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originally posted by: Xcalibur254
a reply to: spy66
The R-60 is a heat seeker so it would've targeted the engines. Instead what see is an impact point near the cockpit. It's warhead is also only 3kg. Far too small to produce the damage seen on MH17.
The R-60 uses a small, 3 kg (6.6 lb) tungsten expanding-rod surrounding a high explosive fragmentation warhead. Two different types of proximity fuze can be fitted: the standard Strizh (Swift) optical fuse, which can be replaced with a Kolibri active radar fuse. Missiles equipped with the latter fuse were designated R-60K.[2]
originally posted by: thesaneone
a reply to: spy66
Who else would be blamed?
originally posted by: whitepanther999
originally posted by: thesaneone
a reply to: spy66
Who else would be blamed?
More politically correct from them is to blame the separatists.
originally posted by: Xcalibur254
a reply to: spy66
The proximity fuze only controls how the warhead knows when to detonate. Both variants of the R-60 still use an IR guidance system.
originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: rustyclutch
The maximum ceiling of 23,000 feet is for a clean configuration, meaning nothing hanging on the wings. If you start adding weapons that ceiling goes down.
Maximum altitudes, and speeds are set under very precise conditions. No weapons or fuel tanks, and sometimes not even a full load of fuel. So while it might be able to briefly, it can't with weapons on board.
originally posted by: whitepanther999
They just try to escalate the infowar.
originally posted by: Zaphod58
a reply to: CharlieSpeirs
Not according to its official specifications it can't. The one that can reach that high is the Su-39, which is an upgraded version of the -25, but was never built in any numbers, or at last hasn't been yet.
originally posted by: [post=18182939]rustyclutch
Russian SUPPORT, TRAINING and ARMS sounds like direct Russian involvement. That sounds like as much involvement as you can have without pulling the trigger.
originally posted by: [post=18182939]rustyclutch
I have two opinions on what could have happened and both of them involve the United States. Originally the day it happened my first instinct was the rebels got tricked into shooting it down.
Are these official specs different from the ones I find on the internet everywhere?
Can you show them?
Aircraft performance
Takeoff weight:
- normal (with 2xFAB-500 + 2xR-73E), kg 14,440
- maximum, kg 19,300
Landing weight:
- normal (without external ordnance and stores), kg 11,020
- maximum, kg 13,200
Maximum ordnance load, kg 4,000
Service ceiling (without external ordnance and stores), km 7
Maximum flight speed at sea level (without external ordnance and stores), km/h 950
Max Mach (without external ordnance and stores) 0.82
G-limit (operational) +6.5/-2.0
Practical flight range without external ordnance and stores, km:
- at sea level, km 500
- at height, km 1,000
- with 4 x PTB-800 (to be dropped), km 1,850
A CNN team on the ground in Donetsk was turned away by rebel fighters at the entrance to the town of Snizhne, near Dmytrivka. The militants said they had orders not to allow people to travel farther because of fighting.
MH17: missile launcher was in towns near crash site, videos suggest
Videos and photographs appear to show a mobile anti-aircraft missile launcher in neighbouring towns of Torez and Snizhne
Analysis of videos and photos posted on social media sites on the day the plane was brought down show a mobile Buk anti-aircraft missile launcher in the town of Torez, about six miles south of the farmland where the wreckage is scattered, and then in Snizhne, two miles east of Torez. Washington said that one of its satellites had detected a missile launch from the vicinity of those towns at the time the Boeing 777 was brought down.
And, according to Russia, there was a Ukrainian Air Force aircraft flying — presumably — in the direction of Malaysia Airlines Flight 17.
Although the aircraft’s service ceiling is 22,965 feet — which drops to 16,000 feet with weapons — Russia said the fighter jet can reach 32,000 feet and easily hit a target nearly three miles away. Curiously enough, the Kremlin was caught editing the specifications on the Su-25’s Wikipedia page to increase its ceiling of 23,000 feet. It's also not an interceptor fighter jet — it's more of an attack plane for hitting targets on the ground.
originally posted by: Indigo5
AND THIS CRACKS ME UP...
And, according to Russia, there was a Ukrainian Air Force aircraft flying — presumably — in the direction of Malaysia Airlines Flight 17.
Although the aircraft’s service ceiling is 22,965 feet — which drops to 16,000 feet with weapons — Russia said the fighter jet can reach 32,000 feet and easily hit a target nearly three miles away. Curiously enough, the Kremlin was caught editing the specifications on the Su-25’s Wikipedia page to increase its ceiling of 23,000 feet. It's also not an interceptor fighter jet — it's more of an attack plane for hitting targets on the ground.
mashable.com...