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If they are merely "local self defense forces" and not being armed by the Russians as moscow claims, where did they get the weapons to bring down military aircraft?
ETA: I also like how you completely skipped over my entirely logical question about the double standard of "social media" as evidence when it comes to Russian agendas.
originally posted by: carewemust
Why doesn't Russia simply say that Rebels shot down the aircraft intentionally and that those responsible will be placed before a firing squad.
After all, this is a war situation. Nothing wrong with supplying allies (the Rebels) with whatever firepower they need to combat your mutual enemy. The USA would do the same thing.
Why is Putin over-complicating things by denying what happened? As a former head of the KGB, he should be a Non-BS type of guy.
I think it was the separatists, who were provided with Russian equipment.
originally posted by: DeadSeraph
a reply to: pheonix358
I never said it was Russia. EVER. I think it was the separatists, who were provided with Russian equipment. Whether or not the man who fired the missile was from Russia, or a genuine eastern Ukrainian, I cannot know (and nobody ever will).
You talk about my agenda yet it is clear there is an agenda on this very site. So yes, I have an agenda, and it's to present the other side of the story when it's clear this website has been infiltrated by a large influx of pro-russian trolls. I make no apologies for that when it's obvious that nobody wants to answer any of the questions I keep asking.
Ukraine’s “Democratic Coup d’Etat”: Killing Civilians as a Pretext for Regime Change Global Research, February 26, 2014 With the support of Washington, Ukraine’s opposition “transitional government” headed by the parliament’s speaker Oleksandr Turchinov has issued an arrest warrant directed against the democratically elected President Viktor Yanukovych, accusing him of having ordered the “mass murder” of civilians during the bloody riots and clashes with police forces on Maidan Independence Square. This “mass murder” for which he is accused bears the fingerprints of the Right Sector and Neo-Nazi party Svoboda, which is supported and financed through various channels by the US and the EU. The Maidan riots as well as the riots organized in other parts of the country were carefully staged with a timeline and specific political objectives in mind. Civilian casualties were part of this staged agenda, with a view to accusing president Yanukovych of “mass murder”, thereby providing a justification for regime change on humanitarian grounds.
DONETSK, Ukraine, July 23 (Reuters) - A powerful Ukrainian rebel leader has confirmed that pro-Russian separatists had an anti-aircraft missile of the type Washington says was used to shoot down Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 and it could have originated in Russia.
In an interview with Reuters, Alexander Khodakovsky, commander of the Vostok Battalion, acknowledged for the first time since the airliner was brought down in eastern Ukraine on Thursday that the rebels did possess the BUK missile system and said it could have been sent back subsequently to remove proof of its presence.
Before the Malaysian plane was shot down, rebels had boasted of obtaining the BUK missiles, which can shoot down airliners at cruising height. But since the disaster the separatists' main group, the self-proclaimed People's Republic of Donetsk, has repeatedly denied ever having possessed such weapons.
Khodakovsky is a former head of the "Alpha" anti-terrorism unit of the security service in Donetsk, and one of the few major rebel commanders in Donetsk who actually hails from Ukraine rather than Russia.
There has been friction in the past between him and rebel leaders from outside the region, such as Igor Strelkov, the Muscovite who has declared himself commander of all rebel forces in Donetsk province.
originally posted by: DeadSeraph
Smoking gun evidence that surely won't be good enough for Moscow's apologists.
DONETSK Ukraine (Reuters) - A powerful Ukrainian rebel leader has confirmed that pro-Russian separatists had anti-aircraft missiles of the type Washington says were used to shoot down Malaysia Airlines flight MH17.
In an interview with Reuters, Alexander Khodakovsky, commander of the Vostok Battalion, acknowledged for the first time since the airliner was brought down in eastern Ukraine on Thursday that the rebels did possess the BUK missile system.
He also indicated that the BUK may have originated in Russia and could have been sent back to remove proof of its presence.
Incredible. What will the excuses be now from the internets army of pro-putin shills? Is this man merely a shape shifting lizard person, in league with the illuminati? An alien? A CIA agent? Or is what he says true, and now it's the Ukrainians fault (even though the separatists clearly shot the plane down with a Russian supplied weapons system)?
This link has been posted in other threads, but I feel this deserves it's own thread. It will be comical to read the excuses.
It would seem the Russian spin masters are already at it:
Clearly, this man is a traitor, and nothing more, and he is lying. Of course. Didn't see that coming a mile away.
originally posted by: rickymouse
The guy says that he heard that they had it after the plane was shot down. He did not see it. I am sure the US military satellited would have pictures of it leaving the country if it did leave, it is not something that you cannot see. There are spy satellites stationed over that area. I think that maybe this guy was bought off, if he actually even exists. This sort of tactic is used by lots of governments around the world, it usually flops. Nowadays people can communicate better and someone will be telling the truth shortly, if they aren't too scared to say something.
originally posted by: Zcustosmorum
a reply to: DeadSeraph
Fair words and star for it
I still say Russia had nothing to gain from this, doesn't make sense to me other it being in error without Russian complicity.
Additonally, the U.S. want to put military bases everywhere these days (Ukraine included), I shudder to think about their overall game plan