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Research: Possibility that Wind Turbine Farms, Solar Panel farms, and Large Green Projects to Genera

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posted on Jul, 20 2014 @ 03:21 AM
Research: Possibility that Wind Turbine Farms, Solar Panel farms, and Large Green Projects to Generate Power Could be Behind the Deaths and Disappearances of Animals and Bees Which Use Earth's Magnetic Field for Navigation and Orientation.

(I wasn't entirely sure in which forum I should post this information, if this is the wrong forum please move it.)

(This will be an ongoing project and could also be a thread to compile information and data on the subject of this thread. Members who want to be a part of this project could provide on site evidence, such as providing eyewitness testimonies on deaths and disappearances of large groups of animals, and insects like bees. Or by helping in providing additional information related with this thread)

The majority of ATS members by now should know that many species of animals, and insects like bees, have for years now been acting strangely, such as the disappearances of bees, and the strange migratory behavior of many species of birds. But there is also the strange deaths of many of these species of large groups of birds, and other animals including whales and dolphins which have been reported in these forums and the media for years now. But what the majority of the public are probably not aware of is that many so called "green projects" such as wind turbine farms are also directly responsible for the deaths of hundreds of thousands of birds, and bats as they fly into the rotating blades of these massive green projects.

In 2012 alone wind turbine farms in the United States have been responsible for the death of 573,000 birds, including raptors such as eagles, and 888,000 bats in the United States. These figures around the world should be more extensive. For the most part these tragic occurrences are not being reported on any form of public media, and the majority of the perpetrators whose green projects are causing the massive deaths of these animals are not being punished for the most part.

On another thread I made a report of some of these occurrences, but since the topic of that thread doesn't deal directly with this problem it was my decision to make this thread to keep as much information on this topic compiled in just one thread and to bring awareness of all these problems.

I can only speculate as to why there hasn’t been a prosecution. But it’s worth noting that the Pine Tree project is owned by the Los Angeles Department of Water and Power. Prosecuting such a high-profile governmental entity for repeatedly violating some of America’s oldest wildlife-protection laws would be politically embarrassing. On its website, the LADWP claims that the Pine Tree facility is the “largest municipally owned wind farm in the US.” The agency also says the Pine Tree project “displaces at least 200,000 tons of greenhouse gases” per year.xv

In March 2013, a peer-reviewed study published in the Wildlife Society Bulletin, estimated that in 2012 alone, US wind turbines killed 888,000 bats and 573,000 birds. Those bird kills included 83,000 raptors.xvi In September 2013, some of the Fish and Wildlife Service’s top raptor biologists reported that the number of eagles being killed by wind turbines has increased dramatically over the last few years, going from two in 2007 to 24 in 2011. In all, the biologists found that wind turbines have killed some 85 eagles since 1997. And Joel Pagel, the lead author of the report, told me that that the eagle-kill figures they used are “an absolute minimum.” Among the carcasses: six bald eagles.

Pagel’s study was published just five months after the Fish and Wildlife Service issued a report which said flatly “there are no conservation measures that have been scientifically shown to reduce eagle disturbance and blade-strike mortality at wind projects.” xvii

The Pagel study is key because it shows that as more wind projects have been built, more birds have been killed. In 2007, the US had about 17,000 megawatts of installed capacity. By 2011, that figure had nearly tripled to about 47,000 megawatts.xviii Over that time period, the number of documented eagle kills increased by a factor of 12.

The information excerpted above, and more information on this problem can be found on the following website.

(Credit on reporting the deaths of birds, and bats caused by the rotating blades of wind turbine farms is hereby given to the author(s) of the website linked above.)

(to be continued)

posted on Jul, 20 2014 @ 03:28 AM
Moved below the continuation.
edit on 20-7-2014 by Mianeye because: (no reason given)

posted on Jul, 20 2014 @ 04:03 AM

Apart from the direct deaths of all these birds, and bats, there is another side effect caused by these massive projects that could very well be a factor of the strange behavior, and strange pattern of migration experienced for years now of not only birds and bats, but also bees. As well as the inexplicable deaths of whales and dolphins which have beached themselves in large numbers for many years now.

What happens when electricity is being conducted through a medium such as a cable? An electromagnetic field is formed.

In recent years there has been extensive research done on whether the electromagnetic field formed by wind turbines can affect human health. However, as far as I know this research was just based on measuring the electromagnetic field of the wind turbines closer to homes, generally within 500m. However, as far as I know, there hasn't been any extensive research done on the effect of the accumulated electromagnetic fields being formed by the total sum of all wind turbines in a farm; or the effects such electromagnetic fields can have on birds, bees and other animals who have the biological ability of "magnetoreception" in the case of vertebrates and insects, and "electroreception" in the case of invertebrate aquatic or amphibious animals.

Animal Magnetoreception

Magnetic sensing is a type of sensory perception that has long captivated the human imagination, although it seems inaccessible to humans. Over the past 50 years, scientific studies have shown that a wide variety of living organisms have the ability to perceive magnetic fields and can use information from the earth's magnetic field in orientation behavior. Examples abound: salmon (Oncorhynchus nerka), sea turtles (Dermochelys coriacea), spotted newts (Notophthalmus viridescens), lobsters (Panulirus argus), honeybees (Apis mellifera), and fruitflies (Drosophila melongaster) can all perceive and utilize geomagnetic field information. But perhaps the most well-studied example of animal magnetoreception is the case of migratory birds (e.g. European robins (Erithacus rubecula), silvereyes (Zosterops l. lateralis), garden warblers (Sylvia borin)), who use the earth's magnetic field, as well as a variety of other environmental cues, to find their way during migration.

Electroception is the biological ability either to create or to detect electric charges. It is found most frequently in ocean animals because of the superior ability of water to conduct electricity. Examples of animals with electroception include sharks, rays, eels, and weakly-electric fish. Monotremes, including echidnas and platypi, are the only mammals that have the ability.

To give an example on how these large green projects of alternative power sources can have on the biological magnetoreception and electroreception ability of animals and insects imagine this. A bee can detect the presence and the pattern of the static charge on a single flower, as recent research has shown.

Bumblebees sense electric fields in flowers

Electroreception may help pollinators to guess where others have already fed on nectar.
Matt Kaplan

21 February 2013

A flower's electric field (right, with associated electric potential on the left) helps bumblebees predict where to find the most nectar.

As they zero in on their sugary reward, foraging bumblebees follow an invisible clue: electric fields. Although some animals, including sharks, are known to have an electric sense, this is the first time the ability has been documented in insects.

Below is a picture of most wind turbine farms in the United States.

The above picture was provided by the USGS.

To make matters worst we know that the Earth's magnetic field itself has been weakening by about 5% per century since around 1845.

Earth's Magnetic Field Is Fading

John Roach
for National Geographic News

September 9, 2004

Earth's magnetic field is fading. Today it is about 10 percent weaker than it was when German mathematician Carl Friedrich Gauss started keeping tabs on it in 1845, scientists say.

That was in 2004. We know that for the past 6 months the Earth magnetic field is changing and weakening more quickly.

Earth's Magnetic Field Weakening More Quickly

Jul 9, 2014 06:22 PM ET // by Kelly Dickerson, LiveScience

Changes measured by the Swarm satellite over the past 6 months shows that Earth's magnetic field is changing. Shades of red show areas where it is strengthening, and shades of blue show areas that are weakening.

Earth's magnetic field, which protects the planet from huge blasts of deadly solar radiation, has been weakening over the past six months, according to data collected by a European Space Agency (ESA) satellite array called Swarm.

The biggest weak spots in the magnetic field -- which extends 370,000 miles (600,000 kilometers) above the planet's surface -- have sprung up over the Western Hemisphere, while the field has strengthened over areas like the southern Indian Ocean, according to the magnetometers onboard the Swarm satellites -- three separate satellites floating in tandem.

The scientists who conducted the study are still unsure why the magnetic field is weakening, but one likely reason is that Earth's magnetic poles are getting ready to flip, said Rune Floberghagen, the ESA's Swarm mission manager. In fact, the data suggest magnetic north is moving toward Siberia.

Notice how the magnetic field is weaker now in the western hemisphere which includes all of the Americas as well as Canada, about half of Antarctica, most of the Atlantic ocean and half of the Pacific ocean.

The fact that Earth's magnetic field is getting weaker, and weaker, and the fact that throughout countries like the U.S., as well as ocean areas, we have been building large wind turbine and solar panel farms together could be 2 of the major causes why there has been such strange behavior in animals and insects which use the Earth's magnetic field as well as other electromagnetic fields to orient themselves to find food, how to return home, as well as when and how to migrate.

All animals and insects who have these abilities could be reading and mistaking the anthropogenic electromagnetic fields created by all these massive green energy projects as if it was a realigning of Earth's own magnetic field, more so over the area where earth's magnetic field is weaker.


edit on 20-7-2014 by ElectricUniverse because: add comment.

posted on Jul, 20 2014 @ 04:07 AM
a reply to: ElectricUniverse

I think more birds and insects are killed by planes, trains and automobiles and other moving objects than wind turbines and solar panels, doubt it's taking a toll too, but it's not a dominator, i am almost sure cars are the main cause for mass death of animals when it comes to moving objects.

posted on Jul, 20 2014 @ 04:54 AM
As opposed to the toxic pollution from fossil fuels destroying the general environment (together with the cost both financially and naturally, in terms of spills, escapes and pollution) and/or the contamination effects of nuclear gone wrong as per Three Mile Island, Chernobyl and Fukushima?

I think I'd rather take my chances with a wind turbine, or solar panel, than a nuclear reactor, and I'd wager the wildlife might prefer that too.

posted on Jul, 20 2014 @ 05:03 AM

Here is another picture showing the position of some of these large wind turbine farms, including 10 wind farms in the Hawaiian islands (Pacific ocean) and 2 in Costa Rica (Atlantic ocean).

1144 wind project locations are in service with an installed cumulative wind power capacity of 60,688 MW.

13 wind project locations are under construction. These locations will add an additional 738 MW of wind power capacity.

This map contains 1302 total wind farm locations, including: in service, under construction and proposed locations.
All locations have a combined wind power capacity with potential for generating up to 87,624 MW .


(BTW, the map on this site is interactive, you can zoom in and out of the map to see where the wind farms are located.)

Some information on ocean wind farms that have been built since 1991.

Offshore Wind Energy

The first offshore wind project was installed off the coast of Denmark in 1991. Since that time, commercial-scale offshore wind facilities have been operating in shallow waters around the world, mostly in Europe. With the U.S. Department of the Interior’s “Smart from the Start” initiative, wind power projects will soon be built offshore the United States. Newer turbine and foundation technologies are being developed so that wind power projects can be built in deeper waters further offshore.

Since 1991 we have been building more and more wind turbine farms all over the world mostly on land except some that were built offshore by other nations. However now there are plans for introducing floating wind farms in the Pacific ocean.

Floating Wind Farms Venture Farther Out to Sea

By Justin Doom February 27, 2014

There’s roughly enough wind off the West Coast to power all of the U.S. Alla Weinstein is determined to harness as much of it as she can. Weinstein is chief executive officer of Principle Power, a Seattle company that has developed a ballast system that buoys wind turbines so they don’t have to be bolted to the seabed. On Feb. 5, Principle received approval from the U.S. Department of the Interior to build a 30-megawatt floating wind farm off Oregon’s coast, the nation’s first in the Pacific Ocean.

Wind speeds are faster and more consistent at sea than on land. Companies seeking to take advantage of that were limited by the need to attach turbines to the ocean floor. Principle Power’s technology removes that constraint. It’s “what happened in the oil and gas industry back in the ’70s, when it moved from fixed foundations to floating foundations,” Weinstein says.



edit on 20-7-2014 by ElectricUniverse because: add comment.

posted on Jul, 20 2014 @ 07:26 AM
a reply to: ElectricUniverse
The bats are attracted to the insects which are attracted to the white turbines. Why are wind turbines white? Can't a bit of pigment be added to make them a little less stressful on the eyes?

posted on Jul, 20 2014 @ 07:32 AM
BTW, something that I wanted to mention and point at is the fact that the strength of the magnetic field is weakening at an exponential level. While in the past it was calculated that the weakening was occurring at 5% per century, the new data shows us that it is now weakening at a rate of 5% per decade. So the weakening of the Earth magnetic field is now 10 times faster than it used to be. We know this because there has been a measured effect of this weakening since around 1845-1868.

While changes in magnetic field strength are part of this normal flipping cycle, data from Swarm have shown the field is starting to weaken more quickly than in the past. Previously, researchers estimated the field was weakening about 5 percent per century, but the new data revealed the field is actually weakening at 5 percent per decade, or 10 times faster than thought.

WATCH: The U.N.'s Plan to Defend Earth from Asteroids

As such, rather than the full flip occurring in about 2,000 years, as was predicted, the new data suggest it could happen sooner.

Floberghagen hopes that more data from Swarm will shed light on why the field is weakening faster now.

Earth's Magnetic Field Is Weakening 10 Times Faster Now

The most profound change is happening to the speed in which the magnetic north has been moving towards Siberia. In the last years, since mid 1990s, the speed of the movement of magnetic north has increased to 50-60 km, meanwhile it used to be moving for the last 100 years at an average rate of 10-20 km, and now in the past 6 months it has been weakening faster. So something is causing these changes to accelerate.( magnetic south is not moving as fast)

For more information, including a video produced by ESA explaining what has been happening to the Earth's magnetic field go to the link below.

The theory of what is probably causing this is the rapid movement of plumes (large volumes of molten lava) from the core of the Earth to the upper mantle. The specific plume that could be causing this rapid acceleration of magnetic north is the sudden movement of a plume into the Greenland mantle. Meanwhile there should be two plumes moving into the mantles of north America and the other in south America that would explain the weakening effect of the Earth's magnetic field on the western hemisphere.
However we know of no core mechanisms that could be causing this rapid acceleration and weakening of Earth's magnetic field. What we do know is that there are similar geomagnetic jerks that have occurred and have left signs of these events in the geological record of Earth and have been 10,000 times too fast and 100,000 times to large in magnitude to be caused by any core mechanism.

Anyway, I do not want to deviate from the main premise of this thread although I wanted to point this out because this weakening of the Earth's magnetic field on the western hemisphere, together with the increase in alternative energy sources such as wind farms, hydroelectric, solar panel farms etc would create large anthropogenic electromagnetic fields that will disturb not only migratory patterns of many species, but will also continue to be the cause of the massive deaths which we have witnessed of animals, and insects that use the Earth's magnetic field to orient themselves to find food sources, and find their way home.

edit on 20-7-2014 by ElectricUniverse because: correct error in link and add comment.

posted on Jul, 20 2014 @ 08:28 AM
a reply to: ElectricUniverse

My experience of 'renewables' is horrendous. As a result of this I have concluded that the whole fake 'renewable' scam is part of the insane depopulation programme that is underway worldwide. The wholesale disruption of sensitive, natural navigation systems could be deliberate. I applaud you for bringing attention to this subject.

posted on Jul, 20 2014 @ 09:13 AM

As I have mentioned earlier we have done research on the possible effects of anthropogenic electromagnetic fields caused by wind turbine farms, including the possibility of impacts to marine life by offshore wind farms. The impacts caused by offshore wind turbines include but are not limited to acoustic disturbance, and anthropogenic magnetic field disturbance. The possible effects of wind turbines mainly on land to birds and insects includes anthropogenic electromagnetic field disturbance, physical contact with the blades, acoustic disturbance, air pressure disturbance.

However, all of the research have been mostly on the impact of single wind turbines, and not on the accumulative effect of large wind farms. While a single wind turbine will have some effects on marine life and birds and insects, large wind farms will mimic the effects of Earth's magnetic field since they cover large areas of land and oceans and will have a greater impact on marine life as well as birds and insects mainly over land.

Many species of birds, as well as bats seem to be attracted by the wind turbines. There are several hypotheses of what exactly is attracting these animals including acoustic distortion, electromagnetic field disorientation, heat attraction, roost attraction, etc.

9 Hypotheses for Bat Attraction to Wind Turbines

Various scientific hypotheses have been proposed as to why bats are seemingly attracted to and/or fail to detect wind turbines

The more plausible hypotheses include the following:

1. Auditory Attraction

Bats may be attracted to the audible “swishing” sound produced by wind turbines. Museum collectors seeking bat specimens have used long poles that were swung back and forth to attract bats and then knock them to the ground for collection.

It is not known if these bats were attracted to the audible “swishing” sound, the movement of the pole, or both factors.

2. Electromagnetic Field Disorientation

Wind turbines produce complex electromagnetic fields, which may cause bats in the general vicinity to become disoriented and continue flying close to the turbines.

3. Insect Attraction

As flying insects may be attracted to wind turbines, perhaps due to their prominence in the landscape, white color, lighting sources, or heat emitted from the nacelles, bats would be attracted to concentrations of prey.

4. Heat Attraction

Bats may be attracted to the heat produced by the nacelles of wind turbines because they are seeking warm roosting sites.

5. Roost Attraction

Wind turbines may attract bats because they are perceived as potential roosting sites.

6. Lek Mating

Migratory tree bats may be attracted to wind turbines because they are the highest structures in the landscape along migratory routes, possibly thereby serving as ren-dezvous points for mating.

7. Linear Corridor

Wind farms constructed along forested ridge-tops create clearings with linear landscapes that may be attractive to bats.

8. Forest Edge Effect

The clearings around wind turbines and access roads located within forested areas create forest edges. At forest edges, insect activity might well be higher, along with the ability of bats to capture the insects in flight.

Resident bats as well as migrants making stopovers may be similarly attracted to these areas to feed, thus increasing their expo-sure to turbines and thus mortality from collision or barotrauma.

9. Thermal Inversion

Thermal inversions create dense fog in cool valleys, thus concentrating both bats and their insect prey on ridge-tops.

posted on Jul, 20 2014 @ 09:30 AM
a reply to: ElectricUniverse

Very interesting link. When fly-fishing as a child I once accidentally hit a bat with the rod. I always thought that was coincidence but now I wonder if the swish of the rod attracted it.
edit on 20 7 2014 by Kester because: spelling

posted on Jul, 20 2014 @ 10:31 AM
We do know that for example cell phones have an impact on honeybees and induce "honeybee worker piping", which either announce the swarming process of honeybees, or is a signal of a disturbed colony. Such research points out the fact that anthropogenic electromagnetic field disturbances in general, which would include wind turbine farms, would impair magnetic field discrimination of honeybees and they would become disoriented.

Apidologie Original article
* The Author(s) 2011. This article is published with open access at
DOI: 10.1007/s13592-011-0016-x

Mobile phone-induced honeybee worker piping
Daniel FAVRE
1Scientific collaborator in the Laboratory of Cellular Biotechnology (LBTC), Swiss Federal Institute of Technology
(EPFL), Lausanne, Switzerland
2Apiary School of the City of Lausanne, Chemin du Bornalet 2, CH-1066, Épalinges, Switzerland
Received 24 June 2009 – Revised 29 March 2010 – Accepted 8 April 2010
4.2. Mobile phone handsets and induced honeybee worker piping.
It is known that honeybees possess magnetite crystals in their fat body cells and that they present magnetic remanence (Gould et al. 1978; Keim et al. 2002). These magnetite structures are active parts of the magnetoreception system in honeybees (Hsu and Li 1994; Hsu et al. 2007).
Importantly, it has been shown that honeybees can be trained to respond to very small changes in the constant local geomagnetic field intensity (Walker and Bitterman 1989a). In that study, magnetic anomalies as low as 26 nT (nanoTesla)
were responsible for changes in the foraging behavior. Moreover, attached magnets impair magnetic field discrimination by honeybees (Walker and Bitterman 1989b).


More recent research points to the fact that anthropogenic electromagnetic interference disrupts bird navigation.

Anthropogenic electromagnetic noise disrupts magnetic compass orientation in a migratory bird
Svenja Engels, Nils-Lasse Schneider, Nele Lefeldt, Christine Maira Hein, Manuela Zapka, Andreas Michalik, Dana Elbers, Achim Kittel, P. J. Hore & Henrik Mouritsen
Corresponding author

Nature 509, 353–356 (15 May 2014) doi:10.1038/nature13290 Received 28 January 2014 Accepted 28 March 2014 Published online 07 May 2014

Electromagnetic noise is emitted everywhere humans use electronic devices. For decades, it has been hotly debated whether man-made electric and magnetic fields affect biological processes, including human health1, 2, 3, 4, 5. So far, no putative effect of anthropogenic electromagnetic noise at intensities below the guidelines adopted by the World Health Organization1, 2 has withstood the test of independent replication under truly blinded experimental conditions. No effect has therefore been widely accepted as scientifically proven1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6. Here we show that migratory birds are unable to use their magnetic compass in the presence of urban electromagnetic noise.

It is not possible that wind turbine farms do not have a negative effect on migratory birds, insects, and other animals that use magnetoreception/electroreception and the rapid weakening of the Earth's magnetic field should be making it worse for all these animals.

posted on Jul, 20 2014 @ 11:27 AM
all of these 'connections' can be attributed to cell-towers imo.

rf emissions

posted on Jul, 20 2014 @ 11:30 AM
a reply to: Mianeye

So, are you saying that as long as they die for green projects it is ok?

Remember that more and more green projects such as wind farms are being built each year. This means that the deaths and disturbance of species that use Earth's magnetic field, as well as those that use the electric field in flowers and other animals to gather food will continue to increase, since it is okay for these species to die for "green causes".

I am asking because that seems to be the implication you are making.

posted on Jul, 20 2014 @ 12:02 PM
a reply to: ElectricUniverse

No not at all, every useless animal killing causes by human activity is wrong and should be avoided as much as possible, but the world we live in is pretty much a mass killer to animals when it comes to human activity, so my point was that green energy does kill a lot but vehicles kill ten times more, but we don't discuss that as being a problem.

So in all, why all the focus on what green energy kills when it's been going on since the invention of various vehicles on much larger scale and it's being completely ignored.

Btw: I like your thread, very interesting, and my first comment is a little oftopic cause of the updates

posted on Jul, 20 2014 @ 12:30 PM
a reply to: neformore

First of all, where did I state that it is okay to pollute with toxic chemicals the environment? Although first we would have to find out exactly what you are referring to as "pollution". Because there are gases that have been labeled as "pollutants" even thou they are not really pollutants. I am talking about CO2, but I differ as this would derail the thread.

Anyway, tell me, since when is it ok for animals and birds to "die for the green cause"? Why are you making this decision that it is better this way? BTW, I doubt that animals would choose either way to die. Not to mention that the more wind turbine farms and other similar green projects are built, the more disturbances and deaths of these animals that will occur.

Also, do notice that these death's and disturbances of such animals and insects would exacerbate and become worse during times when the Earth's magnetic field over those areas is weaker.

I would also differ with your conclusion of what is a better alternative because combined these electromagnetic disturbances alongside the faster rate that Earth's magnetic field is weakening they have a more disastrous outcome if this continues the way it is going.

I am not saying that oil spills, and the release of real toxic substances is okay, or that they don't negatively affect the environment, because they do have large negative effects on "local" environments. But these electromagnetic disturbances from anthropogenic sources have a larger and more disastrous impact. More so since these anthropogenic green projects are on the rise throughout the world.

posted on Jul, 20 2014 @ 12:41 PM
Found many links which say windturbines in fact save birds when it would replace fossil fuel and are no way a big bird killer..

Want to save 70 million birds a year? Build more wind farms

Forbid house cats outside, now that would save many more birds I'm sure.

edit on 20-7-2014 by Plugin because: (no reason given)

posted on Jul, 20 2014 @ 12:42 PM
I'm not going to say that this thread is 100% legit, but this ties into my overall thought that no matter what kind of energy alternative we seek, we continue to make a footprint that is too large for the earth we depend on to provide a hospital terrain.

I mean, what is the clean alternative to fossil fuels? Where is it? We are employing a variety of methods to capture and utilize energy worldwide, and yet our impact on the environment continues to grow as time passes. I'm all for increased efficiency, tech breakthroughs, and whatever else we can throw at our problem of desiring to ever consume, expand, and conquer territories without destabilizing the ecosystem in the long term. So what do we have?

posted on Jul, 20 2014 @ 12:51 PM
a reply to: Mianeye

So you think that overall the anthropogenic forcing of such projects don't exacerbate the migratory problems that we have been observing on birds, fish, and mammals like dolphins and whales? Plus the negative effects that anthropogenic electromagnetic disturbances have on the eating, and mating habits that all those animals and insects do with the help of their magnetoreception/electroreception abilities?

While I do know that the fact that we exist and are using technology will affect in some ways, and no matter what we do, many animals and insects. These anthropogenic electromagnetic disturbances which will continue to increase can have a much larger impact than all the anthropogenic disasters we have seen so far, such as oil spills.

posted on Jul, 20 2014 @ 01:00 PM

originally posted by: pl3bscheese

I mean, what is the clean alternative to fossil fuels? Where is it?

If it's funded by the private financiers fiat currency/fractional reserve banking system it isn't going to be good.

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