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Official: Police chokehold caused NYC man's death

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posted on Aug, 1 2014 @ 08:46 PM
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a reply to: areyouserious2010

it could also be argued that had he began to fight, he might have given himself an asthma or heart attack -shrug- again, as we both agree, it's very difficult, if not impossible, to actually determine what actions would have what effects, in a situation like this...




posted on Aug, 1 2014 @ 08:46 PM
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a reply to: GetOutOfMyLight

heh...sure...



posted on Aug, 1 2014 @ 08:46 PM
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originally posted by: areyouserious2010
a reply to: phinubian


The use of force was illegal that hold is not approved by NYPD

The decision to take the guy down with a sudden, decisive use of force was made because the guy was 6-03 and 350 lbs and because he was already becoming physically resistant to the arrest. If the guy was allowed to fight, the guy would have been a serious threat.

Again, touching someone's neck during a fight is not tantamount to a choke hold.


The police have other measures for taking down threats, hence why there are tactics deemed 'illegal'.

I dont doubt that the chokehold contributed to his death, just as much as his asthma, heart disease, obesity & the chest compressions contributed to his death.

The officer needs to be held accountable for using illegal tactics. I think there are too many variables to charge him with murder though.



posted on Aug, 1 2014 @ 08:47 PM
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a reply to: Daedalus
These sort of conversations are "fun" for them.



posted on Aug, 1 2014 @ 08:47 PM
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originally posted by: areyouserious2010
a reply to: phinubian


The use of force was illegal that hold is not approved by NYPD

The decision to take the guy down with a sudden, decisive use of force was made because the guy was 6-03 and 350 lbs and because he was already becoming physically resistant to the arrest. If the guy was allowed to fight, the guy would have been a serious threat.

Again, touching someone's neck during a fight is not tantamount to a choke hold.


pitiful and shameful just as much a gang as crips or bloods or any other

Really, try suing or filing a complaint against the bloods or crips for how they would treat you.


You're completely wrong, the officers in this instance were not in compliance with reasonable procedure and use of force in this instance. They are going to be sued for a very large sum of money and they are going to have to pay it and I would almost guarantee criminal charges and convictions but in our militarized police force day and age and almost no accountability, there just aren't any guarantees.

That officer will be fired and he will never be a cop again, that much I can guarantee. His day has come to an end as far as "law enforcement" goes.
edit on 1-8-2014 by Helious because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 1 2014 @ 08:48 PM
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a reply to: GetOutOfMyLight

i don't doubt that for a moment.



posted on Aug, 1 2014 @ 08:53 PM
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I think his being a fat slob had something to do with it.



posted on Aug, 1 2014 @ 08:53 PM
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a reply to: Daedalus

Ok, I see where we got off the same page.

When I posted that the articles had different wording, the first article from the Associated Press only said this:

"the compression of his chest and prone positioning during physical restraint by police,"

It did not say anything about his neck. I took this to mean the two articles said different things about the same Medical Examiner's report.

After I posted that, they updated the article to include a picture and more detail, namely about the neck compression.

With that in mind, I concede that now the two articles say the same thing.

I apologize for that misunderstanding on my part.

Do I think the officers should have enforced the law? Yes. Do I think it is murder? No. Do I think it still needs to be investigated? Yes. Should the officer have a fair trial? Of course.



posted on Aug, 1 2014 @ 08:56 PM
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a reply to: Collateral


The police have other measures for taking down threats, hence why there are tactics deemed 'illegal'.

I dont doubt that the chokehold contributed to his death, just as much as his asthma, heart disease, obesity & the chest compressions contributed to his death.

The officer needs to be held accountable for using illegal tactics. I think there are too many variables to charge him with murder though.

I don't disagree with anything you said here.



posted on Aug, 1 2014 @ 09:08 PM
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a reply to: Helious


You're completely wrong, the officers in this instance were not in compliance with reasonable procedure and use of force in this instance.

I think you misunderstood what I was trying to say.

The officers were right to enforce the law.

They made the decision to arrest the guy. We cannot say whether this was right or wrong because we were not there.

The guy was very large and already was becoming physically resistant. There needed to be a sudden, decisive and reasonable use of force to take the guy into custody so he did not have the chance to fight.

A choke hold is not acceptable. But, there are upper-body take down methods, that are not tantamount to a choke hold, which at first glance would look like a choke hold.

There was a misunderstanding on my part which caused me to think the Associated Press article and the Raw Story article said different things. It has been rectified and it is now clear one of the contributing factors in the man's death was compression of his neck.



posted on Aug, 1 2014 @ 09:31 PM
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I like all the ppl here downplaying what killed him, citing Asthma and other medical whatevers. . . if you dropkick a frail old man and he died later of his injuries because he was so frail you don't pass the buck onto his medical condition.

The drop-kick killed him. Same here the cop killed him, no if, butts or maybe's.



posted on Aug, 1 2014 @ 09:51 PM
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originally posted by: igor_ats
I like all the ppl here downplaying what killed him, citing Asthma and other medical whatevers. . . if you dropkick a frail old man and he died later of his injuries because he was so frail you don't pass the buck onto his medical condition.

The drop-kick killed him. Same here the cop killed him, no if, butts or maybe's.


Is the old man 6"3ft and 300lb resisting arrest?



posted on Aug, 1 2014 @ 10:30 PM
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a reply to: Restricted

lolwtf...

wow, man....tell us how you REALLY feel...



posted on Aug, 1 2014 @ 10:33 PM
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a reply to: areyouserious2010

concession accepted. and thank you for that...it takes a big person to admit a mistake.

so now we almost completely agree...pretty rare here..

on that note, i think i'm gonna bow out of this one, before i end up banned...was nice chatting with you..seeya around



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