a reply to: spy66
I cant speak for Ukraine or the Ukrainian people, but I have a lot of Ukrainian friends and all of them before this whole thing got started said life
there was more on the boring side then anything else and dont even really know what and how this whole thing got started. There proud of there
heritage and break away from the USSR but the majority of them are kind of clueless on things, and really there is little difference between the two
countries and people, its more just the fact that people are people and they would rather go there own way then have others tell them what to do. And
I dont think they completely know what joining the EU would make them any freer then they were before or if it will ultimately be better then if they
were under the Russian wing if you know what I mean.
The People surly havent payied any attention to the costs of converting to the EU standard. The Ukraine have to spend billions which they dont have to
rebuild everything from their laws, education; practically everything from the playground and up. Just to forfill their free trade obligations With
the EU. Ukraine is broke already. Ukraine wont be a member of the EU for at least a 100 years or more, if ever. The Ukraines dont have enough cash to
forfill their free trade obligation.
That's the thing, you dont need to set up a free trade agreement for any of that stuff. Generally when people sell you free stuff, its anything but
free and you will end up paying for it down the line and at a premium. Look at it like this, I have not been in the Ukraine, but some 7 years ago I
was in the next country over. And really the country is in the EU, but the things they have built there since they joined in 2007 were in the process
long before, I mean they have everything we do here, they even have there equivalent of Costco/wallchart I forgot the name of the place and it was a
bit more of a Costco/Lowes type of place, most of the business and buildings there were started by either German, french or UK companies.
And really they would be there no matter under who's wing the country is under, its just good business, its a practical new market to tap into. I
mean you have gas-stations there supplying gas from Russian companies and UK companies you have McDonald and you even have German stores or car shops
as Germany is literally not far literally like there Canada and people have been shipping goods back and forth ever since the end of the war. So much
so that last time I been there with family BMW were taxi's and I think you could get some BMW's there for cheaper then you could get a Honda.
And you have some french cellphones companies there building on there new market, I know because one of my cousins works for a company there, and
even in the most backward places its starting to look like your average town in the US fast. But then again you have oil companies with the consent of
the president making deals with foreign companies which are drilling and fracking in certain areas against the consent of the people living there, and
you have other companies mining other areas. Basically you have a whole bag of mixed tricks, all of which would come to there sooner or latter with or
without a free trade agreement, a free trade agreement is merely a fancy and complicated way of dividending were profits from resources really go,
its more often then not just a fancy way of saying your going to get the short end of the stick or pie. People are just stupid enough to believe
otherwise or that somehow others making speeches or pieces of paper saying there now free to trade will somehow make things better. Oh and they never
read the small print.
As for the whole Ukraine thing, well like I said they probably had or were in the process of having there little slice of weternism complete with
MacDonalds and all that, I even heard that from an Ukrainian friend who goes back and forth and was born there. Really what this is about, is
probably the oil pipe lines and cutting in on Russian oil flow as well as there business, and considering that they will likely after the initial
phase get oil from the Russians for cheaper. Well, you know how things work the free samples are just there to get you hooked before the prices
change. That and cornering and monopolizing Eastern Europe, and off course likely building military basses there, which I do not think Russian will
look to fondly on as they built the pipelines there, and that whole pesky thing of having other nations build military basses and stations so close to
there borders, they probably do not look to fondly on.
Really I do not think the skirmishes for the Ukrainian people have even started yet, and its stupid to put yourself between two powerhouses both just
looking for there interests, with short sighted leaders who are also looking for there interests. I mean how did that work in Africa or in the middle
east? Not very well and it could potential lead to some more major skirmishes and lots more dead people.
Like I said its sort of pointless, as that African saying goes. "When the elephants fight its the grass that suffers" And really there is nothing
any other nation or group could give them that would not at some point come to them eventually if for nothing more then the new markets a whole
country would offer, the only crux is, on who's terms will it be? Because after all when there helping them recover there national dept there just
moving zeros from one account into another before they let corporations and business interests move in, and they they Ukrainian people will have to
pay all that back with interest. So really its free trade for whom? Or is it just a complicated way of sticking the bill on others and making a
profit on that as well, and even there leaders are clueless to such things its basically a way constructs such as corporations or governments get
free reigns on things to make up the rules so they can dictate how things will go down to there bottom dollar.
Its how to control nations and peoples 101, the free trade system, which off course if it was actually free you would not need it, like an ancient
Greek philosopher once said if you need to install freedom then your not free, and none of this would be an issue, and not only that you already have
all those companies moving in into Ukraine and some have been there for a while long before this whole skirmish with Russia started.
Really the only difference between most superpowers or nations or groups is the effectiveness of there PR teams. And lets face it the majority of
people are just not smart enough to see beyond basic childish illusions much such as this, much less some of the major illusions going on in, and
around, this planet we call earth.
edit on 8pmSundaypm292014f0pmSun, 29 Jun 2014 20:29:36 -0500 by galadofwarthethird because: (no reason given)