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MH17 Black Box Data Shows Evidence Of Missile Strike

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posted on Jul, 29 2014 @ 08:50 PM
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a reply to: glend

I think what Zaph was saying is why and how would the Ukraine Government drive their valuable SAM system into rebel held territory without being challenged, have time to set up to shoot down an airliner, then be allowed to leave said rebel territory safely, all while the rebels chatter on mobile and social media about shooting down a plane.....

Occams razor should be employed and it seems every counter-theory put forward to try and shift the blame off the separatists seems to require an extraordinary chain of events and unbelievably good luck, whereas if the separatists did it requires nothing out of the ordinary and fits with the pattern of them shooting down multiple Government aircraft in the days/weeks prior....




posted on Jul, 29 2014 @ 08:53 PM
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If he is willing to execute reporters, then he is willing to fire on a civilian aircraft.

Ukraine rebel chief Igor Bezler threatens to execute interviewer


With a walrus moustache, a fiery temper and a reputation for brutality, Igor Bezler is the most feared of all the rebel leaders in eastern Ukraine. Nicknamed Bes, or “the Demon”, he is regarded as something of a loose cannon, even by other rebels, who speak about him in hushed tones. If the Ukrainian security services, the SBU, are to be believed, the Demon and a group of his men were responsible for shooting down Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 over the region a fortnight ago.

According to the recording of a phone call allegedly made two minutes before the disaster, the Demon was told: “A bird is flying towards you.” He asked whether it was small or big, and was told that it was hard to see, as it was flying high above the clouds. In another recording, apparently made 20 minutes later, the Demon reported to his interlocutor, supposedly a Russian intelligence official, that a plane had been shot down. Bezler said the recording was real, but referred to a different incident: as well as allegedly bringing down MH17, the rebels have shot down 10 Ukrainian aircraft.

The Demon hardly ever gives interviews, but a Russian journalist and I managed to secure one, so we set off last Thursdayto visit his headquarters in the town of Gorlovka, a 40-minute drive along deserted roads from the regional capital of Donetsk.

Previously a normal east Ukrainian town, with decaying Soviet-era industrial plants and a political elite that skimmed off the financial flows that might have helped lift it from its decrepit state, Gorlovka has become the Demon’s fiefdom in the three months since the uprising started.


Click link for remainder of article...

so this is what "Pro Russian Democracy and Self Determination" look like in the East / South rebel controlled areas.



posted on Jul, 29 2014 @ 08:58 PM
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a reply to: Zaphod58

If militia had planes, yes it would be a valuable asset, they don't, so its expendable.

The shooting down of a commercial airliner doesn't benefit Russia or the miltia but it certainly benefits the US. If US wants war then we can all kiss our families goodbye.



posted on Jul, 29 2014 @ 09:04 PM
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a reply to: stumason

Militia aren't controlling every square mile of the land, reporters drove in the area. Buk takes 5 minutes to setup from stop. Russian satellite pictures here..



posted on Jul, 29 2014 @ 09:04 PM
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originally posted by: glend
a reply to: Zaphod58

If militia had planes, yes it would be a valuable asset, they don't, so its expendable.

The shooting down of a commercial airliner doesn't benefit Russia or the miltia but it certainly benefits the US. If US wants war then we can all kiss our families goodbye.


I love how you guys can't get off this war kick. Really, educate yourself on the situation because its getting annoying to keep hearing the bs war crap when the only country pushing for a war is Russia.

As for the shoot down you guys really need to stop ignoring the other possibility, the one you guys are desperate to keep from becoming part of the discussion.

That the shoot down of the aircraft by rebels was a result of mistaken identity.



posted on Jul, 29 2014 @ 09:04 PM
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a reply to: glend

Wow, really? The rebels don't have planes, so it's not valuable anymore? Does that even BEGIN to make sense to you?

That would be practically HANDING the rebels something that would allow them to do all kinds of damage to the Ukrainian Air Force, at any altitude they fly at.

The rebels have at least one SAM launcher, and you think that the Ukrainians would risk giving them another?



posted on Jul, 29 2014 @ 09:06 PM
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originally posted by: glend
a reply to: stumason

Militia aren't controlling every square mile of the land, reporters drove in the area. Buk takes 5 minutes to setup from stop. Russian satellite pictures here..



How were the Russians able to identify the aircraft as an SU 25?

The image is radar btw.

The MH17 was flying through Ukraine airspace for some time. It was in contact with Ukraine ATC. The Ukraine authorities new the plane was civilian.

The rebels on the other hand.. not so much.
edit on 29-7-2014 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 29 2014 @ 09:06 PM
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a reply to: glend

They don't have to control every bit of the road. All they have to do is control enough to know it's there, and ambush it, and capture it. It wouldn't be hard with no security around it.



posted on Jul, 29 2014 @ 09:11 PM
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a reply to: Xcathdra

If you believe that all the arab countries after 1000 years have all just disintegrated in last 10 by their own accord then you don't have a clue whats happening. US economy has collapsed and see's war as the only way out.


edit on 29 7 2014 by glend because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 29 2014 @ 09:15 PM
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a reply to: Zaphod58

You'd arm it for detonation rather than let it fall enemy hands.



posted on Jul, 29 2014 @ 09:16 PM
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a reply to: glend

And how are you going to do that? The units operating SAM batteries generally only have small arms, and I've never heard of a missile that has a self destruct in them that can be operated on the ground.



posted on Jul, 29 2014 @ 09:16 PM
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edit on 7/29/2014 by Zaphod58 because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 29 2014 @ 09:21 PM
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a reply to: Zaphod58

just because you never heard of it doesn't make it fact. But even if it didn't there are such things as timed explosives!



posted on Jul, 29 2014 @ 09:25 PM
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a reply to: glend

And most units don't carry around prepacked explosives. You've been watching too many movies. They get guns, bullets, and whatever equipment they need to keep their gear up and running. They don't carry around RPGs, or have self destruct systems that can accidentally be activated, and blow all their gear up, or timed explosives that can accidentally be detonated through any one of a dozen ways.



posted on Jul, 29 2014 @ 09:32 PM
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a reply to: Zaphod58

If a so called muslum terrorist can get a bomb I am sure the Ukraine army can too. But if the purpose of downing MH17 was to get the world to side with economic sanctions against Russia then the dangers of loosing one Buk system is totally irrelevant when looking at the bigger picture.



posted on Jul, 29 2014 @ 09:36 PM
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a reply to: glend

And when word gets out that they allowed it to happen, or even arrange for it to happen, the world turns on them.

Except for the fact that it was in rebel hands well before the Russians said that it was moved into the area. They used it to shoot down a Ukrainian transport about a week before MH17 was shot down.



posted on Jul, 29 2014 @ 09:53 PM
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a reply to: Zaphod58

Western media will NEVER let that happen,media is totally controlled, and the Russians know it. Russian statement last month said they expect a European war shortly, expanding soon after into a Eurasian war. The Chinese are siding with Russia. Yes I know rebels shot down a couple planes but in every event you have to look for the reason that isn't there, and that is questioning why the rebels would shoot down a commercial airliner. It doesn't profit them in any way or form.

And even if the rebels mistakenly shot down an airliner whats with the sanctions. Normally commanders get medals for shooting down airliners, or at least the US commander that shot down Iran Air Flight 655 in 1988 did.



posted on Jul, 29 2014 @ 10:01 PM
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a reply to: glend

And Russian media is completely 100% open, and not controlled in the least, right?



posted on Jul, 29 2014 @ 10:09 PM
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originally posted by: glend
a reply to: Xcathdra

If you believe that all the arab countries after 1000 years have all just disintegrated in last 10 by their own accord then you don't have a clue whats happening. US economy has collapsed and see's war as the only way out.



Yeah because a video that is years old is accurate. Live in the now. Its not the cold war anymore.



posted on Jul, 29 2014 @ 10:13 PM
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a reply to: Zaphod58

No, Russia media is as bad as the west but the Russian people know how to read between the lines (lie's). The western population doesn't. You'd think after the Iraq WMD fiasco we'd learn, but no, we are still stupid. Obama has now put sanctions on a country with enough nukes to burn the world, war is guaranteed.




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