originally posted by: pl3bscheese
a reply to: BO XIAN
Then we're on the same page.
Not exactly my most common experience on ATS. LOL.
I don't, however, think that scientific insight can happen outside of experiential, and phenomenological intuition to boot.
And what is it about such a BASIC, SOLID FACT . . . that seems to terminally escape otherwise bright folks???
So many of the RELIGION OF SCIENTISM seem to just not realize that their
APPREHENSION, GRASPING, UNDERSTANDING
is ABSOLUTELY DEPENDENT on their PHENOMENOLOGICAL EXPERIENCE
of whatever it is that is being considered.
Physicists have conclusively demonstrated that life is incredibly complex . . . that solid objects are not really solid, at all . . . that stationary
objects are in constant motion . . .
Physicists have demonstrated that there's TONS OF UNCERTAINTY in the MOST BASIC of physical properties . . . at the most foundational levels.
And yet, the RELIGION OF SCIENTISM pontificators hereon blather about AS THOUGH
THEIR PARTICULAR, VERY PERSONAL, VERY PHENOMENOLOGICALLY APPREHENDED; THEIR VERY PHENOMENOLOGICALLY PERCEIVED 'micrometer'
were measuring something pristine, solid, TRULY TRUEST TRUE IN THE TRULY TRUEST TRUE SENSE--STATIC, UNALTERABLY AND INDEPENDENTLY
TRUE--FAR MORE TRUE THAN ANY "Christian" "nonsense."
While IN FACT, all they are doing IS VERY SUBJECTIVELY "measuring"
--something that was in motion
--something colored by THEIR particular history and perceptive capacities
AS WELL AS BY THEIR particular emphases of various DIFFERENT components of the phenomenon AND of various DIFFERENT aspects of the process of
measurement and of perceiving said measurement.
. . . AND that their INTERPRETATION of said PERCEPTIONS of said "SCIENTIFIC"
"MEASUREMENT" is also particularly colored (distorted, mangled, altered)
particular preferences, needs, motivations, biases etc. etc. etc.
Yet, they insist on blathering on AS THOUGH ALL the above "scientific" findings are a single fact oriented unalterable dogmatic truth
founded on an unmovable rock of the foundation of the RELIGION OF SCIENTISM.
What a farce. What nonsense.
They live in an illusion that makes the Heisenberg uncertainty principle look like a 100% certain law 100% predictable and boring in all respects on
all occasions to all degrees.
They then FAIL UTTERLY TO SEE--that the above compulsion is A RELIGIOUS DOGMA every bit as implemented by RELIGIOUS FORCES, EMOTIONS AND SENSIBILITIES
as any Pentecostal prayer service might be.
It's just their dogma that the above is not true.
It's just their dogma that their BELIEFS are somehow sterile time + chance TRUTH, independent of RELIGIOUS sensibilities and forces.
It's just their dogma that consciousness can't exist beyond presumably finite bio-chemical and electrical puppetized noises in their brains.
I say "puppetized" because it is their DOGMA
THAT EVERYTHING THEY ARE AND EVERYTHING THEY DO is merely a product of absolutely !CONTROLLING! impersonal chance plus time--with no other foundation
That is, that their CHANCE ENVIRONMENT 100% TOTALLY DICTATES who they are and what they think and do. They are totally very SLAVISH puppets of their
environments IF their dogma is true.
Globalist B.F. Skinner's BEYOND FREEDOM AND DIGNITY makes this somewhat clear--though he's also grossly hypocritical in these regards.
they have ABSOLUTELY NO CAPACITY TO LIVE THAT WAY--
THEY HAVE ABSOLUTELY NO CAPACITY TO LIVE AS THOUGH EVERYTHING THEY ARE AND EVERYTHING THEY DO IS UTTERLY MEANINGLESS built totally and only on
impersonal chance plus time.
THEY HAVE ABSOLUTELY NO CAPACITY TO LIVE consistent with the dogmatic values and implications of the RELIGION OF SCIENTISM.
They COMPULSIVELY MUST PRETEND
that their values and their choices and their actions
= = = = =
YET, they CANNOT tolerate the whole idea that there even might be some PERSONAL AUTHORITY
beyond their silly religion of scientism
that just might have a JUST and well grounded, authentic claim on their lives . . . and the right and authority to require of them one set of values
and behaviors vs a different set of values and behaviors.
= = = = =
THEREFORE, some of them are salivating at the whole idea, the whole fantasy that turning off EVIDENCE of consciousness proves that the
individual is merely a time + chance machine with no consciousness beyond the electrical connections in their brains.
The problem seems to be with the minions within the sciences who don't really comprehend what the discoverers gleamed at.
That would be 100% or near 100% of all the super reductionists, super 'naturalists' super 'rationalists' concerned.
Discovery is . . . as you say so well . . . a function and process of insightful "intuition."
. . . WITHOUT . . . any discussion of where the intuition comes from.
They DON'T DARE GO THERE. They can't really do it logically but yet again, they pretend that even intuition is merely a product of chance plus time
and particularly chance firings of neurons in their brains. What nonsense.
They don't really know or understand what's in "the black box."
Yet they can't tolerate the idea that something or SomeOne outside the black box has a dialogical connection with something unknown within the black
So the idea that they can turn all THAT stuff off with a newly found switch has them giddily dancing in the streets and on the graves
of any who held forth about the realities of that Other beyond their black boxes.
While, actually, as far as I understand the research so far . . . all they've found is another way to turn off awareness or the reporting out of
awareness from the black box.
They've found a new light switch. But the light bulb is still there. The electrical power to light the bulb is still there.
But we must not confuse them with facts. It causes them tooooo much existential angst and frothing at the fingers while smoke spews out their ears.
So it seems that, although we differ on some specifics, we in general agree.
Evidently so . . . though I'm not sure how much of the above you'd agree with! LOL.
edit on 5/7/2014 by BO XIAN because: typo
edit on 5/7/2014 by BO XIAN because: clarity
edit on 5/7/2014 by BO
XIAN because: clarity
edit on 5/7/2014 by BO XIAN because: clarity