The Christian right seeks cultural and political domination

a reply to: BuzzyWigs
Buzzy. Like you I was gobsmacked. In my youth(I to am past child bearing years) I was attracted to a rightwing charismatic group which, as my eyes opened and I managed to pull free of it's influence, allowed me to see the beginnings of that organized movement for domination of the American political and cultural scene. It is as real as you have now come to understand. At this time, my one great hope is that these people people keep getting sucked in by the likes of the promoters in the list you mentioned.

For a long while, I held to that great liberal falsehood that what was needed was for the information to be presented to the people and that with that information these people could also free themselves from the constraints of conservative memes, just as I had. Now, generally, I no longer hold this to be true. In specific cases yes but in general,no, as the responses to your expose would indicate.

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

NOT AT ALL.

It has to do with evidence and logic . . . and perhaps probabilities.

However, I have 0.000000% confidence in my ability to help you see that.

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
a reply to: NavyDoc

The article itself made mention of Hobby Lobby. I included that quip. I also said that recently around here there had been an uproar about Hobby Lobby. THE THREAD was not about Hobby Lobby - it's been done to death.

Nor is it about gays or birth control or the tax codes. NONE of those things.

It is about a VERY REAL and increasingly powerful once-fringe group of Evangelical Bible-Thumpers who want to take over all aspects of our society.

WHY does no one get that??!!!!!

I suppose it's the title (which I DID NOT COMPOSE).


I do want to apologize to Xtrozero, however, because the "byline" of the article on Global Possibilities was NOT, in fact the author. It was the person who posted it. The article WAS written by CJ Werleman, and yes, he is very much anti-religion.

ahhhh yessssss, we are all behind the westboro baptist church.

all 25 of them.

a reply to: AfterInfinity

The OP contends that the Evangelical "Christian" "extreme" "right" is gerry manding and whatever other strategy they can get away with

FORCING a "Christian Government" on the USA.

I contend that the globalist oligarchy essentially that's been running the world for more than 100 years under the table--particularly the Western world but essentially even the Communist world . . . They put the Communists in power in Russia. They put Hitler in power. They put Mao in power . . . all of this is extremely verified . . . some by Congressional study . . .

I contend that the globalist oligarchy is working hard to do what was predicted 2,000 years ago--fairly precisely--to set-up a one world government--THE NWO--spoken of by so many including the Bush's . . . who's great granddaddy, I think it was--Granddad or Great granddad--funded Hitler early on and insured his success . . . The same cluster of global elite have been working hard to set up

--a one world government
and
--a one world theocracy wherein every citizen would be required to literally worship satan--just as predicted 2,000 years ago for the same era in which Israel became a nation again in a day--as it did in 1948.

That, essentially, the blokes running the world still somewhat covertly but increasingly overtly--THOSE BLOKES ARE setting up a theocracy but it is THE OPPOSITE of what the OP fears from the "Christian right."

And the same folks will be exterminating, murdering all on the "Christian right" they can get their genocidal hands on.

That much has been verified repeatedly in their own words and their own documents--authentic documents. Even some of my list of quotes point to that.

My point mainly being that the OP has FAR MORE TO FEAR from the globalists about a theocracy than from the "Christian right."
.

originally posted by: NavyDoc

I never saw Christ advocate for the government to force redistribution of wealth nor did he advocate a person taking from one person to give to another. He advocated individual giving and voluntary charity, both at odds with socialism and communism.

ABSOLUTELY INDEED.

I presume for a number of reasons:

1. Giving which is not voluntary has no redemptive spiritual value enhancing one's relationship with fellow man nor with God, the Father.

2. Giving which is not voluntary tends to be
--mercenary,
--cold,
--sterile,
--klunky,
--unfitting,
--one-size-fits-all
--resented on both sides,
--counter-productive as often as not;
--coarse
--insensitive
--carry a huge overhead cost
--easily corrupted
--have a bloated bureaucracy to administer it
--become endemic, entrenched, bondage
--thievery
. . .
. . .

originally posted by: ketsuko
a reply to: BuzzyWigs

Yes, and Obama's most important legislation - Obamacare - is fascist bill. Fascism is where the government controls the private businesses so tightly through regulation or other means that they might as well be government controlled. The means of "saving" the auto industry also saw government taking ownership stakes in two of the big three with union labor getting significant ownership stakes also. So, BUSINESS as tightly controlled by the state is a very big part of this administration. Are you contending that this administration is really a RIGHT WING THEOCRATIC one?

It was the insurance companies and private hospitals that were telling the government what to put in the Obamacare bill (compulsory health insurance to "bring the costs down"). Everyone was trying to double-cross everyone else.
Doctors thought they would get higher fees - they were blocked out.
Health insurance companies thought they could charge higher rates - they got blocked out too.
Customers thought they would get more free stuff - they end up paying more.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs


theres a book out called "The Family: The Secret Fundamentalism at the Heart of American Power" by jeff sharlet that exposes this very thing. it traces and shows how the christian dominionists have infiltrated politics in a coordinated effort. many in congress rent rooms in the c street house, which is owned by the dominionists.

their greatest success has been uganda, where being gay is a death sentence and knowing but not reporting gays gets you locked up in prison.

as for corporate theocracy, i disagree. from what ive seen, corporations are amoral. the only care about the buck. some of the family owned or religious owned corps might bring their religion into play, but all the big boy corps just want the buck. they run sweat shops in third world countries to save and make a buck. the would gladly do it here if they could.

originally posted by: AfterInfinity

originally posted by: BO XIAN
I lost track of the bloke asking about the definition of "oligarchy"

Here's a common one:

www.thefreedictionary.com...

ol·i·gar·chy (l-gärk, l-)
n. pl. ol·i·gar·chies
1.
a. Government by a few, especially by a small faction of persons or families.
b. Those making up such a government.
2. A state governed by a few persons.

It has taken on the flavors, also of . . . ill-gotten or unfairly gotten or corruptly gotten !control!, leadership by a few.

It could be argued that any government which includes congress and the senate and a cabinet could be considered an oligarchy. I'm not sure what exactly you're trying to criticize or why...

i am pretty sure he is talking of the likes og Goldman Sachs, the owners of the federal reserve, etc.. you know, those that actually own everything now. You honestly do not think the likes of Nancy (how do we know whats in the aca till we pass it o we can read it) Pelosi is in charge?

a reply to: stormson

theres a book out called "The Family: The Secret Fundamentalism at the Heart of American Power" by jeff sharlet that exposes this very thing.

As a foreigner I can assure youit is not just the 'christian' far right that shocks me. Its also your crazy liberals. You never seem to discuss things with each other anymore, just insults.

I see my country going the same way.

Just blaming the right wing in the US is incredinly naive.

Obama is AS BAD as Bush was. That, I think is the opinion of most foreigners here at least.

originally posted by: ~Lucidity
I know you're not saying that without religion there are no morals, right? Morals do not come from religion. Religion is not what gives someone morals. They come from within a person or society, as part of the foundation of a person or society.

What I'm saying is morals are a learned trait. We have an evolutionary trait to protect the pack, but I think many mistake individual morals for society morals and they are totally different. Many of you that have zero religious beliefs say " I'm a good person" and so you do not need religion to set your moral compass, and this is most likely true. The problem is what do we have to establish society morals, Kant? I have given examples of society morals that go extremely astray, so what is it that we fall back on to reset that compass? Please enlighten me.

You, I will protect the pack but how do we expand that over others not in the pack? You talk about foundation, so just what is that foundation?

basic fundamentals that all humans share in common already, the more base level on which all can relate and what we all have to live within the bounds of.

This is a pipe dream and I can show you that the vast majority of the world does not adhere to. I travel all over and have most of my life, there is no moral compass that isn't shattered easily as morals become horrent behaviors.

Choose religion if you want or need to, However, be aware that it is not the alpha and omega to everyone. That alone is reason enough to disqualify it from the common ground and common good. When it becomes an excuse for hate or an otherwise polarizing agent is where we have our issues and even our wars, or excuses for them.

What establishes "the common good"? Religion doesn't hate, but people do and always will. The basic teachings of Jesus has no hate, so why are there Christians that hate?

The world could do just fine without religion, or with religions that just follow their own beliefs and not try to impose them on others and stay out of those things we ALL have in common in society.

Really? Once again I have given examples of man's greatest evils and religion had nothing to do with them.

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
And meanwhile, it's okay for them to pay people sub-par wages while the taxpayers pull up the slack, which they then bitch about. If they paid a living wage, those people would not NEED government assistance. It's known as Corporate Welfare. And it, too, is very real.

Should every job be a living wage? Should I become a shelf stocker and plan on raising a family on my wage? What you suggest is all wages should be a solo living wage, and the rest of the world does work that way, why should we? When you look to most of the world the family as a whole creates a living wage for the FAMILY. In America we expect everyone to get any job no matter what and expect that person so be able to live on their own...Really?

At some point one needs to look at a job and ask themselves what is that job worth, and then strive to do better throughout their entire life. If you are pumping gas at the age of 17 and are still pimping gas at the age of 30 you have failed in life, and complaining that that job should provide a living wage doesn't take away that failure to succeed. Also lets say you are a single mom of 2 and you do not make enough money...who fault is that, Wal-Mart?

a reply to: Xtrozero

should every job be a living wage?

yes. if you are single and work 40 hrs, you should make enough to rent an apartment, buy food, and pay for a used car. the nature of your job is irrelevant. work is work. knowing how to assemble a burger is no different than assembling a car, except for the power tools. another example, why do you pay your yard guy far more then your neighbors kid to cut your lawn? same job, but you think you can rip the neighbors kid off.

to say otherwise opens you up to substandard pay. why pay you a living wage when i can get a firm in india to do it? remember, all the perks you get at work are because of unions. "but we dont need unions anymore because of fair labor laws". yet corps are spending millions on lobbyists to get rid of those laws. not to mention that if a corp would ever give you what you deserve out of good will, they wouldnt have sweatshops in asia.

better yet, why get a job at all if it wont pay me enough to live? why try? carrot on the stick. if i make enough for a simple apt and food, i know i can do better and will work for that. if not, why even bother? i get more from the gov. and if i dont get it from the gov, well ill just take it from you.

welfare isnt to help the poor, but to protect the rich.

originally posted by: Xtrozero

originally posted by: BuzzyWigs
And meanwhile, it's okay for them to pay people sub-par wages while the taxpayers pull up the slack, which they then bitch about. If they paid a living wage, those people would not NEED government assistance. It's known as Corporate Welfare. And it, too, is very real.

Should every job be a living wage? Should I become a shelf stocker and plan on raising a family on my wage? What you suggest is all wages should be a solo living wage, and the rest of the world does work that way, why should we? When you look to most of the world the family as a whole creates a living wage for the FAMILY. In America we expect everyone to get any job no matter what and expect that person so be able to live on their own...Really?

At some point one needs to look at a job and ask themselves what is that job worth, and then strive to do better throughout their entire life. If you are pumping gas at the age of 17 and are still pimping gas at the age of 30 you have failed in life, and complaining that that job should provide a living wage doesn't take away that failure to succeed. Also lets say you are a single mom of 2 and you do not make enough money...who fault is that, Wal-Mart?

These jobs that you're talking about are very common jobs in the U.S. some of the most common in fact. Positions such as cashiers, fast-food workers, waiters, and salesmen make up a large sum of jobs. Not everyone can be in a very high paying job due to the simple fact that there are very, very few high paying jobs around. There simply isn't enough room for everyone. Not everyone can be a CEO, doctor, or high ranking government official. Take a look at the income inequality in this country right now. Even people who are so-called middle class are struggling.

www.usatoday.com...

I have a hard time stomaching that some corporate CEO's and other board members pocket something like 300x more than their AVERAGE worker. How in the world can someone work that much harder? It makes no sense. It's all just greed. A company who doesn't want to give their workers descent wages or benefits obviously don't care about their workers. They only care for themselves. It's the average workers who actually keeps the company moving. Their the worker bees doing all the work while they take orders from the top.

Work is work at the end of the day. Sure, some jobs are obviously more demanding and more difficult, but with the amount of money some of these companies make, compared to how much their willing to pay their average workers, absolutely disgusts me.

a reply to: Xtrozero

In many of those other countries they might have some chickens and a cow in their back yard!
Our gov't won't let me have a cow! Or a rooster for that matter! I can have a few hens!!!
Would you mind having a few roosters crowing every morning in your neighbor's yard? How about a few cows escaping from their pen and trampling down your pretty flower bed?? Mind if I don't mow my lawn for the next few weeks my lawn mower is just as hungry as I am and I can only feed one of us!


Our gov't is rather broke! Matter of fact it is beyond broke and entered the realm of bankrupt! The welfare is not gonna last forever!
Do you want people to stock your store and ring up your items? Do you want them producing your goods?
Printing your sales signs? Growing your food? Think the military wants to keep having the gaskets for their planes delivered when needed??? Do you want your kids to have someone doing these things also?
Do you want an educated generation for the future? Do you want a future generation at all! Or should we just pull our kids out of school and put them to work so the family can survive? When the welfare check goes many of these workers are going to need an alternative income source. What do you suggest they do?? Get another job??? We have how many people out of the job force now. We don't have enough to make a second job a necessity for them!

Some of our kids are close to 30 and still living with mom and dad because they can't make enough to do anything else. Instead of the parents scaling back on their spending and saving for their retirement they have been ripped off of their savings and are still having to partially support their grown children! And I am sorry but it is good for a young adult's development to be on their own!!! It's a learning experience that they shouldn't be deprived of.

Homeless, hungry and sick workers are not going to be working for long! And there's many employers who now think that having a phone number to contact their employees at a whim is their right!! They also think that they should be able to demand a doctor's note for every sick day!!! You need an address to get a license. You need it to get a bank account. And frankly you need to have your correct address filed at the post office to get a PO Box! I think it's a law. They want to know where to find you if they want!!!

So yes every job in this country that requires full time hours should be paying a living wage!!!
And just off the top of my head here is some of the positions I have run across that weren't back in the 90's. There are probably more now that the economy has been screwed up more.
Printers
People who work in plastic factories.
Clerical Workers
Resturant Managers (not just McDonalds and the like but also some of the classier places)
Gasket manufacturers
School bus drivers
The people who make and package your perfume!

And well it's early and my brain is sleeping still. Maybe someone else can add to the list! But
I have either worked in these fields and not made enough that I wouldn't have qualified for some sort of gov't benefit if I was on my own with no other income or I personally knew someone who did!

I would like to add though.
There is an alternative to increasing the wages. That would be reducing the cost of the necessities of life! When a rat invested 4 brm apt is being hud subsidized for a thousand dollars and there is no wage earner that would rent it if they had to if they could afford it there is something wrong with that picture also!
Instead of raising rents we could
reduce rents
reduce the cost of food
reduce the cost of transportation
reduce the cost of child care
reduce the cost of food
reduce the cost of clothing
reduce taxes!!!!!
and well I am sure you get the idea

You could at one time live in mild comfort on a minimum wage job I know because I did it!

originally posted by: BO XIAN
It has to do with evidence and logic . . .

Exactly. The evidence is world population is growing and had been growing exponentially. Logic then dictates that there is no apocalypse depopulation doom porn agenda.

originally posted by: stormson
knowing how to assemble a burger is no different than assembling a car, except for the power tools.

While I think that some UAW members are overpaid there is no comparison between someone who slaps burgers together and someone who assembles automobiles. One can look like it came out of the Whammy Burger and the other requires tight tolerances and fit.

a reply to: BuzzyWigs
OP...you are nothing but another lying progressive trying to make demons of everyone that is not you or of your mind-set. IF...and that is a big IF...anyone is attacking because of your views, maybe it's the WHITE, RELIGIOUS, GUN OWNERS you have been trying to defeat for so many years. And IF that is true...you reap what you sow. Enjoy the revolution from the real Americans.

I am an animal husbandman. There is something going on that is relevant here. Gmo corn is causing animals to go sterile, completely 100% sterile in 3 generations. I dont feed corn and i dont eat corn any more. We see generations in animals quicker than in people. The world is outlawing gmo, our reps are making it illegal not to grow it and we have laws protecting them from labeling gmo's. There are slow kill methods in progress. I see your arg with bo like this. Bo says we are going off aroof 100 stories high and we are in freefall. He is concerned about the last few feet before we hit the ground. You see it uneventful because after 99 stories everything is still fine and there is still no blood to clean up. The failure for the aca to actually insure someone is putting all the sick and elderly in death spirals without getting any care. They have been thrown off the roof. Most have not landed yet and are in freefall. I agree with Bo. Depop programs are in motion. The health pandemic in motion as illegals from border crossings are bringing disease to america and the vaccination program is allready in place. They are vaccinated hogs across this country right now. All the pigs are dying after being vaccinated. They call deaths from the vaccines...swine flu. What disease will we have after we become vaccinated? It's a plan in motion. And if you want real doom porn. Those cell towers everywhere. One of the biggest crimes going is that they never let science print anything about microwaves except it makes heat. They literaly have a kill switch in place that will make the cells in your body a potpouri. My opinion, get your house in order, we are screwed. It is in motion.a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

a reply to: manna2
Correct me if I am wrong but Obamacare is only in the United States. How does that effect India, China, Indonesia, Africa, etc? The world's population continues to grow, the so-called New World Order has failed in my opinion if their goal was to depopulate the planet.