NASA Confirms New EM Thruster Violates Laws Of Conservation

originally posted by: AnarchoCapitalist

originally posted by: Rob48
The problem is that so many of these have the strong whiff of scam about them.

The EmDrive is actually quite interesting, but you also promoted BlackLight Power in your opening post, and BlackLight is an undisputed, dyed-in-the-wool, 100% guaranteed FRAUD. Just like that gold-from-beer-bottles scam you were punting a few weeks ago.

So you believe that all of the universities and engineering firms confirming Blacklight's results made them up?

I believe that Blacklight is completely full of #### when they say QM is wrong and there are magic grounder-than-ground states. Which would have enormous observational consequences literally everywhere you look in the Universe (and lasers would work differently), but we don't see any of them ever.

EmDrive is different story. The website itself claims that everything is compatible with conventional physics once relativity is taken into account, I assume this is disputed, but again that explanation or NASA's involving Casimir properties doesn't result in massive consequences in observational data.

And you believe the video demonstrations with lab tests in them, along with numerous PhDs, engineers, and contractors are all staged?

Or mistaken, or fooled.

Or do you believe all of the universities and engineering firms are part of grand conspiracy to defraud investors?

No, but which ones have independently made it?

nextbigfuture.com...

He he
Ill luagh good when i see a vid
of a debunker looking straight
at a flying spaceship with some
freaky propolsion and say:
"Naa i cant see it were is it....."

Its like " They cant see the forest
because theres to many trees in
the way"......

This just confirms what I've said for years, that there are No Laws of Physics, there are No laws of conservation, no laws of thermodynamics etc.

These are all statements of generalization used to explain what we have observed - Only - they are not written in stone as most folks like to think. Just because they call it a Law does not mean it's unchanging or even outright Wrong as seen with new information.

This is why so called Scientist for all their so called smarts really piss me off because they cling to these laws like dogma, like the Religion of Science that it is. This is why Scientists are all washed up, and will not make new discoveries as long as they stick to this ill-logical and Unscientific idea about "laws".

A Real Scientist will Never say, something cannot be invented/proven ect because some silly "Law" will get in the way - they will try until they prove the so called law wrong null and void.

a reply to: Charizard

Several of you in here are making some close correlations to another thread on ats. Magic happens when rabbit holes collide. parad0x122 we're all trying to go "green" on planet and off

a reply to: mbkennel

So you don't believe it's a conspiracy, you just think all three university labs don't know how to property conduct testing? And you think Blacklight is forging their own experimental results?

a reply to: AnarchoCapitalist

this just goes with what i've been saying in pretty much EVERY scientific argument i've had on here....""laws" in science are only laws until we advance far enough to discover they were incorrect...then we change them.."

a reply to: AnarchoCapitalist

EMDrive is definately real despite being dismissed as impossible by many physicists. In addition, the thruster was analysed by UK government scientists and the government went on to fund research. Thrust is proportional to cavity Q so significant thrust should be achievable for modest power input with a superconducting cavity.

Blacklight have clearly demonstrated an effect that has been replicated. However I am not sure of Mills' physics. They have had a lot of money and research time without any clear breakthrough. This NASA test of a Mills type cell produced excess energy NASA. There seems to be a lot of reports of excess energy involving nickel.

However the two reports from AKI and TRN are remarkably similar to me - do these companies have to use a report template?

Thanks for the interesting info...

a reply to: mbkennel
What I want to know about BLP and their hydrinos is... what happens next?

You've sucked the energy out of the hydrogen atoms and taken them below their ground state, and then what?

Once you switch it off do they suddenly suck the energy up to revert to ground state? Do they start drawing heat from their surroundings?

Something has to balance the books!

Alternatively the whole thing is another classic hidden-wire scam.

originally posted by: JohnPhoenix
This just confirms what I've said for years, that there are No Laws of Physics, there are No laws of conservation, no laws of thermodynamics etc.

These are all statements of generalization used to explain what we have observed - Only - they are not written in stone as most folks like to think. Just because they call it a Law does not mean it's unchanging or even outright Wrong as seen with new information.

This is why so called Scientist for all their so called smarts really piss me off because they cling to these laws like dogma, like the Religion of Science that it is. This is why Scientists are all washed up, and will not make new discoveries as long as they stick to this ill-logical and Unscientific idea about "laws".

A Real Scientist will Never say, something cannot be invented/proven ect because some silly "Law" will get in the way - they will try until they prove the so called law wrong null and void.

Doesn't this situation completely debunk your theory?

Assuming this guy is right.

Didn't this get reviewed and test, even tho it was against conventional science?


Won't the rewrite the law of conservation and other problems with the standard model?

There can be no lasting conspiracy in science. That would require paying off or scilencing every MIT type graduate every single year.... Now they can be wrong, but sooner or later some one finds a better way and the books are changed.

originally posted by: Another_Nut
I wonder if whatever is effecting the decay rates of radioactive isotopes is the same thing this is messing with


Does that make sense to anyone but me?

Sorry to go off on a tangent, but what is affecting radioactive decay rates?

Is that something you could provide me a link to please?

Having read the actual paper (not just the abstract), I'm convinced all they're measuring are traditional electromagnetic forces. For instance, they say:

The null force testing indicated that there was an average null force of 9.6 micronewtons present in the as tested configuration. The presence of this null force was a result of the DC power current of 5.6 amps running in the power cable to the RF amplifier from the liquid metal contacts. This current causes the power cable to generate a magnetic field that interacts with the torsion pendulum magnetic damper system.

So simply the electricity flowing through the power cable, creating a magnetic field, was able to produce 9.6 micronewtons of force on the torsion pendulum. I bet in the test configuration there are other magnetic fields being formed that they simply haven't accounted for.

originally posted by: NoRulesAllowed
Am I the only one who was immediately reminded of the guy posting a thread that he invented a warp drive and afterwards got harassed by alines?

The principles at work here seem to me not too far off, but of course we don't even know what principle it is which provides thrust. Astonishing article, to say the least...

More here:

emdrive.com...
emdrive.com...

Light can only move at the speed of light. When light is emitted by a body moving at high velocity it becomes red or blue shifted.

Maybe motion is one of the phenomena caused by light needing to maintain its constant speed.

originally posted by: sy.gunson

originally posted by: Another_Nut
I wonder if whatever is effecting the decay rates of radioactive isotopes is the same thing this is messing with


Does that make sense to anyone but me?

Sorry to go off on a tangent, but what is affecting radioactive decay rates?

Is that something you could provide me a link to please?

There is some modest evidence that certain radioactive decays may be influenced by the yearly solar cycle. The most plausible explanation would be an as yet unknown influence from solar neutrinos.

cuthelain.wordpress.com...

originally posted by: Rob48
a reply to: mbkennel
What I want to know about BLP and their hydrinos is... what happens next?

You've sucked the energy out of the hydrogen atoms and taken them below their ground state, and then what?

There's some blathering about turning it into dark matter or something.

Once you switch it off do they suddenly suck the energy up to revert to ground state? Do they start drawing heat from their surroundings?

Yeah, none of the explanations makes sense or it has other big problems.

What's so special about hydrogen? Why not squeezing other larger collections of electrons + protons? We already know them---heavy nuclei have much closer and already squeezed electrons. Why dont' they turn into 'hydrinos' or some higher order variant thereof?

Exotic conditions in stars are much denser than in the lab, why no 'hydrinos' being produced there? Why no plethora of anomalous spectral lines in stellar observations?

Why white dwarfs at degeneracy pressure? Why didn't they all 'pop' into a hydrino star and give a huge stellar burst of radiation?

a reply to: AnarchoCapitalist

This has more chance of working than Blacklights BS machine.



This is also explained better!!

a reply to: AnarchoCapitalist
Yes-- this is very interesting, could lead to a 'cold fusion' like discovery
also I think or at least a cheap energy source.

I wonder how the energy companies of the world will react.

Rebel 5

originally posted by: championoftruth

originally posted by: rickymouse
So it works as the guy said it would. Nobody paid attention to the guy for many years, thinking he was nuts because it was in contradiction to what they were taught. Now NASA tested it and is trying to figure out how it works, trying to use Occams Razor to explain how it works. Who cares how it works, it works, it can be utilized and just because it defies the law does not mean it is a crime to use it.

This sounds normal to me, reality is based on beliefs. Breaking misguided beliefs is hard to do.

yes.I totally agree with you.who cares how it works.if it works use it.for example even aircraft lift is still not well understood with at least a dozen explanations but millions of planes flying out there.

Exactly. I don't argue about how gravity isn't possible. Instead, I use it to get food and water into my belly.

I'm just glad I have the E-CAT on preorder reserve.

originally posted by: Cuervo
yes.I totally agree with you.who cares how it works.if it works use it.for example even aircraft lift is still not well understood with at least a dozen explanations but millions of planes flying out there.

WTF?

The Wright brothers knew how aircraft lift worked, and they measured it. Bottom side pushes, top side sucks.

It will be very interesting to see how this tech goes into our space program. Or if it does at all...

Once again we will be waiting another fitfy years for nothing to happen...

Oh and try to replace the word 'gravity' with the word INERTIA if you want to understand it better. You are in a state of inertia that is estimated to be 108,000 km/h or 67,108 miles as you orbit the sun. Now imagine how fast you could instantly travel if you could instantly STOP your inertial momentum. MMMmmmmmmmm.