It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.
Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.
Thank you.
Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.
originally posted by: combatmaster
originally posted by: ProfessorChaos
"The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct 'Palestinian
people' to oppose Zionism.
"For tactical reasons, Jordan, which is a sovereign state with defined borders, cannot raise claims to Haifa and Jaffa.
While as a Palestinian, I can undoubtedly demand Haifa, Jaffa, Beer-Sheva and Jerusalem. However, the moment we
reclaim our right to all of Palestine, we will not wait even a minute to unite Palestine and Jordan."
(PLO executive committee member Zahir Muhsein, in a 1977
interview with the Dutch newspaper Trouw.)
This will be ignored by the ignorant!
originally posted by: Quetzalcoatl14
This argument is getting really old, and to me it sounds really war crimey every time I hear it.
1) There have been people, including many of the Palestinians, living in Palestine for millennia. Many ethnic groups that are not Jewish have been living there, according to not only historical evidence but also according to the very religious texts that the Jews and Christians believe in.
2) Orthodox Jews and Christians find themselves between a rock and a hard place. If they claim that the Old Testament is the inerrant word of God and within that word is the claim that "God" gave Israel to the Jews, then they also have to recognize that the very same "inerrant" "word of the Lord" states that Abraham came from Sumeria (Ur) and the Hebrews invaded the land of Canaan. Hence, the "original claim to the land" is unfounded if coming from a religious perspective.
3) Much anthropological evidence suggests that not only are many Palestinians related genetically to both the canaanites and Jews, but many may in fact be descended from Jews that converted to Christianity or Islam. Hence once again they have a strong claim to the land.
4) According to most international law, no group can really retake land from a 2000 year old claim, uprooting people that have a much more recent claim. Many of the Palestinian's grandparents lived on land that the Israeli's have now taken. We are talking 20th century land claims, not 0 A.D. land claims. If every person were to claim what they assert their relatives had in 0 A.D., virtually all current land ownership in North America and most of Europe would be void. And, who can prove exactly which piece of land their relatives owned in 0 A.D? Very few.
Basically, all SUPERIOR land claims, meaning more than other groups in the area, don't really hold up. I rest my case.
originally posted by: combatmaster
originally posted by: ProfessorChaos
"The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct 'Palestinian
people' to oppose Zionism.
"For tactical reasons, Jordan, which is a sovereign state with defined borders, cannot raise claims to Haifa and Jaffa.
While as a Palestinian, I can undoubtedly demand Haifa, Jaffa, Beer-Sheva and Jerusalem. However, the moment we
reclaim our right to all of Palestine, we will not wait even a minute to unite Palestine and Jordan."
(PLO executive committee member Zahir Muhsein, in a 1977
interview with the Dutch newspaper Trouw.)
This will be ignored by the ignorant!
Israel exists cos the UN voted for it after british mandate. Not god!
originally posted by: combatmaster
originally posted by: Quetzalcoatl14
This argument is getting really old, and to me it sounds really war crimey every time I hear it.
1) There have been people, including many of the Palestinians, living in Palestine for millennia. Many ethnic groups that are not Jewish have been living there, according to not only historical evidence but also according to the very religious texts that the Jews and Christians believe in.
2) Orthodox Jews and Christians find themselves between a rock and a hard place. If they claim that the Old Testament is the inerrant word of God and within that word is the claim that "God" gave Israel to the Jews, then they also have to recognize that the very same "inerrant" "word of the Lord" states that Abraham came from Sumeria (Ur) and the Hebrews invaded the land of Canaan. Hence, the "original claim to the land" is unfounded if coming from a religious perspective.
3) Much anthropological evidence suggests that not only are many Palestinians related genetically to both the canaanites and Jews, but many may in fact be descended from Jews that converted to Christianity or Islam. Hence once again they have a strong claim to the land.
4) According to most international law, no group can really retake land from a 2000 year old claim, uprooting people that have a much more recent claim. Many of the Palestinian's grandparents lived on land that the Israeli's have now taken. We are talking 20th century land claims, not 0 A.D. land claims. If every person were to claim what they assert their relatives had in 0 A.D., virtually all current land ownership in North America and most of Europe would be void. And, who can prove exactly which piece of land their relatives owned in 0 A.D? Very few.
Basically, all SUPERIOR land claims, meaning more than other groups in the area, don't really hold up. I rest my case.
originally posted by: combatmaster
originally posted by: ProfessorChaos
"The Palestinian people does not exist. The creation of a Palestinian state is only a means for continuing our struggle against the state of Israel for our Arab unity. In reality today there is no difference between Jordanians, Palestinians, Syrians and Lebanese. Only for political and tactical reasons do we speak today about the existence of a Palestinian people, since Arab national interests demand that we posit the existence of a distinct 'Palestinian
people' to oppose Zionism.
"For tactical reasons, Jordan, which is a sovereign state with defined borders, cannot raise claims to Haifa and Jaffa.
While as a Palestinian, I can undoubtedly demand Haifa, Jaffa, Beer-Sheva and Jerusalem. However, the moment we
reclaim our right to all of Palestine, we will not wait even a minute to unite Palestine and Jordan."
(PLO executive committee member Zahir Muhsein, in a 1977
interview with the Dutch newspaper Trouw.)
This will be ignored by the ignorant!
Israel exists cos the UN voted for it after british mandate. Not god!
originally posted by: ManBehindTheMask
a reply to: combatmaster
Israel exists cos the UN voted for it after british mandate. Not god!
Funny I thought the first Jewish temple was built LONG before the UN was even an idea.........
originally posted by: fred999
Been visititing ats for about 9 years, never joined up or left comments. But in last couple weeks couldn't believe the peope defending israeli action on this site and others. Where the hell has humanity gone . Common sense. Defending itself by wiping palestine off the map?
LONG LIVE PALESTINE
Just 90 minutes into the “humanitarian” “ceasefire” Hamas emerged from a terror tunnel, detonated a suicide bomb and took one Jew hostage back through the tunnel.
An Israeli analyst told CNN’s Wolf Blitzer Friday morning that he received information from reliable sources that 3,000 Hamas elite soldiers told their families goodbye and appear ready to carry out suicide attacks on Israel.
Middle East analyst Gershon Baskin said that all the fighters were equipped with suicide vests and that they had expected to die in terrorist attacks.