the jet motor air inlets, and cause the engine to malfunction. So, why that pilot took that risk to loose his job?
The only brave one, or the initiator? Take your pick.

4. Water submerged HE cutter charges :
Place your usual water resistant (wax, clay) cutter charge rods inside a 200 liter vessel filled with water, under the usual angle tightly against one inside vessel wall, and park them tightly beside all core columns.
The water and the vessel will never go over 100 degrees Celsius, even in an hour long 800 degrees fire, the water will boil, and evaporate a while, that's all. All localized fires lasted for no longer than 30 minutes, until all combustibles were consumed. Water resistant HE cutter charges can easily stand 100 C heat. (DATB)
Added value : water is an excellent sound muffler agent. And we saw a lot of huge thick whitish smoke rolls, a.k.a. water vapor, pumped out of one floor's height at all four facade sides, at collapse initiation.
Example North tower-top demolition, 12 floors blown to smithereens :
Explosions nr 1 were the cutter charges going off in water, triggered by any of the forementioned methods. Cutting all 47 core columns.
Explosions number 2 were the first TB's, and were much heavier, showing orange coloured fire balls rolling out of all 4 sides at a few floors under explosions nr 1.
And balloon blewed-up the next floors. Blowing all those Vierendeel triplets laterally sideways over nearly hundred meters, and dustified all concrete floor slabs.

I could come up with more systems, this however suffices for the moment to schlepp this thread on for another few pages.

edit on 8/9/14 by LaBTop because: Added radiowaves.

posted on Sep, 8 2014 @ 04:58 PM
Huge thermobaric references list made for the Trusting and Doubting readers alike :

posted on Sep, 9 2014 @ 10:45 AM
Title : WTC destruction, the Leftover candidates, Pro&Contra Arguments.
Read its page 4 :

It's about all the seismic articles that disappeared from the huge NIST online depository.

I hope you read the whole thread, and do not think at times that those O.S. Trusters there sometimes got me, every time again I countered all there arguments, and they did not return with solid rebuttals.
They can not rebut my three signature LINKS..!
They tried. But their arguments were proved by me to be far to weak to even to be worthy of serious consideration by any academic peers.

posted on Sep, 9 2014 @ 10:49 AM

originally posted by: LaBTop

These are the missing videos from all over my threads. The account of one You Tube user with over 3,500 uploaded videos was canceled, since he seemed to have copied the huge amount of his posted videos from the original posters at You Tube or elsewhere.

It can also be a neat trick to disturb online forum posts, by complaining at You Tube with at least 3 persons with different IP addresses, about copy rights. You Tube then automatically suspends your account. It would not surprise me one second, to hear that in the near future, when FOIA freed material will come available about all these false tricks that this military Cyberspace-War department will have played upon us all.

Go to 93 secs : When he went to see the replays on TV, they had taken out all the explosions he definitely and totally clear had heard in the morning, CUT-OUT !



Go to 52 seconds and see the steam rising high at the bottom of the South Twin Tower ,13 seconds before collapse.

This is that, from the locked huge >64,000 items NIST video and photo collection, FOIA freed video, with the original sound track of that camera, still in it.
Go to the 6 seconds position into this video to hear clearly, that very low explosive rumbling sound at WTC 7.

posted on Sep, 9 2014 @ 02:20 PM
Full HD-movie "ZERO, an investigation into 9-11" by Grupo Zero :

14:37 Underwriters Labs fire tests on identical steel as used in the WTC towers, confirmed the "Pancake" theory was wrong, it never happened. Even at much higher temperatures, the steel did not fail.
NIST did some sustained-temperatures tests in 2005 on original WTC steel and concluded that the temperatures it underwent were not even high enough to soften the steel. They compared painted WTC steel with identical painted steel that was heated. It showed temps not higher than 600 C as the max ever reached in the WTC steel.

Then NIST ignored their own measurements, and the Pancake theory was replaced with the Inward-Bowing theory. But they manipulated their tests, they doubled some parameters, or cut others in half. Fire exposure of steel was doubled to 90 minutes, instead of the real 45 minutes max in reality. For both towers, 45 minutes max.!

18:40 - 24:00 WTC-7.

24:00 Thermite residues.

25:10 - 29:00 Many huge explosions and many flashes and going off in rings around the buildings, reported by firefighters and people in the towers.

29:00 The Pentagon attack.

40:00 - 50:00 The circling maneuver of Flight 77, before it smashed in the west wall of the Pentagon, can not be accomplished by any pilot with thousands of hours flight experience in a 757-200,
Everyone trying that, went into a Dutch-roll when coming out of the circle, or still inside it already.

I analyzed its FDR extensively, the air speeds inside that circle were far less than PilotsFor911Truth pilot Rusty Aimer used in their Boeing 757-flight simulator circling-test video, but still, no pilot on earth could have done that, at the FDR's still impressive, real air speeds, without the auto pilot on. I showed you all, that this system was shut off indefinitely, about 10 minutes before that circling was started, according to the recovered FDR data, recovered from the black-box, found in the Pentagon debris piles.

50:00 - 59:00 NORAD = No Reasonable Air Defense on 9/11 !!! No jet fighters interception.
Pay special attention to all the Pentagon brass in that last minute, that got PROMOTED, after failing all, so majestically on 9/11.

59:00 No actual evidence that the hijackers were on all the 4 flights. The hijackers uncertainties.

1:10:30 Who did it ?

1:15:30 - 1:23:00 Al Quai'da + The Data Base = Mujahideen in Afghanistan funded by the CIA, MI6 and 5, and later hired by MPRI.

1:23:00 Flight school training. With false names from passports from Saudi Airlines and Moroccan Airlines real pilots, still flying there.

1:26:00 - 1:31:20 The three female FBI whistle blowers. The Bush administration double-speak phrase : "These attacks took us by surprise" was a pack of lies.

1:31:20 The heartbreaking story of the father of Robert (Bobby) McIlvaine jr., who died on 9/11 in the lobby of one of the Towers. It's for these I do what I do. It could happen any day again, to you, me, our children, friends, or any others.
Planned by creatures without a shimmer of morale.

The rest is the conclusions, based on what you saw and heard, with some more William Rodriguez, and Sibel Edmonds, and Gore Vidal, and more from the father of Bobby McIlvaine.
That firefighter, they took his friends away, his job away and his health away.
Them, I do all of this 9/11 posting for.

Made by

posted on Sep, 9 2014 @ 07:42 PM
I grew up in NY and I still have family in the city. I almost stopped talking to my family over this years ago, but now they are beginning to see the light.

Thank you for your efforts.

Years back I sat my friends down about ten of them and talked for like two hours about everything that was wrong with the official story. Since then there has been a wealth of information come forward. I'll watch the video when I have time.

My uncle barely made it out of one of the towers.

Lets not forget Barry Jennings, i'm sure you mentioned it. I didn't read everything you wrote yet.

posted on Sep, 11 2014 @ 02:14 AM
This is the still existing remnant of the former website with all the free accessible original News video clips and photographs. Online from 9/11/2001 up to at least April 2002.
Then Henrik Melvang decided to ask money for the 4 hours DVD he made from its, up till then, free accessible contents.
It stayed accessible through 2005, when I posted so many video and photo links to his site, which then, however, in 2006, all became dead links when his site disappeared from the net.

You can try to paste all my links to his former site, in an search page WayBack window :

Now it's called

Here is a very short excerpt, his web page text is much longer.
He seems to have lost interest in 9/11 somewhere after October 31, 2004, that's the last time he updated this page its text.

Since after that, lots of evidence however, emerged that indicated what he said up to April 2002, was indeed true.
There was indeed heavy editing going on in the newsrooms of the main US networks, they edited their 9/11 videos and sounds material, before airing it on 9/11 and the weeks after.
Lately, much more original material got wrestled loose from NIST their extensive video and sound database of over 64,000 clips that they kept under locks, based on "copyright and privacy" reasons, so they say. And of course the good old "National Security" smoke curtains, safely guarded by, and based on, that White House presidential directive Nr.12333, precisely constructed for exactly that "lock all that 9/11 evidence up" purpose.

Evidence of BOMBS INSIDE the WTC and Pentagon

Both the WTC Twin towers were exposed to heavy bombs being detonated inside and below - before the Towers fell down.

Several Bomb-explosions were taking place INSIDE the WTC and Bombs were detonated far below the Towers Crash level and these Demolition Bombs can be seen on certain and selected live TV pictures of the WTC Tower collapses.
But in general the News medias that controlled the flow of video-transmissions on Sept.11(and in the days that followed) - have tried to CENSOR most of the video clips of the WTC Tower collapse.(Manipulated video editing gives evidence of all this).
On my video I will present evidence of both "TV Picture Censorship" and "Sound Track Censorship".

The "Live TV Picture Censorship" was conducted in the following manner:

The Original Video clips of both Tower Collapses were NOT always shown in its entire length.


Last updated: October 31th - 2004

End of report.
The above text was written by Henrik Melvang, Denmark - on April 20, 2002.

posted on Sep, 11 2014 @ 02:20 AM
a reply to: LaBTop
There was indeed heavy editing going on in the newsrooms of the main US networks, they edited their 9/11 videos and sounds material, before airing it on 9/11 and the weeks after.

Very handy the B.B.C lost the internal tape's from that day in question but still have the world service tapes without the time on it

posted on Sep, 11 2014 @ 05:29 PM
The World Trade Center.

For the self declared hi-rise builders in this and other threads.
Who really think for all these 13 years that the floor decks could (one by one) have one sagging truss under them, and such non existing sagging could also happen to SINGLE 10 cm thick concrete on steel COMPOSITE floor decks.

Here are the following excerpts about the composite-floor decks and their underlaying double-trusses structuring from the book :
"Multi-Storey Buildings in Steel", Godfrey, GB (Editor); Second Edition; Collins, London, England, 1985 :

Structural system for a typical floor :

Composite floors comprise 900 mm deep bar joists (spaced at 2.04 m centers and braced transversely by secondary joists ) and a 10 cm thick lightweight concrete slab laid on steel trough decking as permanent form-work. Composite action between the concrete and the steelwork is ensured by extending the diagonal web members of the joists through the steel decking and embedding them in the slab. Dead weight of floor 50 kg/in2, imposed load 488 kg/in2.

Diagram (above): Constructional features of a prefabricated floor unit

21 Floor covering
22 In-situ concrete
23 Trough decking
24 Bar joist
25 Electrical services duct
26 Air-conditioning duct

Each upper floor comprises 32 prefabricated units spanning between core and external columns.

18 Floors have heavy steel beams instead of trusses. Consider the following quote from Engineering News-Record, January 1, 1970 :

On the 41st and 42nd floors, both towers will house mechanical equipment. To accommodate the heavy loads, the floors are designed as structural steel frame slabs. All other floors from the ninth to the top (except for 75 and 76, which will also carry mechanical equipment) have typical truss floor joists and steel decking.

Typical office floors have 4-in. thick slabs of composite construction using top chord knuckles of the joists (trusses), which extend into the slab, as shear connectors. On mechanical floors, composite action is provided by welded stud shear connectors.

So the first 8 + 6 = 14 stories, and the 41st, 42nd, 75th and 76th floors, used solid steel beams in place of trusses. Also, the top stories had special steel reinforcing diagonals called outrigger trusses.

These units are of two sizes: 18.3 x 6.0 m along the longitudinal faces of the core and 10.7 x 4.0 m along the transverse faces. Additional beams are provided to strengthen the four corner bays.

Diagram (above): Shock absorbers between floor girders and external wall: plan and elevation.

29 Viscose-elastic pads
30 High tensile steel wire
31 Steel plates

Oscillations due to wind are absorbed by viscose-elastic shock absorbers installed between the floor beams and the external columns. Electricity and telephone cables and air-conditioning ducts are incorporated in the floor units, being installed prior to erection.

Fire protection of the steelwork is provided by 3 mm thick sprayed vermiculite plaster. The core has been designed as a safety zone with emergency stairs for escape and with hydrants for active fire-fighting operations. Water for extinguishing fires is available in tanks, each of 18,500 liters capacity, which are installed on the technical services floors. Additional riser pipes are installed in the core.

Assembly of the external wall units (alternately staggered in one-story heights) and floor units.

I never saw anyone mention those 90 cm deep bar joists at every 2.04 m, and additionally braced transversely by secondary joists.
Note that the buildings were greatly stiffened by these huge composite steel-concrete floors. The floors were an integral part of the structural system and definitely not some loosely connected separate floor deck system, as that first animation tried to burn into your memories.
And certainly did not sag one by one per separate floor deck, of the 39 decks in total per side. Those 39 decks acted as one huge composite floor. And all those huge composite floors were very well welded and bolted to the core and exterior columns.

There were no whole floors ripped out by the plane impacts. Most of the impact was absorbed by the exterior columns Vierendeel triplets, some of them shoved partly a floor deep in front of the compacted plane debris, but most floors were only partly dented by parts of exterior columns plus plane debris.
There was no huge floor space dislodged. Only parts of it was sheared off, or folded up.
See this photo of a plane impact hole :

edit on 11/9/14 by LaBTop because: Now the pics fit maximal into the ATS forum window. Maximum allowed dimensions = 580x432.

posted on Sep, 14 2014 @ 02:48 PM
Since I just gave solid evidence, in a link to my other thread, a few pages back, that NIST's theory about sagging floors and thus also their trusses, based on their interpretation of photographs of something hanging in a long curve behind a row of glassless windows, is solidly proven now by me, to be impossible.
In fact, it were aluminum ceiling-rims hanging behind those empty windows, their glass shattered by the breaking through them, building and plane debris parts.

Thus, you have to freshly interpret NIST's own words from their FAQ page :

NIST conducted an extremely thorough three-year investigation into what caused the WTC towers to collapse, as explained in NIST’s dedicated Web site,
This included consideration of a number of hypotheses for the collapses of the towers.

... analyzed 236 pieces of steel from the wreckage, performed laboratory tests and sophisticated computer simulations of the sequence of events that occurred from the moment the aircraft struck the towers until they began to collapse.

Based on this comprehensive investigation, NIST concluded that the WTC towers collapsed because :

(1) the impact of the planes severed and damaged support columns, dislodged fireproofing insulation coating the steel floor trusses and steel columns, and widely dispersed jet fuel over multiple floors; and

(2) the subsequent unusually large jet-fuel ignited multi-floor fires (which reached temperatures as high as 1,000 degrees Celsius) significantly weakened the floors and columns with dislodged fireproofing to the point where floors sagged and pulled inward on the perimeter columns.

This led to the inward bowing of the perimeter columns and failure of the south face of WTC 1 and the east face of WTC 2, initiating the collapse of each of the towers.
Both photographic and video evidence—as well as accounts from the New York Police Department aviation unit during a half-hour period prior to collapse—support this sequence for each tower.

NIST’s findings do not support the “pancake theory” of collapse, which is premised on a progressive failure of the floor systems in the WTC towers (the composite floor system—that connected the core columns and the perimeter columns—consisted of a grid of steel “trusses” integrated with a concrete slab ; see diagram below). Instead, the NIST investigation showed conclusively that the failure of the inwardly bowed perimeter columns initiated collapse and that the occurrence of this inward bowing required the sagging floors to remain connected to the columns and pull the columns inwards. Thus, the floors did not fail progressively to cause a pancaking phenomenon.

NIST, now left without any solid evidence of sagging floors and trusses, now has to re-phrase that above sentence as follows :

to the point where core columns on the south face of WTC-1N and the east face of WTC-2S were failing (cut), and they sunk down a few meters and the composite floors sinking together with those core columns, pulled the perimeter columns on those sides, inwards.

And it is very convenient, that WTC-2S fell to the east, and then WTC-1N fell to the south.
Exactly what a demolition team would plan, when working under orders to keep collateral damage to the least possible.
So they planned two "hinge" demolitions, cutting the row of core columns at the east side of WTC-2S first at 09:59:04, then that tower came down eastwards.
Then they also cut a row of core columns at the south side of WTC-1N at 10:28:31 and that tower came down southwards.

To keep both towers falling to these two sides, they also had to ignite their cutter charges on the hinging sides a few microseconds earlier than the rest of the 3 sides.
Note also, that they intended to keep the lower 60 floors worth of core columns standing a few seconds longer than their exterior columns, to let these two towers their floors and exterior columns spread out around their footprints, just as you see in the aerial videos and photos.
Then the final blows were dealt to those two core remnants (spires) and they also sunk down vertically.

And which detonation method, do you think, follows everything we saw happening in all those videos of both collapses, to the letter..?

1. Thermobaric bombs, to blow up those floor spaces, and at the same time lifting those Vierendeel columns from their bolts inside their own tops and bottoms, then spitting them laterally outwards together with the pulverized concrete and steel floor-decks.

2. Depleted Uranium (DU) cutter charges to cut those thick steel core columns.
Probably placed in something alike a Wall Breaching Unit. That's a plastic double-walled shield filled with a bit of water around a 0-shaped ring formed by Det-Cord.
In this case however, a DU-lined cutter charge, inside a water filled plastic tube.
That water muffles the sound of those detonating cutters enormously.
While the sound of a cutter charge exploding deep inside a still intact building core and floors and exterior is already drowning in the immense sound from a top to bottom exploding building its floor spaces, while that all is thundering down.
Thus, these muffled ones were only needed in the exploding two tops of the WTC towers.

Btw, the North Tower started failing in the middle of that top above the plane impact, while the impacted floors kept standing under that first demolition wave.
Those were floors that had all their sprayed-on fireproofing in place and intact, and that stuff was good for at least one hour stopping heating up of their steel under it.

And the impacted floors on the sides of the impacts were not burning anymore after half an hour, all ignitable materials were already consumed then, and the fires had spread to floors above the impact levels. Thus, all that steel had already cooled down, aided by the strong winds at those 350 meters heights.

posted on Sep, 14 2014 @ 03:06 PM
Once again all speculation. Post after post of speculation.
After a FULL 13 years all the conspiracy people have is speculation.

posted on Sep, 15 2014 @ 12:00 PM
a reply to: LaBTop

You and many others in the "Truth" Movement keep falling for that most basic error in reading comprehension about pancaking floors. NIST has discovered that progressive pancaking was not the initiator of the collapse, but rather the end result of the actual initiator, which was the inward bowing and the resulting failure of the external columns, something that your magical thermobaric bombs are unable to explain, since they would have been heard loud and clear, and I'm sorry but muffling them with water would have seriously degraded their use. I dont think you still fully comprehend how a thermobaric device works. And to claim that one can muffle it with water just proves to me that you have no idea. Thermobaric devices need to scatter their fuel first before ignition. Be it a fuel air bomb or some other flammable fuel, they need to mix with the surrounding air to detonate properly. Placing water around them, makes them fizzle.

Also this magical thermobaric bomb's genesis is from the mind of Michael Riconosciuto. a gentleman of dubious backgrounds, more akin to a hoaxer than a respected professional. There is no actual literature ANYWHERE that backs up his nonsense and your entire argument is hooked on this dubious account. And this is why the "Truth" Movement has been doomed, when basic entire arguments and theories on nonsense and lies and speculation, and especially hearsay nonsense from sources that are prone to hoaxing.
edit on 9/15/2014 by GenRadek because: (no reason given)

posted on Sep, 16 2014 @ 12:28 PM
GenRadek, you just keep repeating a whole list of misconceptions in your first non-argument.
And you must know you do, because I gave you already the answers, for an identical post by you, in the last weeks.
This can't be some misunderstanding anymore, it's clearly intentional.
You are now showing your feathers.

You knew very well that I proposed cutter charges in water, not TB's in water, which is indeed impossible, a child will understand why. Because you even tried to make a fact, of water being capable of serious halting of cutter charges their cutting power and brisance.

That tiny bit of water is instantly converted to lots of whitish steam, by the white hot DU-plasma formed by the detonation of its RDX liner, and STEAM has enormous sound-muffler specs. Remember my "sound in Mist" remark now in my last answer to your same remarks?
It will however, not measurably slow down the brisance power of the cutter charge itself.

Do you seriously think this audience is dumb?
A DU-cutter charge detonation that slices through those thick steel core columns as if it was butter, is not slowed down measurably by some liters of water vapor.
But its accompanying normal high pitch sound in clean air will be filtered down remarkably.
And the cutting happened already in a normal, closed space core, not as in a bare bone left public demolition building. Even certainly in the elevator shafts spaces.

You can see the blackish demolition clouds from during the top part of WTC-1N demolition in my above first video of it, change into whitish steam clouds spitting out in rings around the lower sections of that Tower-1N. Because there were no fires or soot in its lower, intact part. So you see only steam mixed with concrete dust spitting out every third or fourth floor's windows, in downwards accelerating dust/steam rings all around that tower.

Btw, regarding your second non-argument, you seem to pop up and out of my threads, without much reading up. In a post here, or in my other latest thread, I offered specially for readers like you, about 12 or so, links to (also) government sites that explain TB's, and I even gave you patents links.
edit on 16/9/14 by LaBTop because: Link

posted on Sep, 16 2014 @ 12:41 PM

originally posted by: samkent
Once again all speculation. Post after post of speculation.
After a FULL 13 years all the conspiracy people have is speculation.

Sam, is this coincidental?
Did you base your username on this former Federal Judge?

originally posted by: AlanQaida
I had lunch yesterday in Houston with former-Federal Judge Sam Kent (the first Federal Judge found guilty of serious crimes in the US) and he told me why he thinks he was prosecuted. For those who haven't followed this, he was found guilty on perjury & sexual misconduct. Yes, he slept with those two women, but it was consensual. Actually, they were old affairs and long over. What Sam said was that "isn't is strange that the Justice Department begins sniffing around for dirt to throw at me just weeks after I ruled a heavy case against Halliburton. Then a small set of affairs turn into an untrue situation and then spun up into an unprecedented case against a Federal Judge." Of course, I told him he was nuts to rule anything against Halliburton. I also told him that this sounds like a John Grisham plotline.

" After 10 years all they have are Youtube videos and speculation."
So why are you still here, another 3 years? Obsessed about us? You are just as obsessed, together with us, about all the anomalies of 9/11.
Btw, people here expect there to be a certain amount of intelligence to participate in meaningful debate.

Like the following addition to a meaningful 9/11 debate.
It's for SamKent, who after 13 years of nuisance-raids and constant presence, still doesn't got it. After all these facts and videos we showed him.
One thing is sure, he keeps us at the ball. Perhaps that's the underlaying intent of his numerous one and two liners. In that case, thank you, Sam. You have climbed the ranks, to become one of our beloved 9/11 Mascottes.

It's a pdf debunking the "pile driver" model of the collapse of WTC-1N, for the math-impaired :

Chandler's Downward Acceleration Of WTC1 - No Math.

The roof line of the North Tower of the World Trade Center is shown to have been in constant downward acceleration until it disappeared. A downward acceleration of the falling upper block implies a downward net force, which requires that the upward resistive force was less than the weight of the block.
Newton’s second law of motion says that a net force acting on a body will cause it to accelerate. The net force and the resulting acceleration will be in the same direction. In this case, since the measured acceleration is downward, the net force is also downward. Since the net force in this case is made up of gravity (acting downward) and structural resistance (acting upward), the upward resistance must be weaker than the gravitational force.
However the gravitational force on the upper block is simply its weight, so we conclude that the resistive force is less than the weight of the upper block.

Therefore the downward force exerted by the falling block must also have been less than its weight.
Newton’s third law of motion says that forces come in pairs. Two bodies will always exert equal but opposite forces on each other. Therefore the downward force of the upper block on the lower section of the building is equal to the upward resistive force, which we have shown is less than the weight of the upper block.
Since the lower section of the building was designed to support several times the weight of the upper block, the reduced force exerted by the falling block was insufficient to crush the lower section of the building. Therefore the falling block could not have acted as a "pile driver." The downward acceleration of the upper block can be understood as a consequence of, not the cause of, the disintegration of the lower section of the building.


..from the fact that the upper block continues to move downward without deceleration, it is clear that there was no jolt, despite the significant deformation of the building in the first three seconds. (LT : no SLOWING jolt, at all)

Videos show that the section of the building above the plane impact point was the first section to disintegrate. It was significantly reduced in size prior to the onset of destruction of the lower section of the building.

See the animated GIF of the destruction of the top part of Tower-1N, with the two red horizontal lines, I posted a few posts up there.
The whole section under the lowest red line, does not change at all.!
While the whole upper top half is exploding.

posted on Sep, 16 2014 @ 01:01 PM

See the animated GIF of the destruction of the top part of Tower-1N, with the two red horizontal lines, I posted a few posts up there.
The whole section under the lowest red line, does not change at all.!
While the whole upper top half is exploding.

The top section is falling into the lower section.
Much as you would expect when the impacted floor(s) gives way.
I don't understand your surprise?

posted on Sep, 16 2014 @ 01:23 PM

originally posted by: GenRadek
a reply to: LaBTop

You and many others in the "Truth" Movement keep falling for that most basic error in reading comprehension about pancaking floors. NIST has discovered that progressive pancaking was not the initiator of the collapse, but rather the end result of the actual initiator, which was the inward bowing and the resulting failure of the external columns, something that your magical thermobaric bombs are unable to explain, since they would have been heard loud and clear, and I'm sorry but muffling them with water would have seriously degraded their use. I don't think you still fully comprehend how a thermobaric device works. And to claim that one can muffle it with water just proves to me that you have no idea. Thermobaric devices need to scatter their fuel first before ignition. Be it a fuel air bomb or some other flammable fuel, they need to mix with the surrounding air to detonate properly. Placing water around them, makes them fizzle.

And you're the one complaining about reading comprehension.?
From my post above yours :
""In this case however, a DU-lined cutter charge, inside a water filled plastic tube. ""

You have the order wrong :
""the actual initiator, which was the inward bowing and the resulting failure of the external columns, something that your magical thermobaric bombs are unable to explain, since they would have been heard loud and clear,""

You do not understand at all, or do not read my full posts at all.
Explain what in fact was the cause of that NIST inward bowing.
Because I gave the evidence that sagging trusses, let it be sagging concrete on steel decks composite floors, was a non-argument, a few posts back (with link). NIST staff at least mis-interpreted those sagging aluminum ceiling rims.!

The DU-cutter charges will have cut the southern row of core columns of the North Tower first ( the one with the antenna).
Then it s t a r t s leaning southwards, the sunken row of cut southern core columns pulled down the composite floors that were still firmly attached on hundreds of points and strips to those core AND exterior columns. Thus pulling those exterior columns partly inwards, mostly opposite of those cut core columns.

DU since Jeff Prager found all those nuclear fission products in lock-step, (do you even remember that DU when exploded, will result in the same fission products Jeff found?

Then they cut the core columns halfway up the 15 stories high burning top part, then the TB's blew that upper top half to kingdom come, the upper half sunk into the lower half which took 3 seconds, measured by David Chandler, of unobstructed demolition. No measurable RESISTANCE at all.
Then they cut all core columns just under that lowest red line in that above animated GIF picture, and then the whole sequence of cutting core columns at 3 stories high lengths, then blowing 3 to 4 floors up with TB's, was started, all the way down that tower.
And none of the planners gave a damn anymore about explosion sounds, because they calculated those explosions so rapidly, to become one overwhelming sound train.
edit on 16/9/14 by LaBTop because: Accidentally hit the post button, wasn't ready yet.

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