Can someone explain why gangs are allowed to roam free and not be charged as domestic terriost

originally posted by: musicismagic
I don't get it at all. They do more damage to neighborhoods and the communities and schools and yet they are allowed to roam freely and terrorise businesses and people.

This is exactly what I said when Bush announced that the US will NOT tolerate terrorist.

All of these poor people saying how bullets come through their windows and wall every week yet they can't afford to move!!

Take the plank out of America's eye before we go picking at world splinters!

originally posted by: Sremmos80
a reply to: musicismagic


Its not so simple as just getting rid of them, gangs have been around the past century if not longer. If there is a void another will takes it's place.

Does this mean you support gangs and their inevitability in our society? This type of thinking only sets us back... we need to always move forward to resolve issues, and not shrug our shoulders and just accept them.

a reply to: jupiter869
No it was a response to a question of why don't we just simply get rid of them. The answer is you that you can't. That is the realistic answer.
The first part if the post that you didn't quote is about the pd units that are dedicated to stopping them. What is your forward solution to gangs?

a reply to: NthOther

Because if they got rid of the gangs, the cops would lose one of their primary justifications for militarization.

Or they would be helping to cut down the acts of violence they create amongst themselves, and create less collateral damage against normal citizens caught up in the situation.

a reply to: DirtyD

Whether gangs are labeled terrorists or criminals, they both murder innocent civilians and create fear which is exactly what terrorists do! I don't understand how you can even defend organizations that kill innocent people and create an atmosphere of fear. Gangs and organized crime destroy the moral beliefs of our youth and destroy the fabric of our society. Gangs pose more of a threat to American society than terrorists!

The city I live in never had huge drug trafficking problem, home invasions and shootings until gangs from Detroit moved in. All of this happened in just a 2 year time span! Gangs can infiltrate neighborhoods without being monitored unlike terrorist cells. Both gangs and terrorists can establish roots for their ideology whether it be radical or criminal. The difference is gangs can establish it much easier because terrorism is now monitored 24/7.

Our constitution was written years ago without any crystal ball to the changes and threats to the future of society. Criminals have more rights than their victims. Ask anyone whose been a victim of crime, including myself. Most criminal should lose their civil liberties that's why they're put away in jails! Terrorists caught in this country are given fair trials...the shoe bomber, the Boston bomber, even Timothy Mcveigh. Gang bangers choose to lead a life of crime and they deserve to lose their civil liberties! I would rather protect innocent law abiding citizens rather than organizations that prey on innocent people.

Calling the Op ignorant because of their views and those of other posters including myself is clearly a violation of ATS policies. No matter how passionate you are about a particular subject, you can convey your views in a much more civil manner.

a reply to: ScientiaFortisDefendit

The racism actually exists in the not doing anything about it. Factor in using poverty and race to justify LEA budgets and then propagate stereotypes and there's your racism. Way to use your brain...

Oh and don't forget the need for prison labor.

a reply to: WeRpeons

We cannot paint with broad strokes when it comes to labelig people terrorists. It sets a dangerous precedent. The NDAA allows for "terrorists" to be indefinitely detained without due process. "Terrorists" can be stripped of rights without ever seeing a day in court. "Terrorists" can be drone bombed at the will of the President, even if they are American citizens, the precedent has already been set. Though this has yet to occur on American soil, start allowing the state to bandy about terrorism charges and see how quickly that changes. Tyrants call criminals "terrorists" so they steal them off in the middle of the night without judge or jury. Do you really think the shoe bomber got a fair trail? Do you think the Boaton bomber is getting a fair trail? Do any of us even know what's going on with that trail? No.

Gang bangers are nothing more than criminals, they may terrorize a neighborhood but they are not terrorists. Throw that label on them and you make them much more than they are, while further empowering the state to rid them of their rights before a crime has even been committed.

ETA: You're right, I shouldn't have called the question ignorant. It doesn't add to civil discourse. But it worries me to see how quick some of us are to call people terrorists.

a reply to: WeRpeons

And how many of those who joined up with gangs came from broken homes or single-parent homes?

Also, why do we allow a culture to exist that glorifies gangster life? Wouldn't it be easier to curb that culture than it would be to stamp out gangs? They are basically a social group that forms and they are used to create a strong base for criminal activity, and yes, they've been around forever. Have you seen West Side Story or read Oliver Twist? What was Artful Dodger if not a gang moniker of Dickens' day?

To join a gang you have to commit a crime. You can not join a street gang without committing a crime and getting beat in. Or if a female you have to commit a crime and get the option of being raped in instead of beat in. Gangs are criminal enterprises. You do not join a gang and then not commit crimes. You do not join a gang and then become a baker or a humanitarian. You join a gang and become a drug dealer or a thief or a soldier who commits violent crimes on the orders of those higher up than you. Everyone who puts on those colors is a criminal. That is what they mean.

I understand were people are coming from. This is America. We are supposed to have the illusion of freedom. You can not label gangs as terrorists. They are different things. However it seems most of you have never lived in a neighborhood plagued with gangs or have never worked with gang members who are trying to get out of the lifestyle. They are all criminals the moment they put those colors on. As soon as you join it is only a matter of time before you commit a crime. End of story.

Do not feel sorry for these guys. Only feel sorry for those trying to get out. They kill without mercy and then laugh and joke about it. They destroy there own neighborhoods for profit. This all comes from experience. I grew up in the worst city in the country. People call it Chiraq for a reason. I am involved in trying to solve the problem. I am in the streets talking to these guys, trying to educate them. This is not some internet tough guy routine. I call them cowards to their faces. Like I posted earlier. I have been shot at. I have had guns to my head. I have been stabbed twice. I am in the trenches.

I do not hate gang members. They should not all be rounded up and executed but I do not make excuses for them. I grew up in the same neighborhood they did. My father pressured me into joining. I did not. I took the hard path. They use the sympathy of liberals. They want you to feel sorry for them because they are minorities and grew up in the ghetto. Then they use those sympathys to rob you and sell your kids drugs. If you need to feel sorry for someone. Feel sorry for the people living right and being terrorized by the gangs.

originally posted by: DirtyD
a reply to: WeRpeons

We cannot paint with broad strokes when it comes to labelig people terrorists.

The justice department does exactly that.

a reply to: ScientiaFortisDefendit

Exactly, which is why we should be fighting to curb the DOJ's judicial overreach, not embolden it.

a reply to: karmicecstasy

But that still doesn't justify just rounding someone up for being in a gang. That in and of itself is not a crime. The murders, the thefts, the beatings ... those are all crimes and deserve to be prosecuted as such, but the minute you start opening the door to criminalizing simply belonging to the wrong groups, all hell will break loose because where does that stop? Do we criminalize people for belonging in the KKK? Do criminalize people for belonging in PETA? Do we criminalize people for belonging in ELF? How about for belonging to the wrong political or religious groups?

a reply to: ketsuko

Maybe I typed that wrong. I meant that they should not all be rounded up and executed. I was not advocating that they should. I fixed it so thank you for responding to me and pointing that out. Wow people must think im crazy lol.

Why dont we just go ahead and do liek the FBI did in the 20,s and 30,s and just kill them off. Under the NDAA they can be legally disposed of since they are engaging in actions that terrorist themselves engage in. Reason why they wont though? VOTES. the democratic base is the reason why they do not do it.

a reply to: musicismagic

I'm tired of seeing dogs roaming the streets of my neighborhood. I think I'm gonna write a politician about these canine terrorists (tongue firmly planted in cheek).

Its real simple . Take the destruction of Cleveland for instance. Pump up the lazy entitlement welfare cash flow , let the braindead ignorant live like filthy rich pigs. Then its time to get arrogant, bigmouthed and believe that everyone else is suppose to pick up there trash they throw without a though all over the streets and beaches. Im talking slimeball littering taught from childhood. Then when 10 million Lil waynes eminems are running around tearing everything up with fully pumped up egos and all the suburb kids worship them, and think there gods walking. The bottom drops out on purpose "Dat food card" gets cut off. The brand new Mercedes they got from welfare is out of gas , then they will group up in the thousands to go house to house to take everything you got and cut you to pieces just for fun. Sounds like a good way to destroy a country from the inside out. Of course there allowed to roam the streets shooting people and setting them on fire in there cars. lol USA is a brainwashed TV slimeball gladiator sports loving bunch of soon to be memorys. So keep hiding under the bed with your remote control .
Ya I guess im a rasist, I hate the ghetto slime ignorant gangsta's paradise we live in here in the North and watching my USA get decimated street by street one gangster at a time.

originally posted by: dntwastetime
Its real simple . Take the destruction of Cleveland for instance. Pump up the lazy entitlement welfare cash flow , let the braindead ignorant live like filthy rich pigs. Then its time to get arrogant, bigmouthed and believe that everyone else is suppose to pick up there trash they throw without a though all over the streets and beaches. Im talking slimeball littering taught from childhood. Then when 10 million Lil waynes eminems are running around tearing everything up with fully pumped up egos and all the suburb kids worship them, and think there gods walking. The bottom drops out on purpose "Dat food card" gets cut off. The brand new Mercedes they got from welfare is out of gas , then they will group up in the thousands to go house to house to take everything you got and cut you to pieces just for fun. Sounds like a good way to destroy a country from the inside out. Of course there allowed to roam the streets shooting people and setting them on fire in there cars. lol USA is a brainwashed TV slimeball gladiator sports loving bunch of soon to be memorys. So keep hiding under the bed with your remote control .
Ya I guess im a rasist, I hate the ghetto slime ignorant gangsta's paradise we live in here in the North and watching my USA get decimated street by street one gangster at a time.

When I used the word "domestic" terriorist, I meant exactly that. We can play dictionary words games here, but when you posted the above, I believe you understand where my question was truly coming from, from the heart. Yes, I had my run ins with the gangs even in Santa Monica running a 7-11 store. They take, smiling at you what ever they want. They are pigs and animals. I'm talking about the bad gangs here.

Here in this country we have to deal with the local yakuza when we open a business. The thing about it here is, most people are related to someone in government. So very little gets done, its mostly hidden from the public what they do I think, not too sure since I live among the rice paddies.

originally posted by: musicismagic
I don't get it at all. They do more damage to neighborhoods and the communities and schools and yet they are allowed to roam freely and terrorise businesses and people.

Where are we going to incarcerate them all? I'm all for shooting them or locking the little bastards away, but we haven't got the infrastructure for it.

Because 'hanging out' isn't a crime. They could only be arrested if they were doing something, rather caught, doing something illegal. You can't just arrest someone for being in a gang and hanging out around town.

a reply to: musicismagic

Well, maybe if they let the gangs run free, they can use them as a perfect excuse to bring about martial law.
After they ban guns, the crime rate will shoot up and then they can say "we need to have martial law for your safety".
The people will almost beg for it. Saying "please protect us from the gangs", then they will have complete control.

Also the gang bangers are making a lot of "people" money selling drugs and guns. Look at Chicago, they call it Chiraq and they should. It's almost imposable to own a gun in Chicago, yet the crime/murder rate is over the top and between July 3rd and July 7th, 82 people were wounded and 16 killed by gunfire.

No rallys, no 24 hour news coverage. Now if there is not an agenda in play, than I guess all the anti-gunners only care about "their" neighborhoods.

The justice system is a joke, jail is a second home for these kids and they get pampered in prison. So you need to ask why. Why is the gang task-force being disassembled in Chicago? Why are these kids being put back on the street when they should be serving 30+ years? Why can't the people own and carry a gun for their protection?

IMO I think the gangs are part of an agenda, one that will get people (most of them) to beg to have the rest of their rights taken away.