Fla. church cancels gay man's funeral

originally posted by: AmmonSeth
So if people don't want to respect his religious beliefs and the principles of the church he represents. Then why would said people wish to have the service in that church?

Seems like the people were just out to stir the pot.
...

This was the church that the parents of the deceased, attended (or - had attended).
I'm guessing they wanted some 'familiarity' and (possibly - warmth) in their time of bereavement.

Regarding the remainder of your comments...(imo)
~ This was not about where the body would be interred...
~ The only possible deception in this matter was - the church/minister initially accepting the request to 'officiate', and then, on the day before said ceremony, reneging (perhaps...pursuant to his rights under the Blasphemy Clause of the Constitution - - I don't know, for sure, as I haven't read that far, yet...

)...

a reply to: beezzer

what if gays are part of Satan's plan to see
if the gay person can resist the sin of lust.

originally posted by: spirited75
what if gays are part of Satan's plan to see
if the gay person can resist the sin of lust.

Straight people experience lust, too. It's also called sexual desire. It's built into us as human beings to insure propagation of the species. It's a human instinct, not a "sin". Teaching you that sexual desire is SIN proves the premise of this thread.

If a church/pastor has the job of "judging" me when my funeral time comes....geez, I guess I'll be getting stuffed in a hefty bag and shot out to sea. I thought the so called god is the one that is relegated to judging us relevant to our supposed "sins".

The whole trouble with the world view of today...too many dang labels...we have labels for everything and everyone. Gay...what kinda label/word is that? We have liberals and right wingers, and this religion and that....so many labels and divisions...divide and conquer. When did we stop just being human beings? Why the need to "name" everything. Maybe cavemen didn't bury their dead but if they did, they had no such complex problems back in those days...either bury their brethren, eat them or whatever. The longer we exist it seems the more divided we get.

originally posted by: spirited75
a reply to: beezzer

what if gays are part of Satan's plan to see
if the gay person can resist the sin of lust.

What's your idea on how to turn off what is inherently built into a person? Lobotomy?

Oh man, what a mess. When something like this happens it can be an absolute cluster! As a funeral director, I think of myself as a fast-acting party planner. I am trying to accommodate a family's needs in order to help them get on the proper path thru the grieving process and give em the best chance they have at moving forward, not backwards...I digress. Anyhow, could be any number of issues to look at in terms of assigning fault. Human nature tells me that we are all equal and deserve a proper and timely final disposition. I'd like to think the pastor and his church are to blame for not being forgiving, but it could also be the fault of the funeral home for failing to mention this to the pastor prior to his commitment. Or it may also lay at the feet of his family for keeping it quiet. Springing that on an officiant, last minute could completely change his outlook and that's probably what happened, again not that I agree with it at all. Only once have we been asked to remove a body from a church prior to the actual service and it was a result of competing ideologies. And trust me...what followed was a zoo. I really feel for this family, no one deserves to be treated that way. I'd like to think that the pastor could have done the service anyways. While maybe the pastor didn't agree with the lifestyle that the individual lived we have to remember that funeral services aren't for our dead, but for those of us still living. He should've risen above himself and done right by the family.

a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

You fail to realize that the pastor didn't refuse to bury a gay man, he refused to bury a man that was married to another man. Gay marriage presents a unique problem for Christians. Start having murderer marriages and liar marriages and I'm sure you'll run into the same kind of opposition you're seeing now.

originally posted by: BasementWarriorKryptonite

What's your idea on how to turn off what is inherently built into a person? Lobotomy?

Discipline is less invasive.

originally posted by: Bone75
a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

You fail to realize that the pastor didn't refuse to bury a gay man, he refused to bury a man that was married to another man. Gay marriage presents a unique problem for Christians. Start having murderer marriages and liar marriages and I'm sure you'll run into the same kind of opposition you're seeing now.

Word it any way you want. You obviously have to in order to justify what is obviously one of the most f**ked up actions a pastor could ever take. He actually refused to give last rights and bury a dead man. One that he had already agreed to hold a service for and did so last minute and because of his own judgement against another.

BTW, it doesn't matter if he was married to another man, HE'S DEAD. He's not gay anymore. He's nothing anymore but a meat sack. An empty shell. So I guess passing judgement on people even after they're dead is the job of the Church now too??

I'm not religious, for obvious reasons of which this is just one single example, but for those who are you should absolutely enraged by the actions taken here. For someone of Faith having their body and soul respectfully dealt with with is vital to them. Even mass murderers and child molesters are given proper burial and their last rights when they are executed in prisons without such treatment. To me, I wouldn't give a crap what you do. Toss me in the woods or whatever, I don't care. But for a church pastor to do this is beyond words. There is no way to defend what this man did. NONE.

Couldn't swallow their pride at least a little bit? How rude. I hope they ended up getting an ear full. Refusing to do a funeral for anyone is pretty low if you ask me. I shall shake my head slowly for a moment or two.

originally posted by: Bone75

originally posted by: BasementWarriorKryptonite

What's your idea on how to turn off what is inherently built into a person? Lobotomy?

Discipline is less invasive.

I think I'll enjoy my life and encourage others to enjoy theirs, too. I'll also be open to dead people being honoured by their loved ones in the best way they see fit, rather than passing judgement on them for something that has nothing to do with me at all.

a reply to: ChaosComplex

Wow...Who does that?

THIS is what is wrong with the world today...Well, this and a zillion other things. There's NOTHING "Christian" about this church's behavior.

Jesus was ALL ABOUT THE LOVE people. The love for one another, not judgement or blasphemy. That's a man made issue.

And, isn't Christianity based on his teachings, his Word?

originally posted by: BasementWarriorKryptonite

originally posted by: spirited75
a reply to: beezzer

what if gays are part of Satan's plan to see
if the gay person can resist the sin of lust.

What's your idea on how to turn off what is inherently built into a person? Lobotomy?

You hit the nail on the head. Love is love. People don't just "choose" who they are, or aren't, attracted to. We're BORN that way. This story is almost as ridic as those "programs" that attempt Bible the Gay out of people. The family probably never thought a CHURCH would do something like this. They're supposed to be above that sort of judgmental thinking, right?

originally posted by: Bone75
a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

You fail to realize that the pastor didn't refuse to bury a gay man, he refused to bury a man that was married to another man. Gay marriage presents a unique problem for Christians. Start having murderer marriages and liar marriages and I'm sure you'll run into the same kind of opposition you're seeing now.

Are you serious?

Marriage should be available to ALL people who are committed to each other and who love each other, regardless if it is a man & woman, two men, or two women.

If two people love each other, and remember that Jesus was about loving one another, then who's business is it, other than theirs, if they get married or not? Christians, real ones anyway, don't pass judgement on others, no matter what their story is.

a reply to: lovebeck

Trying to reason with people so deeply invested in their cult of hate is futile. Seriousll, though - the funeral should have been in a beautiful garden or on a beach, or somewhere really nice. Not some depressing, life-sucking, soul-draining church.

originally posted by: Bone75

originally posted by: BasementWarriorKryptonite

What's your idea on how to turn off what is inherently built into a person? Lobotomy?

Discipline is less invasive.

So what...beat it out of them? Lock your kid in a room until they are straight? Water-boarding? Electroshock therapy?

Discipline to change someone's mindset is the definition of invasive.

a reply to: BasementWarriorKryptonite

I don't know why I'm bothering to reply, since it's all going to fall on deaf ears, but eh...

Religion is not what's wrong, it's people. You have extremists on every side of every ideology on this planet. Finding a balance is what creates peace, not blanket-genocide-ing things you don't agree with. With your mindset, if children picking their nose offended you, you would cut off all their fingers and toes....or should we just get rid of children altogether?

It's far more effective to provide structure, inculcate that structure, and eventually it will permeate the entire society. There are plenty of people out there now, willing to defend their fragile construct of reality with little or no rational thought.

The problem however....is freedom prevents us from conforming to any single set of beliefs (structure). In order to find peace, we would all have to agree on a structure. That's never going to happen in a free society. So all of this debate is just hot air, allowing you to feel good as you mock religion; just one of many ideologies subject to extremism.

If we were really concerned about living moral lives, we would be more concerned about our neighbors then ourselves. The Truth is, neither Theist, Atheist, nor Agnostic has a desire to compromise on their beliefs to create a loving environment for all of us. It's much more fun to take cheap shots at each others ideologies, sitting on our high horses.

So by all means, keep vexing one another... it's worked out so well for us so far...

a reply to: ValleyofAshes Enjoyed your post. My first thought was that services are for the loved ones still here to help them cope with their loss, not the deceased person because they are after all, deceased. Something apparently is lacking in that pastor's mind/heart to have forgotten that fact and its sad to see a so-called trusted leader in the church be so uncompassionate. It happens, we're all human I guess.

a reply to: Aedaeum

Blah blah blah. I gave your post a chance and it was just this long winded rip into me for attacking religion. Well, matey potatey, you can tell us all that it's not religion but humanity that is the problem all you like - and I actually agree with you - except you fail to realise that it's humanity that created religions.

If you want to talk about some agreement we can all have, how about this one: live and let live. You leave me the hell alone and I'll do the same - it is just so simple. You mention freedom and how it stops us from getting along because we are all free to believe and act as we please. Well, I'll freely punch some religious idiot and then maybe we will get somewhere.