Police Commit Murder Caught on Video: Daniel Saenz handcuffed and shot by El Paso Police Officer

I would say the shoulder shot was deffinately not intended to be a kill shot, got lucky with an artery

I would have like to have seen this thread posted in the Posse Comitatis forum though
Its good to keep all the cop violence (deserved or not) in a similar place

X

Brings me to a question I can't believe I don't know. What's the policy concerning where police should shoot to subdue a suspect? Would a leg shot have sufficed?

a reply to: Antipathy17

I think that's where the tasers and pepper spray come in

In this instance with this particular person who already showed strength and fighting back, I would have to suggest that these guys were negligent by attempting to handle him with only two men and a set of handcuffs.

x

a reply to: Xcouncil=wisdom
And their remedy for improper tactics is death. Heck of a job.

More evidence police are just poorly trained these days and unable to do their jobs without resorting to extreme levels of violence. Yea the suspect was resisting and struggling but he was cuffed and not putting the officer's life in grave danger so this officer should be fired and sued.

Before I go to bed I have to say folks… this is murder.

That’s just how brainwashed we have become that we see a handcuffed man get shot dead by police and were debating if its murder or not!
He was struggling. Unless this guy is Harry Houdini and Rambo combined then by what right did they have to shot him dead for struggling while handcuffed?

No Taser or billy club?

No calling on other officers to subdue the guy… just shoot him dead
pitiful state were in...

yeah thats manslaughter at least I mean the guy is in cuffs and on the ground, just whap him with your nightstick a bit in the shins if you have to and he will eventually comply

this is just a horrible waste of life and a manner of death which few actually deserve

not all cops are bad but all of these types of stories sure are

a reply to: Antipathy17

Guess no one learned from Oscar Grant at the Fruitvale Station.

a reply to: charles1952
There is indeed an article, that gives bullspit excuses.
If these officers were so incapable of handling this prisoner, maybe they could have put a cuff restraining belt on him so he could not "front" his cuffs, this is why these devices are made and employed by EVERY agency in such cases.
OR
If the officers were so incompetent maybe they could have put another set of less barney fife'ish officers on the prisoner.
If this case goes unchecked this will become common place, "Ummm...the perp demonstrated earlier that he could front his cuffs, so I shot him in the back while he was on the ground"...

This was a clear cut case of a coward executing a prisoner.

originally posted by: roadgravel
a reply to: Xcouncil=wisdom
And their remedy for improper tactics is death. Heck of a job.

Just want to reiterate this ^^^
Poor training and poor handling should not end up in deaths of people.
They had him pinned and the shooting officer got up, HE lost control of the situation and "gained" it back by shooting the guy.
And again, fronting your cuffs by your self in a cell is not the same as doing in it the middle of struggle with 2 officer's

After reading about his previous history, I,ve no sympathy for this nasty piece of work. He won't be throwing his weight(s) around anymore.

The police could have managed the situation better though....

a reply to: MrJohnSmith

P.s. to anyone who thinks a tazer would have subdued this man, read the report in the El Paso Times, a tazer had been used on him previously, with no effect. he was also under the influence of perception altering drugs.

By the logic used to let this murderer get of scot free, if the police were to arrest say, Bruce Lee or Chuck Norris, they could just go ahead and blow him away because they have previously seen them demonstrate martial arts prowess.
In other words if a cop runs into someone he can't easily push around he can just shoot them.

a reply to: MrJohnSmith
If you have to shoot an UNARMED opponent who is on the ground and handcuffed, in a 2 against one scenario, you are too big a pussy to be a police officer in the first place.

originally posted by: ArchPlayer
a reply to: Antipathy17

Guess no one learned from Oscar Grant at the Fruitvale Station.

In what regard, to the cop being prosecuted and jailed for a shot period of time on manslaughter? If so, it's nice to see him tried over Grants death but it's seldom that cops are found in complete wrong. It's always black ans white.

originally posted by: MrJohnSmith
After reading about his previous history, I,ve no sympathy for this nasty piece of work. He won't be throwing his weight(s) around anymore.

The police could have managed the situation better though....

..... He was in jail for his past history, going thru his constitutional right of due process
He attacked a cop, he was going to be in jail for a while....
Getting shot in the back lot of the jail is not due process. Does not matter what he did in the PAST, he was paying for it already.
But since the cop could not be bothered by him putting up a fight, he shot him.
Yes i know that tazers might not work on him, but he was cuffed! You can manipulate those cuffs to many different things to stop the perp form doing what ever he is doing, that is the entire point of them!
I will give the cop credit that he was able to only put one bullet in the guy and not the entire magazine, but if that officer never stood up in the first place then the guy would have been awarded his constitutional rights.
And he still would not be throwing his weight around anymore, cause he sure as heck would have met some bigger and badder then him in the slammer.
You don't have to have sympathy for the man, but you should have anger at the police for killing another human being for absolutely no reason

a reply to: MrJohnSmith

That's what I was thinking. Dude was known to be a violent felon, high on DMAA( a known psychoses inducing drug and illegal stimulant), weighed 217 and 5'8 almost all muscle and literally threw grown men off of him while handcuffed.

You're telling me that any of you knowing that Tazers and pain would not work on him, wouldn't pull a gun if you thought he might be a threat? And you can clearly see that he was struck by the guard when the guard was thrown off.
Were there better ways of handling this? Maybe. None of you are law enforcement, in El Paso, and you don't know # about nothing.
This was the same officer who had two months previously bought a homeless guy boots and socks out of his own pocket. So you gotta think, how does the act of accidentally killing a handcuffed prisoner weigh on his conscious?
You know, the thing that every non serial killer has.

I think you guys just love to hate on cops. And I bet most of you would be the first ones dialing 911 if you were in trouble.
A classmate of mine lost his dad in the line of duty. His dad, who everyone knew as an upstanding role model in the community pulled over someone for a traffic violation, not even a misdemeanor. He got shot twice in the throat by a habitual drunk and repeat offender who was driving without a license.
Every day that they step out, one officer doesn't come home. And that's a fact

a reply to: thisguy27
They screwed up! They restrained him improperly at the least. You can't tell me that you are so terrified of this guy that you have no choice but to shoot an unarmed man, but you weren't scared enough to put a cuff belt and shackles on him. If you were really that scared of this guy you should have followed procedure for dealing with a violent offender, you didn't. You rectified your own mistake with murder.

a reply to: thisguy27
How is he a threat if he is handcuffed!
I understand his past was shady, and yes he may of had the intent, but in no way did this man have the means to be able to cause great bodily harm at that time. It was 2 grown men v 1 grown man that was handcuffed with his pants around his ankles. He couldn't eve have kicked them if he wanted, his pants would have stopped him.
He did not throw those men off of him, the officer stood up. They had him pinned down until that point. Yes he was turning over at one point, but that is hardly throwing the men off of him.
It is not just a "maybe" the could have handled it better, they handled it horribly. And then shot him to fix it, great police work. Their job is to get that guy in front a judge, that is how due process works. If you need to rack up the charges on the way for him fighting you, then that is within your right. Shooting the guy cause he is resisting does not call for getting shot and in this case, death.

I am sorry to hear about your friends dad, but I don't see how that is relevant to this thread other then you just trying to add to the state of fear cops allow them self's to operate under and use that to justify every time they shoot some one....
I have the very same chance every time i go outside to get killed, so do you. Almost 7000 people die a day in the United states, and that is a fact.

originally posted by: MrJohnSmith
a reply to: MrJohnSmith

P.s. to anyone who thinks a tazer would have subdued this man, read the report in the El Paso Times, a tazer had been used on him previously, with no effect. he was also under the influence of perception altering drugs.

Was a tazer used? We only have the cops word on this. They wouldn't lie to cover for one of their own would they?

They also say he hit his own head into a door or something. Cops have billy clubs don't they? They wouldn't lie about hitting an inmate would they?