Why do peole think that Jesus was god?

a reply to: roth1
The idea that Jesus was God is absurd.

How could God die?

If he were God who was he praying to…himself?

Going undercover amongst his creatures?

A Jew saying he was God wouldn’t last five seconds amongst those ancient Jews.

It was the later Romans who innovated this doctrine.

So he was thought as a God because of the pagan inclinations of ignorant people in those days where in fact many of the Roman Emperors were “gods”

It’s an easy story. This crazy doctrine of Jesus’ being God only happened because the Romans took over Christianity at the time of Constantine and of course at the famous council on Nicea the Bishops VOTED this doctrine as the truth in a vote!

The Arians, a sect of Christians who were vehemently against deifying Christ were voted out and then eventually murdered overtime by the Roman Catholic Church


The fact of the matte is this is why the brother of Jesus, James and some early Christians were vehemently against Paul who was the one who started this Jesus idolatry.

a reply to: AnuTyr

Your post is grossly misleading.

The Dead Sea Scrolls . . . particularly the scroll of Isaiah

were STARTLING

IN THEIR DEMONSTRATING THAT

The copies of the Jewish Scriptures available elsewhere were

99.999% accurate. IIRC. At least 99.99% accurate.

Considering the number of years involved, that's incredible.

Your post made it sound like the Dead Sea scrolls proved that the earlier copies were greatly different and thereby flawed.

That's simply NOT TRUE.

Though in a symbolic sense the idea of Jesus being God or the son of God esoterically means that ALL humans can become divine by tapping into some mysterious inner realm

Jesus said: “The Kingdom of God is within you”

If we contact this “Kingdom” and work on ourselves and cultivate nearness to God WE ALL CAN BECOME LIKE GOD.
Not just Jesus.

According to Rumi, he claims Jesus is in all of us and it is a spiritual archetype that all humans can activate through devotion and awareness...though let no one deceive you it is a difficult path for the vast majority of humans.

Esoterically ALL humans have God in them and are the sons and daughters of God.

a reply to: Willtell

Romans 14:11 (EXB) | In Context | Whole Chapter

11 because it is written in the Scriptures:

“‘As surely as I live,’ says the Lord,
‘·Everyone [L Every knee] will bow before me;
·everyone [L every tongue] will ·say that I am [confess; acknowledge; or praise] God [Is. 45:23].’”

Romans 14:11 (GNT) | In Context | Whole Chapter

11 For the scripture says,

“As surely as I am the living God, says the Lord,
everyone will kneel before me,
and everyone will confess that I am God.”

The Message Version:

“As I live and breathe,” God says,
“every knee will bow before me;
Every tongue will tell the honest truth
that I and only I am God.”

Romans 14:11 (NCV) | In Context | Whole Chapter

11 because it is written in the Scriptures:

“‘As surely as I live,’ says the Lord,
‘Everyone will bow before me;
everyone will say that I am God.’” Isaiah 45:23

Romans 14:11 (NLV) | In Context | Whole Chapter

11 The Holy Writings say, “As I live, says the Lord, every knee will bow before Me. And every tongue will say that I am God.”

"Hashem" used in that verse = "breaker of bread" . . . Who could that MORE apply to than Jesus?

Isaiah originated the passage . . . the most Messianic prophetic source about the life of Jesus in the Old Testament.

a reply to: mytquin
Get that pascal wager BS out of here.

It only works coming from a position of belief. It makes zero sense to an agnostic or athiest. Seeing as how there are thousands of religions, that all clash enormously with each other. A whole lot of them offering unseen rewards after death for following, and threatening unseen punishment for not following, how does that wager make any sense?

What are we to do? Roll a thousand sided die and go with whatever it lands on? How is that safer? If it rolls on the wrong one we are screwed. We got a thousand different sects yelling about they are the one and only truth, yet not a single damn one can offer one shread of proof, that their truth is safer than any of the other shouting sects. Insanity.

Sooo...at the end of you life....if you are wrong, then what?

If a muslim said those words to you while trying to convert you to allah, you would likely scoff at them. Now multiply that by a thousand different sects, all hungry for the souls and money of us that do not know, or not believe any of them.

The Answer to this Question. "Why do Christians believe Jesus was God " Is answered in the New Testament Holy Bible in the Book of John . Read the entire Book of John . John 3:16 . This will make your spirit cry . Jesus was always from the beginning with God . He is God and made all things and is holding every atom and molecule together with his "Dunamis" It is the Greek word for "Power" . Read the book of "Romans" in the new Testament. In the book of Isaiah in the old testament it speaks to the Messiah and there are over 300 prophecy's to who he will be. It is THE CHRIST. The whole reason Christians believe Jesus is God is because Jesus say's HE AND THE FATHER ARE ONE. For God so loved the world that he gave his only son to be sacrificed for OUR SINS. Jesus came into an earthen body to teach and suffer and die . He became half man half God. It is a wonderful mysterious mystery we mere humans will not understand . Get it through your head mere mortals . We humans are a creation. We are all different, each one of us. We are made very meticulously and with a reason . The ten Commandments were given as the LAW . The Law of God was meant to show us our sin and that we cannot be good enough TO ENTER HEAVEN AFTER DEATH . The law makes us realize our sin and that to be washed clean just admit you are a sinner and that you know THE CHRIST died and rose again and that you want to "repent" or "turn away" from your sinful life and let God remake you into the person that he meant for you to be . But he gave us all free will and we all have a choice .. The choice is simple. Live in this world as a PART of the carnal world . Or serender your soul to God and THE CHRIST You will be washed clean and made a new person . To explain this phenomenon I will tell you it is a supernatural rebirth. You will instantly know that you are a changed being . Not perfect but changed . He and the Father are one . This is why Christmas is so special . Behold the lamb of God who takes away the sin of the world . That is how much God Loves us all .

a reply to: roth1
That is a LIE! He said, "Before Abraham was, I AM!"

When the Centurions were sent to arrest Him, when Judas identified Him as Yeshua/Jesus with his betraying kiss, the Centurions asked are You Yeshua, and when He said, "I AM" the Soldiers all fell backwards at the mighty power of His utterance and proclamation.

You Atheists are something.

Arm yourselves with TRUTH before you make these ridiculous allegations that you are not able to back up.

originally posted by: TKDRL
a reply to: mytquin
Get that pascal wager BS out of here.

It only works coming from a position of belief. It makes zero sense to an agnostic or athiest. Seeing as how there are thousands of religions, that all clash enormously with each other. A whole lot of them offering unseen rewards after death for following, and threatening unseen punishment for not following, how does that wager make any sense?

What are we to do? Roll a thousand sided die and go with whatever it lands on? How is that safer? If it rolls on the wrong one we are screwed. We got a thousand different sects yelling about they are the one and only truth, yet not a single damn one can offer one shread of proof, that their truth is safer than any of the other shouting sects. Insanity.

the truth is, (spoiler alert) that if you don't believe, nothing applies or will happen to you/them.

everybody getting upset coz they told you, you will go to hell, is silly.

they're not going to heaven, let alone hell. lol, good news indeed!

the way to God is through Jesus.
and Jesus was asked if He was the king of the jews.
He said His kingdom was not of this earth.

He always claimed to be the Son of God.
is He God? what difference does it make?
will that answer change any minds or hearts?

no it won't.

originally posted by: nenothtu

originally posted by: Akragon

I would like to see one person come up with a verse that has Jesus saying "this was my will"... not my Father's

Poor guy couldn't even beg "the Father" to spare him...

The only way to do that and leave it at that is dishonestly, by ignoring the myriad other places that specify where the authority REALLY comes from, and how Jesus got it, in His OWN words.

I seem to recall a particular place where He said "Nevertheless, not my will but Thine be done".

I would like to see someone try and do all the things that Jesus says are possible, here.

That will completely open the door to EVERYTHING.

originally posted by: roth1
Jesus never in the bible said he was god. He always claimed to be the son of god. If the had claimed to be god gov would have killed him much sooner. The Jews would not have had to beg to have him executed. Where did this come from? The church not the bible? Remember the bible says that god said not to worship any before him. Isn't this against the bible? I don't know for sure if this is a conspiracy, but some group propagated this for some intent.

Because that is how the "priests" in most Catholic Churches refer to God, and that is how children are conditioned at a time when they are the most vulnerable and receptive.

Here's another important question...

Why do people and bibles refer to God as being male? It is contradictory. God is everything , it is energy , it is both male and female. It is the spiritual force that keeps us inspired to nurture and care for our planet.

What kind of effect do you think this has had on our society, referring to God as "He." Do you think this contributes to the suppression of the divine female energy and thus the neglect of our sacred Mother Earth? A truth that is mirrored by the physical reality we are faced with. There are many subconscious contradictions that lie at the very heart of our belief "systems".

"My country is the world, and my religion is to do good." - Thomas Paine

Peace

originally posted by: FlyersFan

originally posted by: Akragon
a WORD is essentially a sound... even a vibration
Both of which need something to create them

There are very few things we disagree about, this is probably the one thing

God doesn't have to create Himself. Calling Jesus 'The Word' is the closest in human language John could use to describe Jesus ... Jesus Who Himself said He came down from Heaven, and He backed that statement up with his miracles. (unlike others who made claims to be a prophet and produced no evidence).

In the beginning was The Word, and The Word was with God, and The Word was God .


'The Word'. An aspect of God Himself.

As always, you are free to disagree. We'll find out for sure when we are dead.

The best surprise for Christians and almost everyone else, will be when they find out that "GOD" did need ITSELF to DESTROY ITSELF, AKA total IMMERSION into its creation, without memory or soul.

The only way , it could ever offer true choice of will to ANY CREATION, NO MORE OBSERVER.

If anyone could chew on that, they are getting a HELL of a lot closer to what is going on, and the fact that these Galaxies, UNIVERSES, all came FAR AFTER THAT!!

originally posted by: nenothtu

originally posted by: deadeyedick
a reply to: nenothtu It is a time travel thing. Some believe that the word of god was givin to the past from the future and that the son of GOD a living person had a light inside him that was used by a computer system with the aid of filters and amplifers to also be the sun. They believe that people are planets and so on... I take that back some people do not believe that. it is just probaly me that believes that. I have made several threads where the thought that people make up everything we see including the stars the trees plants animals.

There is no "time", so it cannot be traveled in. All "time" is One, it's all the same, it's all "now". Insisting on divisions like "future" and "past" is just a human invention to deal with things that would otherwise overwhelm them.

Ahh, now you are getting into the realm of being like the others, BELIEVING what you have been told.

It is with great interest the perception that a kind of "time" does not exist and all is here, and now.

And it is utter and TOTAL nonsense, without direction, and completely off course.

It lives inside this Hologram along with all the other manipulations that are here.

Let us try and ACTUALLY find out what is going on COMPLETELY, without any of these books and examples.

Or is that just too dam OUTSIDE THE BOX.

a reply to: TKDRL

There are probably a number of folks who've tried to convince us one way or another that they are brighter than Pascal was.

I can't think of any that have convinced me that was true of them, however.

a reply to: BO XIAN
No matter how bright he may or may not have been, his wager is illogical as hell. Some of us don't seem to have the same believe or not believe switch that a lot of believers claim exists.

I cannot believe, no matter how hard I try, that there is a boogeyman under my bed, I have already looked and saw he don't exist. I can go through the motions of jumping to my bed from as far away as I can, I can lie and tell others that I think he exists, but that feeling of belief is not there.

If any of the gods out there, save for a few that aren't like the abrahamic type exist, they would know I was lieing, right? So it would be a waste of time to project the lie that I believe, as I would be screwed anyways. God has chosen not to reveal himself to me for whatever reason, if he exists.

a reply to: OpinionatedB

Why such resistance to alternate ways of thinking?

You do not see that it this whole debate is here to continue the meaningless circle?

Why do you believe GOD, is a creator and has a plan??? BECAUSE YOU HAVE BEEN TOLD SO.

Every beLIEfe on this planet is constructed in the same manner, and NONE of them lead to actually knowing or doing anything about ANYTHING.

Faith, Hope, Belief, the REAL TRINITY, of total despair and exhaustion, it warrants that you will never know anything, and yet some part of you was designed to want to know, but you cannot, for it has been ingrained into you, that you are not worthy.

I think differently, I have a COMPLETE LACK OF FAITH, BELIEF, or HOPE.... and a whole lot of "LET US GO AND FIND IT ALL!!!"

a reply to: TKDRL

Certainly God is not interested in deception from anyone toward Him.

One can, however, say something like:

"Hey, Big Boss, if you exist, Please make yourself real to me in terms I can wrap my understanding around; in a time frame that makes sense to me in terms of this request; and in a way that is functional for me."

Warning . . . He still does things HIS WAY and IN HIS TIME. But He has a real persistent habit of answering an earnest communication of that sort.

And, He still tends to answer in a way that is right on the razor thin line between faith and proof.

He will provide SUFFICIENT PROOF . . . but STILL REQUIRE a measure of faith to LEAN ON that sufficient proof. Then . . . a bit more tends to come.

He has decreed that without faith, it is impossible to please Him. And . . . HE IS THE BOSS.

originally posted by: ParasuvO

I would like to see someone try and do all the things that Jesus says are possible, here.

That will completely open the door to EVERYTHING.

How so? What doors would it open?

If people saw and refused to believe then, what is it you think makes them any better now?

People will believe what they want to believe, even in the face of the evidence of their own eyes. There is a reason for that, and most folks don't like that reason at all, so they refuse to believe it, too.

originally posted by: ParasuvO

Ahh, now you are getting into the realm of being like the others, BELIEVING what you have been told.

It is with great interest the perception that a kind of "time" does not exist and all is here, and now.

And it is utter and TOTAL nonsense, without direction, and completely off course.

It lives inside this Hologram along with all the other manipulations that are here.

Let us try and ACTUALLY find out what is going on COMPLETELY, without any of these books and examples.

Or is that just too dam OUTSIDE THE BOX.

What are you on about? You think we live inside a little square dove in the corner of a cosmic VISA card?

If you need the direction that "future" and "past" provides, it's been given to you, so run with it. I can see how you would label it "nonsense", since things we cannot understand never make sense to us, and thus, to us, are "nonsense" - not making sense to us.

Hang tight to your dimensioned perception, and enjoy. That's what it's there for - to give you some small sense of direction and purpose, without which you would be directionless and purposeless, entirely adrift. It's a framework provided for the comfort of your existence, so that you have somewhere to hang your hat.

I have no problem with your insistence on marking time.

It's sadly amusing to see you rail at another about "believing what they have been told" (as if! - who do you suppose told me to believe that there is no time?) and then proceeding to defend an artificial construct that YOU have been told to believe...

a reply to: BO XIAN
Sure one can say stuff like that, every day for ~28 years, I am still waiting to this day. Had some interesting experiences in meditations, but not a single thing that could not be explained by science in one way or another as an ordinary occurrence.

originally posted by: ParasuvO
a reply to: OpinionatedB

Why such resistance to alternate ways of thinking?

You do not see that it this whole debate is here to continue the meaningless circle?

Why do you believe GOD, is a creator and has a plan??? BECAUSE YOU HAVE BEEN TOLD SO.

Every beLIEfe on this planet is constructed in the same manner, and NONE of them lead to actually knowing or doing anything about ANYTHING.

Faith, Hope, Belief, the REAL TRINITY, of total despair and exhaustion, it warrants that you will never know anything, and yet some part of you was designed to want to know, but you cannot, for it has been ingrained into you, that you are not worthy.

You know, I started to go down the list of things I've been told over my life, things which obviously cannot be true simply because I have been told them, and therefore within your framework they can't be true because they have been told, but it was too exhausting to stop believing in things like atmosphere, dangerous animals, taxes - that was a biggie, because I've never actually seen a tax, but they sneak in and steal my money at random while I'm not looking - and so forth, so I stopped worrying about it just a few seconds into the exercise. You worry about what you want to worry about, and the rest of us will do likewise.

Perhaps the funniest thing is that the member you were addressing in this post isn't a christian, and hasn't been told anything about christianity beyond what she has dicovered on her own. How does that holographic thingy work relative to assumptions?

I think differently, I have a COMPLETE LACK OF FAITH, BELIEF, or HOPE.... and a whole lot of "LET US GO AND FIND IT ALL!!!"

Well that's pretty cool! Bye! Have a nice trip! See you when you get back, all enlightened and everything. Do you need me to pack you a lunch?