Removing the WILL TO RULE from American males

Originally posted by Arkaleus
Brothers:

It was the same in Greece, where our thoughts and traditions come from.

Nope, your thoughts and traditions come from all over the world. Your founding fathers' traditions come from England.

US recently played bad games with Greece by recognizing Macedonia as something different than Greek....so much from Greece as the root of US.

How do you have a Greek-inspired civil system without Greek-inspired people? Obviously - YOU CAN'T. So what kind of system do we really have?
[edit on 2-12-2004 by Arkaleus]

You have many misconceptions about ancient Greeks, man. Let me tell you a few things:

1) Democracy was only in Athens. All the other cities-states where kingdoms.

2) Ancient Greeks destroyed themselves in the exact same way US will do: they thought they were too powerful, and they blatantly blackmailed other cities to either 'protect' them or destroy them.

3) their great opponent, the Spartans, where lean and mean just like Russians are.

4) when Latins invaded Greece, there was nothing left standing from 30 years of total war.

Ancient Greece is where the modern logical way of thinking has started; when mathematical deduction was used for the first time; where sports were founded; where arts like music, theatre (with sponsors!) flourished for the first time; where the first written history was recorded.

But all that ended in a great war.

Arkeleus, you are on target.
Castrate and and demasculinate the male population of our society, suppress aggression, destroy the spirit and feed them junk food and other food that is lacking in nutrient.
If they do not rise up and stop it while they have the strength, it'll only be a matter of time before they are conquered

Shorty you are running away from my lessons and I will not have it!

The human form was made from bugs and animals and mud.

The human mind was never part of these constituents. God is in the MIND, not the BODY. Bodies can be slaves, and we do not complain, but minds were never meant to be slaves. Most certainly of all, God did not make a slave of man's mind. That was the work of darker forces.

Equality is a Godly trait that only good beings can endure. Be good with me, silly kid. God created so that He might have companionship. What is the only thing God lacks? Companionship.

Arkaleus

You have many misconceptions about ancient Greeks, man. Let me tell you a few things

No, I don't! I am not misrepresenting the origins of America.

I know very well where my people come from. We aren't Greeks, we came from the enlightened minds of Englishmen and Frenchmen [Edit: And other nations who loved God's Liberty more than tyranny] who took the best of what they learned from Classical Cultures and constructed a whole new idea. Their idea was more glorious and worthy than ANY other government to establish itself on the face of this earth.

We are the children of this endeavor, man. My brothers and I were cruelly cheated of the dignity of our inhertiance by a class of men that has come into power in the shadows. They have conspired against our Liberty, and have designed a prison of the mind for our generations to be born into.

The only thing that excels my hatred of these men and their system is the fate they will endure for creating it.

The concept of male power in a Republic is almost wholly Greek, it never existed anywhere else to my knowledge. Rome never held such values, and Greece only held it for short times. Read the wise words of Socrates if you desire what they themselves said of the matter.

The magnificent truth that cannot be hid is that the American system was perfect as man could make. But, like all things man made, it requires worthy stewardship. The problem isn't in the design of our Republic, it was inspired. Not one of you foreigners can claim a wiser or more worthy design! But it was the greed of men and the evil of dark things that come to be, and they have worked steadily to displace this righteous system for one of their own design.

That is why I call for the lads, and the men, to remember themselves, and glorify their Fathers and reclaim their dignity.

Arkaleus

[edit on 2-12-2004 by Arkaleus]

Originally posted by Arkaleus
This isn't a gender issue.

Oh quite contrare monfrare. The majority of your post all over ATS & BTS, clearly state that it is. And many people here have pointed this out to you, several times, not just me.

Originally posted by Arkaleus
These are classified by philosophers as feminine traits. Middle class public schools are becoming very hostile towards strong males, and have taken many, many actions to supress it.

I don't know exactly what you mean here, I'm interested because if there is some hostility in the school systems I highly doubt it is targeted at only males and if that is truly the case, I'd give anything to see some validity in your accusations. Feelings and thoughts don't cut if for me here, sorry.

Originally posted by Arkaleus
I do not hate women shorty, but I love mankind. It THEIR inheritance that has been robbed, not the woman's. Therefore, I speak on HIS behalf.

"I don't hate women, but..." Why is there a "but" after that statement?
Again, I have read many of your post that conflict with this statement. If you really don't hate women, then why are you posting constant negativity all over this forum about them? Who is the "HIS" behalf that you speak on???

Originally posted by Arkaleus
What kind of boy are you? Are you one to stand with the free males? Do you have an understanding of a Republic, or Liberty? If you did, then you would not wonder at my words.

Freedom is not gender specific my friend. The first sign that you are free person is when you can renounce the negative entities that adhere to your mind and keep you imprisoned with the idea that ONE particular gender or race is responsible for all the wrong doings of the world.

Geez. It puzzles me greatly that you are STILL continuing to post in different topics and ways this expression of hatred for;women/female/girls/mothers/daughters/sisters grandmothers/wives/friends/counterparts etc..etc..

Bring me the woman I have wronged.

Otherwise cease your accusations.

I am not speaking about individuals. I am speaking about the male and female traits of societies and people. Small minds cannot separate objects from abstracts.

I am speaking in conceptual terms. Male values vs. female tendencies. Are there female values? Tell us your female values, and grant us some dignity and respect. I have yet to find a single woman able to teach me her values, or give any kind reasoned philosophy to me. I know there are some who are capable of this, but I have not yet found one here.

If you are not able to constructively add to this discussion of male virtue, then take your persecutions elsewhere.

Arkaleus

Originally posted by Arkaleus
If you are not able to constructively add to this discussion of male virtue, then take your persecutions elsewhere.

You don't moderate this forum. Don't tell people they can or can't post here.
Chill out.

i think you're half right, ark, man.
the will to do anything is not just being removed from men. it is being removed from women, too. we are being conditioned to respect 'the system', and respect 'authority', when in fact, in true republic democracy, we ARE the system, and WE are authority.
the immasculation of normal testosterone imbalance is only one front in the battle for control of the HUMAN will to rule.
how do you think it is for a women cop, who goes into battle PRAYING that they send some big MALES for back-up, when dealing with a dangerous cornered psycho-killer? this is a bit of a shock to women who thought or were brainwashed to believe they were equal to men.
i've heard women cops say this, so no need for militant feminists to try and tell me, 'a woman can do any job a man can do'. the fact is, that is an insanely irrational thing to say, nevermind turn into policy, based on 'equal rights'. men are bigger, stronger, faster, and more aggressive. it is a physical thing. we have thicker bones, and more muscles. more testosterone. so, until gentech makes new warrior women bodies, there will be a difference between the physical characteristics of men and women.
i gotta go to, but i'll come and explain myself more, because i know a lot of ladies just got mad at me, when in fact, i'm merely pointing out patterns and truth. my hope is that we can realise how the illuminati have us chasing our tails by institutionalising mass cognitive dissonance.

If you don't contribute to this dicussion, then you have no place posting in there. That is YOUR job, moderator. You should remove YOUR own post.

I don't think it falls within the spirit of this forum to invade and inject your own needless comments. Shall I complain more?

It will not go over very well if this "free expression" forum begins harassing its members for "free expression."

Take your needless comments elsewhere, moderator.

Or do you wish to make a power play and intimidate me for my views? To put it lightly, I may speak of whatever I will, to whomever I please.

If people come to make rude accusations of me, and then bring in some moderator who makes equally useless and threatening comments, then the problem is in YOUR estimation of YOUR OWN authority.

Words are threats only to the decevier, and the tyrant. That is what we fight against, down with the NWO, and filthy people who live willingly under its power.

Arkaleus


[edit on 2-12-2004 by Arkaleus]

Hello ark.

I read some of your posts, (well most of them!) and they speak alot of truth.

Keep it up, just dont get too far ahead of yourself, we learn everyday!

Anway laterz-

Originally posted by Arkaleus
Bring me the woman I have wronged.

Otherwise cease your accusations.

I am not speaking about individuals. I am speaking about the male and female traits of societies and people. Small minds cannot separate objects from abstracts.

I am speaking in conceptual terms. Male values vs. female tendencies. Are there female values? Tell us your female values, and grant us some dignity and respect. I have yet to find a single woman able to teach me her values, or give any kind reasoned philosophy to me. I know there are some who are capable of this, but I have not yet found one here.

If you are not able to constructively add to this discussion of male virtue, then take your persecutions elsewhere.

Arkaleus

Why on earth are you demanding that I tell you of my "female values"? What if I "tell you" that my values are not confined to being born female? I consider my values as my own, that I may have aquired over time, lessons, trial, accomplishments, love and so on. Not strictly female values. Perhaps there are no gender values within my soul. Perhaps the values I hold so sacredly are ones related to being human and they are gathered and combined with fortitude and hope for all mankind. That's both male and female.

I'd love to know where you concluded that I have persecutions. Not me, not so, not in my actions or words. You might be confusing my words with your own..let's not do that so we can lessen the confusion for the readers.

Does/did your Mother have values? How about Grandmother? Surely you aren't so confined that in all of your 50 or so years of life you missed some values provided by women?

Here's a little piece of heart to heart Arkaleus, if you start actually seeking and looking for the positive values associated or connected to women you might be granted with the knowledge you seek. But if you continue to blindly accuse and persecute the female gender as a whole, then you'll only ever see what your mind has prisoned you with. Your views are not all that horrific in my opinion and they are yours and forever remain as such, but you are missing out on quality people in this world when you constantly shun women away from you.

You want to be considered one of God's chosen, you express this all in your posts and you even claim to be speaking on behalf of the Main Man in Charge..but how can anyone see truth, love and light in your heart when you project the complete opposite? Good, true intentions speak volumes to all and all listen and hear. Bad intentions are spoken through a confined tube and thus distorted and unclear, therefore only heard by few.

I know that which is in my heart and soul. I wish that for you too.

Originally posted by Arkaleus


It will not go over very well if this "free expression" forum begins harassing its members for "free expression."

Actually this is a Privately Owned Board so there really is no such thing as "Free Expression" per se'

Or do you wish to make a power play and intimidate me for my views? To put it lightly, I may speak of whatever I will, to whomever I please.

Sure you may, but you don't have the right to do it here. This message board is a private venture, so you must comply with the board rules and etiquette. It was pointed out that you do not moderate this forum thus have no place telling anyone who can and cannot post here.

Madam, you came into a thread concerning male values, accuse me of misogyny, and then become quite bitter towards me. It does not fit into the rest of the posts here, which are quite friendly and brotherly. This is, after all, a thread concerning MEN and the UPBRINGING.

But if you continue to blindly accuse and persecute the female gender as a whole, then you'll only ever see what your mind has prisoned you with

What accusation? I have said that the feminine values of this society have become destructive to the formative male. I have not spoken blindly, I have experienced everything I speak of. We are a free people, understand? We require FREEDOM to grow. Not conformity to your sensibilities and fashions.

Quite frankly, madam, you have barged in on a forum of men discussing things rationally, calmly, peacefully, and overturned the flow of this thread. You are most unwelcome. You do not add anything to our wisdom, but come spitting accusations like a most intolerable cobra.

I ask ladies to tell me their values so that I might commune with them, and come to reason as men properly should. Yet none of those ladies whom I ask seem to be willing. They seem threatened by my words, because I say that I am a free male, and I delight in male business, and that it is a matter independent of the ladies.

My cherished love for the perfect female is a matter I will not discuss with such a rude person. Quite simply put, I do not offer it to you. I am no racist, sexist, or any other low form of humanity you accuse me of. I hold the fire of truth in my mouth and speak it wherever I should like to set things ablaze.

My mother is a strong woman, who set me free as much as she could, so that I could survive in this world. She did not do what you do here, which is the TRUE HATRED. Away with you, and your bitterness, I'll not taste a single drop of it.

Good, true intentions speak volumes to all and all listen and hear. Bad intentions are spoken through a confined tube and thus distorted and unclear, therefore only heard by few.

My words are not for you. Only to those who can receive them. I have not come here to destroy women, but to strengthen men. But you have come here to destroy ME.

Arkaleus

Originally posted by Arkaleus
A republic's energy is generated by the Liberty and authority of her male citizens.

A republic's downfall is also brought about by liberty and authority of male citizens, it was the same in greece.

It was the same in Greece, where our thoughts and traditions come from. As long as there were strong men speaking and debating, and RULING their land as a band of brothers, no tyranny could ever emerge.

Actually tyrannies often emerged in greek city states, usually because a powerful elite had taken over and run roughshode of the constitutional foundations and traditional rights of the -people-, not just the 'menfolk'. The tyrant would come in and put things back to order, and be welcomed for it.

up or power could ever overthrow them, because they asserted their own authority, in accordance with their ideal of Liberty.

Right. Except for those powers that did overthrow them. Like alexander, or the romans. Or just anohter city state. Or, in the case of the most 'philosophical' and advanced of the greek cities (those in Ionia) the persians.

We have no sense of community among our own kind, American boys are deprived of the lessons, images, and words of our strong male forefathers.

Where?

We are conditioned to be adverse to persona of strong men, or any individual with personal will or authority.

No, authority itself is not shunned in america. its abuse of authority, and having one's will subsumed by someone else's. If anything everyone is encouraged to exercise their will.

Authority and will is only proper in the hands of government,

I agree that the people must, by necessity, give authority to the government, but not their -wills- or the institution.

The bad guys in history have become the rich white males, we are forced in public schools to analyze their "faults and shortcomings" in a blatant attempt to destroy our heroes

Heros can have shortcommings and faults too. Pretending that they were perfect or some such is fantasy, and pointless. too often people pretend that everything -now- is corrupt and falling apart, when the truth is that its -allways- been that way. The great liberator Washington also held slaves. heck, the Founders themselves said 'human rights are universal and inalienable' and actively traded in human slaves.

Instead, our boys and young men are indoctrinated with the process of consumption

its not just men, its women that are brought up as this too.

Education is given for this purpose only, the whole concept of school is given as the potential earnings of the graduates of high school vs. college, etc.

I agree that there is a terrible trend to make, at least univeristy education little more than 'job training' or some such. High school of course can't serve much more purpose than to provide general education and prepartation for life and to make good citizens, aware of their civic duties.

energetic and competitive games, running freely, exploring outside areas, rough and tumble, that is how you raise boys. That is how you create male minds able to receive and maintain a republic.

No one is denying men or women these things.

. Their "rights" are taught to them in terms of their ability to work and spend money, the greater concepts of Liberty and Independence are held back from them.

Again, where is this happening? The schools don't teach people that money is everything, you just said that they make the 'rich' into bad people. The schools -deemphasize- material success, or 'success' in general, and they certainly aren't promoting that 'money rules everything around me, cream, dolla dolla bill y'all". Thats comming from society itself. People have gotten used to living in relative peace. In such times, the average person doesn't do much more than worry about their income and a certain amount of material pleasure.

And what fool isn't going to work to control their own wealth, material surroundings, and future comforty? Business and the ammassing of capital are a -graet- expression of intent, skill, and will. I would'nt say that they are goals in themselvs, but, at the very least, they are necessary. Even in those ancient greek city states, with their culture and philosophy and theories government and science, they were only possible at all because people had accumulated wealth and had economic reasons to come in from their huts and villages to make it all profitable. The great philosphers only even had time to sit around and think because they weren't toiling in fields or labouring.

I strongly accuse the women in public education for this conspiracy.

Oh come on, a conspiracy? I could understand if you were saying its an entire way of thinking that is flawed but has become popular, or one that people don't understand the risks of, but a conspiracy? Thats absurd. You don't know any women in education? You think that the women in education who read this aren't going to -know- that this is b/s?

I say they have hated male authority from the beginning, and they have struck against what they have hated for generations. They have committed a act of treachery against generations of boys. They have raised up slaves and servants, and stolen the inheritance of freemen.

What are you channeling an coutler, that insane woman who makes lists of traitors?

And even if 'White men' were being demonized in schools, the rest of society more than makes up for that demonization and throws it completely out of balance. Besides, I thought you were talking about men in general, now its just 'white men'? Then why even begin to talk about the greeks, particuarly the greeks from the golden age of greece, they'd probably universally be recognized as some sort of 'non-white'.

Go ahead and continue to constrict your mind. I posted my values. Evidentally you could careless really to know what values I hold or you would have clearly read where I provided what I value.

I'm not confined in the belief that men or women in human skin are more or less supreme of the other because of their born identity. God had his reasons for giving life to man and woman. I'm grateful for having life on earth as either.

Please spare me with your attacks on women and your bitter comments toward me as a person/human/female. You had better believe that no matter where you go, or where you continue to spray your hatred in this world, be it cyber or real & physical, that many people are going to take offense the moment you start accusing an entire gender for destroying people. I've yet to see any such proof of this accusation, and I have asked..nicely.

I refuse to allow you to continually post ignorance and corruption. I don't believe in breeding hate of any kind and I'm not afraid to step in and add love and honour for all human beings of the planet. Now there's one clear value of mine for you to ponder over.

You claim that you've come to strengthen men. That's all well and good, but not when you use women as the tool of arson in your argument. This my friend will never acheive any amount of good or strength for any people or nation. From an intelligent perspective and one that does not discriminate;it weakens your argument to the point of being read as nothing more than a puddle of piddle.

I've not come to "destroy" you. That's your delusion. I've come to correct you.

Originally posted by Arkaleus
This isn't a gender issue.

Contradiction in five four three two..

A republic is generated by the energy of male minds. Without that energy of maleness, the governments become tyrannies.

Please demonstrate what 'maleness' is and how it was lost in those societies where tyrannies were founded and why those tyrannies result in the return of 'maleness' made governance?

. What I mean by this is that the collective will is emphasized over the individual, the emphasis is on control, comformity, submissiveness, and obedience.

On of the most republican city states amoung all the greeks was that of Sparta. They had asemblies, 'gerousia', courts, formalized education, a meritocratic advancement system, an enourmous suppression of women, a consitution and two executives along with tremendous interest in competition at all societal levels and enourmous investiment in phyiscal training. They were also one of the most communal, conformist, anti-individuist socities in history.

These are classified by philosophers as feminine traits.

Those traits do no follow from having two x chromosomes.

Middle class public schools are becoming very hostile towards strong males, and have taken many, many actions to supress it

Such as??.

Drugs, rules, restrictions, laws - all these have been put in place to bind up the boys

Please elaborate as you point is not clear

We are the only where Liberty still clings on in the minds of a few men and women.

This is patently false, and furthermore it contradicts your ideas. The places where these supposed 'manly' virtues are most in place and where women have the least influence are the ones that are the least republican in form.

I do not hate women shorty, but I love mankind. It THEIR inheritance that has been robbed, not the woman's.

Liberty is something that belongs to all people, not the ones with testicles only.

skyfox2
I don't think Arkaleus is insinuating women are to blame.

No, he is infact outright stating that its a problem that has come directly from females with their perverse, weak, and unvirtuous morality and ethics.

There simply isn't the energy and intellect to sustain it.

So females and the like don't have energy nor intellect? Were men in Sparta also free? they maintained a republic.

Great leaders are not allowed under this new world tyranny

Great leaders are not needed in a republic either.

infinite
How can you blame women when the America has never had a female president as ruler??

For that matter, look at the women who have been in charge of other places. Boudicca rallied the various free tribes of britain in their last stand against roman invasion and 'tyranny'. Joan of Arc lead the French against English imperialism and tyranny. Zenobia led the city of Palmyra against rampant Roman 'tyranny'. And Queens Victoria and Elizabeth were hardly 'tyrannical', certainly not relative to some of the other 'free, sporty, and manly' kings that came before them.

masterp
Ancient Greeks destroyed themselves in the exact same way US will do: they thought they were too powerful, and they blatantly blackmailed other cities to either 'protect' them or destroy them

Classical greece was 'destroyed' by alexander. It had nothing to do with arrogance and power.

arkaleus
The concept of male power in a Republic is almost wholly Greek, it never existed anywhere else to my knowledge.

What are you talking about? Practically every civilization has considered 'rough and ready liberty loving sporty prowess' as a manly virtue and a virtue for good government.

arkaleus
Bring me the woman I have wronged.

Would be rather difficult to get every woman into the ATS site, but I guess its worth a try.

I am speaking about the male and female traits of societies and people

'traits' do not have genders, and you have been speaking specifically about the male and female biological sexes.

I have yet to find a single woman able to teach me her values

Not even your own? besides, why would anything a woman values be different from what a man values? The things you list as virtue, they have nothing to do with production of sperm or ability to metabolise and utilize testosterone.

Shall I complain more?

Continue, woman.

It will not go over very well if this "free expression" forum begins harassing its members for "free expression."

Is deceit a womanly virtue/tendency? You are expressing it nicely. A mod comes in and says 'don't tell people what they are allowed to talk about here' and you cry about having your expression limited?

I may speak of whatever I will, to whomever I please.

Actually, you are powerless to do this, and only do so at the delight of the moderators. But this is rather irrelevant, as no one has told you what you are not allowed to talk about. Or is an inability to understand plain manly speech a womanly trait of yours?

Well, seeing as this thread is turning into a bash-fest....
this thread is closed.