The polar ice caps are MELTING!

One of the biggest fears of AGW seems to be the polar ice caps melting and causing terrible coastal flooding, death and destruction. But, if humans are the cause of the ice caps melting, we can assume they never melted before right?

Not exactly.

Evidence from ice at the bottom of ice cores from the Canadian Arctic Islands and Camp Century and Dye-3 in Greenland suggests that the Greenland ice sheet melted extensively or completely during the last interglacial period more than 100 ka (thousand years ago), in contrast to earlier interpretations. The presence of dirt particles in the basal ice has previously been thought to indicate that the base of the ice sheets had melted and that the evidence for the time of original growth of these ice masses had been destroyed. However, the particles most likely blew onto the ice when the dimensions of the ice caps and ice sheets were much smaller. Ice texture, gas content, and other evidence also suggest that the basal ice at each drill site is superimposed ice, a type of ice typical of the early growth stages of an ice cap or ice sheet. If the present-day ice masses began their growth during the last interglacial, the ice sheet from the earlier (Illinoian) glacial period must have competely or largely melted during the early part of the same interglacial period. If such melting did occur, the 6-meter higher-than-present sea level during the Sangamon cannot be attributed to disintegration of the West Antarctic ice sheet, as has been suggested.

Link to source

So if there has been significant melting in the past, what caused it? Whale farts possibly?

Our Earth is changing. It has been changing since 4.5 billion years ago. I can only assume it will continue to change. With, or without us.

Does this prove humans aren't doing terrible things to the Earth? nope. But it does shed some light on the global scare tactics that are being used.

If they melt again, there might be terrible flooding at coastal regions. But then, who in their right mind would study history and not think that at some point, things might change? We are just super pissed that it's affecting us. We are the superior species here. Top of the food chain. How dare the Earth change without our approval. We should fix it right away...............

Or, perhaps we should figure out how to deal with change, and be good marines. Adapt, improvise, overcome.

Just a little food for thought.

a reply to: network dude

I think this image speaks a thousand words. See if you can spot where humans entered the picture.

And where are all the Penguins and Polar Bears supposed to go...

a reply to: network dude

It's all hype...a story fabricated to distract us while the world's pockets are fleeced.

If the Polar bear was native to the state of New York it would have gone the way of the Do-Do years ago ..They are a nasty bear ,and quite capable of living without ice ..

a reply to: network dude

Or, perhaps we should figure out how to deal with change, and be good marines. Adapt, improvise, overcome.

Which in the end also has a financial cost, so no matter which way it goes we will be taxed.

a reply to: InverseLookingGlass

You didn't provide the source of that chart but it appears to be from GISP2, though fiddled with a bit.

The trouble is, that chart is based on ice core data which ends in 1855. Where that chart says "Present" is actually 159 years ago. Its gotten warmer since then.

a reply to: network dude

So if there has been significant melting in the past, what caused it? Whale farts possibly?

Cycles involving orbital and axial configurations which affect solar insolation, changes in solar irradiance, changes in ocean circulation patterns.

The argument that, because climate has changed naturally in the past it must mean that the current warming is natural doesn't hold any water. There were natural floods in the past. Does that mean a flood caused by a broken dam is a natural flood?

The factors which led to past warming are not occurring now. What is occurring now is that atmospheric CO2 levels are rising as a result of the burning of fossil fuels. That rise in CO2 levels increases radiative forcing. That increase in forcing increases the amount of heat captured by the atmosphere. The CO2 being released by burning fossil fuels is like that dam.

You need to go work for the IPCC because you can spin the whole scientific debate into a consensus that Cook would be proud of . a reply to: Phage

What I glean from this is that our ancestors, with all the technology of theirs (the discovery of how to make stone tools and fire), survived melting of the ice sheets.

We probably will survive it too, whether we have any effect on climate or not.

Now whether we could survive a large asteroid strike, that's a different story. I think we would be in the same boat as our forebears 100,000 years ago.

All we need to do is look around this planet and see our fellow humans living in eco systems vastly different from one another to believe we will survive . It's the politics I fear mush more then the weather ,truth be known . a reply to: butcherguy

" The polar ice caps are MELTING! "

Yup.

It's Summer again.

Time to get legal advice.

The Sun is angry.

This can also play a big part. www.abovetopsecret.com...

a reply to: Phage

The trouble is, that chart is based on ice core data which ends in 1855. Where that chart says "Present" is actually 159 years ago. Its gotten warmer since then.

Yes, it has gotten warmer since then...

A whole whopping 0.7°C warmer.

Are you saying that adding in the 0.7 degree increase from 1855 is going to cause the graph line to shoot right up and off the page ?

So assuming MMGWW is true ... how will it help anything if I lose upwards of 70% of my paycheck to various taxes?

a reply to: Phage

The trouble is, that chart is based on ice core data which ends in 1855. Where that chart says "Present" is actually 159 years ago. Its gotten warmer since then.

Yup..

Right about when an ice age was ending ..

and still is.

a reply to: ketsuko

It's going to stop Man Made Global Warming because they will reduce your carbon footprint by forcing you not to be able to afford all the creature comforts we have become accustom too.

Grass Huts and all of us singing songs of peace around a campfire after working at super high tech facilities here we come! While we get put into CO2 scrubbing chambers when we have reached our daily limit of breathing and CO2 emissions.

According to what I have read on the internet, especially climate depot, volcanic activity is up 300% in 2,000 years, CO2 parts per million is now 400, (less than one percent) beginning of this June, iceburgs on lake Superior, as well as human growth, animal growth as well, cows, sheep, pigs, horses. ( expulsion of rear end gases) natural forest fires, algae blooms in the sea, El Nino, so many variables, I bet this stuff was happening hundreds of years ago.
Which reminds me, there was very little glaciation in Norway during Roman times, so it 'must' have been warm in those days!

a reply to: CranialSponge

Are you saying that adding in the 0.7 degree increase from 1855 is going to cause the graph line to shoot right up and off the page ?

That would depend upon how large the page is.

I'm not sure where you're getting that 0.7º figure from. Are you talking about average global temperature? That's not what the posted chart represents. It shows reconstructed temperatures from a particular location in Greenland. With that in mind it may be more useful to look at what the increase near that location has been. The ten year average is more like 1.44º higher than it was then. Apparently warmer than it was during the Medieval warm period at that location.

hot-topic.co.nz...
hot-topic.co.nz...

But using data from one particular location as indicator that warming has not occurred (as the person who posted the GISP2 graph apparently intended) is not really very convincing, especially when "current warming" is defined as being 159 year ago. Posting that chart was pointless, seeming to imply that warming has not been occurring at an accelerating rate.

a reply to: xuenchen

Right about when an ice age was ending ..

Take another look at the chart. The last glacial period ended 10,000 years ago. Not159 years ago.