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Creationism Will be the End of Cristianity.

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posted on Jun, 18 2014 @ 07:18 PM
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a reply to: mOjOm

well for the record, the diversity of world views in ancient egypt is what made it the longest existing human civilization in human history.
edit on 18-6-2014 by undo because: (no reason given)




posted on Jun, 18 2014 @ 07:27 PM
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a reply to: undo

Well for the record this isn't ancient Egypt.

A lot has changed since then and we are talking the entire planet too. I kinda doubt that ancient Egypt had a huge variety of World Views either. Being that right now we have thousands of various Religions as well as Non Religious Philosophies and Plain Non Religious, I'm going to guess that as far as the quantity of Wold Views I doubt they had more than we do now.

IMO it has less to do with a variety of World Views than you think. Just a few world views or even one would be fine as long as it wasn't an Exclusive Ideology like many of them are today. If your world view isn't about Control over some Single Most High Truth but instead is accepting of others, even if and when they don't agree with you, then everything is still ok. It's not a majority that screws things up it's Intolerance that does the damage. That goes for minorities too.



posted on Jun, 18 2014 @ 07:35 PM
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a reply to: mOjOm

from the perspective of a non-atheist, you are making the same Single Most High Truth claim and being intolerant to boot. i mean how much control does atheism have to have? they are in control of the minds of our children, which they force us to send to their brain washing sessions lol you have no idea how good atheism as a world view, has it right now, and how completely intolerant the world view is against any other world view. there's no wiggle room in there. the closest i have seen to wiggle room is carl sagan's description of the 4th dimension.



posted on Jun, 18 2014 @ 08:00 PM
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originally posted by: Agree2Disagree

originally posted by: ArtemisE



Beliefs of any kind? Like it sure would be a shame if nazism disappeared or what about racial superiority or slavery types???

That is some awsome logic...

Or really if a belief system you follow were to die out. That's the only real problem huh?


It really is a shame you pretend to know me. I am NOT a creationist.

also if you notice, I'm not the one that said I support belief systems in all walks of life....barcs was....
Your statement should be redirected to him...

A2D



But your a Christian and the topic was could creationism hurt/end Christianity.


Yea. I apologize if I reply to the wrong person.... Or if I use the word you, as if I mean you in particular. This is all text so it's hard to interpret without voice tone and such.



posted on Jun, 18 2014 @ 08:03 PM
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originally posted by: undo
a reply to: mOjOm

from the perspective of a non-atheist, you are making the same Single Most High Truth claim and being intolerant to boot. i mean how much control does atheism have to have? they are in control of the minds of our children, which they force us to send to their brain washing sessions lol you have no idea how good atheism as a world view, has it right now, and how completely intolerant the world view is against any other world view. there's no wiggle room in there. the closest i have seen to wiggle room is carl sagan's description of the 4th dimension.


What are you talking about?? I'm not atheist but agnostic and I'm not claiming any Most High Truth.

Atheism isn't in control of anything. You must be crazy to think that. Your problem is you think anyone who isn't some devout Religious follower is therefor Atheist. How the hell is Atheism in control with the majority of the world being Religious???

You, like many others seem to hate that science is dominating over theology, even though science isn't dominated by atheists either but it is secular.

Control of the minds of children??? What kind of paranoid statement is that anyway??? As if all the crazy religions haven't been doing that forever now and are still at it today. You may not like science but it works, the proof of which is that we are talking right now using electricity moving at near light speed across the globe in a house with all the modern comforts and so on and so forth...

I'm not saying science is perfect, but it doesn't claim to be. Religion on the other hand does claim divine perfection but delivers nothing but superstitions and fantasy.



posted on Jun, 18 2014 @ 08:06 PM
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originally posted by: undo
a reply to: mOjOm

from the perspective of a non-atheist, you are making the same Single Most High Truth claim and being intolerant to boot. i mean how much control does atheism have to have? they are in control of the minds of our children, which they force us to send to their brain washing sessions lol you have no idea how good atheism as a world view, has it right now, and how completely intolerant the world view is against any other world view. there's no wiggle room in there. the closest i have seen to wiggle room is carl sagan's description of the 4th dimension.


Atheism is viewing the world as if there's nothing supernatural. Atheism is facts only, like science. Religion is faith in the supernatural.

You can't use the supernatural in court. You can't teach the supernatural in school. It would be a disaster!!!



posted on Jun, 18 2014 @ 08:07 PM
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a reply to: ArtemisE

well you can address it to me cause i'm a creationist. hehe
well i have secondary theory on a back burner waiting for confirmation.
that is, that there have been three rounds of evoultion, each one
culminating in a sentient version at the top of the food chain,
starting with amphibians. then reptiles. then mammals. each time,
rising to high technological levels and summarily wiping out anyone
on the surface of the planet. meaning there are potentially smart
frog people out there in space that originally hailed from here, who
escaped the cataclsym that destroyed the planet before they left or
prepetrated it.
but, that's still contingent on the idea that each of the sentient versions
were created from the previous sentient version by an advanced being
referred to as god, each time getting
new upgrades that the previous version didn't have. or in some cases,
downgrades or both.
edit on 18-6-2014 by undo because: (no reason given)



posted on Jun, 18 2014 @ 08:09 PM
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a reply to: ArtemisE

i like the neutral stance of atheism in the public sector, provided it stays neutral, but when it gets all fundie about it, and cheers on the end of ideologies it doesn't agree with, that's when i don't like it anymore, but i don't blame them because i think this whole planet is being victimized.



posted on Jun, 18 2014 @ 08:12 PM
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originally posted by: mOjOm

originally posted by: undo
a reply to: mOjOm

from the perspective of a non-atheist, you are making the same Single Most High Truth claim and being intolerant to boot. i mean how much control does atheism have to have? they are in control of the minds of our children, which they force us to send to their brain washing sessions lol you have no idea how good atheism as a world view, has it right now, and how completely intolerant the world view is against any other world view. there's no wiggle room in there. the closest i have seen to wiggle room is carl sagan's description of the 4th dimension.


What are you talking about?? I'm not atheist but agnostic and I'm not claiming any Most High Truth.

Atheism isn't in control of anything. You must be crazy to think that. Your problem is you think anyone who isn't some devout Religious follower is therefor Atheist. How the hell is Atheism in control with the majority of the world being Religious???

You, like many others seem to hate that science is dominating over theology, even though science isn't dominated by atheists either but it is secular.

Control of the minds of children??? What kind of paranoid statement is that anyway??? As if all the crazy religions haven't been doing that forever now and are still at it today. You may not like science but it works, the proof of which is that we are talking right now using electricity moving at near light speed across the globe in a house with all the modern comforts and so on and so forth...

I'm not saying science is perfect, but it doesn't claim to be. Religion on the other hand does claim divine perfection but delivers nothing but superstitions and fantasy.



Really what it is........is that we are screwing with the brainwashing they are doing with their kids. Our science disproving the infallibility of the bible and all...



posted on Jun, 18 2014 @ 08:19 PM
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a reply to: ArtemisE

Yes I am a Christian....but most certainly not a typical one by any means....

and while extreme creationism can be detrimental to Christianity as a whole, it will by no means be the end of it. A lot of evil has been perpetrated in the name of religion in general, and Christianity specifically, but it's people like me that keep going....

I know these people don't represent my faith...so they could never impact my faith....
They could however impact someone's view from the outside about my faith...if that person counted us as the same...

I hope that makes sense....(my brain sometimes........
)

A2D



posted on Jun, 18 2014 @ 08:24 PM
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a reply to: mOjOm

let me put it this way: remember when the catholic church forced people to undergo their brand of education? well, same idea. they were the pentultimate purveyors of truth and would brook no evidence from anyone else. in fact, it was their tendency to do this that lead to the enlightenment, which removed them from ultimate power. (although i theorize they are still in charge of the planet. they just have people in every world view big enough to effect public opinion and lead it around using sciences like psychology, to manipulate it.)

that's why atheism has went from the neutrality of things like deism, to the hard core atheism where we are mandated by law, to send our children to schools where they are brainwashed into believing things that may or may not be completely true. you realize, that whole approach to other people's world views is isolated to a few select groups that repeat this same thing through out history?



posted on Jun, 18 2014 @ 08:43 PM
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This is similar on how I view religion. Someone's Faith is supposed to be personal, not thrown around or pushed on people of another faith or no faith. But that just isn't the case with exclusive religions. The rest of us are caught between religious wars, religious extremism, sometimes Racism, Sexism, etc. They're on TV and Radio calling everyone sinners, passing laws to legalize discrimination, removing Science from Science Class. I know it's not all of them but the radicals are going off totally unchecked and I personally think it should be the rest of the Normal Christians who set them straight. But maybe there are no Normal ones left and that is why they don't say anything, it's hard to tell anymore.



posted on Jun, 18 2014 @ 09:00 PM
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originally posted by: mOjOm
This is similar on how I view religion. Someone's Faith is supposed to be personal, not thrown around or pushed on people of another faith or no faith. But that just isn't the case with exclusive religions. The rest of us are caught between religious wars, religious extremism, sometimes Racism, Sexism, etc. They're on TV and Radio calling everyone sinners, passing laws to legalize discrimination, removing Science from Science Class. I know it's not all of them but the radicals are going off totally unchecked and I personally think it should be the rest of the Normal Christians who set them straight. But maybe there are no Normal ones left and that is why they don't say anything, it's hard to tell anymore.


oh i agree that religion can and has been abused. for all its atheism, communist russia was not exactly woman friendly. see this is a very sensitive area. let me give you a near perfect example of how this can all go very badly very quickly

religion has historically abused women. we refer to this as sexism. jesus did not teach sexism. women were supposed to be equal to men, 2000 years ago. but the world view was hijacked by rome. many religions, to this day, take a dim view of women and the ones who claim they don't usually use their "goddess" figures as an indication that they don't. unfortunately, the goddess and the female human population were 2 different things, and so the women were often treated just as badly, if not worse in some cases,than the religions where women were just chattal.

but for all its ugly mistakes, religion doesn't hold a candle to the extremes that can be and are reached in an atheistic world view. before you freak out, allow me to explain.

in an atheistic world view, the increase in a population can be viewed in very stark matter of factness-- that is, women create more children, like heifers create more cows and does create more deer. mao saw china's success in a large population, so encouraged the women to have more babies. the current communist party, discourages more population by isolating the population to 1 or 2 children per couple . this has resulted in the abortion of female children specifically, to the tune of 500,000,000 females (they have since outlawed sex selective abortion).

now this is partially the fault of the traditional chinese view about female children, but, and here's the clincher, the chinese government knew this about their people and still did it, because to them, females are just heifers in a herd. on its face, that's about the same as saying chattal. the big difference is the sheer number of female children. and the actual number is probably much larger because many are murdered at birth by their own mothers/fathers, who can't afford to pay the fines and so on, for having more than one child.

that kind of "ends justifies the means" mentality is a product of logic and reason, but it lacks things like human compassion.



posted on Jun, 18 2014 @ 09:00 PM
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originally posted by: undo
that's why atheism has went from the neutrality of things like deism, to the hard core atheism where we are mandated by law, to send our children to schools where they are brainwashed into believing things that may or may not be completely true. you realize, that whole approach to other people's world views is isolated to a few select groups that repeat this same thing through out history?


I know there are some radical atheists out there but I don't think they have as much control as you think. Even within the Sciences there are many people who are Religious. And nobody mandates your kids must go to secular schools either. You can send them to private schools if you want. But if you send them to a Secular School and they have a Science Class then expect them to learn Science. What else would you have them learn in Science Class if not Science???

As far as being brainwashed, I'm not sure how to even respond to that. Sure some areas of Science are theoretical but even science theory is based upon factual evidence and it's always open for change or correction. It's also backed up by Repeatable Experiments and Observations which can be repeated by anyone as well as peer reviewed. It may not be correct all the time but it's got a pretty good track record up until now. While the alternative just seems to be a whole lot non verifiable tales about paranormal events, morality, etc. Those are all subjective and there is nothing scientific about them.



posted on Jun, 18 2014 @ 09:01 PM
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a reply to: mOjOm


I know it's not all of them but the radicals are going off totally unchecked and I personally think it should be the rest of the Normal Christians who set them straight. But maybe there are no Normal ones left and that is why they don't say anything, it's hard to tell anymore.


You should understand...the "normal Christians" have tried...trust me...we just get told the same thing anybody else that isn't a Christian gets told....there is no keeping these guys in check....(freedom sometimes causes abuse...ie give em an inch they take a mile)

A2D



posted on Jun, 18 2014 @ 09:03 PM
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a reply to: mOjOm

note my post above yours



posted on Jun, 18 2014 @ 09:34 PM
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a reply to: undo

Ok, let's talk about this population thing. Rather than represent one side or the other, I'm going to give you my perspective as a Non-Religious person which I think would also fit for many other people, even some Religious ones as well.

Population is a very unstable thing to try and figure out with total accuracy. However, when it comes to the math behind Exponential Growth and/or Doubling within a population things are pretty clear. I don't know how much you know about the math side of it, but to put it simply, things get out of hand REALLY QUICK and typically when you notice it, you're almost too late. Example, if I gave you a penny at the 1st of the month, then 2 the next day, then 4, then 8, and continue to double it until the end of the month what happens??? It stays pretty normal for almost the whole month, but it's those last few days that explode out of control. Same with population and if you wait until the last couple of days, you're probably too late.

Nobody, except some psychos maybe, like the idea of population control. But it has to be done in some way or we will literally wipe out everything. Even if we don't wipe out us and everything else in the process, just breeding too much at a certain point causes many other problems. Most significant of those are resource management and human rights and value. It sounds cold and heartless but it's not. It's not what I would consider compassion to let people breed themselves into extinction or even a period of prolonged low quality of life. Abortion isn't a wonderful thing, certainly preventing it using other methods is better, but it is needed in some cases. We live in a finite environment with finite resources. The best option is a population where there is enough for everyone. That plus when you have too many people, the value of each individual is reduced. That is a bummer to think about it like that, but it's true. China, like you said, makes a great example of that.

Basically though, I'm not saying we should kill people off. That is just madness. We do need to slow our growth and the sooner we understand that the less drastic the method of doing will be. When you really understand the situation you realize that not doing something out of compassion is a bad thing because the Heart may be sincere but it's also stupid sometimes and you should have used your head instead. While Abortion may seem cruel, I find it far less cruel than letting a child be born into a f**ked up world where they're most likely to starve to death young, die from poverty and disease, have no value as a person and be used like a slave or other horrible possibilities.



posted on Jun, 18 2014 @ 09:40 PM
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So, for the atheists that see science as the antithesis of God what are your views on M Theory?



posted on Jun, 18 2014 @ 09:42 PM
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a reply to: mOjOm

let me put it into perspective for you:

its called female infanticide. you should look it up. it's an epidemic in some places. mostly due to religion, but also due to some atheistic governments using that situation to their advantage.

female infanticide means they are wiping out a gender. it may seem logical for future purposes, but it is genocide of a very specific nature. not only did they turn a blind eye to it for 10 years, it resulted in the orphanges being filled with females almost exclusively and many more murdered by their parents after they were born. the government knew this would happen. cold logic can kiss my shiny white hiney.



posted on Jun, 18 2014 @ 09:54 PM
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a reply to: undo

Actually that kind of madness I wouldn't even consider logic either. They may say it was all just logical reasoning that made that, but that is clearly madness. Logic doesn't lead to that kind of thinking. They are using "Cold Hard Logic" as a scapegoat at that point to justify criminal actions.

Sexism, Racism, etc. are anything but logical. Logic is Reasonable. I doubt there is any reasonable position one could show where Women, just because of their sex, should be treated in such a way.




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