supressed information. psychology "they" don't want you to know.

a reply to: mOjOm

So in your warped mind, blue balls is pleasure. Interesting.

originally posted by: mattsawaufo
a reply to: mOjOm

So in your warped mind, blue balls is pleasure. Interesting.

No, I consider "Blue Balls" to be something only a child would say. However...

What you're talking about there is Repressing Sexual Desire not Sexual Desire. "Blue Balls" as you like to word it, is a reference to a repressing or attempting to block sexual desire rather than releasing it or dealing with it in some other way. Sexual Desire when you can express it isn't pain but pleasure. The pain comes from trying to go against a natural function.

How about the other questions I asked???

originally posted by: mattsawaufo
Brain Owner's Guide Excelsior a complete psychology handbook

pleasure is caused by cells reproducing via food or rest (even blinking) or procreation or increasing bloodflow (such as walking Or caffeine or a warm bath or alcohol or drugs or ibuprophen) or breathing or evacuation of bodily waste Or 98.6 degree body temperature or the removal or pain or anything known to cause pleasure.

pain is the dying of cells or Death or hunger or fatigue or sexual arousal or adrenaline rush or crying or restriction of body (or mind) or full bowel/bladder or a rise/lowering of body temperature or illness Or regurgitating or sneezing or Removal of pleasure or anything known to cause pain. 

So to summarize these first two paragraphs, "Pleasure is caused by anything known to cause pleasure and pain is caused by anything known to cause pain." Hmmmm...mind blowing.
Also, sneezing is quite pleasurable for me

males and females have different humor tastes.

Everyone has a different sense of humor, it's not a male/female thing.

All jokes say pain is pleasure and pleasure is pain...

Ok...not really following. What about the classic "Why did the chicken cross the road?" Not much pain or pleasure going on there...

pain impairs judgement. Anger is when a source of pain is experiencing pleasure.

For me, pain has the tendency to sharpen my focus. Some have a low threshold for pain, maybe those are who you are referring to?

Crying is a response to pain

Tears of joy?

The goal of all activity is to cure pains with Pleasure.People "love" pleasure and "hate" pain. Pleasure is good and pain is bad. Pleasure is healthy and pain is unhealthy.

Lots of generalizations in this writing, not everyone fits this standard you seem to have. In fact I'm willing to bet that your standards of pain and pleasure apply to maybe half of all people.

People do what they think will cause pleasure and avoid that which they think causes pain. People love other people because of mutual pleasures and pains they share and teaming up is seen as increasing chances of pleasure/survival (even blind ants surround the queen and hold hands to protect her)

This is basic survival. Life is much more primal that you may be lead to believe. Instincts will always exist.

Repetition or Transcription or rhyming makes things easier to remember.

Finally something I can agree with.

Comparisons, metaphors, parables, etcetera etcetera are mental tricks.

Tricks, or shortcuts?

Unconcious hypnosis trance does not exist and all hypnosis does is make a person crave pleasures more. Hypnotists tell a person to imagine pleasure and describe the pleasure using all 5 senses using the imagination which relaxes a person. Intoxication makes a person easier to hypnotize.

I'm highly skeptical of hypnosis, so I have to agree with the statement "Does not exist" until I'm proven wrong...the rest...not too sure.

Money isn't happiness, pleasure is happiness.

Money can buy pleasure, leading to happiness.

This will not help you trick people

Of course it won't, it's a bunch of poorly explained ideas.

this information will merely facilitate logic and reasoning.

I can't see how that would be possible...

Music is based on beat of highest treble note.

What? I've been a musician for over 20 years, and the only possible way I can see this applied would be in the case of an extremely simple arrangement with a 4/4 or maybe a 3/4 signature. Some of the most powerful music doesn't follow 'standard' layouts, in fact the power comes from the way seemingly misaligned tempos and accents ebb and flow. More extreme generalizations that have no real substance, in my opinion.

Pain is unavoidable...SUFFERING, however is OPTIONAL.....

What a waste of time this OP was.

a reply to: mOjOm

Do you not know what the word procreation means? I'll be glad when school is back in, in a few weeks.

originally posted by: mattsawaufo
a reply to: mOjOm

Do you not know what the word procreation means? I'll be glad when school is back in, in a few weeks.

Yah, smart guy. You do realize sexual activities are not limited to Procreation, yes???

You should be glad school is back on soon because you obviously need some serious time there. I on the other had have been out of school for a very long time so you can stop trying to act superior intellectually or otherwise.

You obviously feel threatened by other simply asking you valid questions about your half-ass theory. If your only defense for your argument is to insult others with personal attacks, then you've already lost.

originally posted by: mattsawaufo
a reply to: ChaosComplex

Take your medication.
Stop self medicating.
You suffer from an inferiority complex.

Interesting diagnosis, Dr. Phil.

Care to address any of the points I made about your OP?
If you want to discuss the points you're trying to make then by all means, let's see what you've got. Otherwise, your textbook ATS bu11sh!tter responses so far in this thread say all I really need to know.

originally posted by: subtopia
supressed information. psychology "they" don't want you to know.

Of course they don't want you to know it, how else are they going to pay off their Uni debts if people could heal their own mental conflicts.

How would they pay for their holidays, how would they get their kickbacks from writing unnecessary prescriptions.

I have yet to get a single 'kickback' and pay is in the toilet. I do therapy and crisis work because I love to help. Now...I will agree that not all in clinical psychology therapists feel the same...but who am I to try and point out the fakers?

Psychiatry...well that's a whole other area that I could go on about...some good and some bad

But as far as the psychology of self healing...I recall the words of my clinical director from my internship

She said "Kyo (not my real name obviously), a real therapist is a person who offers an ear and guidance to help their client find the answer they already know."

THAT is what I believe we do in therapy and I have seen it work over and over. I do feel we have to move away from the 'expert model' and move towards the 'empowerment model.' Again, that's a whole other discussion. People DO have the power to heal themselves (within reason) but unfortunately, the environment and indeed our own processes make it difficult to see the light and truth we have buried under our own rubble...my job is to remove rubble...NOT to tell my client what the light is saying

a reply to: KyoZero

I have done what some consider "counselling" professionally for years now but in an industry you probably wouldn't take seriously (and I wouldn't either if basing my profession on what I see most of my contemporaries do with clients) but I wanted to chime in on your point.

Empowerment has always been my goal. The people seeking help just need better tools to access what they already know. I'm delighted to hear your sentiments from a person in a more conventional branch of therapy. It's awesome and I'm sure your clients are blessed to have your help.

originally posted by: Cuervo
a reply to: KyoZero

I have done what some consider "counselling" professionally for years now but in an industry you probably wouldn't take seriously (and I wouldn't either if basing my profession on what I see most of my contemporaries do with clients) but I wanted to chime in on your point.

Empowerment has always been my goal. The people seeking help just need better tools to access what they already know. I'm delighted to hear your sentiments from a person in a more conventional branch of therapy. It's awesome and I'm sure your clients are blessed to have your help.

I think you'd be quite surprised what I take seriously

Shamanism, Reiki, hypnosis...I've experienced all of them...and I want to train in shamanism once I get past some clinical licensure

but yes empowerment is the model

I am not going to take credit for this original thought...I swear someone on ATS said this first...but I am way too lazy to search

One of the differences I notice between social work and psychology (again, as pointed out by this member) is that social work tends towards empowerment while psychology tends towards expertise. I do consider myself very good at diagnosis and treatment of anxiety and PTSD...but I still always tend towards empowerment...I was trained in clinical psych and the expert model was rampant...it was all about "I am the professional therefore I know"

That just does not seem right to me. The last I checked, nobody in this world knows your mind like you...I can at best be a willing and very learned spectator...and yes help

Ok...not really following. What about the classic "Why did the chicken cross the road?" Not much pain or pleasure going on there...

To get to the other side.

Why, oh why, did the poor chicken cross the road?

(Pain: a chicken getting ran over on a dangerous road)

(Pleasure: to make it to the other side, not getting ran over [relief, pleasure], to attain something on the other side [fulfillment, pleasure].)

Am I the only one seeing that?

This classic comedy is clearly related to pain and pleasure.

Why did it cross? Poor thing got ran over. So painful.
Oh, wait, no it didn't, how funny, it made it, that's pleasurable.

(edit: Wow, I feel remedial with this one .. that's funny, enjoying being remedial, having pleasure in a painful thing.. lol)

originally posted by: r0xor

Ok...not really following. What about the classic "Why did the chicken cross the road?" Not much pain or pleasure going on there...

To get to the other side.

Why, oh why, did the poor chicken cross the road?

(Pain: a chicken getting ran over on a dangerous road)

(Pleasure: to make it to the other side, not getting ran over [relief, pleasure], to attain something on the other side [fulfillment, pleasure].)

Am I the only one seeing that?

This classic comedy is clearly related to pain and pleasure.

Why did it cross? Poor thing got ran over. So painful.
Oh, wait, no it didn't, how funny, it made it, that's pleasurable.

(edit: Wow, I feel remedial with this one .. that's funny, enjoying being remedial, having pleasure in a painful thing.. lol)

You must have been brought up with a different version of the joke.
Q: Why did the chicken cross the road?
A: To get to the other side.
No pain, no pleasure. Just a stupid joke, that is one of the countless exceptions the OP was asking to be pointed out.

The intelligence community I would imagine would suppress any sort of advances that could make the public smarter and more able to watch out for themselves. Just like they kill people over letters of the alphabet. It doesn't make sense. You would think they would want the whole of the population to be stronger, smarter, more well equipped and able to do. Definitely not stupid, poor, subservient and completely helpless. Yet, that's what they do. Kinda frugal or medieval IMO but hey, I guess guns over brains wins every time.

a reply to: ChaosComplex

I'm just taking a guess at this so don't take it too seriously or anything.

The chicken had a desire to cross the road. As long as that desire remained unfulfilled it served as a source of pain. Longing is pain. Wanting for something is a form of pain, no after how trivial or ephemeral. Once it crossed the road that desire was fulfilled, resulting in pleasure. Mission accomplished. Basking in the glory of your achievements.

The chicken crossing the road is just a metaphor describing any desire and a fulfillment of it. Pain/pleasure.

I guess every human experience or interaction with other humans can be described in terms of pain/pleasure, simply because the degrees of both cover such a wide spectrum and even overlap as in the ops example of tickling. Or maybe there are some examples I just haven't thought of. II'm not god after all. But at first glance it set to me that the entire human experience is about pain/pleasure.

The question is, how far are you willing to go to receive pleasure? Are you willing to experience some pain for the sake of others? Are you willing to sacrifice a little pleasure now in order to receive a greater pleasure later? After all, pleasure is most intense after a period of pain. In this way, pain becomes pleasure. Working hard can be painful, but the pleasure after a job well done when seeing the results of your hard work can be considered "worth it". Once this is understood and experienced thoroughly, the hard work doesn't even feel like pain anymore, because you know that a great reward is coming.

But what about when you spend a lot of hard work doing something and the expected rewarddoes not come? You spend hours mmeticulously building a house of cards, and when you are nearly finished, you accidentally bump into it and knock the entire thing down, or someone else comes along and does it. Does it matter if it was you or another person? Does it feel better when you have someone to blame for your missed pleasure? What if it's your dog or cat hopping up on your lap, happy to see you? Can you really get mad?

a reply to: ChaosComplex

I'm just taking a guess at this so don't take it too seriously or anything.

The chicken had a desire to cross the road. As long as that desire remained unfulfilled it served as a source of pain. Longing is pain. Wanting for something is a form of pain, no after how trivial or ephemeral. Once it crossed the road that desire was fulfilled, resulting in pleasure. Mission accomplished. Basking in the glory of your achievements.

The chicken crossing the road is just a metaphor describing any desire and a fulfillment of it. Pain/pleasure.

I guess every human experience or interaction with other humans can be described in terms of pain/pleasure, simply because the degrees of both cover such a wide spectrum and even overlap as in the ops example of tickling. Or maybe there are some examples I just haven't thought of. II'm not god after all. But at first glance it set to me that the entire human experience is about pain/pleasure.

The question is, how far are you willing to go to receive pleasure? Are you willing to experience some pain for the sake of others? Are you willing to sacrifice a little pleasure now in order to receive a greater pleasure later? After all, pleasure is most intense after a period of pain. In this way, pain becomes pleasure. Working hard can be painful, but the pleasure after a job well done when seeing the results of your hard work can be considered "worth it". Once this is understood and experienced thoroughly, the hard work doesn't even feel like pain anymore, because you know that a great reward is coming.

But what about when you spend a lot of hard work doing something and the expected rewarddoes not come for whatever reason? I guess that's where the virtue of patience comes in handy as well as the realization that you can plan a pretty picnic but you can't predict the weather. Sorry I'm done rambling now

a reply to: ChaosComplex

For example if you put your hand on a stove you will get anxiety because you know if it's turned on it will burn you. Things that can cause pain will cause pain if it is known as possible. Same goes for pleasure. Let's say you get alot of dates from going to bars, whether or not you get a date on a particular night you get more pleasure from going to a bar. Even if a gun has three safeties and is loaded and pointed at you it will cause pain even if you know the person won't shoot you, the reason for this is guns cause pain, that's what a gun does.

The music thing is most easily demonstrated by clapping to a beat while singing a Capella.


You're right about anger sharpening your focus. Hate makes a person hyper sensitive to pain. Hate also has the tendency to make people do anything for even the smallest amounts of pleasure. It is irrational though.

a reply to: mOjOm

It's not my "half ass" theory. It is Sigmund Freud's hypothesis expanded upon. Homeostasis as pleasure is another form of it and alot of cited papers will turn up in a google search. If you'd like to put your head in the sand I suggest you go read one of the many articles that claim comedy is mysterious.

Many people hate this because it proves evolution. Some hate it simply because it is the truth.

originally posted by: mattsawaufo
a reply to: mOjOm

It's not my "half ass" theory. It is Sigmund Freud's hypothesis expanded upon. Homeostasis as pleasure is another form of it and alot of cited papers will turn up in a google search. If you'd like to put your head in the sand I suggest you go read one of the many articles that claim comedy is mysterious.

Many people hate this because it proves evolution. Some hate it simply because it is the truth.

First, thank you for the polite reply sir.

I understand a bit of Freud and what you're saying here. However my question was dealing with Sexual Arousal being in the Pain section. However, perhaps it's just a problem of what you mean by that. You seem to be saying that sexual arousal is pain when it happens unwanted thereby taking the body out of it's balanced state of being. Even more so when such arousal is left unsatisfied. I can understand that in such a context.

My point was that sexual arousal can't always be considered pain in that it can be pleasure by being part of the process of sexual release too. In a physical sense and to use your example, you have increased blood flow in the pleasure section. Sexual arousal, physically would be increased blood flow. So I see a bit of a conflict there. Nothing major, but maybe just rephrasing it from "sexual arousal" to something else would correct it. That's all.

Other than that I was curious as to how mental pain and pleasure fit into this theory as well since all you have listed is the physical side of it.???

Also, I never had anything negative to say about the comedy part of it so I'm not sure why you bring that up. I'm also certainly not against any ideas toward proving evolution or against the truth. I have studied Freud actually although it was when I was in school many years ago. He had his insights as well as his questionable ideas as well. Personally I liked Jung better.