Atheism, not religion, is the real force behind the mass murders of history

a reply to: tsingtao

atheism replaced God with the self. that's all they have done.

How do you replace something that was never there in the first place?

How can you be sure that God doesn't exist? Are you sure you know everything there is about existence? But let's say science was to prove that we're in a simulation, people would have no problems believing that, just because science says so, yet there would be little difference between that and a man waving his wand in the sky and creating everything.

You know in Sim City you just click and drag an icon to build something? Well, that's how God works. He clicks on an icon, toggles the amount that he wants, and voila, a species appear. Instead of a wand, he uses a mouse and keyboard.

You know, when I took programming classes, I was always fascinated by how a series of 0s and 1s can just manifest themselves into graphic. To me, we are already gods on a mini-level(including the ability to clone and revive extinct species already). God is merely someone with a computer with much much higher processing power and memory.

originally posted by: np6888
To me, we are already gods on a mini-level(including the ability to clone and revive extinct species already). God is merely someone with a computer with much much higher processing power and memory.

I actually believe that's probably the reality of it. (Layers upon layers upon layers over billions of years).

But, what is "god".

When you think about it though, atheism has indeed been a driving force for mass murders of history.

I mean, weren't they heretics in the eyes of the major religions back in the day and thus a prime target for murder?

...or religion caused Atheism?
Joseph Stalin - Raised in the Georgian Orthodox faith
Adolf Hitler - was born to a practicing Catholic mother and an anticlerical father

The best example of religious persecution in America is the Salem witch trials. How many people were killed in those trials? Thousands? Hundreds? Actually, fewer than 25.

Yes, pay no attention to the number of witch executions worldwide which were in the thousands.

originally posted by: adjensen
a reply to: ArnoldNonymous

This may help you: The War Audit. This was a BBC funded study to determine the role that religion played in war, and rated all known major conflicts on a scale of 0 - 5, with zero being "religion played no role" and five being "it was all about religion". When they were done, a grand total of three conflicts received a five -- the Muslim conquests, the Crusades and the Wars of Reformation, and the vast majority of conflicts rated a zero.

Here are the relevant charts (right click and open in a new window to see them larger):

I'm going to use these charts which by the way are very well sourced to prove the OP wrong.....

Everything that caused a war that was not based on religion received a zero slot. This includes: wars caused by economic differences, race, natural resources, border arguments, governmental differences, humanitarian reasons, land grabs, taxation, broken treaties....this ENTIRE LIST AND ALL OTHER REASONS I COULDNT THINK OF received a COMBINED TOTAL of 43 slots

Vs

religion ( gets the 1 thru 5 slots) ALL BY ITS SELF got 29 slots


Think about it.

If you can name a MILLION reasons of what causes a war and it so happens that 400k of them is a religious reason what does that tell you? Think about it people.

originally posted by: Alien Abduct
This was a BBC funded study... ... which by the way are very well sourced to prove the OP wrong.....

Something else to think about...

The MSM is ALWAYS driven by a hidden agenda.

If they are airing something, it is going to be deceptive.

FYI, I'm not defending religion, it too is driven by hidden agendas.

All I'm saying is I will NEVER trust anything the mainstream media says.

History shows us without a shadow of a doubt, that religion was invariably used as a façade to hide the true purpose of all wars of aggression: That is, the consolidation of power through fear and the acquisition of wealth in all its manifestations. www.inthenameofallah.org...

"Atheism, not religion, is the real force behind the mass murders of history"
Yes and ebola will cure your annoying seasonal flu....
Oh and Hitler was a nice man....

a reply to: Alien Abduct

religion ( gets the 1 thru 5 slots) ALL BY ITS SELF got 29 slots

I should point out the criteria of ranking, which is:

In calculating the role of religion in major wars we focused on five components:

q religion as a mobiliser
q religious motivation and discourse by political leaders
q attacks on symbolic religious targets
q conversion goals
q strong support from religious leaders

The presence or lack of these five factors was the determinant of the role of religion in the given conflict. Due to the nature of this methodology these are debateable findings. For instance one leader may declare simply ‘May God bless us and watch over us’ whereas another may declare that ‘God calls us, his chosen people, to annihilate our enemies’. Both are employing a religious discourse yet there is clearly a difference in severity. Measuring this difference is difficult and our findings had to reflect this. Some components are more straightforward such as religion as a mobiliser. Of the five levels outlined in the table, 0 represents a minimal or virtually nonexistent religious element to the conflict. For instance, in the Korean War religion was marginal to what was a primarily ideological struggle. Whether a conflict is rated 1-5 represents a broad application of the five criteria above. (Source)

So a simple "God bless us", spoken by a leader in a speech, is sufficient to provide a ranking above zero. I think it's only when you get into the 3, 4 and 5 range that you are actually seeing a significant impact from religion, and that takes the number down to seven conflicts. In all recorded history.

a reply to: Murgatroid

All I'm saying is I will NEVER trust anything the mainstream media says.

Which makes you willfully ignorant.

Actual academics and scholars do not post their findings on the crackpot websites that you implicitly trust, they are published in mainstream media. By dismissing the conventional avenue of information dissemination, you are dismissing credible sources of data in favour of kooks and speculators.

It is no wonder that you come to the ridiculously unsupportable positions that you do.

There has never been a war fought for atheism.

This thread is ridiculous.

a reply to: ArnoldNonymous

Atheism is a religion that worships the absence of god. They have gatherings and wealthy atheist "leaders" that organize stuff in several countries. Those atheist leaders are essentially a god to most "devoted" atheists.

Most who claim to be an atheist dont fully comprehend how similar to other religions it is. They enjoy sharing atheist literature and enjoying reading and studying it as much as a christian enjoys the bible.

If you dont claim a religion then thats not atheism. Its just not claiming a religion.

Yep, atheists were behind the crusades. Gotcha. They were also behind Jonestown, David Koresh, Ruby Ridge and how many others? yeah, ok.

a reply to: darkwarrior

By definition, atheist means anti-theist. We don't believe in any god. It's not a religion, but yes atheists do seek out other atheists just like artists seek out other artists. It's a social thing.

I notice that the several denials of Hitler's stated Christianity and Catholicism are not referenced by any external citations, while evidence of his faith and religious beliefs have been above and are below.

Perhaps you folks should state that it is your personal "belief" that Hitler wasn't Christian, or doesn't meet your criteria for being Christian, or that you don't want to acknowledge that a Christian committed the acts that he did, but your simple denials are merely your opinion, not fact.

Adolf Hitler

It will at any rate be my supreme task to see to it that in the newly awakened NSDAP, the adherents of both Confessions can live peacefully together side by side in order that they may take their stand in the common fight against the power which is the mortal foe of any true Christianity.

Source -Adolf Hitler, in an article headed "A New Beginning," 26 Feb. 1925

We are a people of different faiths, but we are one. Which faith conquers the other is not the question; rather, the question is whether Christianity stands or falls.... We tolerate no one in our ranks who attacks the ideas of Christianity... in fact our movement is Christian. We are filled with a desire for Catholics and Protestants to discover one another in the deep distress of our own people.

Source -Adolf Hitler, in a speech in Passau, 27 October 1928, Bundesarchiv Berlin-Zehlendorf

The fact that the Vatican is concluding a treaty with the new Germany means the acknowledgement of the National Socialist state by the Catholic Church. This treaty shows the whole world clearly and unequivocally that the assertion that National Socialism is hostile to religion is a lie.

Source-Adolf Hitler, 22 July 1933, writing to the Nazi Party

AND IF THAT DOESN'T MAKE THE POINT CLEAR ....


POINT 24 of the NSDAP (Nationalsozialistische Deutsche Arbeiterpartei aka The Nazi Party)

24. We demand freedom of religion for all religious denominations within the state so long as they do not endanger its existence or oppose the moral senses of the Germanic race. The Party as such advocates the standpoint of a positive Christianity without binding itself confessionally to any one denomination. It combats the Jewish-materialistic spirit within and around us, and is convinced that a lasting recovery of our nation can only succeed from within on the framework: The good of the state before the good of the individual

Source: Konrad Heiden, A History of National Socialism, 1935. Translated by Alfred A. Knopf, page 17

Joseph Goebbels

The idea of sacrifice first gained visible shape in Christ. Sacrifice is intrinsic to socialism.... The Jew, however, does not understand this at all. His socialism consists of sacrificing others for himself. This is what Marxism is like in practice.... The struggle we are now waging today until victory or the bitter end, is in its deepest sense, a struggle between Christ and Marx. Christ: the principle of love. Marx: the principle of hate.

Source-Joseph Goebbels, Michael: Ein deutsches Schicksl in Tagebuchblattern (Munich, 1929)

When today a clique accuses us of having anti-Christian opinions, I believe that the first Christian, Christ himself, would discover more of his teaching in our actions than in this theological hair-splitting.

Source -Joseph Goebbels, Evangelisches Zentralarchiv in Berlin, 2 March 1934: Hamburg

Source for these quotations. You will find reams of additional evidence of the direct connection between Nazism and the Christian Religion at the link, if you're interested in facts.

Atheism ...Theism...Bah
It's like the blind arguing on which color should they paint the room.

One thing I know, Acceptance never killed masses and Acceptance should be the first word that comes to mind about others beliefs.

Oh, and speaking of facts here's a few more:

a) Hitler was baptized as Roman Catholic during infancy in Austria.

b) As Hitler approached boyhood he attended a monastery school. (On his way to school young Adolf daily observed a stone arch which was carved with the monastery’s coat of arms bearing a swastika.)

c) Hitler was a communicant and an altar boy in the Catholic Church.

d) Hitler was NEVER excommunicated nor condemned by his church.

And further...

"Around 1937, when Hitler heard that at the instigation of the party and the SS vast numbers of his followers had left the church because it was obstinately opposing his plans, he nevertheless ordered his chief associates, above all Goering and Gobbels, to remain members of the church. He too would remain a member of the Catholic Church, he said, although he had no real attachment to it. And in fact he remained in the church until his suicide."

(Inside the Third Reich by Albert Speer page 95-96)

I do realize these are inconvenient truths.

Source.

originally posted by: haarvik
a reply to: darkwarrior

. . . yes atheists do seek out other atheists just like artists seek out other artists. It's a social thing.

They do? Where? I've never met another atheist. Atheism is not exactly part of everyday conversation.

And just because you lack belief in a god, doesn't mean you're gonna have anything in common with another atheist.

However, I do support more organization and groups. Mainly because minorities have to unite to have their voice heard. Separation of church and state is the main focus of American Atheists.

a reply to: Annee

They do? Where?

Sunday Assemblies: sundayassembly.com

And after the "Great Schism", lol, Godless Revival: www.facebook.com