They Did It Again, Israel Strikes UN School 10 Murdered

originally posted by: pavil
I know Israel isn't an angel or perfect and that they probably care little about Palestinian collateral damage. I just wish people would stop painting Hamas as angels or perfect. Call Hamas out for battling in dense urban areas, close to innocent civilians.

It is the nature of the situation. Hamas cannot fight in the open to a superior foe so they fight and hide in dense civilian populated areas. The locals support Hamas and most like cheer them on, feed them and support them with use of their dwellings. Little do they know that when Hamas launches a rocket near them then hides in the dwelling they instantly become a military target too by even international standards.

If Israel actually wanted to just target civilians there would be 10,000s dead already not a handful at a time. When Hamas fires 50 different rockets that most likely means that there is also 50 different places where civilians are right with those rockets, and Israel knows very quickly where each and every rock was fired from and response in force.

originally posted by: sosobad
How can they attack from anywhere that isn't populated? The civilians have nowhere to go. They are a tiny country that was further reduced by another 44% since this war started. Let that sink in...The size of Gaza almost halved again, it has been declared a no go zone for Palestinians. 1.8 million people in the worlds largest ghetto. No one allowed in and no one allowed out they just sit there until they get bombed.

When did Gaza become a country? Worlds largest Ghetto, really? You need to travel more. India alone has neighborhoods bigger than that with everyone living in cardboard boxes...just saying...

Why don't they go to Jordan across the river? Why doesn't Jordan (and other Arab countries) rebuild their area? Why do they elect/support extremist that do not want to compromise in anyway.

Lastly, when Israel and Jordan were created by the Brits/French Jordan was considered Arab Palestine land and the Jewish Palestine got Israel, extremely smaller with no oil. When Egypt controlled Gaza 100,000s of refugees that no one wanted poured into it. Egypt closed their borders to it all (sound familiar?) and let it rot. After Israel won the 1967 war against all the countries around them they ended up with Gaza and its problems that we see today.

a reply to: Xtrozero

I believe he was referring to THIS kind of Ghetto.

and you go on to say that "India has neighborhoods..." - I don't see a connection?

and I don't see a reason why to derail the topic so drastically.

Hamas didn't start this - Israel did for the reasons well known.

a reply to: Swills
C'mon the only thing the Nightly News in the Red White and Blue is the one missing f'ing Israeli Soldier.

He who owns the media, owns the content.

a reply to: demus

Exactly. If people didn't see it clearly before this, let them all consider that what they now see is an annihilation scenario, devoid of any humanity what-so-ever. Remove the water source and sewage disposal system remove electricity and it's guaranteed that disease moves in. Next will come typhoid etc. It is not only repulsive and extremely disgusting, Israel's words no longer merit being listened to AT ALL. They have gone way too far.

It is a pure evil plan very far removed from any god, and we all have the ability and the human duty to see it now.

Its ALL ok for the combatants.....they do what they want with no restraint on BOTH sides.....let them kill each other off....
Its the innocent lives that aren't OK....
I am ashamed to be a member of the human race betimes......
ALL Those people who commit this stuff are clinically insane .......

a reply to: demus

i really do feel for every civilian who is killed. it is tragic to say the least!

but do not compare gaza to the warsaw ghetto.... they are totally different and it makes you look ignorant of facts!

originally posted by: Swills
a reply to: pavil

Are you saying there are Hamas supporters in this thread?........

No one supports Hamas. Hamas is the thorn in the anti Israel crowds side.

If not supporters then enablers.... Condemn Hamas for their CONTINUAL rocket attacks. Sure, they don't seem very effective, but if you neighbor continually shot things at your house, you'd retaliate or call the Police, right?

If you don't like Hamas either, then why shed a tear when someone finally tries to take them out of the equation. I get that you can feel horrible for the average resident of Gaza. They are stuck between a rock and even bigger, sharper rock. But if the average Gazan (?) doesn't do anything to rid themselves of Hamas, then they reap all the rewards that poor decision entails.

If that were only True. You can feel bad for the Palestinians, They have got the short end of the stick almost 70 years now and have idiots for leaders, let alone Israel pummeling them for any given reason. Hamas needs to go, they aren't the people who will bring the Palestinian people a State or Peace with Israel.

I know Peace is way off, but with Hamas in Charge, its never going to happen.

If no one supports Hamas, then how do they stay in power in Gaza??????

If the Palestinian people can't or won't get rid of Hamas, and Egypt can't, who will do it?

Hamas took Gaza by force from the PA, so don't give me "they are the elected officials there" line.
Hamas is the Primary obstacle to Israel and Palestine having peace with safe and secure borders. Not that the Israelis and the PA are much better, but Hamas is a Non Partner for Peace.

Does anyone here honestly think that Israel can negotiate peace with Hamas, an organization that wants "liberate" all of Palestine ie Israel ? It's the crux of the problem. Hamas doesn't have a future in a world where Israel and Palestine have secure States at Peace with one another. You won't be seeing a Hamas leader getting the Nobel Peace Prize is what I'm saying.


There are a LOT of Arab States who won't shed a tear when Hamas ceases to run Gaza. Hamas makes the PA look like proper Statesman.

a reply to: pavil

Sorry you wrote such a long post because I stopped reading when you called us Hamas enablers.

Agree to completely disagree.

originally posted by: pavil


If not supporters then enablers.... Condemn Hamas for their CONTINUAL rocket attacks.

This is a place to condemn Israel for THEIR continual rocket attacks and disregard of all warfare rules of conduct. People around the globe are not falling for zionist self victimization any more. The oppressed have become the oppressor.

..but do feel free to start your own thread about hamas. They are just as evil.

a reply to: Swills

I appreciate your responses and respect your views, even though I disagree with them. It's a free country.
Feel free to not listen to those who disagree with you. Limits your experience, but to each their own. Same thoughts apply to your post Exitt.

If you spent half the time criticizing Israel , criticizing Hamas as well, then maybe Hamas wouldn't still be in power in Gaza.
I'm glad posters who disagree with me say they despise Hamas as much as they do Israel.
To be honest, I don't hear them condemn both sides equally. I'd love for you to prove me wrong and actually hold Hamas's feet to the fire for their abysmal running of Gaza and the stall in the peace process.
Ask the average Gazan, are they better off under Hamas's rule?

Hamas is the equivalent of ISIS in my book. They need to be eradicated. I don't see them ever recognizing Israel's right to exist in peace as a Jewish State. Sorry to be so blunt. Just to be clear, that doesn't equate to me wanting all Palestinians eradicated, I bet some will want to spin it that way.

It sucks that average Gazans are stuck with Hamas as their rulers.
Anyone who thinks Hamas and the PA have a unity government is playing with unicorns.
There will be a real civil war in the West Bank and Gaza sooner or later. Both the PA and Hamas will not coexist for much longer.

I find the arrogance of Israel stunning at times, I guess that is the arrogance that comes with the financial backing of half the military budget of a world super-power. Okay, the 'Genocide is Permissible' article was the misguided behaviour of one journalist, but this article by Deputy Speaker of the Knesset, Moshe Feiglin, is almost as shocking. It details a 'Solution' to the conflict. I wonder if he forgot to put 'Final' in the title...

Sovereignty – Gaza is part of our Land and we will remain there forever. Liberation of parts of our land forever is the only thing that justifies endangering our soldiers in battle to capture land. Subsequent to the elimination of terror from Gaza, it will become part of sovereign Israel and will be populated by Jews. This will also serve to ease the housing crisis in Israel. The coastal train line will be extended, as soon as possible, to reach the entire length of Gaza.

The argument is that civilians immediately become militants if they refuse to leave, an argument for genocide written by a key figure in Israeli politics.

Moshe Feiglin Solution for Gaza

Additionally, Moshe has been quoted from his facebook page (which I can't verify because I can't read the language) as calling for concentration camps, and defining the enemy as all of Islam, rather than just Hamas. Justifying the argument on the basis of a missing officer who the Israeli military have since confirmed died in battle, Feiglin makes the following claims:

We have just heard that Hamas has used the ceasefire to abduct an officer. It turns out that this operation is not about to be over any too soon. The failures of this operation were inherent to it from the outset, because:

a) It has no proper and clear goal;

b) there is no appropriate moral framework to support our soldiers. What is required now is that we internalize the fact that Oslo is finished, that this is our country – our country exclusively, including Gaza.

There are no two states, and there are no two peoples. There is only one state for one people. Having internalized this, what is needed is a deep and thorough strategic review, in terms of the definition of the enemy, of the operational tasks, of the strategic goals, and of course, of appropriate necessary war ethics.

(1) Defining the enemy: The strategic enemy is extremist Arab Islam in all its varieties, from Iran to Gaza, which seeks to annihilate Israel in its entirety. The immediate enemy is Hamas. (Not the tunnels, not the rockets, but Hamas.)

(2) Defining the tasks Conquest of the entire Gaza Strip, and annihilation of all fighting forces and their supporters.

(3) Defining the strategic goal: To turn Gaza into Jaffa, a flourishing Israeli city with a minimum number of hostile civilians.

(4) Defining war ethics: “Woe to the evildoer, and woe to his neighbor” In light of these four points, Israel must do the following:

a) The IDF [Israeli army] shall designate certain open areas on the Sinai border, adjacent to the sea, in which the civilian population will be concentrated, far from the built-up areas that are used for launches and tunneling. In these areas, tent encampments will be established, until relevant emigration destinations are determined. The supply of electricity and water to the formerly populated areas will be disconnected.

b) The formerly populated areas will be shelled with maximum fire power. The entire civilian and military infrastructure of Hamas, its means of communication and of logistics, will be destroyed entirely, down to their foundations.

c) The IDF will divide the Gaza Strip laterally and crosswise, significantly expand the corridors, occupy commanding positions, and exterminate nests of resistance, in the event that any should remain.

d) Israel will start searching for emigration destinations and quotas for the refugees from Gaza. Those who wish to emigrate will be given a generous economic support package, and will arrive at the receiving countries with considerable economic capabilities.

e) Those who insist on staying, if they can be proven to have no affiliation with Hamas, will be required to publicly sign a declaration of loyalty to Israel, and receive a blue ID card similar to that of the Arabs of East Jerusalem.

f) When the fighting will end, Israeli law will be extended to cover the entire Gaza Strip, the people evicted from the Gush Katif will be invited to return to their settlements, and the city of Gaza and its suburbs will be rebuilt as true Israeli touristic and commercial cities.

Feiglin letter to Netanyahu

If these views show anything, it's just how far away from a peaceful solution it is.

originally posted by: demus
and I don't see a reason why to derail the topic so drastically.

So you didn't like my first paragraph, why didn't you reply to the other two since you linked it. I would really like an honest opinion on the other two.

originally posted by: twfau

If these views show anything, it's just how far away from a peaceful solution it is.

Both sides have bred and trained their people to dehumanize the other. The trend I see unfortunately, is BOTH sides becoming more and more hardline/bloodthirsty.

I pity the children of both Palestinians and Israelis. Shame on both sides for spilling the blood of your offspring over a battle neither of them can win and are unwilling to settle peacefully. I seriously doubt Yahweh and Allah approve of their behavior.

You mean Israel defended itself after 80 rockets fired off by Hamas? Damn we killed a lot more by people in Iraq and Afghanistan.

With a title like yours "They Did It Again, Israel Strikes UN School 10 Murdered" seems way out of content.

Cue "human shield" narrative