World first: Australian solar plant has generated “supercritical” steam that rivals fossil fuels

Hoorah for the Australians!

This is great news. Im surprised it hasnt been posted yet, at least not by this title.

Snip from Story:

A solar thermal test plant in Newcastle, Australia, has generated “supercritical” steam at a pressure of 23.5 mpa (3400 psi) and 570°C (1,058°F).

It is a short article, so one more little snip:

"Instead of relying on burning fossil fuels to produce supercritical steam, this breakthrough demonstrates that the power plants of the future could instead be using the free, zero emission energy of the sun to achieve the same result,” Dr Wonhas explained.

I wonder how many of these would need to be built to actually cover critical countries first, or I guess I should say the biggest polluting countries.

I dont think they can really put this cat back in the bag. It is pretty obvious that free energy can now be accomplished.

LINK TO ARTICLE

I dont think its really a world first. It seems to be a sensational headline to grab attention.

Here is an article from November 2012 on The Smithsonian.

Unlike photovoltaic technology, which converts solar radiation directly into electricity, the Ivanpah facility generates heat. More than 170,000 mirrors will gather tremendous amounts of sunlight and focus it on three towers filled with water, raising temperatures to more than 1,000 degrees Fahrenheit and producing steam that spins turbines that generate electricity. The Oakland-based company BrightSource Energy, which is overseeing construction by the Bechtel corporation, says that using sunlight instead of fossil fuels to power the turbines will reduce carbon emissions by more than 400,000 tons annually. The desert region—thanks to its elevation and clear, dry air—receives reliable sunlight 330 to 350 days per year.

The Smithsonian

This has been done and had some unintended consequences. It fries birds to death as they fly through the beams of intense heat reflected at the boiler towers.

BrightSource reported finding dozens of dead birds at the plant over the past several months, with some having singed or burned feathers, according to federal biologists and documents filed with the California Energy Commission, the Journal reported. State and federal regulators are currently conducting a two-year study of the Ivanpah plant's effects on birds.

FOX

Its a great idea to use the sun to boil water into steam to create electricity. I just don't get why they don't put some sort of mesh or grid around the facility. Surely that cant be that difficult or expensive. It would keep environmentalists off their behinds about the birds and other animals.

This is not free energy in any sense of the word. "Free Energy" breaks the laws of physics by creating energy, it is OVER 100% efficient and it puts out more energy than it takes in in essence creating new energy. It's impossible. This device captures energy from the sun, and is less than 100% efficient.

It is also not free in the sense that it does not cost anything. Manufacturing solar panels has a cost, you will pay for it. Cheaper is not free .. IF this is even cheaper, which there is no evidence from the story it is.

We also need a way to store excess energy from solar panels and currently there is no good solution. Otherwise cloudy/rainy days you have no power. Night time .. no power.

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

We also need a way to store excess energy from solar panels and currently there is no good solution. Otherwise cloudy/rainy days you have no power. Night time .. no power.

That's why they build these things in deserts. Almost year round energy production during daylight.

The CSIRO brought you extended wear contact lenses,advanced weather modelling,the first effective flu and hendra virus vaccines and most recently wireless LAN technology it runs on the smell of an oily rag compared to many other world science organisations.In the current budget we've bought 14 billion dollars worth of the F35 TURKEY but cut $111 million off the CSIRO making them cut 500 jobs and shut several sites Australia's leaders truly have the vision and foresight of a protozoan.

originally posted by: shaneslaughta

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04

We also need a way to store excess energy from solar panels and currently there is no good solution. Otherwise cloudy/rainy days you have no power. Night time .. no power.

That's why they build these things in deserts. Almost year round energy production during daylight.

Does not do anything at night. That is why we need batteries.

originally posted by: khnum
The CSIRO brought you extended wear contact lenses,advanced weather modelling,the first effective flu and hendra virus vaccines and most recently wireless LAN technology it runs on the smell of an oily rag compared to many other world science organisations.In the current budget we've bought 14 billion dollars worth of the F35 TURKEY but cut $111 million off the CSIRO making them cut 500 jobs and shut several sites Australia's leaders truly have the vision and foresight of a protozoan.

Many other countries like the UK have done the same.

a reply to: OccamsRazor04

Batteries are too high maintenance for storage of power on that level. Right now i cant say that i know of any battery tech that could serve in such a situation and make it cheap enough to do so.

Hopefully in the near future that could change.

I'm a fan cleaner energy production (as well as fossil fuels for the simple reason of their geological relevance. ) but I kinda doubt this will be providing energy to anyone anytime soon. The cost of the infrastructure, the land, the ability to store and transmit energy, the roads to the sites... It would probably be much cheaper to continue fossil fuel use for a good while... Let's be realistic here, does anyone believe that we'd switch from oil'n'gas/coal to solar energy (in this form heat, which would still be needed to turn a turbine to generate electricity, which wouldn't be useable in transportation without an overhaul to the gasoline pump stations/relevant infrastructure in place...) without needing to?

I'm not a pessimist... I'm just a saddened realist when it comes to energy. : /

dumb question, what do they use at night?

It wouldn't work well up here, but it would work in the southern part of the country. There were frost warnings here on the night of the third. Snow would cover the mirrors here for four months making it impossible to create energy. Not cost effective around here I feel


Makes me think of that guy who made a device to boil water using sound. It would be a lot cheaper and the electricity to make the sound could be a lot less than the electricity created. You would also have to excite the steam though.

originally posted by: shaneslaughta
a reply to: OccamsRazor04

Batteries are too high maintenance for storage of power on that level. Right now i cant say that i know of any battery tech that could serve in such a situation and make it cheap enough to do so.

Hopefully in the near future that could change.

Yes there are some new technologies that show promise. Hopefully in 10 years we have something.

this is terrible news. if we trap all the suns light in one place, then it will get colder. and we will be in darkness a lot.

Why do they have to ruin everything. Sunlight should be for everyone, they shouldnt steal it all in deserts.

And as for at night, the sun still shines you know. it's not turning off. Maybe if they build these things in space then we wont have climate freezing due to them hogging all the sunlight and it can be powered constantly. Mars and Venus dont need the sun anyway.

a reply to: sn0rch

I can only hope that was a failed attempt at satire?

Well I think this is another good step towards renewable energy production.
As others have pointed out, this technology is only good during daylight hours, but the big picture is that developing countries such as India and China could reduce their carbon footprint significantly. There is no single cure for our fossil fuel reliance, lizard men aliens will not come down in a space ship and teach us about exotic power sources. It will take a number of different technologies to fully replace fossil fuels, this is one more tool in the shed.

a reply to: shaneslaughta

Molten Salt. Technology has been around since the early 60's at least. Developed at the University of Arizona.

I understand there is a big plant going up in Arizona right now that will use molten salt for heat storage to use during the night.

Edit: not going up. Running. Powering Arizona homes right now. : Solana Generating Station

originally posted by: rnaa
a reply to: shaneslaughta

Molten Salt. Technology has been around since the early 60's at least. Developed at the University of Arizona.

I understand there is a big plant going up in Arizona right now that will use molten salt for heat storage to use during the night.

Edit: not going up. Running. Powering Arizona homes right now. : Solana Generating Station

Molten salt technology was used at solar two near Barstow calif. but it was just a test plant.
Solar Two had sufficient capacity to continue running for up to three hours after the sun had set.
en.wikipedia.org...

a reply to: hounddoghowlie

dumb question, what do they use at night?

If you use the steam to spin a massive flywheel during the day, you can use the flywheel at night to generate power.

Not that hard to do.

You can also use the heat generated to heat specific types of salts and use the stored heat at night to generate power.

There are reliable solutions that would cover the majority of you power needs.

P

originally posted by: sn0rch
this is terrible news. if we trap all the suns light in one place, then it will get colder. and we will be in darkness a lot.

Why do they have to ruin everything. Sunlight should be for everyone, they shouldnt steal it all in deserts.

And as for at night, the sun still shines you know. it's not turning off. Maybe if they build these things in space then we wont have climate freezing due to them hogging all the sunlight and it can be powered constantly. Mars and Venus dont need the sun anyway.

I have no words...



Regardless, I really believe that eventually we will see a greater implementation of off-shore tidal activated hydro-electric facilities. the acquiescence (or abject surrendering to) wind-driven turbines, solar arrays on every square inch of rooftop and, liquid salt powered sunlight powered facilities and (fingers crossed) Thorium based nuclear power plants to satiate the globes insatiable thirst for electricity.

I also expect to see my electric bill increase at least 100% in my lifetime, if not more. But that pales in comparison to what I expect my water bill to be

originally posted by: OccamsRazor04
It is also not free in the sense that it does not cost anything. Manufacturing solar panels has a cost, you will pay for it. Cheaper is not free .. IF this is even cheaper, which there is no evidence from the story it is.

We also need a way to store excess energy from solar panels and currently there is no good solution. Otherwise cloudy/rainy days you have no power. Night time .. no power.

There are advantages to this setup. For one, it is sustainable and does not require additional fuel - so only start-up and repair costs. As for the night time energy, there are capacitors or batteries that can store excess electricity from the day to use at night.

On another note, this is an entirely feasible power plant design. As another poster said, the energy comes from the sun and the power plant is not 100% + efficient.