Ukraine Coalition Government Collapses as 2 Parties Quit

originally posted by: whitepanther999
a reply to: Xcathdra

It's just funny how people who question western media are pro-russians and brainwashed, but those who question russian propaganda are good guys. Labelling is strong in these forums.

on both sides...

Just as all Ukrainians are Nazis right? Or that the "Junta" in Kiev are Nazis?

originally posted by: Xcathdra

originally posted by: the2ofusr1
Actually I read a lot from independent writers .Then when I watch RT it makes it easier to get a good picture .Rarley does RT let loose with the accusations you will find from someone like a Webster Tarpley or a Pepe Escobar . Global Research has some good stuff as well . The western media is just not believable anymore . a reply to: tsurfer2000h

Please tell me you are joking.

RT is state sponsored propaganda.. Thats already been established.

So is the BBC, your point?


.

a reply to: Xcathdra
But you chose to engage it and your ammount of posts far out number anybody else's.

But, seeing as you have made this point......my comment applies to everybody else who respond to your dragging up Crimea and Russia's involvement (there's a thread for that) in everything Ukranian, from the Malayan plane crash (there's a thread for that), to Putin invading Crimea (there's even a thread for that).

Let's keep it to good old fashioned politics, and the possible outcomes shall we?

a reply to: Xcathdra

Last I checked Crimea was a part of Ukraine, currently occupied by Russia, which is the business of the Ukraine government. The government in Ukraine is still in place until the Parliament elections in or around October.

Last time i had seen the majority of the population wanted to be part with Russia the same way eastern ukraine want to be part with Russia as Ukrainians arent a new race, Ukrainians are Russians they speak the same native tongue.


The government in Ukraine is still in place until the Parliament elections in or around October.
LOL you crack me up with this. even after the Ukrainian government had collapsed you still claim that the Ukraine is still in place until the Parliament elections in or around October? and then what? since the far right and the facists were the ones whom stopped the collation this only tells one thing.

Is that they want to be party of the government as they were the ones with the majority of the protesters whom were protesting agaisnt the party of region last year ago.

a reply to: Xcathdra

im sorry but the action to fire was approved by the head of the new ,

The Donetsk People's Republic ,,,NOT,, where Russians / Pro Russian rebels.

So who is the head of the militart in the new "Donetsk People's Republic " ,,??? and why has the WORLDS NEWS MEDIA not asked him??

instead of Obama or Putin?

just curious.





(DPR or DNR) (Russian: Донецкая народная республика, Donétskaya naródnaya respúblika, Ukrainian: Донецька народна ...


or

Donetsk People's Republic The Donetsk People's Republic is a self-proclaimed state in eastern Ukraine. It is part of the self-proclaimed Federal State of Novorossiya. Wikipedia

a reply to: Xcathdra

Western Ukraine:Far Right.
Eastern Ukraine: Russia.

originally posted by: TheChrome
Fox News just reported the Pentagon has confirmed that Russia is firing artillery on Ukrainian military positions.

www.huffingtonpost.com...

Reminds me of the time last year that the Pentagon has confirmed that Assad in Moscow residing aside a Russian Ship, according to anonymous sources.

originally posted by: Agent_USA_Supporter
Funny for a user that has being following all the news of Ukraine from sources based on Twitter and Keivpost which arent reliable shred of sources.

translation - You cant support the misinformation you just tried to pass off ref Russian language so you resort in attacking the poster - check.

originally posted by: Agent_USA_Supporter
According to whom? the Ukrainian ministry of Truth and Kiev post? i got sources of the Ukrainian parliament banning the Russian language.

Good god man.. do some research. The lie Russia told about the Russian language is clouding your judgment. There never was a law passed restricting the Russian language.

originally posted by: Agent_USA_Supporter
Are you going to claim next that the opposition Communist party isn't banned either?

Party of Regions disbanded. Stop trying to move the goal post when your argument gets shot down.

I find it startling that you are in a thread talking about Ukraine's government and you appear to not know anything about it.

originally posted by: Agent_USA_Supporter
You crack me up so much with that little line, Why Why? Peaceful lovely Democratic Ukraine hasn't nothing wrong towards there own brethren.

What did Ukraine do wrong?

originally posted by: Agent_USA_Supporter
Lets just ignore the way the Ukrainian military forces are killing innocent civilians and using them as human shields. Or how they burned the innocent protestors in Odessa.

Then ask Pro Russian rebels why they refused to allow civilians to flee cities.
I was not aware the Odessa incident had been completely investigated. Or are you suggesting its ok to assume in that situation and not in the shoot down situation?

originally posted by: Agent_USA_Supporter
But wait your going to probably claim that they did that towards themselves by burning themselves.

and you would be wrong...

originally posted by: Agent_USA_Supporter
According to you the Euporean Union Empire which already the cards are falling can actually save Ukraine, yet Greece, Spain,France, Britain, Poland are having a mess number of unemployment rate.

European Union Empire? Not as catchy as the Russian Empire. You can stop with the drama by the way. You are only showing your bias.

originally posted by: Agent_USA_Supporter
Which isn't stopping any time soon, more youths are becoming and following your logic your suggesting that Ukraine would be better of with the EU even though the EU has offered Ukraine what again?

Gas supplies via reverse supply lines.
Monetary assistance
food / humanitarian supplies
EU affiliation treaty.

What has Russia offered? Other than an armed invasion?

originally posted by: Agent_USA_Supporter
Turkish Gas?

What about it?

originally posted by: Agent_USA_Supporter
If you really believe that claim of yours so badly why dont you go buy a ticket yourself and go yourself to Crimea and ask the people to see just the Russian people really think of your opinion?

Because those people beleive the lies Russia has told and are still being prevented from seeing any information that does not tow the party line.

originally posted by: Agent_USA_Supporter
Comparing to the other parts of Ukraine, Crimea has being peaceful and there has being invasion.

And Russia would disagree with you since they are being forced to donate time and money so Crimea can be fixed.
Nothing like happy Crimean Russian citizens - ussian rules anger citizens in Crimea

originally posted by: Agent_USA_Supporter
What Invasion? care to some actual actual evidence? and not some videos from Youtube or twitter tweets made by pro Ukrainian users?

Already been supplied many times over now. Feel free to read the UN reports on russias invasion of Ukraine and illegal annexation of Crimea.

Simply ignoring it does not make Russian propaganda right.

originally posted by: Agent_USA_Supporter
Do read my post again.

I had to when answering being you never bothered to support any of your claims. Eventually I noticed you obfuscated the claims you made.


Also - Putins own Presidential council proved the crimea elections were a sham.

originally posted by: Agent_USA_Supporter" target="_blank" class="postlink" rel="nofollow">Putin's 'Human Rights Council' Accidentally Posts Real Crimean Election Results

As you may recall, the official Crimean election results, as reported widely in the Western press, showed a 97 percent vote in favor of annexation with a turnout of 83 percent. No international observers were allowed. The pro-Russia election pressure would have raised the already weak vote in favor of annexation, of course.

Yesterday, however, according to a major Ukrainian news site, TSN.ua, the website of the President of Russia’s Council on Civil Society and Human Rights (shortened to President’s Human Rights Council) posted a report that was quickly taken down as if it were toxic radioactive waste. According to this purported report about the March referendum to annex Crimea, the turnout of Crimean voters was only 30 percent. And of these, only half voted for the referendum–meaning only 15 percent of Crimean citizens voted for annexation.

The TSN report does not link to a copy of the cited report. However, there is a report of the Human Rights Council, entitled “Problems of Crimean Residents,” still up on the president-sovet.ru website, which discusses the Council’s estimates of the results of the March 16 referendum. Quoting from that report: “In Crimea, according to various indicators, 50-60% voted for unification with Russia with a voter turnout (yavka) of 30-50%.” This leads to a range of between 15 percent (50% x 30%) and 30 percent (60% x 50%) voting for annexation. The turnout in the Crimean district of Sevastopol, according to the Council, was higher: 50-80%.

click for remainder of article.

originally posted by: angelchemuel
a reply to: Xcathdra
But you chose to engage it and your ammount of posts far out number anybody else's.

But, seeing as you have made this point......my comment applies to everybody else who respond to your dragging up Crimea and Russia's involvement (there's a thread for that) in everything Ukranian, from the Malayan plane crash (there's a thread for that), to Putin invading Crimea (there's even a thread for that).

Let's keep it to good old fashioned politics, and the possible outcomes shall we?

Fair enough.. Maybe you should get the pro russians to stop their posts off topic. If they are going to respond to my posts, I want to respond to theirs.

However I take notice that you just stated they went off topic first, and you are not happy with me responding to them. To me its an attempt to let them get the propaganda out while trying to silence those who don't agree.

a reply to: Xcathdra

Laughable.

so you resort in attacking the poster - check.

Nope i haven't attacked you in any way, rather attacking your sources There is a difference.

Good god man.. do some research. The lie Russia told about the Russian language is clouding your judgment. There never was a law passed restricting the Russian language.

I will be post all about the Russian language and how it was banned just like how majority of the Russian Television stations were banned as well.

There never was a law passed restricting the Russian language.

Yes there was, the only people claiming that the Russian language wasnt banned are journalists whom are doing the propaganda trying to justify there claims that Russia invaded Crimea based on false pretexts Cheering the botox Kerry, mainly these articles are usual made by NeoCons.


Example Noah Rothman,NeoCon, former member of Hot Air an NeoCon News Daily site wrote.
The Most Hilarious Russian Propaganda Justifying the Invasion of Crimea

While there are certainly extremist elements in the Ukrainian opposition, and even the provisional government, the notion that Kiev’s government fell to a neo-fascist movement is a fantasy lent credence by Russian state television.

Noah Rothman has written several pro Syrian rebel articles and articles justifying an invasion of Gaza and Iran as well.

Good god man.. do some research.

The fact that i had being a member of Some NeoCons sites as Young Man before joining ATS and had seen what kind of level propaganda the western media plays i have done my research pretty well.



I am not surprised why you would rather surprised an far right Ukrainian government while you would claim that you dont support the Syrian rebels. You feel that America is being defeated and therefore you think that your opinions would be heard which in a majority of the times in the past people's opinions and votes really dont matter.

a reply to: Xcathdra

The majority of people arent buying into your claims that Russia did it, these are the same people that lied about Syria and Libya.

a reply to: Xcathdra

Ah yes setimes not a reliable source. they are almost as BBC as they were on Syria, Libya.

food / humanitarian supplies

Goodbye organic food and hello GMO based food and as for the humanitarian supplies yup nothing says good then canned food and manufactured canned food that taste like Crap.

Gas supplies via reverse supply lines.

The Majority of the Gas Supplies including the via reverse supply lines comes from Russia your reverse supply lines wont last long.

Monetary assistance

So your an IMF supporter to now? the IMF, monetary assistance hasn't helped Italy nor other countries whom are still having mass recessions that arent over nor done with it.

The Monetary assistance is like a temporarily relief. Which only benefits the government and the citizens.

Also - Putins own Presidential council proved the crimea elections were a sham.

Putins own Presidential council proved the crimea elections were a sham? like how your state department failed to prove that Putin was behind the downing of the airliner based no evidence.


From the article.

Yesterday, however, according to a major Ukrainian news site, TSN.ua, the website of the President of Russia’s Council on Civil Society and Human Rights (shortened to President’s Human Rights Council) posted a report that was quickly taken down

A Major Ukrainian news site, TSN.ua, again not reliable source and here's why.

The TSN report does not link to a copy of the cited report. However, there is a report of the Human Rights Council, entitled “Problems of Crimean Residents,” still up on the president-sovet.ru website, which discusses the Council’s estimates of the results of the March 16 referendum. Quoting from that report: “In Crimea, according to various indicators, 50-60% voted for unification with Russia with a voter turnout (yavka) of 30-50%.” This leads to a range of between 15 percent (50% x 30%) and 30 percent (60% x 50%) voting for annexation. The turnout in the Crimean district of Sevastopol, according to the Council, was higher: 50-80%.

These are the same numbers which the Westren MSM claimed that were occurring in Crimea even though they have no proof either.

Already been supplied many times over now. Feel free to read the UN reports on russias invasion of Ukraine and illegal annexation of Crimea.

Care to proof it yourself rather then me searching for it? either way for you to cite the UN and there claims that Russia has invaded Ukraine is rather Laughable.


Then ask Pro Russian rebels why they refused to allow civilians to flee cities. I was not aware the Odessa incident had been completely investigated. Or are you suggesting its ok to assume in that situation and not in the shoot down situation?


Correction dear Xcathdra why dont you ask the Ukrainian military on why the refused to allow civilians to flee cities? as they were surrounding of the cities with artillery shelling.

a reply to: Agent_USA_Supporter

wow...

wrong across the board.

In deference to the op do you have anything on topic?

Im sure you can find something to stir debate on that.

In deference to the op do you have anything on topic?

Funny i had being staying on topic for a while now.

wrong across the board.

Care to explain why you are being so defensive about the Ukrainian government?

Regards Agent..

originally posted by: Agent_USA_Supporter
Funny i had being staying on topic for a while now.

Not according to the op.

originally posted by: Agent_USA_Supporter
Care to explain why you are being so defensive about the Ukrainian government?

Im not.. I just refuse to accept the rantings of people who have nothing to support their claims. Even when Russia produces information that contradict the pro Russians in this thread, they continue down the same propaganda road, arguing the information is valid.

Just like people in this and other threads who make posts using the Huffingtonpost as their source, only to dismiss other posts using the same source.

I just wish pro russians could actually debate / discuss in an intelligent manner instead of the manner in which they do, which is to make claims they cant support and when called out, they attack the poster and discuss anything and everything but the claim they refuse to support.

As has been stated time and again, this is not Russia and we have used on this site who are capable of independent thought. If that is a source of contention with some pro Russians they need to get used to it.

So, once again, anything on topic?

Why do you hate Ukraine so much?
Why do you hate the Ukraine government?
Why do you support Russia / Pro Russian rebels without ever questioning their information?

Why is the Ukraine government resigning news worth to the extent it being a bad thing?
Why do pro russians constantly use terms like Junta or Nazi when its been shown time and again that the government in ukraine prior to the removal of yanukovych was lawful and the government after yanukovych fled was lawful?

a reply to: Xcathdra

Why do you hate Ukraine so much? Why do you hate the Ukraine government? Why do you support Russia / Pro Russian rebels without ever questioning their information?

First rule of debating is, dont ask these questions if you dont know anything about me, as my grandfather was Ukrainian if he was here alive he would be agaisnt this current Ukrainian government as he was a true Cossack.

Why do you support Russia / Pro Russian rebels without ever questioning their information?

I could return you the same favor by asking you the same statement, why do you Russia and Russian people in General? is it because they are making you feel weak as an American? or vise verse?

without ever questioning their information?

Do you ever question your western mainstream information? that comes out with full of Nonsense? unless of course your mind is filled of hatred and russophobia which it would explain a number of things.

a reply to: Xcathdra

Why is the Ukraine government resigning news worth to the extent it being a bad thing?

The majority of Ukrainian articles based on whatever the Ministry of truth tells the news outlets like the current election that happened in Ukraine.

Thus vice verse.

originally posted by: Xcathdra

originally posted by: angelchemuel
a reply to: Xcathdra
But you chose to engage it and your ammount of posts far out number anybody else's.

But, seeing as you have made this point......my comment applies to everybody else who respond to your dragging up Crimea and Russia's involvement (there's a thread for that) in everything Ukranian, from the Malayan plane crash (there's a thread for that), to Putin invading Crimea (there's even a thread for that).

Let's keep it to good old fashioned politics, and the possible outcomes shall we?

Fair enough.. Maybe you should get the pro russians to stop their posts off topic. If they are going to respond to my posts, I want to respond to theirs.

However I take notice that you just stated they went off topic first, and you are not happy with me responding to them. To me its an attempt to let them get the propaganda out while trying to silence those who don't agree.

Where did I say 'they' went first? I will correct myself....you kicked off first.
As to the rest of your post....dummy, toys, pram much?

a reply to: angelchemuel

You should reread the thread then because you are ignoring it.. I stated they kicked off first. I told you, after you only singled me out, that I responded to their off topic posts. You ignored their posts and said I should not have responded. So you are saying it ok for them to post off topic propoganda but I cant refute it.

please read posts more carefully as this gets old. You guys need to stop seeing only what you want.

I respected your request and yet we have USAagent continuing to post off topic.

Yet, once again I see you ignore his posts..

typical yet not surprising.

Do you have anything on your topic or no? Im pretty much done with the double standard.

Here, let me help you out so you dont drag the thread further off topic.

Why is the topic a bad thing for Ukraine? It occurred when Yanukovych was in office. You guys seemed ok with it then. Why does this action catch your attention but not the other?

originally posted by: Rosinitiate
I'm assuming that at this point it is only a matter of time before it comes out that the Ukrainian Army was responsible for the disaster. It would explain a lot of sudden headlines as of late and the only way the US would distance themselves from Ukraine.

If the US leaves and the Ukrainian Nazi Party dissolves that will leave a power vacuum for Russia. More unintended consequences from the morons that brought us 911.

That crap made me laugh...lol

BTW, you should stop wearing tin foil for such long periods, it might give you cancer...