We have 500 Jihadists from the UK presently fighting for the New Islamic State

a reply to: Soloprotocol

I can't think of catching thesed men as a witch hunt, their crimes are too serious and disgusting.

This is one circumstance where I could see people's justice taking place were someone outed as having fought for ISIS had he have slipped in unnoticed by the UK Goverment.

a reply to: GogoVicMorrow

I think Al Jazeera gave the number of ISIS fighters as closer to 40,000 though the Sunni living near Bagdad have agreed to try to stop them and Bagdad has changed its Government.

Apparently Al Malaki was not acceptable to the USA because he had paid USA for weapons and the USA decided not to send him, so he had to buy weapons from the Russians which Obama got narked about - how treacherous though is that?

It opens the question of what governments are doing that we the people don't know about but ultimately pay the price for with terrorists targeting us instead of those responsible.

There is too much dirty dealing and at some time it has to stop and politicians must be made to honour their word, otherwise we will only slip further and further into a mire no one wants.

a reply to: weirdguy
Hey dude...I dont know who it is in your Avatar, but that's my Doppleganger (from the mid 80's)...Spooky man.

Sorry to leave the topic, but it had to be said.

It's the fault of Cameron and his lie s he was jumping up and down wanting to go into Syria because of th lies that Assad,s regime was using chemical weapons and the rebels needed Britains help I'm pretty sure these young fools thought they were doing the right thing ggoing over to help the people the British government wanted to help but the British people wouldn't allow it by now they these young fools are beyond repair terrorist in training to come home to roost and start something in the UK the question is do governments benefit form terrorist threat ? Are people becoming to wise to the untrustworthy governments hence all the turmoil and is it all part of a plan surely if you don't want people going over to be jihadists you talk about it and give others ideas

a reply to: pennydrops

It makes one wonder what exactly is the Agenda of the Western parties that set them up and the agenda of those who are fighting for ISIS.

All ISIS fighters are into modern technology but I cannot see too much freedom for it in an Islamic State that follows the Saudi or other severe regimes. I wonder whether they actually know what they are in form when they have come from the West if they realise their goal?

originally posted by: Soloprotocol
a reply to: weirdguy
Hey dude...I dont know who it is in your Avatar, but that's my Doppleganger (from the mid 80's)...Spooky man.

Sorry to leave the topic, but it had to be said.

dude, that's me. 80s? I still look like that. We must be left over from a clone experiment gone wrong.

If found out and it's 100% fact that he/she left to join another country to kill. They should send the family over there.
Wonder how many would come back and or would think twice about joining up with ISIS IS Stupid munch bunch!
All you can hope for is that they are running around trying to catch the bombs falling

a reply to: daaskapital

I think that if people wanted to leave Australia and they had the money to do so, they would find a way out. I also suppose they would find the same way back in after. I think our only way of catching them is when they are out of the country and cannot be produced. One ease way is credit card transaction - if it goes silent, mobile phones there are several ways of establishing whether someone is there or not and even the police going to the home and requesting to see them.

I worry when it gets to numbers like 500 which is a lot of people for the police and MI5 and who ever the Australian secret sercret services have to cope with over there. Its the same around the world, if 40,000 insurgents are there, then its a lot of people to hunt down if they try to return to their families living safely abroad.

The best deterrant IMHO is to deport the families and confiscate their belongings and assets to send to the families of the sufferers of the war these men fought in. Its the one Israeli policy I do think is absolutely right and fair. All too often we get the soppy simpering Muslim "OOH I didn't know he had gone to fight in a holy war, but its a holy war, sorry know nothing about killing, rape etc Islam is loving OOh la la la". Sorry doesn't wash.

Do we have any data on the welfare status of any of these fighters? seems a bit weird to make out they are all from poor families.

a reply to: Britguy

I think you are spot on about governments doing Rothschild and his bankers demands. However I don't think that is exactly the problem, we have moved on to another worse in some ways. There doesn't appear to be a group with a plan in the back ground, what does appear is is a world made up of oligarchs but more selfish families trying to run the world with no coordinated plans as eventually they will have to fight rothschild versus rockafellers lot if we are lucky and kill themselves off completely

But its the lack of a policy for any betterment that we see coming from the Western governments, both the USA and UK especially know that their time of corruption is slowly coming to an end because the publics are so fed up with their policies and waste of funds needed to better the lifestyle and environment in these country's - our infrastructure is creaking and desperately needs a huge cash injection to improve things for the average Brit as well as investment in new entrepreneurs to start up work and opportunities for our young.

Its because of the chaos and the sly different parties involved that we have this horrible mess that doesn't appear to have any cohesive policy behind it that I suspect ha been grasped by who ever promotes these young men to go to fight. They see the chaos and lack of control by bent governments allied to the bankers and oligarchs and the zionist web around the world and perhaps this is the only way they can see to fight such a situation eg create a new state outside of what we have existing today.

Its no excuse but something/someone has driven these men to fight back and be especially evil in order to shock the world. For the men themselves, if they survive they have to face their kid sisters and mothers when they get home. I wonder how many mothers, especially, who will look on their sons with the same love in their eyes knowing what they are capable of doing? Once a line has been crossed its moved further into barbarism we are all less safe.

a reply to: WilsonWilson

Nothing to my knowledge. If you think back though we had a dentist trying to blow up some airport in Scotland I think so it goes across the lines of wealth and I expect they come from all walks of life.

My hope is that many young men will think twice about joint because they do not want to fight a war of killing unarmed civilians and especially women and children.

originally posted by: Shiloh7
a reply to: Soloprotocol

I can't think of catching thesed men as a witch hunt, their crimes are too serious and disgusting.

This is one circumstance where I could see people's justice taking place were someone outed as having fought for ISIS had he have slipped in unnoticed by the UK Goverment.

In my home town a young guy and a woman were arrested when they were/are suspected of funding ISIS via various criminal activity. No-one in town had a clue what they were up to until they were arrested.
www.chad.co.uk...

They were bailed back to their address, which was a BIG mistake because crowds of locals found out and staged protests outside their house demanding they GTFO of our country. Police have had to move them to keep them safe from locals. But what about keeping UK citizens safe from ISIS fanatics? They aren't all leaving the country to fight, many are still here planning and plotting for ISIS, and they could be our neighbours.

a reply to: doobydoll

Agree totally with you and as you say though why come here and then go back. It makes one wonder if they have a different news system giving different information out as it doesn't make sense. I did see something about some trial of someone who had been a fighter but I suspect if they are found guilty it could be community service and no deportation as I would prefer to see. I do think if they know their families will suffer by being put into the war zone they helped create many wouldn't go in the first place.

Its Blair and cameron's responsibility for this along with other country's and these men need to come up to the line to sort this quickly. Personally I don't have any faith in cameron, he's just a posh lackey for queenie buy blair did give a very good speech about the danger these fighters and their ideology posed to the West - how he faced the camera with such dirty hands though himself knowing he helped to create their existence, I don't know.

a reply to: doobydoll

These are definitely not the kind of people you want in your country... at all. I'll be honest, I think the death penalty is good... you cannot change them now at this point - they are thoroughly brainwashed now...

Why bother housing them, feeding them etc in a prison when you really don't need to deal with the possible consequences of letting them out again?

My two cents on that...

originally posted by: supamoto
I hope they never let them back in the UK. They want to go fight there, let them die there too.

I agree, why the big fuss ? If they want to go and fight let them. Let them believe in the almighty Allah (just for the record i don't believe in any religion) and that he will reward them after death. But the way the UK is they will probably be let back in to the country and claim some sort of benefit.

originally posted by: ThePeaceMaker

originally posted by: supamoto
I hope they never let them back in the UK. They want to go fight there, let them die there too.

I agree, why the big fuss ? If they want to go and fight let them. Let them believe in the almighty Allah (just for the record i don't believe in any religion) and that he will reward them after death. But the way the UK is they will probably be let back in to the country and claim some sort of benefit.

The big fuss is that if they are British passport holders then we can't stop them returning here whenever they like, they are British citizens like us.

I say if they leave here to fight for ISIS, and/or are caught funding terrorist armies, then confiscate their passports upon their exit and send their families to join them.

Knowing our gov, nothing will be done even when the UK is a smouldering heap from terrorist attacks. Gov is more concerned with keeping terrorists safe from citizens than the other way around, talk about backwards.

a reply to: Shiloh7

I have been fighting extremism for years and years now - from the inside, as I am also Muslim. I will offer up my perspective here, I hope you don't mind.

They have websites and all where they export this extreme (and false) interpretation of Islam. People like me, we go there, and use polemics etc and show this interpretation as being wholly wrong.

I used to do this 8-12 hours a day (some days 16) every day after I got hurt and couldn't work a normal job. Many people do this in their off hours - still 4-8 hours a day after work, every single day. Many like me who practically make this a career - we just don't get paid.

And some people you gain, and some people you loose. We always seem to loose way more than we gain... its like for every 1 we pull away, there are 10 more joining this false belief.

So I started working on getting the worst of these websites down, but ran into much difficulty and opposition in that - between their supposed freedoms and the governments incessant desire to "know what they are talking about" it's near impossible to shut them down...

Anyhow, I was talking to my husband and he disagrees also about shutting these sites down. He says that is not the actual source of the problem, the source of the problem is whatever makes them feel disenfranchised from the rest of society which makes them prone to accepting extremism.

Something I was thinking about, since it is more European countries that are seeing the brunt of converts to extremism... a low estimate of 12,000 (but could be as much as 16-20 thousand) from Europe alone fighting in Iraq and Syria right now, either for ISIS or for Al-Qaeda. Those are absolutely large numbers, and these are young men (18-30 year olds), whose parents are usually not extremists themselves - they aren't learning it at home in other words. Cultural Muslims who try to practice their faith yes, extremists no.

I do think we have to figure out what is making large numbers of European muslims prone to extremism... and I wonder if it is not, as my husband says... a feeling of disenfranchisement from society at large.

The one thing Europe did was to allow large numbers of immigrants without really working on integrating them into society, so you have these children growing up in immigrant communities who perhaps feel as though they are outcasts from the rest of the country.

I don't know... but I think it is worth thinking about... a lack of integration and allowing too many immigrants all at the same time, could be a contributing factor.

Someone once was discussing that... saying how if you have a group of 30 people all working on a project together, and you add one to the group, then the group integrates the 1... when you add 5, the 5 keep to themselves more, eventually becoming a part of the group but much slower than the 1 did, but when you add 15, they will keep to themselves and isolate themselves from the rest of the group...

This is probably part of the reason extremism is growing. There are almost more European and other foreign muslims fighting in Iraq and Syria than there are Middle Eastern Muslims....Al-Qaeda and ISIS have gotten a substantial part of their fighting forces from our disenfranchised kids...

Anyway, its something to think about... what is the root cause of making someone susceptible to extremism?

I think the issues is that a lot of them are British born, we can't just strip them of their passports and say we don't want them back. The countries they are currently terrorize won't want to keep them. I say charge them with war crimes.

originally posted by: WilsonWilson
I think the issues is that a lot of them are British born, we can't just strip them of their passports and say we don't want them back.

Why can't we?

a reply to: doobydoll

Why should some other country get stuck with our trash,we can't just flip tip them in someone else garden.