It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.


Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.


Why do peole think that Jesus was god?

page: 18
<< 15  16  17    19  20  21 >>

log in


posted on Jul, 18 2014 @ 04:57 PM

originally posted by: Akragon
a reply to: Rex282

That's all well and good, but im no Christian either...

What im referring to is the basis of every religion through out history... the existence of "life" after the death of the body...

Being a Christain doesn't have anything to do with what I said. Many people believe "Christian doctrines"(like...a place called heaven..where you go to after you die) and are just as wrong.

originally posted by: Akragon

Regardless of whether or not you want to call it Heaven or the afterlife... That is what religion is all about...

exactly that is what "religion" is all about.. beliefs in a Belief System religion that isn't true.Some are half truths however a little leaven corrupts the whole loaf of bread.Its impossible for truth to be a little wrong.

originally posted by: Akragon
you talk about the things Jesus said all the time... well that was the main idea behind everything he taught...

the FACT that life continues after the death of the body

That's incorrect I don't talk about "Jesus" at all I write of Yahoshua.Christians and those that believe some Christian doctrines talk about "Jesus" ALL the time.The man Yahoshua of Nazareth is "gone". They don't exist in the physical realm anymore.What they did is "accomplished...finished ..fine...the results of the fruition (the resurrection to LIFE) are yet to be "experienced".It only takes reason to know it hasn't happened because every person that has ever lived has died and IS dead.

Yahoshua "proclaimed only ONE thing..the "coming of the Kingdom of God realm for ALL of mankind.Being "freed from the bonadge of hades ...the realm of death and imperception.The Kingdom of God has NOT come(because people still die by the droves daily and billions still "believe" in their Belief System religion(their imperception) which is false.This ain't rocket surgery it is common reason.There are no "mulligan" life" do overs till you get it right because the ultimate "failure" of life is ...DEATH!!Doing the same thing (living then dieing ) over and over and expecting different results is a good definition of insanity.

Yahoshua proclaimed something very basic to Nicodemus that had ZERO to do with religion or mysticism of ANY kind.You must be "born anew".... to LIFE...Nicodemus could only perceiving being born "again" through a flesh mother.Yahoshua said born anew is LIFE not "death" again.The Kingdom of the creator God IS coming....not to a theater near you nor to the physical realm at all because it is the Kingdom of the creator God where everything will LIVE.....not die.It could not be more obvious the physical realm in any form is NOT the Kingdom of the creator God.Yahoshua clearly stated this was Not his Kingdom.

ALL of mankind WILL enter into the Kingdom of God realm AFTER they have been resurrected from the realm of death.The only prerequisite is...NOTHING!Everyone will enter in(be delivered ..born) through their experiences and the main "complication" will be their "religion" their false Belief System that they have "lived" their whole life in the shadow of the valley of death.They will grasp onto it like a useless umbilical cord but eventually it will be cut and discarded.( that was a metaphor).

Yahoshua only spoke with" reason" he never"taught" religion or even morality and ethics or philosophy or psychology etc etc....Yahoshua accomplished his purpose was part (the catalyst) of the process that brings LIFE(spirit) to creation...the Kingdom of the creator God.THAT is the God News ...and the GOOD news is the essence of everything Yahoshua said and did.
edit on 18-7-2014 by Rex282 because: (no reason given)

posted on Jul, 18 2014 @ 07:15 PM
a reply to: Akragon

Text You got the passage... Why do you believe the gospel of John is a time line of events that took place in order? Johns gospel was pieced together from many different texts... it wasn't meant to be a time line written in chronological order... and besides that... do you actually believe no one ever made it to heaven before he arrived? Let me guess... you're also of the belief that only 144k people ever make it there... Amirite?

I have not considered time line of events in my post but I believe there is a bible that claims time line events. The red letter edition of most bibles claim that Jesus is recorded as having said the writings which are red lettered. I suppose that could be argued till hell froze over also.

When I read John 3:13 which is red lettered in my bible I automatically assumed that Jesus was alive when He said the words which are red lettered and that up to His saying John 3:13 no human had entered the celestial realm. But at what point in His life he actually said John 3:13 I have no idea. Now I do understand that Jesus is said to be talking to Nicodemus and that His statement to Nicodemus was a recorded conversation by John or through John. Does that really matter as to the authenticity of the statement? I understand that Jesus has been red lettered as saying that no man (person) has ever entered the heavenly realm except Himself up to this time that He made that statement to Nicodemus.

As far as 144,000 Jews of the 12 tribes of Jacob are concerned I only know what the bible tells me. I really don't know whether the 144,000 are already there or will be there. All I understand is that if they are not there then they will be there. I guess that would be time line also but never really thought about time line events especially in Revelation because it can distract from the entire intended message. I guess we have enough to argue about without time line. The book of Revelation does say that there are an awful lot of people under the alter of God so I guess there are a lot more than 144,000 up there or will be up there.

Sometimes I am an Amirite and other times I am just as dumb as you or anyone else for that matter. I try to read English as the author intends but some times I do get snookered by pretenders that really are not what they seem. You have yourself a good day and was nice to read your nonsense.

posted on Jul, 18 2014 @ 07:19 PM
a reply to: Rex282

Yahoshua clearly stated this was Not his Kingdom.
This person you are talking about sounds an awful lot like the Jesus in the New Testament.
I suppose there is not a Book of Yahoshua that records all his sayings, that we can read.
We do have what we call the gospels that record what Jesus said, that is readily available for viewing.
In those books, it records Jesus saying, "My kingdom is not of this world."
I think that he meant that the rule that he was inheriting was of God, and not dependent on political and military support.
I don't think that he meant that he was making a kingdom somewhere else.
He was speaking specifically of the source for his being King of the Jews.

....Yahoshua accomplished his purpose ...
Which was what, being a reasonable person?

edit on 18-7-2014 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)

posted on Jul, 18 2014 @ 07:41 PM
a reply to: [post=18164631]Rex282[/post

Text Being a Christain doesn't have anything to do with what I said. Many people believe "Christian doctrines"(like...a place called heaven..where you go to after you die) and are just as wrong.

After you wake up from whatever you were in then what? Do you have memory of this life? Are you judged? If you are judged then what? Tell us the rest of the story. You always leave us hanging about for the good part. We all know the bad part and now tell us the good part. By the way where is Adolph in all of this?

posted on Jul, 18 2014 @ 08:07 PM

originally posted by: Rex282

ALL of mankind WILL enter into the Kingdom of God realm AFTER they have been resurrected from the realm of death.The only prerequisite is...NOTHING!

Can I opt out of that?

You see, there are just people in this world that, should I meet them in eternity, I will be forced to beat hell out of on a daily basis (since I would no longer be able to outright kill them if they can't die any more), and that's just no way to spend the rest of forever.

The likes of Hitler and Stalin come to mind - not that they'd be the only ones - but can you imagine the rest of forever getting hell beat out of you by everyone you meet, daily?

Sucks to be them...

posted on Jul, 18 2014 @ 08:09 PM
a reply to: nenothtu
Dead hitler and stalin would crush you bro, remember, they have a lot of their dead armies killed in the wars too

posted on Jul, 18 2014 @ 08:15 PM

originally posted by: TKDRL
a reply to: nenothtu
Dead hitler and stalin would crush you bro, remember, they have a lot of their dead armies killed in the wars too

Well, they couldn't kill me either, right? I mean, it ought to work both ways, an' if no one can die, well, why not just beat those two (and whoever else desperately needs it), and take their lunch money, trading punches for the rest of forever. What are they gonna do? Take away my birthday? I got dead buddies that would prolly have my back, too...

Sounds more like Valhalla than Heaven to me, and nothing to prevent it.

Besides, Hitler and Stalin had that whole "enemies across the Russian Front" thing going on, so their armies might be just a wee bit tied up...

Kinda reminds me of that "Heroes in Hell" series (like "Gilgamesh in the Outback") written by Robert Silverberg, among others.

edit on 2014/7/18 by nenothtu because: (no reason given)

posted on Jul, 18 2014 @ 09:00 PM
a reply to: carewemust

Most people who are even remotely familiar with Biblical stories do not believe that Jesus is God. When Jesus asked his Father to not let him be crucified unless it was absolutely necessary, Jesus was NOT talking to himself!
That is an argument if you are dealing with people who think that "God" is only this single entity, where any god-like being has to, for some reason, just be a different manifestation of the same entity.

Trinitarianism seeks to solve that by saying there is this single "thing" that is God, where there can be multiple person within that "thing".

My view is that there is a single entity, God, who is a person, and no one else is that person.
My solution to the problem that arises from introducing different persons is that there is also a trinitarian style "thing" but is not like some sort of conglomerate entity type thing, but is only a "god" quality.
This "quality" can be assumed of any number of different persons, without intruding on the personal God-ness of the individual we know of as "God".
These persons can be angels or other heavenly denizens.
It could also include various earthly persons of special authority, such as you see in the Old Testament with Moses being given an "Elohim" quality (as it seems to imply by the Greek of the Septuagint), and what Jesus says to the Jews about people called Elohim that he quotes from the OT.
edit on 18-7-2014 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)

posted on Jul, 18 2014 @ 09:10 PM
a reply to: occuluinunc

Read 'The Case For Christ' by Lee Strobel. He was a 'spiritual skeptic' until he started investigating and writing this book which presents evidence of why Jesus was/is God.

I think this book is good as an introduction for people just entering into this discussion, of Jesus being a real person, but might not hold up too well to arguments from hard core skeptics.

posted on Jul, 18 2014 @ 09:22 PM
a reply to: 5StarOracle

before the beginning there was God and the Word was with God and the Word was God... The Word of God Is none other than Jesus...
I mentioned this on another thread, that the Greek is ambiguous here and could be interpreted as "he" or "it".
There is part of 1 John 5:7 that is generally left out of newer Bibles that says, "... in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost: and these three are one."
The substitution of the expected "Jesus" with "the word", I think is what leads to the intro to the Gospel of John being translated where the Logos is described as a person, with "he" being used where otherwise "it" could just as justifiably be used, if you hadn't already assumed it was about a person.

I personally think that the Logos is brought in as a well known philosophical term of that time, to try to get people reading it an idea that there is a connection between prophecy as an enlightenment, and also a power to make things happen, and those two aspects coming together at that moment for our salvation.

edit on 18-7-2014 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)

posted on Jul, 18 2014 @ 09:43 PM
a reply to: 3NL1GHT3N3D1

Because parts of the bible outside of Jesus and his words say so I guess.

Philippians 2
6 Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God

It's very explicit in Paul's epistles that Jesus is God/Yahweh, yet Jesus never calls himself God.. Paul authored over half of the NT with 13 epistles, he is the one who twisted Jesus' words IMO.
It is generally thought that Paul here was quoting a song that was used in the church that was about Jesus, in order to make an illustration to emphasize his point about how to be humble.
To fit the context of that purpose, you have to consider the meaning of that word translated in your quote as "robbery".
It means something not to be cherished as something too precious, like Gollum and the ring in TLOTR books.
Whatever that quality was that made him of a "god" status, he gave up, upon becoming human.

posted on Jul, 18 2014 @ 09:54 PM
a reply to: BELIEVERpriest

In Mat 24, Jesus connected the return of the Son of Man to the Day of the Lord. Jesus is the Son of Man and therefore the Lord by context.

Matt 24: 29 “But immediately after the tribulation of those days THE SUN WILL
BE DARKENED, AND THE MOON WILL NOT GIVE ITS LIGHT, AND THE STARS WILL FALL from the sky, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken. 30 “And then the sign of the Son of Man will appear in the sky, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the SON OF MAN COMING ON THE CLOUDS OF THE SKY with power and great glory.
See my post above on Jesus' saying to Nicodemus.
I think Jesus is referring to someone who is like his altar ego, where Jesus himself serves the purpose on the literal ground level that the Son of Man person serves, in heaven, or "the heavens".
When it says "see", it means to see in your mind, so it is a way of saying that it dawns on people that what was prophesied by Jesus just came true.
The actual physical event being described in prophetic terms is the end of the age when all that the people he was talking to represented, this system they were operating under, was coming to an end, with the destruction of Jerusalem, along with its temple.
edit on 18-7-2014 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)

posted on Jul, 18 2014 @ 10:02 PM
a reply to: Xcouncil=wisdom

This doctrine entered Christianity early on with the creation of the Roman Church
By taking bits from older religions and adding a triune god, they placated those that believed in the other pagan gods, that often included a father mother and son
Trinitarianism was around for a long time before then.

Also, by giving the people doctrines that only a priest can explain (well its just a mystery my darling)
They keep the power
Why do you think the church fought to no allow the bible to be translated into common languages for so long
Their lies would eventually be laid bare
That would be the case with what was to become the so-called orthodox view made official in the councils of the church (the corporate entity calling itself the church).

posted on Jul, 18 2014 @ 10:05 PM
a reply to: cavtrooper7

He was an AVATAR of God
The person, Jesus, is the "Name of God".

edit on 18-7-2014 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)

posted on Jul, 18 2014 @ 10:20 PM
a reply to: LightningStrikesHere

Here is my rebuttle ...
Throughout history god has always appointed prophets to relay messages to people . We only see that change at Christianity. . to me it makes more sense that Jesus was a great prophet because if you think about it, why would "god" create a part of him self to be killed to forgive mankind for sin? When as great as he is , he can just will something and it is ?

Also we are given the grace of repentance for sin.

Besides I don't think people were more wicked in those days then they are now.
Jesus was a prophet but at the same time the fulfillment of prophecy.
He was placing himself at the levels of Abraham and Moses.
I think Jesus being killed was for sins, and it says so in the New Testament, especially in the Letter to the Hebrews.
How it works though is that it draws people to God in that a person much like ourselves was ultimately vindicated by God and honored in Heaven, despite literally being a human being with all the inherent weaknesses that comes with that.
People need help along those lines, knowing that they can't ever be completely free of sin as long as we live in these corruptible physical bodies, even with a spirit of God that comes with faith.

If people were no better than before Christ, then it would make Christianity a failure in at least one aspect.
I think everyone in the world benefits from the existence in the world of those who believe in Jesus.

posted on Jul, 18 2014 @ 10:35 PM
a reply to: MeanGuitar

Jesus was always from the beginning with God .
That is talking about the Logos, what Jesus, the disciples, John the Baptist, and the writer of the Gospel of John had dwelling in them.

He is God and made all things and is holding every atom and molecule together with his "Dunamis" It is the Greek word for "Power" .
Maybe you are thinking of Colossians 1:17
He is before all things, and in him all things hold together.
(2011 NIV)
"Before" could be a figure of speech to represent his preeminence in this new age of Christ, since after all, he is the Christ.
Jesus is the glue of the so-called New Covenant age that we now live in.

posted on Jul, 18 2014 @ 10:36 PM
a reply to: nenothtu
Imagine lol. There would be bajillions of people fighting forever and ever. Sounds like hell. Sounds like earth as well lol.

posted on Jul, 18 2014 @ 10:48 PM
a reply to: TinfoilTP

Colossians 1:15 says about Jesus
He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation

That is as clear as can be.
Jesus is the first of God's creation, all else was created after Jesus.
Brings meaning to Genesis, "Let us create Man in our image". Jesus was created in the image of God, Mankind was made in the image of Them, by Them together.

Colossians 1:16 - For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether [they be] thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:

Jesus clearly has the power of creation. All else seems to be created solely by Jesus for Jesus, except Mankind from Genesis which says they created Mankind together.
The creation it is talking about is of the church, and he is the head of it.
"thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers" is dealing with sovereignty, which is what he owns in the church as its founder.

posted on Jul, 18 2014 @ 10:57 PM
a reply to: Murgatroid

In Revelation 19, there are references that read, “His name is called The Word of God.”
There are people who think that the visionary rider on the white horse is Jesus, but I see it as representing the literal Word of God.
It is called "faithful and true", which fits as an apt description for that thing, that "cuts like a two edged sword".
Hebrews 4:12
For the word of God is alive and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart.
(2011 NIV)

"The most important thing to know about this Word is found in verse 14: “And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us, and we have seen his glory, glory as of the only Son from the Father, full of grace and truth.” The Word refers to Jesus Christ.
That is one interpretation, it doesn't say that.
This translation is custom made to fit around the predetermined idea that it is about Jesus being the Logos.
Otherwise it is saying that the prophetic spirit of God had come to man and had entered these people in the story being called "us", starting with John the Baptist, then Jesus, and then the writer of the Gospel of John and then the disciples.

Your father Abraham rejoiced at the thought of seeing my day; he saw it and was glad.
Which could just mean to understand it, and not necessarily literally see it. The idea is that Jesus is saying that he is of a higher importance in the big scheme of things, than Abraham, who just knew that eventually down the line of his descendants, great things would come about.

God was made manifest in the flesh. ~ 1 Timothy 3:16
This is one of those cute little word games that some people play when they get desperate, which is to take a part out of context where you don't notice it is the end of one sentence, and the beginning of another sentence. these last days has spoken to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the world. ~ Heb. 1:2
This fails to recognize that the Greek has it as "worlds", plural. The actual word is "ages", and now, with Jesus and his word on earth, there is the old age, and the new age of Christ, which he created.

But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him. ~ 1 Corinthians 8:6
"All". I think, is being abused if you try to make it mean more that should be obviously what it was intended to mean, which is the church.

And to make all men see what is the fellowship of the mystery, which from the beginning of the world hath been hid in God, who created all things by Jesus Christ ~ Ephesians 3:9
The "by Jesus Christ" part is not in the text but is added by the translator as his interpretation.
edit on 18-7-2014 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)

posted on Jul, 18 2014 @ 11:14 PM

originally posted by: roth1
Jesus never in the bible said he was god. He always claimed to be the son of god. If the had claimed to be god gov would have killed him much sooner. The Jews would not have had to beg to have him executed. Where did this come from? The church not the bible? Remember the bible says that god said not to worship any before him. Isn't this against the bible? I don't know for sure if this is a conspiracy, but some group propagated this for some intent.

Yes He did, Our Lord said "I AM", a reference only God states. This is what upset the disbelievers of His time.

Proof scientifically, an Italian study done in 2011 found the marks on the Shroud of Turin cannot yet be reproduced by man. They were talking about UV rays. Wow, wow, wow, the moment of God's resurrection!!!!

new topics

top topics

<< 15  16  17    19  20  21 >>

log in