Firefighter chases dog and both are missing 411?

a reply to: Ektar

I hope we are NOT at a dead end... Randys

Well, this is another thing about this case that is sorta
bothering me. Here sits a total mystery that, has the greatest
chances of being a journey into the paranormal. I'm willing to
invest my time, money, even board and transpo. And nothing?
Meanwhile, rattlesnake season approaches swiftly and no ones
getting younger.

And as I said before, no I'm not go'in by myself. Not only for the
obvious reasons but it also wouldn't be testimony. I've camped
by myself before, but not under these circumstances. #### that!
People must think I'm stupid? And that's another thing that just occurred
to me. What happened to this guy Herdman, could quite obviously
happen to anyone. Even without knowing what exactly happened.

a reply to: randyvs

I hear you mate....I don't think you or anyone should go there alone.
I was west coast until Fall 2003...lived in Arcadia for a year & hiked the mountains
close by.
I mostly lived in Sherman Oaks...been hiking in the LA Crest...didn't like that
spot because it was too close to LA & bad people would hide out there & there
were many gang people that camped there.

I spent the last 3 yrs there in Pasadena. I really wish I could go with you but
I am on east coast now.
I use to relocate rattle snakes...LOL!

We have so many unanswered questions here...bloody hell if a relative of mine
& especially your spouse or partner died or was killed, I would try me best to
keep the case open until ALL answers were clear.
It's almost like it didn't happen....
This has been a great thread mate & I hope we can still try to find answers...
maybe someone will start feeling too comfortable & "slip up" ?

Cheers
Ektar

a reply to: Ektar

Some great thoughts you have there brother.

originally posted by: randyvs
Notice how " The sealing of official documents" is an enhancement to the
" White wash"? ( dope involved story )

Yep. Good point.
There are too many angles that are razor-sharp in this saga...

a reply to: randyvs
I appreciate your frustration, randyvs…

I am the first to accept the harshness of tone (inferred – so I could be wrong), having continued to push/pull/stall this mystery through quite a few of the last pages…and yet, I don’t know when or if I will be able to fulfill the desire to lay eyes on the location, and investigate the scene of this skull-scratcher.

It is odd that a place, so near civilization, progress & public access is likewise so very remote.

The overall similarity with other “Missing – 411” cases…is odd, as well.
The dog is odd… The story is odd… The spire…is odd.

I, though, can only justify the trip if the intent is to gain as much information regarding as many questions, as possible…because I don’t know that I will be able to make a second trip.
For you, it might be a long weekend. For me, it will/would be a week & a half for both myself and at least two, if not four others coming from multiple states.

This is why I asked earlier, which route you were intending to take—in (and out).
I do not see a group of any less than 5 doing this. And, of course, along with the advantages (strength in numbers) every person added increases the odds of mishap, injury, illness (and I am, by default, at the top of that list)…
Such a venture will require significant planning & investment.
We will surely want to document/video the trip…

I continue to work on my end toward that goal.
Glad you remain interested.

a reply to: WanDash

I, though, can only justify the trip if the intent is to gain as much information regarding as many questions, as possible…because I don’t know that I will be able to make a second trip.
For you, it might be a long weekend. For me, it will/would be a week & a half for both myself and at least two, if not four others coming from multiple states.

Great point Wan and don't mistake my tone for anything
more than what it is my very good member. An attempt
to rattle cages and make challenges to achieve a desired
result. If this thread has effected me in anyway? It has shown
me the intelligence of and offered me insight to, some members
with great talents here at ATS. That I otherwise wouldn't know
anything about. So again, I can only say thanks for
your tremendous help here. Unless we meet up and do a fist
bump and some bonding. Carry on! I feel more is only in need
of a stretch to reach it. The photo with Byars wearing the horns
is great for indivual thought, but can't be tagged and submitted
as anything really. It could be a ploy or a tactic beyond the
knowledge of the person who brought it to our attention. Who
seems to have been to sensitive to with stand a yank on
the chain. Didn't mean to run him off, but that tells me a little
sump'n.

a reply to: WanDash

Hey Wan I thought you were going to do a follow up phone call to Randyvs'
in regards to the case being closed?
Did that ever happen & I missed it? I think that should be the next step
& then 2nd step might be all you guys meeting in the early spring (before
the paranoid of snakes) & go through the whole camp-out Herdsman & Byars.

The "Spiral"...is there any way to get a local person to just go & check out
the spiral? It seems that getting a few of these out of the way first would be smart
prior to several people traveling from all over to do a camp out.
I think the camp out is very important, but there are matters that I think we should
try to clarify first even if only saving time.

I hope I mad some kind of sense.

Cheers
Ektar

Just finished reading the thread! In my defense, it was a long thread with many links with articles, comments.

I feel uneasy about this case and MH's death and have several questions. However, you all seem to have the same questions, and I wonder if any of us will ever get further information (if not it's certainly not for lack of trying).

I read (in thread) that these 'fishermen' didn't call the authorities until after they got back from their trip and saw this on the news. If that's the case, it (seems to me), they didn't know the whole story at all. Not even the part where MH was missing, and yet they searched for the campsite (after) helping T.Byers locate the parking area? If TB were so disoriented then, I wonder how he could even follow direction from these fishermen (or did they literally take Byers to his car), and if so-I missed that and was under the impression that they gave Byers direction.

Story is missing too much information, and 'case closed' seemed premature (imo).

a reply to: RobinB022

The way I read a few accounts of the fishermen.
They saw to it Byars made it back to his car. But to
tell you the truth I don't even see enough reason
for fishermen to even be in that area. And this is one
of the main reasons I can see for going there. Just to get
a better feel for what is and isn't likely to happen there.
I look in on this thread from time to time and that's the
only reason I responded. If you don't address someone you
could go unanswered for awhile partner. Just a lil tip.
Hey thanks for reading BTW.

a reply to: randyvs

I have a problem understanding how these two fishermen got Byars back to his car, and then trekked all those miles hiking back to the campsite. How could Byars have helped them with direction (to campsite) if he were in the condition he was described to have been,ie; dehydrated, disoriented,.. lost.

I'd love to visit the area myself-but don't see that happening-so would like to live vicariously through others who have the means and desire.

a reply to: RobinB022

When you said the story is missing to much information.
You said a mouth full.

originally posted by: randyvs
...I feel more is only in need of a stretch to reach it. The photo with Byars wearing the horns is great for indivual thought, but can't be tagged and submitted as anything really. It could be a ploy or a tactic beyond the knowledge of the person who brought it to our attention. Who seems to have been to sensitive to with stand a yank on the chain. Didn't mean to run him off, but that tells me a little sump'n.

Thanks for your kind words, randyvs.
I can't make a thing of the horned-image, either. No conclusions At All. It's interesting - might be telling if we had other information - might not.
I am still not trying to view Byars with suspicion... ...though something is suspicious.

a reply to: Ektar
Thanks for your thoughts, Ektar...
The 'need' of contacting the authorities for verification of the 'Available/Unavailable' status of case documentation was created (given definition) by myself... In that same event, I, likewise, proceeded to accept said responsibility, noting myself as a poor candidate for the job, but choosing to accept, wanting to create a burden for no-one-else (including yourself)...and being that no-one-else had commented on said 'requirement' either in agreement or opposition, I did not desire that such a task be anyone's responsibility but my own.
If I am remiss or tardy in this assignment to myself – there might be good reason/s (other than those stated previously) – nevertheless – they remain 'unfinished' business in my world...and I consider them, daily.
Unless I were to go into detective-mode (which I will not, as I am not a detective), the intent of this exercise is merely to corroborate precisely what another member has averred, since there has been no public broadcast of this 'fact' (to my knowledge)...
otherwise tasked --- due diligence
More may come of the prospective conversation than the above - if so - that will be gravy that I am not counting on.

As to when & where & how...and as briefly detailed in a recent reply to randyvs...I am doing what I can at the moment...and hoping and preparing to fulfill the desire to make this trip.

Anyone-else is as free as I am to make any plans to answer their questions and solve the riddles presented by this case.
If you want to contact someone locally, and ask them to make that hike to see if there's a 'spire' as shown in Google Earth imagery…please do not hesitate on my regard. I would accept your word as well as I would hope you accepted mine.
I would ask no-one to make the trip to the ‘spire’ without preparing them with “why”…which would include the entire story, as we know it…
I have already spoken with multiple potential companions who were, like – “Yo! Let’s go!” – until they heard (in the voice of Paul Harvey – (RIP)) “The rest of the story”…at which point they each pulled back a bit. I believe they (or – some of them) will ultimately accompany me, if all else falls into place.

Thanks again, for your thoughts and insights.

a reply to: WanDash

Hey I just thought of something & it may or may not help...
When I lived there I had a book, bloody hell I am trying so hard to think
of the name of it...IT rocked for people who enjoyed fishing. It listed ALL
fishing spots in the state of CA...it also provided info in re to campgrounds,
creeks, rivers, the oceans & whatever you can think of...IT is the so called
bible for fisherman...every place was graded A to F on the beauty of the area...
& the fish catch 1 - 10.
It also said if it was a full campground that included hook-ups or not, the number
of tent spaces, restrooms & showers or not & etc.

*** It also included the fishing report... down to the weekly restocking, the days,
the type of fish, the numbers, the locations, sizes & the catch rates...even more...

I'm am trying like hell to remember the name of the book because I do NOT recall
anything near Los Angeles as good fishing period.
I use to go to a place towards the desert off the freeway that was a small lake to catch
trout. I fished for trout...So I have never heard of good fishing in the area of accident.

I could be totally wrong...I will try to figure the title of the book because it will tell you
the type of fish, size, catch rates, when they are stocked & so on....

Sorry I am probably way too out there at the moment but thought I should at least
mention any other possible weirdness to the case. I so badly wish I could join the ATS
search party.

I mention because I DO NOT recall there to be a good fishing spot in the area of "the case".

a reply to: Ektar
Good idea!
Maybe we'll find it, and save some uncertainties.
Do you think it is a "regular" publication of some government entity, or otherwise?

Wow, i thought this thread had died!
I see you all have been busy, anything note worthy other than odd social media pics?

originally posted by: WanDash
Index to External Links Itemizations

1st Installment - Part Juan
& 1st Installment - Part Deux
Thread Pages 1 through 7

2nd Installment - by VoidHawk.
Thread Pages 8 through 20

3rd Installment - and some wanderings
Thread Pages 20 and 21

4th Installment - Part Juan
Thread Pages 22 through 29
&
4th Installment - Part Dos
Thread Page 30

5th Installment
Thread Pages 31 through 35

6th Installment
Thread Page 36 (regards only dinofinder's contribution)

7th Installment
Remainder of Thread Page 36, and Pages 37 through 39

8th Installment
Thread Pages 40 through 49

------------------------------

This was simply an effort at assisting anyone looking for "source references", without having to wade through 50+ pages.

Just because the Thread Pages after 50 are not included (now)...does not mean that there is no good, outstanding, or otherwise pertinent information therein... I just decided to stop where the Itemizations began.

Best Regards.

-------------------------------------

Thought I'd bump this page for easy reference.
Thanks WanDash, your effort made things much easier for me-wading through.

a reply to: Ektar

That's such a good idea Ektar, kudos to you!

Was it like the fishermans almanac maybe?

Gawd that would be horrendous to find out there isn't
any fishing there at all. At that point, we'd be with in bounds
and perfectly able to inquire upon the Ventura county Sherrif's
dept. as to why we are doing their investigation for them. That
should stir the pot just fine.

Great piece of work Ektar!


a reply to: EyesOpenMouthShut

Hell yeah! Ektar just had a brainstorm!

I found the book on line....

Foghorn Outdoors: California Fishing Paperback – February, 1999
by Tom Stienstra

Here's one of the reviews....it was an awesome book but since I no live ther
I tossed it when I moved.

"I've seen a number of California fishing books but this one is simply the best. Whether you are flyfishing or using spinning tackle, you want to know the lay of the land, where to fish, when to go, how to get there, who to talk to. This book answers all those things. It is an excellent comprehensive introduction to the fishable waters of California. Excellent maps, directions, and local guides/services for further advice. It breaks down all the areas of California into discrete geographic segments then gives detailed information on the area.
It is clear that Stienstra is an experienced fisherman whether it is on the fly, lures, or bait. This book is for the true fisherman and covers all the offshore, inshore, and freshwater fishing available throughout California. I cannot recommend this book enough."

I don't know if this will help or not?

Cheers
Ektar

a reply to: Ektar
You might be a genius

I'm on the hunt right now for that book in pdf form.
Maybe someone has it uploaded somewhere and i can post some linkage

All i can find is this Amazon book