CA pastor orders Christians to ‘isolate’ LGBT kids and then ‘turn them over to Satan’

a reply to: TrueBrit

Hey Trubrit,

Thanks for the thoughtful response and I'm sorry for the delay in responding, but I'm old and I doze off about 9, regardless of the quality of the conversation.

Much of what you've written mirrors my own beliefs/sentiments. However, I think that the pastor in the op is paraphrasing Paul's instructions for a very specific situation . . . A Christian who continues in habitual sin. I confess that because of my own disinclination to condemn others, given my own stack of sins, I read into that habitual sin minus any struggle to overcome it or acknowledgement that it is sin, which on a personal level, I'm hoping has some merit in God's eyes. I don't KNOW that I'm justified in taking that position, but I think it harmonizes with the general tenor of the New Testament as a whole. And I'll add, I don't think the breaking of fellowship neither necessarily nor should be motivated by animus or malice. I think it can and should be done out of obedience and with reluctance, a certain sadness and love.

As to whether or not you've answered my question, not really, but that's probably some fault in the way I've worded it. I was just interested in how you reconciled Paul's instructions with your own views, as you've stated them here, or if you even felt the need to reconcile the two.

Cheers Brit

originally posted by: Spiramirabilis
a reply to: NavyDoc

You can't shut down the hobby lobby dude without some collateral damage to the first amendment and the freedom of speech, so the only thing to really do is exercise freedom of speech in opposition.

I'm all for freedom of speech - I have a problem with turning religious views into laws

:-)

Me too--on both sides of the spectrum. A right wing preacher wants to make a law based on his belief is just as wrong when a left wing one does.

originally posted by: ccross
My first thought is apparently different than most. I recall wording in the Bible similar to "expel the evildoers from your midst" and "ones enemies will be of ones own household". Add this to the fact that while Christ did not discriminate he did usually say something to the effect of "go and sin no more". It seems like most people don't realize that the reason he hung out with sinners was because "the healthy do not need a physician". He did NOT sit with sinners and say "its ok to keep sinning" he sat with them and rebuked their sins.

Similarly people tend to think that we cannot judge anyone. We ABSOLUTELY are called to judge actions, we just have no business judging the condition of anyones soul. It is weird to me that so many people think that Christ would have been an enabler and not called anyone on their sins, in other words they think he would have been "politically correct".

I don't know if what this guy is saying is good or not. All I am saying is that IMO he is not as far off as most seem to think.

spot on. This is a very misleading thread and lots of chearleading about things not stated or out of context. This is in house type of counseling. If you claim to be Christian the judge not lest you be judged is replaced by fruit inspectors who do have rights to inspect those that carry the banner. There are alot of people that seem to demand that we accept that gay sexual sin be relagated to a non sex sin status for those that practice Christianity. The reason why even Christ preached against fornication(outside of marriage, adultery) is stated that we take on the spirit entities in our shell house of water(skin) from the person we laid with. They pass from one to another in this way. FACT: every shaman the world over will tell you that it is through sodomy, in ritual, that he passes on his spirit guides to his chosen disciple when he passes the torch.

It is REALLY REALLY sad that this gay/straight hate christian crowd is now involved, Militantly, with policing in church discipline for believers. This has nothing to do with judging the world. This is in house fruit inspection.

And this part that everyone keeps chanting while in lockstep that gays are born that way, b.s.. The gay gene myth is a lie and proven hoax. Sexual sin is sexual sin and is in the brain. If you are married, christian and addicted to porn, fix the brain to stop the chemicals from racing through you to the point your flesh dictates to the body. If you are caught in adultery, fix the brain. I do feel for the gay crowd. They have become political fodder in this divide and conquor scheme and its meme. We are bombarded in our food and water supply with female synthetic hormones and endocrine disruptors and being sold on veggie diets that rob men of testosterone development that leans us in this direction. Little girls going through puberty at 8, little boys and men growing breasts. What a mess. The brain, its in the brain. Neurons that fire together stay together.

flame away

originally posted by: AfterInfinity
a reply to: olaru12

That guy will be called a "false Christian", even though the majority of Christians will agree with him. I'm of the opinion that 80% of the population in hell will be composed of self-professed Christians.

I agree that many that are doomed will be professed; however, I don't find that very funny; nor do I find it as something i'd be happy about. I find it sad that instead of being loving and accepting as they should, they instead succumb to self righteousness.

I used to be like these people. Maybe not as bad, but I was well on my way. It wasn't until I studied and learned the truth about salvation that my eyes were opened, and I could accept my sexuality.

a reply to: Snarl

The resistance you're drawing attention to occurs mostly in response to its celebration.

The celebration is because their movement was resisted to begin with! if it wasn;t for the initial resistance(And now), they would not be celebrating!!!

originally posted by: ccross
My first thought is apparently different than most. I recall wording in the Bible similar to "expel the evildoers from your midst" and "ones enemies will be of ones own household". Add this to the fact that while Christ did not discriminate he did usually say something to the effect of "go and sin no more". It seems like most people don't realize that the reason he hung out with sinners was because "the healthy do not need a physician". He did NOT sit with sinners and say "its ok to keep sinning" he sat with them and rebuked their sins.

Similarly people tend to think that we cannot judge anyone. We ABSOLUTELY are called to judge actions, we just have no business judging the condition of anyones soul. It is weird to me that so many people think that Christ would have been an enabler and not called anyone on their sins, in other words they think he would have been "politically correct".

I don't know if what this guy is saying is good or not. All I am saying is that IMO he is not as far off as most seem to think.

It is only your assumption that Jesus sat with sinners to rebuke them of their ways. Do you really think Jesus would have been welcome to sit with them if all He did was condemn? They seemed to really like His presence.

The admonition Jesus gave to the prostitute when He said "Go and sin no more" was something akin to a rhetorical (?) statement. He knew she would sin somehow; if not by being a prostitute, definitely in some other way. As it says we all have sin, no one is perfect. Turning away from ones own sins is not a requirement to become saved; you also cannot sin to such a degree that you lose your salvation. God knows everything, correct? Then by this logic, would He give you salvation only to take it back because you did something wrong? Can you take a being who is omniscient by surprise?

If not, then He saved you KNOWING everything you'd do in your life. He saved you knowing each and every time you'd commit a sinful act.

So, what is my point? Whether or not homosexuality is a sin (there is no real proof it is), it is useless to argue about it as the sins you do would be just as bad. This is splitting hairs. It makes absolutely no difference.

originally posted by: rupertg
I don't have enough hate in my heart to ever be a true Christian.

Hate is not at all required to be a true Christian; the opposite is, however.

This looks like the easist route for a long post that has so many things wrong with it

NOPE, you got it all wrong. Alot of assumptions that only support your own thoughts.a reply to: JudgeEden

Ok, He is omniscient, yes. But He has promised to always provide away from sinning against Him. Always remember it is against Him that we transgress. It is He that we need to seek forgiveness. And He asks that we first seek to make it right with our brothers and sisters first, before we come to Him. We must forgive others if we seekHis forgiveness.

someone spoke about all the crap that they are dumping into our environment water and food ect.

These chemicals are effecting the sexual abilities of lower forms of animals. Is it that great a leap to think that it may be screwing with ours also? estrogen like hormones. up till recently the amount of these hormones would be limited to the number of women in an area wouldn't they? Could too many women relieving themselves in in an area that would cause the contaminaton of the water supply would have a similar effect wouldn't it?

could this cause the condition that we refer to as homosexual? Could it be just nature's way of humanely reducing an overpopulated area? Which I would have to say is much more human than man's way of dealing with it! Genocide wars and such???

Could our reckless use of chemicals be signaling mother nature that there's a problem so all so naturally her first response is naturally to reduce it by causing a portion of the population to be drawn to the same sex?

If this is the case the who is the bigger sinner? The homosexual or the society that is so recklessly throwing around the chemicals?
Whoa be to him that CAUSETH the sin!!!
So many sins are the results of other more damaging sins.
There wouldn't have been so many prostitutes in the past if the societies weren't so effectively designed to to create a dependency of the women to their male "guardians"!!

And it is quite possible that there wouldn't be so many homosexuals today if our society wasn't so geared to promote profits and products that our environment is a worthy sacrifice to obtain them!

More than likely most of l will sin sometime this week! And I have no idea if God considers homosexuality a greater sin than mine. That is up to him to decide and his answer might be quite personal for each individual. But in a world were presidents and congressmen lie for the priviledge of killing masses of people and destroying economies and financial institutions can lie cheat and steal from their customers with no repercussions for some reason I don't think that the really rather harmless act of homosexuality is the greatest sin in this country!
Fools like this pastor will watch as the corrupt leaders of this nation destroy it and bring it down to third world status all the while pointing their finger at the gays claiming that it's all god's wrath because we allow them to exist within our midst!
When the truth is that he is just as much to blame as anyone else because he not only didn't do a thing about what the leaders were doing but diverted his congregation to this small rather harmless problem (if it is even a problem) instead of pointing their fingers at the guilty ones and warning the people of what is to come!

originally posted by: jjsr420
All this talk of religion and jesus. Can anyone prove, outside of your precious little religious book, that jesus existed? I mean -factual sourced- proof. Blind faith = ignorance.

I think Gorge Carline said it best:
Religion convinced the world that there's an invisible man in the sky who watches everything you do. And there's 10 things he doesn't want you to do or else you'll to to a burning place with a lake of fire until the end of eternity. But he loves you! ...And he needs money! He's all powerful, but he can't handle money! [George Carlin, fromalbum "You Are All Diseased" (it can also be found in the book "Napalm and Silly Putty".]

Here's a little question about your beloved, all-powerful God: Can god, or can god not, create a boulder which he himself can not lift?

Ill make it easy and give you the answer: Its a paradox disproving the idea of omnipotence. If god can create it his power isnt infinite because he cant life it. If he cant create it his power isnt infinite because he cant create it.

What this pastor is doin is horrible. I have -alot- of gay friends, and this really offends me. Theyre good people, who deserve the same respect as everyone else. Pointblankperiod.com

C
Jock Sr.

Hmm, this topic isn't about that, is it? Go and read the thread title again, will you please....i'll wait.

You could have left all of that irrelevant garbage out and just typed that last paragraph. No one cares to prove to you the existence of Jesus.

a reply to: 0zzymand0s

It is not a sin to eat bacon since the apostle had the vision of the sheet lowered from heaven with all manner of beasts upon it and the lord told him to kill and eat, it was also a parable for the jewish sectarian christians whom believed a gentile should not be allowed to be called a christian.
Are we not all damned to hell and only through christ find our salvation but still we must at least try to live good, there choice is between two consenting adults but they show they love one another more than god but they another flaw we tend most of us to have.
I do not judge them or condemn them but neither can I support them against the law and will of my lord and god but I would not doubt the good ones get to heaven the same as anyone else whom god finds faultless through the blood of the lamb and I will explain my point.
A woman called mary magdelain whom became an apostle after and modern blasphemer's further anti christian lies by saying he married her, was saved after she was dragged to a place to be stoned for an act of adultary (which could have meant many things but she probably was in love with a married man or may have even been a lady of the night) as happens today to little girls on backward parts of the world, Jesus became angry so he walked over and stopped the stoneing then picked up a stone, stood there looking at the crown with the eyes of the judge and said to them "Let whomsoever is without a sin cast the first stone", his voice and presence as well as his reputation stopped them in there tracks and they dropped there stones which was lucky for them as before them stood there judge, as they dropped there stones he too dropped his last of all and said to the crowd "Then neither shall I" and remember he also said "Judge not or you shall be judged".
I am far from perfect and I do not judge these people, indeed I see them as my brothers and sisters in god.

originally posted by: jjsr420
Can anyone prove, outside of your precious little religious book, that jesus existed? I mean -factual sourced- proof. Blind faith = ignorance.

Absolutely...

He can and he WILL give you proof.

I can say this because I experienced it PERSONALLY.

This type of experience will erase any and all doubt from a persons mind BTW.

One supernatural experience can completely transform a persons beliefs in a New York second.

This is why so many atheists who have had NDE's are no longer atheists.

When God shows up, things CHANGE.

Here is just ONE example of this happening.

FYI: everyone has blind faith in SOMETHING.

I checked this pastor out, he is really old time religion, he doesn't like Pentecostals or Catholics either.

youtu.be...

Once again, people profess to be Christians while acting like the Philistines that Christ spoke against.

It's much easier to worship a god when you're the one making the rules, no?

originally posted by: scolai
Once again, people profess to be Christians while acting like the Philistines that Christ spoke against.

It's much easier to worship a god when you're the one making the rules, no?

Welcome to Burger King...

originally posted by: scolai
Once again, people profess to be Christians while acting like the Philistines that Christ spoke against.

It's much easier to worship a god when you're the one making the rules, no?

really. Can you help me find some of those quotes from Messiah?
Or did you mean pharisees?

originally posted by: JudgeEden

originally posted by: rupertg
I don't have enough hate in my heart to ever be a true Christian.

Hate is not at all required to be a true Christian; the opposite is, however.

Then someone needs to tell the "Hell-fire and damnation" extreme rightwing style Christians because from my perspective; they have taken over the GOP and are going to institute an corporate theocracy ala "1984" with "Big Brother" as the new GOD.

Reality often mimics art....

a reply to: Murgatroid

I'm atheist. I've had all sorts of out of body experiences, premonitions, and the like.

In one of my OBE's I encountered a very tall gaunt man in a long white robe. He told me I needed to stay in the physical world.

Did that make me believe in God? NOPE. So don't generalize atheists. They are individuals with only one thing connecting them, lack of belief in a god.

a reply to: Annee

Like I said, everyone has blind faith in something.

I USE to be an atheist as well.

I just found it impossible to remain that way after God showed up in the house...

I would be an Athiest too if I had that much faith... ~ Mark Lowry

originally posted by: olaru12

originally posted by: JudgeEden

originally posted by: rupertg
I don't have enough hate in my heart to ever be a true Christian.

Hate is not at all required to be a true Christian; the opposite is, however.

Then someone needs to tell the "Hell-fire and damnation" extreme rightwing style Christians because from my perspective; they have taken over the GOP and are going to institute an corporate theocracy ala "1984" with "Big Brother" as the new GOD.

Reality often mimics art....

And art imitates reality...