The problem that I have with 99% of local churches.

a reply to: OptimusSubprime

On one hand you still believe that Israel is under the law, and yet you are questioning an OT practice.

I never said Israel was still under the Law. As far as Im concerned, the Nation of Israel doesnt exist. Israel was dispersed in 70 AD,when the Temple expired. The OT Law has been converted into a new Law. Not all Dispensationalist are Zionist. A true Dispensationalist will recognize that Israel's prophecies cannot occupy Church time. What we call "Israel" today was established by man's power, not God's

a reply to: BELIEVERpriest

You aren't wrong. Tithing is NOT Biblical for churches. Never was. The NT is clear on how we are to give; as we are led to give, willingly, and never some set amount. Ever. Tithing was for the OT priesthood, as you correctly state. Virtually every single church you can find these days, however, pushes tithing. I have no issue at all with giving. I do have issue with anyone telling me how much I should give, though.

I had a friend (yes, had, as in this person isn't a friend any longer) who was all nuts about tithing. This is the sort of person who believed anything she did was something everyone was supposed to do. Very annoying. she insisted that tithing was correct for churches, even in the face of all evidence, from the Bible, that it isn't. She even tried claiming that, when she didn't tithe, "bad things" happened in the family finances, and "good things" did when she tithed. When I pointed out that isn't even an option for many people, because they simply can't spare the 10%, she acted like that was "stupid". I pointed out a time that I was a single mother (did that for a bit), and had few bills, with virtually nothing left over. Rent, electric, car insurance, cable (or literally NO reception, and that was only about $30 a month at the time), and groceries, plus gas for work, clothing for my daughter and I, and I had to save for months for gifts for her birthday and Christmas. I didn't clear 18K on a good year. A dollar movie (not first run) was a treat for me. This woman insisted that I could have done it anyway. Yes, she is an idiot.

I don't even bother discussing this in churches. I find one that is solid on most of the issues, or as solid as you can find, and just ignore the tithing demands. They get what I decide to give, as I feel God wants me to. Thus far, no one has come to us in person and asked why we don't, so I just let it slide. Overall, this place isn't over spending, either. Money for a new roof, or a parking lot redo, has been needed, and the regular budget doesn't have a lot of excess. Some funds to various places, such as retirement home ministries, etc., but that's outreach/witnessing, so it's ok. We are getting a new sound system, but that isn't "ridiculously expensive", and is sorely needed. The pianist and praise team can't even hear themselves, with what is there now. The place has a piano, and other instruments are played, but the rest are owned by those playing them.

I do know what you mean, however. Some places get too much, and waste a lot of it on things that aren't needed. Budgets have to cover certain things, like building maintenance, utilities, insurance, and salaries (reasonable ones!!!) for staff, etc.; the rest is optional. Any place that closed over that had better be unable to meet the basics, or they are messed up.

I would never attend a place that didn't have congregational meetings, and require congregational approval on the budget. Never, ever. S&F.

a reply to: LadyGreenEyes

I would never attend a place that didn't have congregational meetings, and require congregational approval on the budget. Never, ever.

Thats good advice. Thanks for sharing your story. I wish more of us would wake up, but I fear the problem is deeper than tithing.

originally posted by: BELIEVERpriest
a reply to: LadyGreenEyes

I would never attend a place that didn't have congregational meetings, and require congregational approval on the budget. Never, ever.

Thats good advice. Thanks for sharing your story. I wish more of us would wake up, but I fear the problem is deeper than tithing.

Oh, no doubt about that! The enemy is very good at infiltrating churches, even good ones that try and do as they should. Any and every way that people can be distracted, or mislead, you can bet it's being done. All we can do is stay aware, and try and make others aware as well. That, though, is much easier said than done! The looks I have gotten just for stating a particular author shouldn't be trusted are pretty indicative of the mindset of most; they think if it says it's "Christian", it must be alright.

The church isn't about following your ideas of jesus (bible) but theirs. They preach some of what jesus taught but cant emulate him.

If you view the church as the common ground between government and society. They try to stop the spread of evil but in doing so stop the spread of some things we would say jesus stood for. Like prosecution!

The church is full of people benefiting from rules they and government set but also whom want the best for their society.

Local churches aren't asking for money, they are being given money.