It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Why Kiev Brought Down Flight MH-17…

page: 3
28
<< 1  2    4  5  6 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Jul, 19 2014 @ 06:05 PM
link   
a reply to: stumason

And conveniently the party that was the minority somehow assumed power over Ukraine. When you overthrow a government by force that constitutes a civil war. You don't then get to decide the civil war is over just because you captured the capital. The civil war continues until people get tired of fighting. Just because they called a vote means nothing to the people who voted for the guy they ousted. If he was the guy who won the original election....how is the old super minority party in charge? Furthermore....had the old president used the military on the people who took over, they never would have assumed power. Ironically as soon as the Poroshenko clown got sworn into office he was dropping bombs and mortars the very next day. The bias of some people about this whole situation is pretty amazing. Say what you want about the Ukrainians old President.....he wasn't using the airforce to drop bombs on people.
edit on 19-7-2014 by rustyclutch because: (no reason given)




posted on Jul, 19 2014 @ 06:09 PM
link   


How can you claim the Government is not elected?
a reply to: stumason

Thugs do not walk into an office and throw out a sitting democratically elected President. That part of the government sure is illegal and fraudulent.

Screw the logic about governments and their elections. What I am really worried about is that this Ukraine crisis can very well lead upto WW3 with really ugly and long lasting consequences for the rest of the human race.

Europeans like yourself hold the main key here. Moscow is peeved about NATO expansion to its former USSR republics. Europeans need to understand this and that there is no need for expansion any further.



posted on Jul, 19 2014 @ 06:09 PM
link   

originally posted by: rustyclutch
a reply to: tsurfer2000h

They voted in Donetsk to leave Ukraine too.


That vote was a total farce - threats of violence against Electoral Commissioners, widespread fraud, organised far too quickly, no independent verification or monitoring....



posted on Jul, 19 2014 @ 06:12 PM
link   

originally posted by: victor7
Thugs do not walk into an office and throw out a sitting democratically elected President. That part of the government sure is illegal and fraudulent.


Who threw who out? Yukanovich fled after the Parliament began not one but two impeachment proceedings against him - after that, a working Government had to be formed.


originally posted by: victor7
Screw the logic about governments and their elections. What I am really worried about is that this Ukraine crisis can very well lead upto WW3 with really ugly and long lasting consequences for the rest of the human race.


I am sure cooler heads will prevail. As it is, it isn't worth either side beating the War drums.


originally posted by: victor7
Europeans like yourself hold the main key here. Moscow is peeved about NATO expansion to its former USSR republics. Europeans need to understand this and that there is no need for expansion any further.


And Russia needs to realise it isn't the USSR anymore and has no right to dictate to, or in any way "intervene" in these countries own affairs.

Maybe Russia should ask itself why it cannot keep these former Republics on side.....



posted on Jul, 19 2014 @ 06:13 PM
link   

originally posted by: stumason

originally posted by: rustyclutch
a reply to: tsurfer2000h

They voted in Donetsk to leave Ukraine too.


That vote was a total farce - threats of violence against Electoral Commissioners, widespread fraud, organised far too quickly, no independent verification or monitoring....


Ahhhh...so its a farce when the people of a certain region vote to leave amidst a civil war, but overthrowing the elected government at gunpoint and then holding a vote that you conveniently win isn't. Even though they only ever had about 15% of the parliament at any given time ever before. They obviously weren't that popular. Also.....the previous president associated with their party was in jail was she not? And as soon as they assumed power she was freed. They don't respect the rule of law in Kiev, so the rules of the jungle apply throughout Ukraine.
edit on 19-7-2014 by rustyclutch because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 19 2014 @ 06:16 PM
link   
a reply to: rustyclutch

What are you babbling about? I assume you're trying to paint the picture the far-right group had control of the Government. I have disproved this before - only 4 Cabinet members out of 20 or so were of these right-wing types, the rest were from the other parties in Parliament, including the PM and interim President.

And no, the former President wasn't ousted at gun point - you really are full of it. He was being impeached for using violence and violating the constitution - don't forget, he tried to have all forms of protest banned to silence the protesters.

You peddling so much BS I am surprised you can breath with the stench.



posted on Jul, 19 2014 @ 06:17 PM
link   
a reply to: rustyclutch

And the previous Prime Minister (get it right, if you're going to argue the toss) was in jail on trumped up charges which were politically motivated as she had tried to dismantle the cabal that Yukanovich allowed to flourish, not limited to giving his family members plush jobs and selling state assets at rock bottom prices to his mates.



posted on Jul, 19 2014 @ 06:18 PM
link   

originally posted by: stumason
a reply to: rustyclutch

What are you babbling about? I assume you're trying to paint the picture the far-right group had control of the Government. I have disproved this before - only 4 Cabinet members out of 20 or so were of these right-wing types, the rest were from the other parties in Parliament, including the PM and interim President.

And no, the former President wasn't ousted at gun point - you really are full of it. He was being impeached for using violence and violating the constitution - don't forget, he tried to have all forms of protest banned to silence the protesters.

You peddling so much BS I am surprised you can breath with the stench.


4 out of 20 something is what? about 15-20% right? The party isn't that popular. They came to power through force. They kill civilians. They are criminals. Period. And the U.S. government is complicit.



posted on Jul, 19 2014 @ 06:22 PM
link   

originally posted by: stumason
a reply to: rustyclutch

And the previous Prime Minister (get it right, if you're going to argue the toss) was in jail on trumped up charges which were politically motivated as she had tried to dismantle the cabal that Yukanovich allowed to flourish, not limited to giving his family members plush jobs and selling state assets at rock bottom prices to his mates.


Ahh so you are a judge and reviewed the evidence huh? I would rather have a leader who stole money than a leader who bombed me any day. Just saying. The government in Kiev is no improvement over the government they had. They are well within their rights to continue to fight to overthrow it. The people proclaiming to be the government in Kiev started this civil war. It doesn't end when they say it does. They don't become legitimate by a vote in the middle of a civil war. That's silly. They start a war then hold a vote. No. The war is still ongoing. They need to secure victory before they go claiming to be the victors. By all accounts they have been getting their asses handed to them in recent weeks. They totally needed this false flag. They will hit a brick wall when they set foot in Crimea.



posted on Jul, 19 2014 @ 06:25 PM
link   

originally posted by: gortex
a reply to: jaws1975




The rebels apparently did allow a partial inspection,

Define partial and why wouldn't they let the inspectors inspect what they want ?
From what I've seen and read it looks almost certain that the rebels committed this act of mass murder , probably by mistake that that will be no comport to the grieving families of the lost.



USA Today used the term partial, so I guess they should define what it means. Under the circumstances I don't blame the Russians for being defensive, Keiv has been blaming the Russians from the get, and now we have this supposed impartial group of eurozone inspectors(gee, I wonder what side they are on) wanting to commandeer the crash site.



posted on Jul, 19 2014 @ 06:27 PM
link   


And Russia needs to realise it isn't the USSR anymore and has no right to dictate to, or in any way "intervene" in these countries own affairs.
a reply to: stumason

Russia needs to guard its military and strategic interests against a very powerful alliance with hostile intents proven repeatedly over last 25 years.

Russia is NOT asking to meddle in into the daily affairs of these nations. Only thing it asks is they do not become a member of NATO alliance. Do not think that is too much to ask...............for the sake of the peace on earth.

Btw, London area is roughly 1500 km sq. This means it will take only 3 Topol-M ICBMs each armed with 5 mega ton warhead to destroy major chunk of infrastructure with immense loss of human lives in the following two weeks.

Paris will go quiet with 1 and Berlin without sense with 2 Topol-M hits.

In half an hour, human race will be pushed back by 500 years.

All for the EGO and HATRED of your masters in DC.



posted on Jul, 19 2014 @ 06:38 PM
link   
a reply to: victor7
Any student of recent history can tell you that US/NATO and Russia/Warsaw Pact have meddled in each others and others countries affairs since they were first formed.

And even though this is a tragedy, both ideological sides will milk it for what they can to gain advantage over the other through any means. Yes, the Warsaw Pact is defunct, but it still exists in some peoples mindset over there.

And they are irritated over the fact that not only have they lost cushion territory. But some of that cushion is now a member of NATO, which turns that cushion into a rock.

That alone would make them desperate to turn the tide of public opinion, not to mention other governments, who they are really scared of.



posted on Jul, 19 2014 @ 07:11 PM
link   


And the U.S. government is complicit.
a reply to: rustyclutch

I would strongly disagree !!

US government is not complicit...........IT IS THE MAIN CRIMINAL BEHIND ALL THE LOSS OF LIVES IN UKRAINE !!!



posted on Jul, 19 2014 @ 07:30 PM
link   

originally posted by: victor7



And the U.S. government is complicit.
a reply to: rustyclutch

I would strongly disagree !!

US government is not complicit...........IT IS THE MAIN CRIMINAL BEHIND ALL THE LOSS OF LIVES IN UKRAINE !!!


They aren't acting alone. Those are Ukrainians killing Ukrainians over there. That makes them complicit.



posted on Jul, 19 2014 @ 11:19 PM
link   
OP is mad at speculation .. and then speculates further than Ukraine did. Kind of funny.



posted on Jul, 20 2014 @ 05:28 AM
link   
Why do Russians have this bizarre fear of NATO?

You do know NATO isn't a secret organisation planning to invade Russia and take over the world right?

NATO is a joke in the West, nobody takes NATO seriously. US Generals who get assigned to NATO jobs sigh because it's seen as a backwater?

European Nations grudgingly meet the barest minimum of their NATO membership requirements, and even then they duck out of most of them.

Yet Russian and pro-Russian supporters seem to think it's some vast military conspiracy because AMERICA EVIL!



posted on Jul, 20 2014 @ 05:44 AM
link   
Here is why, link

its convenient is it? But I wonder, since Serbia and many countries they voted today for NATO, dont want it anymore... they force it? Get ready for many events to come....

Add the link into a translator (bing or google). USA voted a new bill today, many countries to enter NATO... read which countries are these. Its not a coincidence.

edit on 20-7-2014 by Ploutonas because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 20 2014 @ 06:00 AM
link   
a reply to: victor7




Thugs do not walk into an office and throw out a sitting democratically elected President. That part of the government sure is illegal and fraudulent.


They do when that elected official steals money from the hard working citizens of the country.

And that part of the government you talk about is valid and respected by all countries including Russia.



Europeans like yourself hold the main key here. Moscow is peeved about NATO expansion to its former USSR republics. Europeans need to understand this and that there is no need for expansion any further.


In case you forgot but Russia has no say as to what their former republics do, as they are no longer under their control and are allowed to deal with anyone they want.



posted on Jul, 20 2014 @ 06:04 AM
link   
a reply to: Ploutonas




Here is why, link


Can you provide a link that isn't towing the Russian lines?

You have been using the same biased source that is no better than Russian media when it comes to Ukraine.



posted on Jul, 20 2014 @ 06:06 AM
link   
a reply to: Ploutonas




Add the link into a translator (bing or google). USA voted a new bill today, many countries to enter NATO... read which countries are these. Its not a coincidence.


That is because they don't want the same thing that happened in Ukraine to happen to them, can you blame them?



new topics

top topics



 
28
<< 1  2    4  5  6 >>

log in

join