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"Hot Coffee"

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posted on Jul, 3 2014 @ 02:21 AM
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I watched this HBO documentary a couple days ago. Its an older documentary so some of you have probably seen it .

Its about tort reform and how we are manipulated by the TPTB through the MSM.

Its starts out with the story of Stella Liebeck the woman who burned herself with a cup of hot coffee at McDonald's then sued and won.

This happened in 1992 so I was 21 at the time and I remember the story and what I thought back then.

I remember thinking OMG of course the coffee was hot its coffee, and how could she win a lawsuit for spilling coffee on herself.

After watching this I realize that is exactly what they wanted me to think and I was manipulated.

Its a great documentary and a real eye opener if you have the time .





posted on Jul, 3 2014 @ 02:26 AM
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I shared the same opinion of the situation that you did until I watched the same documentary. I was always one who thought that it was beyond stupid, and extremely litigious for someone to expect a huge settlement simply because they can't drink coffee like an adult.

That viewpoint did a 180 when I saw this documentary. I was astonished, horrified, and ashamed all at the same time. I was DEAD wrong to have ASSumed so much.

It's not only enlightening because of that incident, it is a good way to learn about Tort Reform.

S&F for the share and if anyone is wondering if it's worth the time??? Absolutely.


edit on 7/3/2014 by Kangaruex4Ewe because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 3 2014 @ 02:29 AM
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originally posted by: alienjuggalo
Its about...how we are manipulated by the TPTB through the MSM.


You bet your a$$ we are.

Operation Mockingbird

If they were thinking about doing it back in the 1950's, they've definitely got their feet in a few doors by now.

Can't wait to watch the vid.
edit on 7/3/2014 by scojak because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 3 2014 @ 02:29 AM
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It's an excellent documentary. Things are usually different than they seem to be at the first glance. We shouldn't make judgments so quickly.



posted on Jul, 3 2014 @ 02:33 AM
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Anyone who sees the burns the lady suffered from the cup of coffee should do a rethink of the entire incident. I know I did..I know I certainly do not place any coffee cups between my legs while driving anymore and I wait fifteen minutes before even trying to drink the stuff...



posted on Jul, 3 2014 @ 02:35 AM
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originally posted by: totallackey
Anyone who sees the burns the lady suffered from the cup of coffee should do a rethink of the entire incident. I know I did..I know I certainly do not place any coffee cups between my legs while driving anymore and I wait fifteen minutes before even trying to drink the stuff...


Thats the thing she wasn't even driving and they just wanted us to believe she was, and I did.



posted on Jul, 3 2014 @ 02:40 AM
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a reply to: Kangaruex4Ewe

The first comment on the video says it all about how well the manipulation works.



This is madness, I don't care how bad she got burned, it was her own fault for spilling it in her lap. If I bought a coffee and it wasn't hot I would want my money back.







edit on 3-7-2014 by alienjuggalo because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 3 2014 @ 03:05 AM
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Interesting documentary.

The most shocking thing I learned from this, is that Jr. Bush actually knows how to pronounce the word "frivolous" without tripping up.

As for that coffee. The burns were horrible, yes I agree. But I don't actually agree McDonalds (as much as I hate them) should have had to pay for an accident someone else made. At the same time though, I think there should have been an obligation for McDonalds to have the temperatures listed somewhere so customers don't confuse really hot with scalding.

Ofc, the documentary wasn't a debate over fair vs unfair lawsuits.

As many here at ATS already know it isn't only the MSM that manipulates!

-Spoiler Alert-
I recently watched "Unthinkable". A film about a domestic terrorist being held and tortured by "H" (Samuel L. Jackson). Jackson's character is trying to find out where three nuclear bombs are hidden by breaking the guys will. Another main character is against the way they have suspended the terrorist's right of habeas corpus and the unethical way they are treating him. They cite back to her NDAA and such. Basically the movie is putting the question in your head, "how far are you willing to go for your country?" The fact that she ultimately refuses Jackson's character wish of torturing the terrorist's kids in front of him, which results in one of the nuclear bombs going off, imo, tells you what way they want your opinion to swing. Ammmerriga.

Anyway, here's another documentary I found interesting. It's somewhat along the same lines. That being, manipulation of the masses via the MSM etc. for ulterior motives. This one about the Tea Party and grassroots movements.

edit on 3-7-2014 by WakeUpBeer because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 3 2014 @ 03:10 AM
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a reply to: alienjuggalo

Could you recap; what made you (all) change your mind?

I just know the headlines - woman buys coffee, spills it herself, get burned, sues, wins.



posted on Jul, 3 2014 @ 03:30 AM
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I am ten minutes in, and the description from the relatives goes like this:

Coffee is bought at a drive-through, the car is stopped a few seconds later and the lady places the cup between her legs and removes the lid. And spills. And get burned.


I cannot for the life of me see how that can be McDonald's responsibility.

Too hot? Coffee is brewed just a tad below boiling point if you care for quality, and traditionally you have poured boiling water on the coffee. Either way, unless McDonald's have found a way to raise the boiling point of water, the claim that the coffee is too hot is ridiculous. Only a couple of seconds has passed since it has been brewed, mind you, so it should be almost at boiling temperature.


I really do not get it!



posted on Jul, 3 2014 @ 03:35 AM
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a reply to: alienjuggalo

When I make a cup of tea or instant coffee )yeah I know, instant), I use BOILING water out of the kettle.

I therefore understand that if I order a hot drink it could be any temperature up to and including 100°C, 212°F, and treat it accordingly. I don't see what is in any way negligent about serving a hot drink at near boiling point.

In my house, that's what temperature hot drinks ARE, and that is why my two-year-old has had it drilled into her that she does not touch mummy and daddy's tea mugs, EVER.

She knows the rule. Surely a McDonald's customer should treat boiling hot liquids with the same respect.

The only "manipulation" being done is the world's lawyers trying to absolve everybody on the planet of personal responsibility.



posted on Jul, 3 2014 @ 03:45 AM
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a reply to: Rob48

I absolutely had the same opinion as you before I watched this. You might change your opinion if you watch the documentary.

Maybe it is because I am old enough to remember the story as it was happening and everything I remember knowing about the case was wrong.



posted on Jul, 3 2014 @ 03:51 AM
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a reply to: DupontDeux

Their coffee was way to hot


McDonalds coffee was not only hot, it was scalding -- capable of almost instantaneous destruction of skin, flesh and muscle

McDonalds also said during discovery that, based on a consultants advice, it held its coffee at between 180 and 190 degrees fahrenheit to maintain optimum taste. He admitted that he had not evaluated the safety ramifications at this temperature. Other establishments sell coffee at substantially lower temperatures, and coffee served at home is generally 135 to 140 degrees


www.lectlaw.com...


edit on 3-7-2014 by alienjuggalo because: (no reason given)

edit on 3-7-2014 by alienjuggalo because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 3 2014 @ 03:52 AM
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If I slip on the ice in a skating rink and crack the back of my skull, can I sue the rink owners? Regardless of how her story was spun etc. it doesn't change the fact/common knowledge that hot coffee is hot!

We shouldn't make our opinions on whether or not her case judged fairly the topic of this thread though (yeah I realize I stated my opinion on it already). I don't think that was the OP intent. The intent was to talk about MSM manipulation!
edit on 3-7-2014 by WakeUpBeer because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 3 2014 @ 03:54 AM
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originally posted by: WakeUpBeer
If I slip on the ice in a skating rink and crack the back of my skull, can I sue the rink owners?

Regardless of how her story was spun etc. it doesn't change the fact/common knowledge that hot coffee is hot!

We shouldn't make our opinions on whether or not her case judged fairly the topic of this thread though (yeah I realize I stated my opinion on it already). I don't think that was the OP intent. The intent was to talk about MSM manipulation!


not that hot. capable of instant destruction to flesh is too hot to drink.
edit on 3-7-2014 by alienjuggalo because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 3 2014 @ 04:02 AM
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a reply to: alienjuggalo


To hot?
Really?

Do you know why coffee is served at 135-140 degrees at other establishments? To avoid frivolous lawsuits!

It was freshly brewed coffee. Pretty much anything below 212 degrees Fahrenheit is just fine for coffee and tea, but really, if you much get below 180 degrees your "hot coffee" is bordering on lukewarm.



But I still do not get, what changed your mind. The claim has always been that the coffee was too hot.



posted on Jul, 3 2014 @ 04:04 AM
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originally posted by: alienjuggalo
capable of instant destruction to flesh is too hot to drink.


Only Duncan Hills sells coffee that hot.
edit on 3-7-2014 by WakeUpBeer because: (no reason given)



posted on Jul, 3 2014 @ 04:06 AM
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originally posted by: DupontDeux
a reply to: alienjuggalo


To hot?
Really?

Do you know why coffee is served at 135-140 degrees at other establishments? To avoid frivolous lawsuits!

It was freshly brewed coffee. Pretty much anything below 212 degrees Fahrenheit is just fine for coffee and tea, but really, if you much get below 180 degrees your "hot coffee" is bordering on lukewarm.



But I still do not get, what changed your mind. The claim has always been that the coffee was too hot.



Are you old enough to remember the case?



posted on Jul, 3 2014 @ 04:12 AM
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a reply to: alienjuggalo

Yeah. I was 16-17 at the time of the trial, but what has that got to do with anything?

Coffee (in the rest of the world anyway) was then and is now brewed at temperatures slightly below boiling point.



posted on Jul, 3 2014 @ 04:20 AM
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originally posted by: DupontDeux
a reply to: alienjuggalo

Yeah. I was 16-17 at the time of the trial, but what has that got to do with anything?

Coffee (in the rest of the world anyway) was then and is now brewed at temperatures slightly below boiling point.


Did you know she tried to settle the suit for 20 grand and mcdes refused? That's the stuff that changed my mind realizing how I was manipulated into believing she was just a gold digging woman. I remember thinking she got rich.

www.lectlaw.com...


The sweatpants Liebeck was wearing absorbed the coffee and held it next to her skin. A vascular surgeon determined that Liebeck suffered full thickness burns (or third-degree burns) over 6 percent of her body, including her inner thighs, perineum, buttocks, and genital and groin areas. She was hospitalized for eight days, during which time she underwent skin grafting. Liebeck, who also underwent debridement treatments, sought to settle her claim for $20,000, but McDonalds refused.

During discovery, McDonalds produced documents showing more than 700 claims by people burned by its coffee between 1982 and 1992. Some claims involved third-degree burns substantially similar to Liebecks. This history documented McDonalds' knowledge about the extent and nature of this hazard.

McDonalds also said during discovery that, based on a consultants advice, it held its coffee at between 180 and 190 degrees fahrenheit to maintain optimum taste. He admitted that he had not evaluated the safety ramifications at this temperature. Other establishments sell coffee at substantially lower temperatures, and coffee served at home is generally 135 to 140 degrees.

Further, McDonalds' quality assurance manager testified that the company actively enforces a requirement that coffee be held in the pot at 185 degrees, plus or minus five degrees.


edit on 3-7-2014 by alienjuggalo because: (no reason given)

edit on Thu Jul 3 2014 by DontTreadOnMe because: trimmed long quote IMPORTANT: Using Content From Other Websites on ATS.....attempt to fix text in OP




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