Should DOD shoot Ebola plane down?

You did an excellent job without being disrespectful. I wish I could give you more than one star. a reply to: VashKonnor

originally posted by: Nyiah
a reply to: Xeven

Dude(ette?). You really need to think logically, not like a pearl-clutcher. A First World country has far freaking better isolation protocols than a Third World African country does. That is their main issue, their medical standards utterly suck by comparison in these W. African countries. We'll weather the patients' stays just fine.

It is First world doctors that were using first world standards that are now infected. You are far too trusting. How do you know the nurse in charge of taking care of these people is not having marriage troubles and taking some drugs or what ever and wont make a mistake? You don't. I live in the reality of human error. These infected Doctors were using the First world protocalls you know and had all the best equipment at their disposal.

a reply to: Xeven
You know I hate to have to point out the obvious because you said this yourself and it really should have dawned on you when you did. He was on the inside of that protective suit. Inside. What ever was on the outside doesn't matter. Or do you think they put it on him in Africa then marched him through muck and infected mire ?
You really have no respect for these people laying down their lives to bring comfort to the sick and dying do you? You obviously think they're a bunch of idiots running around not knowing what they're doing don't you? You pretty much say it in every post. So you must make sacrifices for the human race every day if you can look down your nose at these Samaritans.

a reply to: AutumnWitch657

Again you need to read more...up to 30k could be infected. We have no clue what you say is accurate because you have no source. Nice try though.

originally posted by: AutumnWitch657
a reply to: Xeven
You know I hate to have to point out the obvious because you said this yourself and it really should have dawned on you when you did. He was on the inside of that protective suit. Inside. What ever was on the outside doesn't matter. Or do you think they put it on him in Africa then marched him through muck and infected mire ?
You really have no respect for these people laying down their lives to bring comfort to the sick and dying do you? You obviously think they're a bunch of idiots running around not knowing what they're doing don't you? You pretty much say it in every post. So you must make sacrifices for the human race every day if you can look down your nose at these Samaritans.

Not at all. I hope and pray they survive. There was no medical necessity to bring them to the US and put us all at risk no matter how small that risk may be. Your willing to put our entire population at risk due to your compassion. I am very glad your not in charge of anything important to our survival.

No matter where they put that suit on him the exterior of that suit was exposed to a contaminated area where he put it on. You should think logically.

Let me summarize some things for you from another thread on the topic of this ebola move to the U.S. And again, this is just a summary and may be choppy. There are more details in the (very long) thread.

The NIH trials for ebola vaccine starting in September (which I've mentioned a few times already in this very long and other threads is a pretty big red flag. If this is a new strain they need guinea pigs...er blood...er samples to experiment on and make sure their "trial vaccine" actually works before anything is turned out, eh?

We can almost rest assured that big money is behind this somewhere, as in big pharms probably. The question is...how far will they be wiliing to go? Because big money isn't to be made in third world countries, so they need people fearing in first world ones. Pateients to U.S., England, Germany? Mmmhmm.

And Re: CDC

Let's not forget who brought other pathogens and toxins to this country to "study." Like Lyme (linked to or masked as many previously unknown auto-immune "disorders" such as lupus, CFS, fibromyalgia, and even MS and who knows what else is still to come), West Nile (currently again on the rise). And don't forget we still don't really know how HIV got here on the planet.

Do we really trust these people to bring another strain of ebola into this country?

They could have had a level-4 containment building setup anywhere in the world within days if they wanted to. Days.

There is far, far more to this than simple treating some missionaries.

I am not fear mongering. These are just some things to think about. Not like they haven't done it before.

I still am unsure as to the airborne contagiousness of this virus..

Here's a possiblilty. They don't know. Particularly with this new strain, especially when you consider the unprecedented number of medical workers, perhaps laboring under the assumption that it was not, have contracted this.

Also, from what I've read, even the CDC has not said it is not airborne, just that it has not been PROVEN to be airborne.

There is every chance it may be if we define airborne as being spread by sneezing, coughing, and other types of transmission of body fluid.

Then there's this point a reporter in Africa made...and the CDC director's answer to her.

At a Thursday press conference, CDC director Dr. Tom Frieden avoided claiming that this strain of Ebola is not airborne. Rebecca Hamman of Voice of Nigeria asked: “You just said the transmission of Ebola is through close contact. But it seems it’s going beyond that. The name itself was derived from a river. Do you mean the not water-borne or airborne?” She stated simply: “My people are scared at the rate at which it is being transmitted and moving very fast. I would like to know how Ebola is contracted.”

Frieden’s reply was not that Ebola is not airborne, but that it has not been “proven” to be airborne. He said, “Though there may be circumstances that it might have been spread through the air in situations like intubation of a patient, putting a breathing tube in them, that’s never been proven.”

[Source]

People are saying it's not airborne, that it is passed through bodily fluids, such as vomit, sweat, blood and secretions, but can those not go airborne, again, depending on how we define airborne? Cannot bodily fluids go airborne. Sneezing, coughing, land on dust and other objects? It's not a gas but it can certainly get into the air.

This is how WHO defines airborne:

Airborne transmission
Airborne transmission of infectious agents refers to the transmission of disease caused by
dissemination of droplet nuclei that remain infectious when suspended in air over long distance and
time. Airborne transmission can be further categorized into obligate or preferential airborne
transmission(5).
Obligate airborne transmission refers to pathogens that are transmitted only by deposition of droplet
nuclei under natural conditions (e.g. pulmonary tuberculosis).
Preferential airborne transmission refers to pathogens that can initiate infection by multiple routes,
but are predominantly transmitted by droplet nuclei (e.g. measles, chickenpox).

Infection prevention and control of epidemic- and pandemic-prone acute respiratory diseases in health care, page 6

So. New strain. Spreading faster than is typical. Traditional control methods sort of failing. Definition of airborne. Viruses mutate. And the the bit about waterborn, well water is a fluid. It contaminated fluid hits food, the air, or water, does it spread? Seems they don't really know.

Which returns us to the question of who really made the decision to move him here.

The answer to this has not been clear.

We have them saying the Samaritan's Purse organization made the decision to fly them back, reportedly at the request of the two patients, and that they hired and paid for the transport, and with the "agreement" of Emory to receive them as patients. But we also appear to have military involvement or at least cooperation, as they landed on a military base. We have the Department of State saying, see the CDC, and the CDC saying not much.

If anyone can correct this summary or further fill in the blanks, please help.

ETA, from Samaritan's Purse:

“We thank God that they are alive and now have access to the best care in the world,” said Franklin Graham, president of Samaritan’s Purse. “We are extremely thankful for the help we have received from the State Department, the CDC, the National Institute of Health, WHO and, of course, Emory Hospital.”

NIH. Ebola drug trial in September.

And lets not forget Monsanto and Tekmira.

Doing a bit of digging.

Search argument Tekmira and microcystin yielded a weird result. So did Tekmira and Ohio. Told you I was only sort of kidding. Apparently microcystin is used to combat some viral diseases, HIV among them. I don't understand half the stuff I read but there might be a link here.

realnewsbin.blogspot.com...

growingohio.com...

Who knows. Everything is connected.

In any event, the first plane has allegedly landed and the second is on its way. They didn't shoot anything down. It's here.

Where did you read that this strain is airborne? You don't even have to provide a link just tell me. I know how to use the internet. I've been on it since it first came online in the early nineties. a reply to: ParanoidAmerican

Gas them then incinerate them ? What's your real name? Joseph Stalin? Dr. Mengela?Aldolph Hitler?a reply to: LABTECH767

Yeah the best equipment . Like tents and snow fencing. a reply to: Xeven

Thank you Lucidity. You articulate my thoughts much better than I do. The entire purpose of this post was to bring attention and discussion of the fact that we are willingly bringing a deadly virus into our home and that it might be a bad idea. No one in government is taking responsibility for having authorized this to happen including the CDC director. That is stink to me. They know there is a serious risk or they would not be running scared of taking responsibility.

In my heart I have compassion and care and honor for these people. I also have a brain that is awake and realizes that the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few.

No matter our compassion we should never place our entire nation at risk for simple comfort. It can be argued that they left the best place in the world to be treated for Ebola. They have admitted there was no medical justification to bring them here. They were at a location with the best Ebola care in the world is located. We do not have anything here better suited to fight Ebola.

We put our nation at risk for the comfort of two individuals. I hope that decision does not result in the infection and death of more of us here in the US where this strain of Ebola did not exist until we willingly brought it here.


a reply to: ~Lucidity

But that's not what you said is it Tonto? You said thirty thousand infected. sand reply to: ParanoidAmerican

a reply to: ParanoidAmerican

So I'm a liar then? You post bs but I'm a liar? What ever. You know what we call people like you in my family? Thick headed.

a reply to: AutumnWitch657

I provided a link to the study but you could simply use Google......

originally posted by: AutumnWitch657
Yeah the best equipment . Like tents and snow fencing. a reply to: Xeven

Tent they left

Tents really/ Check the link they left the largest Hospital in Liberia... facts

Oh I didn't know you were there when they put the suit on him. Sorry my bad. a reply to: Xeven

originally posted by: AutumnWitch657
Oh I didn't know you were there when they put the suit on him. Sorry my bad. a reply to: Xeven

How exactly could he put the suit on without exposing it to the environment in which he is in?

a reply to: AutumnWitch657

"They estimate the web could be up to 30,000 infected....Link" is exactly what I said.....so what was that?

I post sources for everything I have said you on the other hand have not posted on source just what you heard. You know what they call your kind of argument Ad Hominem...when you can come back with a source, some logic, and actual facts....we can debate more.

That was a different strain. It was also stated that it was large droplets and spread to nearby lifeforms. Ebola is not airborne. I'm sorry you think all news stations are out to deceive us. Paranoid was a good name for you to choose. Those folks you call talking heads are interviewing the medical professionals and every one says it's not airborne.

a reply to: ParanoidAmerican

a reply to: AutumnWitch657

I would advise you to read my post again, please and do not liken me to scum that murdered my relatives EVER.

If you where faced with a plague and your children and your friend's children would die, if you had to weigh up the option of one life or thousand's if not millions what would you do, if safe quarantine can be effected then ethically and morally that is the way to go as well as scientifically so as to find a natural resistance where drug treatment fails and so to eradicate the disease but if you want to allow population control to be enacted why not simply say OH ok let's let them walk around in the general population (I actually believe the planet can sustain many time's the current population but we have to use our brains not simply take, me me me all the time), so is it you that has the right wing agenda, kill every one so that you don't have to face the need to contain the Virus once and for all because it would be those like yourself that would have the blame for it then.

I am against animal testing but that attitude remind's me of a group of imbeciles who once raided a bio tech lab and released hundreds of pathogenically infected test animals.

The right choice is not always the ethical or even Human choice however unpleasant that may sound but for me every human life is priceless and worth more than any money but when you have to balance the safety and health of a nation against a individual what is the logical solution because if you make the decision whatever the outcome it is on your head.

In Liberia. In other spots it was tents and that bright orange disposable fencing we use for crowd control . s reply to: Xeven