ISRAEL launches offensive on Gaza!

originally posted by: Haxsaw
Anyone with half a clue knows that the Palestinian fatalities far out weigh the Israeli fatalities.

Anyone with half a clue knows that it's not for lack of trying on the part of the Palestinians.

Seriously dude, both sides of this are guilty of awful things. Both sides of this need to evolve. Neither side is innocent. And blame can't be put on one side over the other. This is 2014 and both sides need to accept that and deal with the situation in a civilized manner .. or they can wipe each other off the planet. They should pick one or the other and just do it. Most people have gotten so tired of the antics of Israel and the 'Palestinians' that folks just don't care anymore.

a reply to: FlyersFan

Everyone needs to deal with the reality of here and now .. not what some religious guy who may or may not have existed claimed thousands and thousands of years ago.

If this is true then why do they still cry God gave us this land when people ask them why are they stealing land from the Palestinians?

Israel and Zionism is the cause of every problem on the planet.

I have never said that Israel is the cause of all the problems in the world. But however Zionism is the cause for quite a bit of problems in the world. They control the world banks which profit from the wars they help start. They control virtually all the news medias in the west that spreads disinformation that helps their agenda of hate that helps to get wars started. Do a little research all of this is true.

originally posted by: buster2010
If this is true then why do they still cry God gave us this land when people ask them why are they stealing land from the Palestinians?

Like I said ... they need to dump that mentality. The Jews claim God gave them Israel via Abraham. The Muslims claim that God gave them Israel via Abraham because the Jews didn't fulfill the agreement. Both are wrong. Abraham may not have even existed and you can't have legal right to a property based on some dude that may or may not have lived 4,000 years ago ... a dude who thought God told him to kill his kid via human sacrifice as a burnt offering. YIKES.

Thinking that they have a god given right to the land has to be educated out of them all - both the Jews and the Muslims.

a reply to: FlyersFan

lol... God isn't behind any of this, and you know it.

Definitely something much much more nefarious is at foot. I'm thinking of doing a thread, but I'm missing something somewhere... just cannot find the last piece of the puzzle.

I hate that.

originally posted by: EternalSolace
a reply to: FlyersFan

That's exactly the point. I don't understand what is so difficult to understand about Hamas being a terrorist organization. If Hamas was sitting on a border next to the US and were launching rockets, into say Texas, they'd be obliterated. If you ask me, the Palestinians would be much better off without Hamas ruling over them.

Would you be willing to admit that the Israeli government is a terrorist organization?

They certainly fit the role by their actions and by definition.

Every time Israel bombs a school or hospital they call it a "militant compound" then those who are unaware of the situation say "well Hamas shouldn't hide behind citizens of Gaza" and ignore the pictures of little babies torn limb from limb while there is no proof that Hamas was anywhere near any of these installations.

Where is Hamas supposed to hide? They are caged in the open air prison called Gaza. I do know that not all of Gaza supports Hamas, but Hamas is all they have because no one else is helping them fight the Israeli aggression.

I have a newsflash...no matter what your opinion of Hamas is they are the elected government of Gaza and they don't even have a real military so how could they be militants? Give them an air-force and a real army and allow them to defend themselves then maybe it would be a fair fight, but the international community will not allow that so they must smuggle weapons in - I would do the same as it is everyone's right to defend themselves no matter the cost.

It may seem that I am advocating violence but I am a peaceful person it's just that there comes a point where enough is enough and the Palestinians have reached that point a long time ago.

I woke up this morning with messages from my friend in Gaza saying F-16s were buzzing over his house all night and he had several bombs go off right beside him. His neighborhood is torn to pieces - what was left of it before hand that is.

You used the old "what the USA do if Mexico..." analogy, well I have a question for you.

What would the USA do if Mexico and Canada put a wall up around the USA and then denied them the necessities of life and called them terrorists or militants for fighting back?

This isn't just a physical war, it is a media war too meant to deceive the general population into accepting and justifying another massacre on Gaza.

When I see those little babies torn in half I know who the real terrorists are.

originally posted by: OpinionatedB
lol... God isn't behind any of this, and you know it.

Of course God isn't really behind this. But the people think He is. The Jews and the Muslims both think they own that land because they believe God gave it to them. And they both are wrong.

a reply to: FlyersFan

From what I can tell, the Muslims don't say "God gave me this land".

I believe that their beef is that 750,000 of their ancestors were displaced in 1948 and Israel has continuously stolen their land and mistreated them ever since while ignoring MANY resolutions including ones aimed at returning some of the families of these refugees who were displaced.

The Muslims are more than happy to share the land with the Jews and Christians as long as they are not confined into cages like zoo animals. Some equality would go a long way too...

It's Israel that wants a Jewish only state...they plan to push every single last Palestinian into the sea, many Israeli government officials have said this repeatedly.

originally posted by: Corruption Exposed
From what I can tell, the Muslims don't say "God gave me this land".

There have been muslims on ATS saying that God gave the land to the Hebrews via Abraham but that it was conditional. They say the Jews broke the conditions of the agreement/covenant with God and so the land goes to the next heir .... via the offspring of Hagar ... that would be Muslims.

originally posted by: Corruption Exposed
It's Israel that wants a Jewish only state...

Non Jewish Israels in Israel are treated fine.

But you are correct in that Israel wants all the land to be Israeli.
But the 'Palestinians' want all the land to be Palestinian as well.
The only real answer - a two state solution.
But neither side wants that. Not really.

A lot of people think that its wrong of Israel to defend itself. Think of it like our basic gun rights, if someone is shooting at you and you have a gun, wouldn't you shoot back? Or would you rather give up your arms and surrender? but this isn't a person to person situation, Its worse then that. The only reason rockets are being fired in the first place is because Israel is being provoked, and its definitely working.

a reply to: FlyersFan

Non Jewish Israels in Israel are treated fine.

With all due respect that is completely untrue.

Jews even fight among fellow Jews of different sects, and let's not forget their treatment of migrant workers. It's not nice to urinate on someone and tell them it's raining.

Does this look like they are treating the non jews "fine"?

"Death to the Arabs!"



Or how about bigotry against your fellow Christians?



Or how about their treatment of Africans?





You still going to sit there and tell me that non Jews in Israel are treated fine?

originally posted by: buster2010
So the Iron Dome intercepted 16 out of 85 rockets. Man we sure wasted our money on that POS didn't we.

Why do you think that? It only shoots down rockets that are going to hit a populated area. It is a very effective system.

originally posted by: Corruption Exposed
With all due respect that is completely untrue.

You are right ... let me rephrase. Non-jew citizens are given the same legal status as jews. That's what I mean. Sorry. I wasn't clear. 75% of Israel is Jewish. 25% is not.

originally posted by: Whatsreal
a reply to: Expat888

From the Oslo Accords (Sept. 1993) until September 2000 - nearly 300 Israelis were killed in attacks.

During the Palestinian Al-Aqsa Intifada (Sept. 2000 - Dec. 2005) another 1,100 Israelis were killed.

Since December 2005, Palestinian terrorist attacks have claimed at least another 135 Israeli lives.

This only covers the last 21 years. If you look up all the attacks from 1951 until today it would take a long time to get through a very depressing and bloody list of attacks. You can't really blame Israel for being upset and taking a heavy hand against these groups?

Do you think the USA would act any differently if we had the same issue with Meixco or Canada?
Would England not strike back if Irish terrorists started setting off bombs in cars and busses again?
How about China.. if Mongolia had hoards of terrorists attacking small villages or cities would they just ignore it?

Israel did NOT start attacking anyone first. This goes all the way back to 1951.... do a little homework and read up on the history of the situation instead of making stupid comments about a government engaging in mass murder.


As far as my own opinion about Israel/Palestine... I truly wish they would find a solution to the conflict which did not involve bombs and guns. I have many cousins who live in Israel and don't want to see them get hurt or worse. However, they can't seem to get their act together and the cycles of violence will continue.

Yaaaaaawnn..... spare me the propaganda junior .. spent two yeaes running a clinic in gaza putting people back together and burying the ones that didnt survive .. along with got a bullet in the shoulder while patching up an israeli soldier spending three months enjoying israeli "hospitality" after that ..
Know from experience what israelis are ..

Nothing justifies israels mass murder and crimes against humanity.

originally posted by: buster2010

originally posted by: FlyersFan
Well .. if Hamas would stop firing rockets at Israel, then Israel wouldn't have a reason to shoot back.

Well if Israel would stop stealing their land, mass arresting their people and forcing people out of their homes so more claim jumpers could move in Hamas wouldn't have a reason to shoot rockets at Israel. Not to mention even if Hamas didn't fire rockets Israel would arrange something themselves so they would have a reason to attack Gaza.

originally posted by: buster2010

originally posted by: FlyersFan

originally posted by: daaskapital
What i am trying to say, is that Israel is the root cause of these ongoing problems.

I respectfully disagree. I think both sides are seriously screwed up. Both sides are to blame. And if you rain down 300 rockets on a country that has bigger firepower than you, you are going to get nailed back and in a big way. Common sense says - don't do it. (common sense - something severely lacking in the middle east). I think Seagull said it best - ATS Thread - There Are No Angels

So the Palestinians were supposed to happy that half their nation was stolen from them and given to a bunch of people that had no ties with the land? There is absolutely no way that Israel is not the cause of all of this.

I support the Palestinians and their right to self determination. I am Jewish, and I think there are huge crimes committed against the Palestinian people by Israel. It is a huge mistake to whitewash the actions of Hamas, as if somehow the crimes committed by Israel justify indiscriminate launching of rockets into civilian areas. I am not alone amongst Jews in feeling this way - even in Israel there are Jewish people opposed to the actions of the government and military.



This is what Israel wants, so as to justify their own actions. A hostile Palestinian people railroaded by a terrorist organisation like Hamas gives Israel everything they want. There are plenty of Palestinian people opposed to Hamas, but they are lucky to have a voice at all - Hamas act in a dictatorial manner, and are quite unpopular among more modern Arab people in Palestine who may consider them not entirely dissimilar to ISIS. I have a close friend who was in the PLO, and he believes Hamas in fact receive covert funding from Israel, as a way of keeping the Palestinians divided as well as providing a convenient and immediate enemy.

Regardless of the Byzantine politics of Israel and Palestine, let's call a spade a spade, and stop trying to justify methods of terror. What do these indiscriminate rocket attacks actually achieve, other than more misery and death for those in Gaza? The Palestinian people achieve a lot more when they use politics in a by smart manner upon the world stage - this is what the Israeli government are afraid of of, as the Palestinians gain a lot of positive press, as they have a moral weight behind them. Firing a few rockets into Israel undoes all the hard work, and allows the Palestinians to be labelled terrorists. It doesn't seem so far out to imagine groups like Hamas and Al-Aqsa acting as convenient patsies to justify Israeli incursions into non-Israeli territory.

Those in the west who support the rights of the Palestinian people to self-determination need to stop saying 'they're only sending rockets because of Israel', as if this somehow makes it okay to randomly bomb and kill Israeli civilians. Play politics intelligently, do not justify terrorist attacks - it only serves to weaken one's arguments and the moral ground from which those arguments spring.

As long as nations define themselves based on religion, there will be conflict.

Religion causes disputes and war. The control-mechanism works better than the originators ever thought possible.

originally posted by: JohnTheSmith
I was wondering when they were going to take Gaza. Warmongering land-grabbers, who aid themselves with deceit and manipulation through propaganda. This is the 21st century, after all.

a reply to: Britguy
It appears that the Iron Dome has intercepted at least 5 rockets today.

The Israeli government will have to reoccupy Gaza permanently if they want to stop the rockets. Plenty of talk recently about the great error in leaving Gaza when Israel still under attack. One would expect the Israelis to suffer more casualties in taking over Gaza day in day out like they did in Lebanon in the 90's in comparison with putting up with rocket fire. Maybe they see 10 years down the line and better Gazan rockets hitting the (Tel Aviv) Bubble.

originally posted by: Britguy
No report on Israeli casualties from the Gazan rocket barrage?

How many Israelis were killed? How many Israelis were injured? How many Israelis were terrorised?

I thought that expensive Iron Dome system was supposed to shoot down all these rockets anyway. I wonder too what the infrastructure damage was from this rocket attack? How many homes damaged or destroyed, for example? They always seem to leave all this information out of report, simply saying rockets were fired.

Regardless of the human and property loss, I'm wondering how long you would tolerate incoming rockets raining down on your country's soil? How would your country react?

...and so the idiots are at it again.

The more things change, the more they stay the same.

Blood thirsty morons on both sides.


What exactly will be accomplished by this latest blood-letting? Other than people who shouldn't be dead, will be. On both sides.

I'd call it sickening, but that should go without saying.

a reply to: Expat888

Nothing justifies israels mass murder and crimes against humanity.

At least you admit your bias.