Doctor's Refusing To Treat Unvaccinated Children

originally posted by: Realtruth

originally posted by: LadySkadi
To add some depth, legal perspective Here and the recommendation of:

The American Academy of Pediatrics, though strongly supporting universal vaccinations, discourages doctors from refusing to see unvaccinated patients.

I guess I can see both sides, I do think it can be a slippery slope (many articles also mention the refusal to take on patients with at-risk factors like obesity an smoking, medicare and now obamacare), as well as the violation of the H. oath and all the ethics questions that must be considred. I do think we might be seeing this come up more often as time goes on.

I can see both sides as well.

And with outbreaks of Polio, and others I think it's going to give them strong bases to turn away patients.

I have some issues with vaccines because I lost one family member (54yo) due to a pneumonia vaccine, that was perfectly healthy within the last couple of years. They were pronounce dead within 48 hours of the vaccine.

Also about 10 years ago my nephew, when he was an infant, had a severe reaction to the Pertussis vaccine it left him with a handicap for a number of years.

I'm not sure about vaccinating infants at all. I personally think their systems are not able to handle them, if anyone is going to give a young one a vaccine it should be when they are a bit older, but that is my personal bias.

Although I think that the risks vs benefits of vaccination weighs very heavily on the side of pro-vaccination, I am also a believer in individual liberty and choice, so if one does not believe in vaccination, they should not be obligated by the state to do so.

Another poster did bring up a valid point...that the docs may be considering the safety of their other patients as well. Very often children who are immunocompromised (say leukemia for example) go to the pediatrician and are exposed to other children. Sine they can't be vaccinated or their vaccinations no longer are effective, exposure to an unvaccinated kid would be a safety or liability issue. (Again, too many lawyers.)

originally posted by: NavyDoc

Another poster did bring up a valid point...that the docs may be considering the safety of their other patients as well. Very often children who are immunocompromised (say leukemia for example) go to the pediatrician and are exposed to other children. Sine they can't be vaccinated or their vaccinations no longer are effective, exposure to an unvaccinated kid would be a safety or liability issue. (Again, too many lawyers.)

Again if vaccines are so fantastic, then everyone that is vaccinated should have no worries.

And exposure to an unvaccinated child, from what?

What exactly do unvaccinated children have.


And you bring up a child with leukemia that can not be vaccinated, but this child is putting everyone at risk the same as another unvaccinated child, by reason and logic, slippery slope effect.

originally posted by: Murgatroid
MANY MD's no longer trust those in control of the medical cartel...

When the MD's themselves confirm that the medical industry is being used for population reduction, something is seriously wrong.

"I found that the whole vaccine business was indeed a gigantic hoax. Most doctors are convinced that they are useful, but if you look at the proper statistics and study the instance of these diseases you will realize that this is not so." ~ DR. Archie Kalokerinos MD

My final conclusion after forty years or more in this business is that the unofficial policy of the World Health Organization and the unofficial policy of ‘Save the Children’s Fund and almost all those organizations is one of murder and genocide. They want to make it appear as if they are saving these kids, but in actual fact they don’t. I am talking of those at the very top. Beneath that level is another level of doctors and health workers, like myself, who don’t really understand what they are doing. But I cannot see any other possible explanation: It is murder and it is genocide."

~ DR. Archie Kalokerinos M.D.

www.whale.to...

I don't believe they work for ANYONE, neither do many MD's:

"The medical industry is no longer to be trusted. We have a Medical Inquisition. The Rockefellers took it over way back and warped a lot of it. Our doctors are brainwashed.

The Rockefellers are dedicated to population reduction and are using the medical industry to do it."

Confessions of a Medical Heretic ~ Robert Mendelsohn, M.D

"Much of what you have been led to believe about immunizations simply isn't true. I not only have grave misgivings about them, I would urge you to reject all inoculations for your child. Although I administered them my-self during my early years of practice, I have become a steadfast opponent of mass inoculation because of the myriad hazards they present." ~ Robert Mendelsohn, M.D.

"The greatest threat of childhood disease lies in the dangerous and ineffectual efforts made to prevent them through mass immunization." ~ Dr Robert S Mendelsohn

“I do not believe in Modern Medicine. I am a medical heretic. I believe that Modern Medicine’s treatments for disease . . . are more dangerous than the diseases they are designed to treat."
~ Robert S. Mendelsohn, M.D.

The only wholly safe vaccine is a vaccine that is never used.
~ Dr James A Shannon

Many doctors and health‐care practitioners do not get vaccinated
and do not vaccinate their children. Why not?

• They know vaccines are not proven to be safe or effective.
• They know vaccines contain dangerous substances.
• They know vaccines cause serious health problems.
• They have treated patients with serious side effects from vaccines.
Source

There is a great deal of evidence to prove that immunization of children does more harm than good,...there is no rationale for forcing immunization ~ Dr J Anthony Morris

"Only after realising that routine immunisations were dangerous did I achieve a substantial drop in infant death rates. The worst vaccine of all is the whooping cough vaccine... it is responsible for a lot of deaths and for a lot of infants suffering irreversible brain damage. In susceptible infants, it knocks their immune systems about, leading to irreparable brain damage, or severe attacks or even deaths from diseases like pneumonia or gastro-enteritis and so on." --Dr. Kalokerinos, M.D. Famous Vaccine Quotes

"My honest opinion is that vaccination is the cause of more disease and suffering than anything I could name." -Dr. Harry R. Baybee

A lot of quotes from what, 4 people, who only use anecdotal evidence and express an opinion does not a grand conspiracy make. Just like any other profession, their are nut jobs with "Dr" before their name. Many people will take them at face value simply because what they say matches their preconceived view of the world, but that's not evidence.

My kids have been vaccinated and they are doing super.

I spend a lot of time working in third world #holes so I've been vaccinated over and over and over and over again. The science is clear--vaccinations can and do stop a lot of morbidity and mortality and prevent disease. Some though, like the flu vaccine, are overused because flu in a healthy adult is self limited.

originally posted by: Realtruth

originally posted by: NavyDoc

Another poster did bring up a valid point...that the docs may be considering the safety of their other patients as well. Very often children who are immunocompromised (say leukemia for example) go to the pediatrician and are exposed to other children. Sine they can't be vaccinated or their vaccinations no longer are effective, exposure to an unvaccinated kid would be a safety or liability issue. (Again, too many lawyers.)

Again if vaccines are so fantastic, then everyone that is vaccinated should have no worries.

And exposure to an unvaccinated child, from what?

What exactly do unvaccinated children have.


And you bring up a child with leukemia that can not be vaccinated, but this child is putting everyone at risk the same as another unvaccinated child, by reason and logic, slippery slope effect.

Just putting out a potential reason why. When one works with immunocompormised patients, those who cannot be vaccinated and in whom vaccines don't work (you have to have an intact immune system to have a vaccine work) then, if they are exposed to an unvaccinated person who is carrying a virus, say measles or mumps or whatever, then that can have life threatening complications for the immunocompromised.

If they are around only those who can and do have the protection of vaccination, then they have protection from that "herd immunity."

originally posted by: NavyDoc

Just putting out a potential reason why. When one works with immunocompormised patients, those who cannot be vaccinated and in whom vaccines don't work (you have to have an intact immune system to have a vaccine work) then, if they are exposed to an unvaccinated person who is carrying a virus, say measles or mumps or whatever, then that can have life threatening complications for the immunocompromised.

If they are around only those who can and do have the protection of vaccination, then they have protection from that "herd immunity."

Just because someone is immunized doesn't mean they can't still carry a virus.

Vaccines do not 100% efficacy rate, in fact, influenza is a classic example and how many people does that kill a year?

Also I worked in a lab that produced vaccines (Park Davis - Warner Lambert) years ago, they produce many vaccines through egg incubation, by growing live cultures, then heating some of them to kill the pathogens, but some were actually still live.

Different types of vaccines.

Live, attenuated

Inactivated and Killed


I think there are a couple more, but I can't recall them


And the process is still the same today. Live virus vaccines are used all the time.

a reply to: NavyDoc

Now with all that said.

I am still on the fence in regards to some vaccines because I believe they are valid, and some I think are completely useless and dangerous.

originally posted by: NavyDoc
A lot of quotes from what, 4 people...

What if I gave you a list of 4 MILLION people?

Would it convince you?

Probably not.

Just like you, I once served in the US Navy.

I was proud of that fact but I was naive and had NO earthly idea about who was really in control behind the facade.

For this reason alone I have a HUGE amount of respect for you and many others on ATS just like you.

I write a lot here on ATS not because I have an agenda to push.

I do it because all of us deserve to know the truth.

Without it we are going to be deceived and we are going to fail.

But like the quote says below, you MUST learn the truth on your own.

originally posted by: MagicWand67
OP, I could try to go through your list of questions and give you some of the reasons, supported by facts, why the NWO conspiracy is a valid theory. That it's not just possible but extremely probable that it is true.

But, I feel it would be a complete waste of my time. You are far from a "normal guy". You are a member of the military. Your training and education has indoctrinated and brainwashed you. You've been taught to follow orders, trust your superiors and defend the Government no matter what. Even if it's wrong or evil you, as a member of the military, are expected to blindly do your duty and not ask question or refuse an order.

If you don't see it. It doesn't mean it isn't there. If you want the proof you will need to seek the truth and find it for yourself. No one can convince you of something you are in denial about. You must learn the truth on your own. It seems clear to me that your agenda is not to seek the truth. Instead you seek to support your existing belief system and to deny what you do not want to be real. You are still just following orders like a good soldier. Whether you realize it or not.

"There is no evidence whatsoever of the ability of vaccines to prevent any diseases. To the contrary, there is a great wealth of evidence that they cause serious side effects." -- Dr. Viera Scheibner

Why in the world are infants being given Hep B vaccines. It's not exactly a threat to babies.


If the industry wanted to alleviate parental concerns why would they not at least offer the single dose vaccine. Thimerosal is the main culpret that most parents are concerned with.

originally posted by: Realtruth
Firstly because isn't Vaccines suppose to protect the Vaccinated children, so wouldn't the vaccinated children be immune now?

About ninety percent of the time, yes. That leaves ten percent of hundreds who are endangered, and a substantial burden on society should any of them become really ill (parents missing work or losing jobs, use of scarce medical resources, lifelong disability, etc.).

If vaccines are as good as they say, all the vaccinated people should have to worry about anything.

Who are "they" and how good do you think "they" say vaccination is? Go to FDA.gov or pubmed.gov and read about vaccine efficacy. The only people going around talking about 100% effective vaccines are antivaxers. It's a strawman they like to beat up because they have no real arguments.

Just because parents don't believe in one aspect of the medical profession they should be shunned?

Shunning is an idea that could be explored, but it's not what we're talking about. We're talking about providing medical services in an office setting to people who willingly put others at risk because they do not believe in one of the foundational principles of public health, one that his been proven by evidence again and again. I would say that if parents do not believe in evidence based medicine, and will not conform their actions to the recommendations of the medical establishment, they have no business dealing with a medical practitioner.

What if they require medical treatment for something else say an injury, infection, allergies, etc.

If they are willing to compromise their anti-medicine beliefs in special cases, they can go to the emergency room, or find a doctor who will do housecalls. Or try the internet. I hear Natural News's medical advice is top notch.

You are just solidifying the "God Complex" POV

If it's doctors wih God complexes vs. the Dunning-Kruger crowd (which constitutes an entire pantheon of its own), I know whose side I'm on.

originally posted by: Witness2008
Why in the world are infants being given Hep B vaccines. It's not exactly a threat to babies.

When they started vaccinating infants for hep B in the US, the incidence of infection dropped 94%. "Since implementation of routine childhood immunization, an estimated 6,800 perinatal infections and an additional 18,700 infections during the first 10 years of life have been prevented annually in the United States." (source) Obviously, it was a threat.

If the industry wanted to alleviate parental concerns why would they not at least offer the single dose vaccine. Thimerosal is the main culpret that most parents are concerned with.

Most parents have never heard of thimerasol, which is fine, because it's harmless. There's no thimerasol in our hep B vaccines, anyway. I can't speak for other countries.

a reply to: FurvusRexCaeli

Again....the one size fits all. Hepatitis B is only gotten through blood and body fluid contact. If a mother tests positive then yes, absolutely the vaccine is called for. However vaccinating every child is going a bit overboard. I lead a clean and healthy life style and so does everyone I know, I'm going to make a wild guess that none of us will ever be stricken with Hep B.

I'm not going to inject myself with anything because someone else chooses to lead an unhealthy life style.

Doesn't that go against their oath?

a reply to: RedmoonMWC

Just wanted to add in that I have never had the chicken pox vaccine and contracted it at the age of 1 month 3 weeks. At 20 I had my first shingles outbreak. I guess I never got the shingles protection.

originally posted by: NavyDoc
There are docs who consult and give speeches for pharmaceutical companies. By law their payments has to be disclosed and they have to make an announcement at the beginning of every lecture they give who pays them, so I don't see what more you want.

Some don't even mention the product. Let's say a company sponsors a lecture on postoperative pain control techniques after total hip arthroplasty. There will be a sign out in front "sponsored by Perdue" but he very often goes the entire lecture without mentioning any products made by that company. That a lecture is sponsored by a company does not necessarily mean that their product is being pushed at said lecture. They often support academic endeavors like any other company--to get good press.

I get it, many people have seen too many movies and think there is a big bad conspiracy, but reality is often not perception. Are there issues and some problems? Of course. Is it a big conspiracy and everyone is on the take? Not even close. The medical industry is one of the most regulated industries in the country.

I don't buy it. I'll agree that a majority of doctors are good people. But that doesn't negate Big pharma buying off people with gifts, and none of this would be reported, because its all in the form of brand new golf clubs, etc. This has all been exposed. Much like senators receive their yearly donations from healthcare insurance/pharma. Please tell me about these movies I'd love to see them.

Where is all this regulation coming from? We are the least regulated healthcare wise of all the developed nations.

--- on to the subject at hand
A doctor should respect a patients right to choose, but at the same time a patient should respect a doctors right to refuse service if they don't agree. If a doctor and patient have such different views it is probably best for the both of them if the patient finds a more fitting health provider. Although I understand in todays healthcare world of "networked providers" it isn't always that easy.

Interesting ethical question.. On 1 hand it is not the child's fault that the parents are stupid.. But on the other hand the doctor has to protect the other potential victims of this crime.. Those who are to young to be immunized.