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Firefighter chases dog and both are missing 411?

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posted on Aug, 22 2014 @ 09:21 AM
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originally posted by: VoidHawk
To those still watching this thread
Do you believe the story that Herdsman ran off into the night chasing his dog?


I do not believe he ran off into the night chasing after his dog. At all. However, I do believe that for some reason (in all honesty, most likely because of fear) the dog bolted and Herdman bolted right after it. He wasn't chasing his dog, he was following it in retreat. That, in my mind, is the only logical reason for a man dressed as Herdman was to take off "after his dog." And while you say a frightened dog will get behind his master, that wouldn't be the case if the dog was 'spooked' all of a sudden. You ever jumped out from behind a corner to scare your dog? They bolt. Fast.
Like you VoidHawk, I've been a dog owner for a while and been lucky enough to find areas of the UK where I could hike with him off his lead. Usually, once the lead came off he'd be gone. I'd hike on and 15/20 minutes later I'll be sitting down somewhere and a giant ball of slobbering fur would slam into my back and start licking me. Not once, any time I hiked with him, did I worry about him vanishing. And, as you say, if Herdman hiked with his dog before, he'd be in the exact same boat. Dog takes off? Meh. He's better equipped to survive out here than I am.

If I recall the medical report correctly, didn't it say he was killed by the fall? I can't check atm, but if I recall correctly (chances are I can't) didn't it say he had blunt force trauma but the fall killed him? Which was another one of those "YOUGOTTABEKIDDINGME!" moments we all had.


originally posted by: VoidHawk
I'm in the uk, and over here we dont have big cats and bears etc to worry about,


Hahaha! I wouldn't be so sure about that, Void!




posted on Aug, 22 2014 @ 03:48 PM
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originally posted by: JackofBlades

He wasn't chasing his dog, he was following it in retreat.
I could accept that! That makes much more sense than "he ran off to find his dog without his shoes in the middle of the night"


originally posted by: JackofBlades
And while you say a frightened dog will get behind his master, that wouldn't be the case if the dog was 'spooked' all of a sudden.
Agreed. When I wrote that I was thinking more about the theories that a bear or cat had frightened the dog.
Even if something spooked his dog I still think it would have circled around to get behind its master, the only time I can imagine he wouldn't do that is if he thought his master was severely outnumbered, and that would fit your idea that they were BOTH running away!
I confess I hadn't considered that




originally posted by: JackofBlades
Like you VoidHawk, I've been a dog owner for a while and been lucky enough to find areas of the UK where I could hike with him off his lead. Usually, once the lead came off he'd be gone. I'd hike on and 15/20 minutes later I'll be sitting down somewhere and a giant ball of slobbering fur would slam into my back and start licking me.
LOL
Makes me realize how much I miss my old mate, he's been gone nearly five years now, I think its time I got another one




originally posted by: JackofBlades
If I recall the medical report correctly, didn't it say he was killed by the fall? I can't check atm, but if I recall correctly (chances are I can't) didn't it say he had blunt force trauma but the fall killed him? Which was another one of those "YOUGOTTABEKIDDINGME!" moments we all had.
Your memory is correct. I also seem to remember that he was considered to have been to far out to have gotten there by falling, which caused me to wonder if he was thrown of the cliff.
Would be really interesting to get our hands on the police files AND photos!



originally posted by: VoidHawk
I'm in the uk, and over here we dont have big cats and bears etc to worry about,



originally posted by: JackofBlades
Hahaha! I wouldn't be so sure about that, Void!

I'm down South east. A few years ago some Lynx were known to be roaming about. But not seen any Bears yet



posted on Aug, 22 2014 @ 05:31 PM
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If my interpretation is right, the police would have us believe Herdman took a tumble off a cliff in pursuit of his dog under the influence of some drug, perhaps delivered from Byars. In the initial S&R news conference it was inferred that the body was too far away from the cliff side to it being considered he fell off of it. The fact that no new info is forthcoming is suspicious. I'm not saying it's bigfoot, but you have to admit that the official story doesn't hold water.



posted on Aug, 23 2014 @ 02:29 AM
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As I've been awake for like 30 hours and am typing this with my bed seductively calling to me I'll be a lot briefer than I usually am. Apologies!!

But, and I may have said this previously in the thread, there is a case in the Missing books about a woman who was found at the bottom of a cliff. Initial searchers and rangers determined she'd either tripped and fell, or committed suicide. The police (maybe sheriffs) turned up and pointed out the body had been dragged a ways from the bottom of the cliff where it had first fallen, and been sexually assaulted most likely after death. Oh, and that the initial landing spot of the body was so far out that it had to have been launched (not a jump to death, or a really bad stumble, but launched) in order to reach the area in which it landed.
The woman had also suffered "blunt force trauma" (her head had been pretty much opened up by the blow) but the cause of death was the fall...

I'm seriously considering sending someone the money to request a FOIA on this case. I want to know what Byars said, what condition and injuries the body had when found (which were "consistent with a fall"), and what notes the medical examiner made while performing the autopsy.
I'm incredibly surprised his wife hasn't requested this information already, however I would imagine she had been dissuaded from looking into it too deeply.



posted on Aug, 23 2014 @ 07:23 AM
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a reply to: JackofBlades


I want to know what Byars said, what condition and injuries the body had when found (which were "consistent with a fall"), and what notes the medical examiner made while performing the autopsy.

I too want to know what he said because all we have so far is their interpretation of what he said, and that makes it easy to paint Byars in a bad light. I cannot believe they accepted the story thats been presented to the public, they are hiding something!

While I wouldn't outright accuse Byars of being involved with Herdsmans death, I do think he knows more than we've been told.
Maybe it was Byars who ran off, maybe he ran off leaving his friend to be killed? That would make Byars look like a coward, but he may have been justified in running off. In that situation Byars would be innocent but might be blamed by others for deserting Herdsman, and hence the police release the bs to prevent any backlash towards Byars.

Anyone willing to FOIA for the details?



posted on Aug, 23 2014 @ 08:26 AM
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Missing Russian found dead in Grand Teton park

(fits missing 411 profile)

AP 9:42 p.m. EDT August 22, 2014

I quote:
MOOSE, Wyo. (AP) — A Russian student who went missing in Grand Teton National Park has been found dead.

The body of 20-year-old Aleksandr "Sasha" Sagiev was found in the park Friday. The student from Nizhny Novgorod, Russia, was reported missing Monday after going for a hike.

After a three-day search, Sagiev's body was discovered below a steep traverse, known as Cache Couloir, in Glacier Gulch. His body was found at an elevation of about 9,400 feet, and was removed via helicopter long-line. The National Park Service said Friday that his body has been taken to nearby Jackson, Wyoming.

Sagiev was a seasonal employee at Dornan's Pizza & Pasta Restaurant, a shop near the park. About 60 searchers had been looking for him since he was last seen at work Sunday. The search was complicated by heavy rain and thick clouds near Taggart Lake Trailhead, where authorities believed Sagiev started his hike.

Authorities say that when Sagiev was found, he was wearing the metallic blue "Sochi" jacket that he was last seen wearing. The jacket helped in locating his body in the rocky terrain, the park service reported.

There was no immediate word on the cause of death. An investigation is planned."

end quote.


This is like most cases in this missing 411 books !! I read it and said, "wow", the weather etc.. and much more!!

Just so crazy!!

(from USA TODAY)


Link: www.usatoday.com...

"



posted on Aug, 23 2014 @ 11:30 AM
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a reply to: RUFFREADY

I'm assuming you decided against another thread on this Ruff.
Or you did and also brought the info here. Or just haven't yet and
are going to start one? All of which are very honorable indeed.
Thank you Ruffers.


I had a feeling it was time another one to pop up. Seems many
these cases are only covered by local media.
edit on Ram82314v40201400000009 by randyvs because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 23 2014 @ 11:35 AM
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a reply to: VoidHawk

I would call for patience, money exchange and all that.

Unless someone from around here, has the money and wants to try
of course. But you guys should know I will do what i said.
Just be patient.


edit on Ram82314v362014u43 by randyvs because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 23 2014 @ 11:51 AM
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originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: RUFFREADY

I'm assuming you decided against another thread on this Ruff.
Or you did and also brought the info here. Or just haven't yet and
are going to start one? All of which are very honorable indeed.
Thank you Ruffers.


I had a feeling it was time another one to pop up. Seems many
these cases are only covered by local media.


I thought about it..but thought not ..why not just bring it here since we could all make a thread on this subject. It seems to happen a lot.

I even mention the story on this thread before "this" thread even started lol ...see my last post!! lol!! www.abovetopsecret.com...

That happens to me a lot hahahah!! I'll mention something and then poof!! there's a thread lol!!



posted on Aug, 23 2014 @ 11:54 AM
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a reply to: RUFFREADY

You know, I have a faint memory of noticing that very thing
involving you? Now that you mention it?


edit on Ram82314v55201400000000 by randyvs because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 23 2014 @ 12:03 PM
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a reply to: randyvs

As long as the info flows lol!! Plus save's us all the typing and such.. when that happens


This Missing 411 stuff could have so many "sub" threads I think. I might even think of one soon .... Mmmm

If I can just be good for a little longer
and keep my head clear of goofy things that have been going on with me


That would be a thread in itself !! oh my!!



posted on Aug, 23 2014 @ 12:22 PM
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a reply to: RUFFREADY

Well, I know you're a character sometimes.

I want to say that if I hadn't caught this story on 7
eyewitness news here in So Cal. At exactly the time
i did? I never would of written one up.



posted on Aug, 23 2014 @ 01:48 PM
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originally posted by: randyvs
a reply to: RUFFREADY

Well, I know you're a character sometimes.

I want to say that if I hadn't caught this story on 7
eyewitness news here in So Cal. At exactly the time
i did? I never would of written one up.


Yes I am. But, I earned it !! lol!

As for the weird in the woods. I know there is something strange going on. I did a lot of camping. I have heard and seen some strange things.

The strangest, was in the Angeles National Forest. A buddy and I saw a UFO in a real secluded area. watched it float away. Then out of nowhere there was this Giant cloud like structure that looked like an alien head..
about 500 feet up in the air. No kidding.

We high tailed to our camp site and later that night (we kept hearing all kinds of moving around in the area.. we ended up sleeping in the car locked and loaded
long story short



posted on Aug, 23 2014 @ 02:05 PM
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a reply to: RUFFREADY

Ohhhh ho ho that's ####ing coool!


I would a been like...




posted on Aug, 23 2014 @ 02:11 PM
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a reply to: randyvs

Noew that is really funny!!! Hahahah!!

And

I was!! lol!!

We had the camp fire going (the sighting was at 11:15 PM in a clearing near our camp sight) talking about what we saw and just could not believe it. Then the noises around us..real spooky and that feeling you were being watched. We were not near anyone!! We were very away from other folks.

It was Highly strange to the max!!



posted on Aug, 23 2014 @ 02:35 PM
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If you go on you tube and type in : 'Canam missing project'' ..you can get up to the day reports.

I quote:



David Paulides

18 hrs ·
.

Many of you know I've written four books about people who have gone missing in National Parks and U.S. Forests, "Missing 411" Series. I've had many readers ask us to do a video series on the cases. Up until this summer I never had the expertise or the assistance tot ale on such a project. My son, Ben Paulides, just completed a stay with me and we worked several cases, went to the locations and interviewed witnesses. Ben developed the technical and video expertise and was really the brains behind the project. If you can get past the guy with the goatee on film, the cases are compelling and the videography powerful. Our third video will be posted on the site in the coming weeks. Thanks to Ben for committing to the project and doing a GREAT job, and most of all, thanks for the patience of dealing with an on screen rookie. Our thoughts and prayers go out to each of the families. www.youtube.com...

end quote




posted on Aug, 23 2014 @ 02:45 PM
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originally posted by: RUFFREADY
Yes I am. But, I earned it !! lol!

As for the weird in the woods. I know there is something strange going on. I did a lot of camping. I have heard and seen some strange things.

The strangest, was in the Angeles National Forest. A buddy and I saw a UFO in a real secluded area. watched it float away. Then out of nowhere there was this Giant cloud like structure that looked like an alien head..
about 500 feet up in the air. No kidding.

We high tailed to our camp site and later that night (we kept hearing all kinds of moving around in the area.. we ended up sleeping in the car locked and loaded
long story short

I've spent a lot of time in the wilderness and have seen/heard some seriously strange things while there.
One day i'll talk in detail about it,that's not today.
All i know is, there are some things that go on away from civilization that will change a persons view about what they think they know
edit on 8/23/2014 by EyesOpenMouthShut because: (no reason given)



posted on Aug, 23 2014 @ 03:03 PM
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a reply to: EyesOpenMouthShut

Hey PM me when you do!! I'd like to think I'm not the only one on here that's gone through that stuff.


Thanks for that



posted on Aug, 23 2014 @ 03:05 PM
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a reply to: RUFFREADY
Trust me, you're not alone.
when i decide to share I'll keep you in mind



posted on Aug, 23 2014 @ 03:09 PM
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a reply to: EyesOpenMouthShut

Oh you didn't just pull a Dallas cliff hanger, wait til next
season on me, in this thread, right her on ATS?

And I thought I'd seen every length of corruption extruded by
the mind of man? So wrong!


Ruff
Another much appreciated post. It's a good day on ATS!




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