Police shoot and kill 95 year old nursing home resident who did not want to go to the hospital.

Really think you need to think about takeing guns away from your police like the UK unless they go through mountins of training and phyc evaluations.

a reply to: Blackmarketeer

This is absolutely ghastly.

I find it impossible to reconcile incidents of this nature, elderly men being gunned down for no actual reason, with the belief in DC that gun control is a reasonable thing to inflict on the population of the US.

The fact is, as long as there are officers of the law gunning down any one they fear, including frail old men who are only guilty of exercising their right to determine their own fate, then disarming the population, or controlling their access to firearms to a greater degree than is already allowed for by legislation, is an impossible position to adopt.

Incidents involving elderly persons being murdered by police are either becoming more common, or being reported or posted here more often in recent weeks, just a little trend I have noticed of late. One of the things that really hits one in the guts about this incident, is that the deceased gentleman was a World War Two veteran. This man went to war, in some of the most hellish circumstances ever faced by a human being, survived all the rigours of war, only to be shot dead by police, in his own nation, having done nothing illegal.

Another thing that strikes me as bloody appalling is that the staff at the home he was in, called the police in the first place! Surely it is necessary for all staff at such a place to be aware that they have no right to dictate what treatment their residents receive, or even, whether or not they receive any at all? Forcing a person to undergo medical examination or treatment, unless it is part of a criminal justice proceeding of some sort seems barbaric in the extreme!

I have read up on this in the last ten minutes, and it appears as if there are certain circumstances where a resident of the United States may NOT refuse medical examination and treatment, and that has an awful lot to do with whether or not they receive any kind of state aid. The way I understand it, the rules are crafted so that those who receive some sort of disability payment, cannot prolong their use of government funds by failing to allow their condition to be treated.

While I understand the reason for this mechanism, if this incident was affected by such a factor, then I for one would be shocked. You see, World War Two veterans should not be counted as receiving a benefit, but should be treated by the government as if failing to provide for their dignity and their right to determine their own fate, would cause an immediate collapse of government and the fabric of society. If anyone's right to choose ought to be defended, it's those who were prepared to pay a cost in blood to fight the Nazis.

I am sickened that the staff thought they were in the right to insist, I am disgusted at their choice to call the police, and I am livid at the actions of the officers. They should all be fired, flogged, and then arrested.

a reply to: Blackmarketeer

I would rather be in Prison then in an aged care home from the stories I have heard in Australia... This is disgusting and how the police can even try to justify their actions makes me want to vomit. Are they telling me they couldn't handle a 95 year old man without resorting to their cowardly weapon? Give me a break.... This world is screwed.

a reply to: DarknStormy

The police don't care about helping people, they care only about control
which is why in this situation, the man won't go to the hospital to get help/treatment of his own will, they were glad to invent some way to send him there.
Oh, and getting to shoot someone is a bonus to them.

originally posted by: EyesOpenMouthShut
a reply to: DarknStormy

The police don't care about helping people, they care only about control
which is why in this situation, the man won't go to the hospital to get help/treatment of his own will, they were glad to invent some way to send him there.
Oh, and getting to shoot someone is a bonus to them.

Maybe Americans should install an eye for an eye mentality.. You kill an innocent civilian and we kill one of you. Fear needs to be driven back into these pricks, sorry but it's the truth.

a reply to: dollukka

a reply to: trollz That thread is closed.. you can´t add to that

that one maybe closed, but this one isn't and it was posted just after the indecent in the same forum as this one.
almost a year ago. i have found that the new search engine is ten times better than it use to be.

Illinois Police Kill 95-Year-Old With Taser Shocks and Bean Bag Rounds

a reply to: Blackmarketeer

a WWII veteran is an endangered species and should be handled carefully and with respect. Couldn't they shoot him with a tranquilizer, operate on him and let him roam free in the wild again?

a reply to: Blackmarketeer

A guy was just arrested in my hometown over the weekend for stabbing the heck out of his neighbor with a sword/cane. I am kind of assuming the cane was a sheath and the sword was inside, looking like a normal walking cane. My paper gives very little to no detail.

So, if we go by that example, then of course the leo has every right to assume the worst and take whatever measures needed to ensure their own personal safety. I can't even remember anymore when that became the driving force, Law Enforcement Personnel Safety, yet it seems to drive policy towards violence by the police in order to remain safe.

Maybe the people involved, nurses, police, are just super jaded and wanted the guy to check out, being since he was 95? Not surprising... Some of the meanest people I've ever known have worked in nursing homes. Just like cops, it's the rare few that spoil the bunch.

The thing I don't like is how police needed to be summoned in the first place and why the nursing home personnel felt he was a threat. I'm guessing this wasn't no day spa type atmosphere. I've heard too many stories of the elderly being abused and maltreated just because; A: they ARE jerks. Old people who have dementia tend to be a little different and could possibly become violent or threatening. Not every time, of course, but they are just like anyone else who will react to a situation. Maybe not remember too well after the confrontation. B: there is little consequence. Nursing homes are a huge business and to interrupt the flow of customers/create controversy is bad for business. The saddest part is that most are gov subsidized and keeping problems contained and minimized keeps the dollars flowing in. No doubt that an internal investigation will discover no wrongdoing and that everything was handled according to standard protocol.

When it comes to my time, I'd rather be dead than go to a nursing home.

I find it odd that they did beat the oldtimer sensles first and than put him Down With a bullet. Isnt that how the cops conduct their duties in the US?

Why would the nursing home Call 911? Is that according to procedure?


Why not send a abmbulence to pick him up? They are trained to handel these types of Things. Cops are clearly not trained to rescue People but to put them Down.
The cops in the US are like a hit Squad. If you want someone killed just Call 911. You dont even have to pay them up front.

I dont think anyone should just blame the cops but the nursing home as well.

a reply to: dfens

Firstly, it isn't a small minority or the odd "rare" bad apple of so-called 'law enforcement' officers. There are a huge amount of bad cops - so large that there is no longer a place for them in society, where outlaw and lawlessness is a safer option.

They only exist to keep us in line, to ensure government remains in control of the people it is meant to serve.

Edit: removal of an incorrect statement about a member.

a reply to: BasementWarriorKryptonite
C'mon dude, how do you infer that I'm sticking up for those guys? Maybe I was a little nice by not spitting out hateful vitriol, yet I know the score. It was an outside examination of how/why this happens. I know girls who get a 2 year degree to become a nurse assistant, that's good enough to get you going in these types of homes, climb the ladder even. For the most part, conditions suck, and you have to be mean to get ahead. Making ruthless decisions and generally treating the client load like # actually gets you ahead. Admins and family assess finances in order to figure how much they can charge. 3-5K a month is not odd and they get treated like they are in jail. They get nowhere near that level of service. If the client feels like they're being treated like a useless piece of meat, of course there is backlash. When the going gets rough, they resort to the police who have no interest, other than containing a situation. The boys in blue have as much regard to tazing a 95 year old man as they do a 12 year old girl.

The biggest problem, which is not me, is the people who unilaterally teach their employees to brutalize people, knowing they don't do the dirty work. When you compartmentalize that way, you become insulated from the repercussions. It's the people at the top who encourage that kind of behavior and people go along because it's nice to have a job. It's even better when your mistakes become justified if the message needs to be sent. The best part of it all is that eventually nobody cares. People do forget and it doesn't get the outrage that it deserves.

a reply to: dfens

I must have read your words wrong and if you didn't mean to be at all as I said, I am deeply sorry because I believe any support for what now passes for law enforcement to be not only futile but against the public good.

Thanks to everyone for all the replies.

One of the things that struck me as sickening about this story was the immediate coverup taken by the offending cops. The "we thought he had a knife" routine. Just once, it'd be nice to hear the cops say "We didn't want to deal with a crotchety old man so we shot him with a riot control gun at point blank range."

At least the coroner's office has labeled this a homicide. I fully expect the offending cops to be charged with it and given at least two weeks suspension with pay. :S

a reply to: BasementWarriorKryptonite
No worries. We sort of have to assume that doing the right thing is not the driving force behind these seemingly constant bonehead reactions.

Really? Who in there right mind would think that the headline "6 cops taze the # out of unruly 95 year old, accidentally kill him with beanbags" is good pr? I would call that a very serious lack of judgment and a colossal #up. Unfortunately, it can be turned around and replaced with an even more stupid headline, like Hillary backs off on Iowa primaries. That's why ATS is the best, we get these kind of stories and people should feel outraged.

IMO, calling the cops is a very last resort, desperation measure. They'll only make your original problem worse.

originally posted by: trollz
Already posted
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Yep.

Strange how this story keeps getting recycled. The OP's source just came out yesterday. And, get this!

"On July 26, 2014 , John Wrana, Jr., was twelve days shy of his 96th birthday and a resident at the Victory Centre of Park Forest Assisted Living Center located in Park Forest, Illinois. On that date, Mr. Wrana was alone in his room, suffering from what the facility's staff believed were symptoms indicative of a urinary tract infection in an elderly person," the complaint begins.
www.courthousenews.com...

Am I batty, or has July 2014 not yet happened?

Not trying to minimize the horror of this story, but it's been told, as new, at LEAST 3Xs on ATS.

a reply to: windword

Looks like the incident happened July 26, 2013. I think it appears the Web site "Court House News" made the mistake of dating it 2014, which led to the story making the rounds in news feeders as a new story. Guess that's bound to happen once in a while.

a reply to: Blackmarketeer

Yeah. It's just that, every time I see this story, I think, "WHAT??? It happened again?" But, it didn't. As bad as this story is, it only happened once.

No one has granted these sobs the authority of arbitrary execution.The fact that they are getting away with it disgusts me to no end.As does not a peep about these killings in Washington also.

originally posted by: spy66
I find it odd that they did beat the oldtimer sensles first and than put him Down With a bullet. Isnt that how the cops conduct their duties in the US?

Why would the nursing home Call 911? Is that according to procedure?


Why not send a abmbulence to pick him up? They are trained to handel these types of Things. Cops are clearly not trained to rescue People but to put them Down.
The cops in the US are like a hit Squad. If you want someone killed just Call 911. You dont even have to pay them up front.

I dont think anyone should just blame the cops but the nursing home as well.

I was thinking the same thing...if you want someone dead, don't hire a hitman....call the cops and tell them the guy you want dead, is acting crazy and has a gun in his pocket threatening to shoot people around him, and then let the police do their job and shoot him. won't cost you a dime, and if you use a burn phone, they won't be able to trace it back to you...ok, it'll cost you 40 bucks for a burn phone, but one A**hole less in your life.

originally posted by: TDawg61
No one has granted these sobs the authority of arbitrary execution.The fact that they are getting away with it disgusts me to no end.As does not a peep about these killings in Washington also.

they are getting away with it because it is accepted, how many years now has youtube videos been showing these types of bootjacks.....you would think there would be a DOJ ruling.