Gold Produced From Ground Up Beer Bottles

originally posted by: ErosA433
It is well known that Heat exchange is more effective with a high surface area, this is exactly what I said. I suggest you look up specific heat capacity as it is basic physics that you seem to not understand.

That is exactly what I have been saying too. Pulverizing the glass increases surface area, which increases heat exchange. So again, your blatant inability to read has caused you to insult my intelligence.

originally posted by: ErosA433
The application of electric fields is to remove ions and particulates that spoil the heat transfer by blocking pipes and.... reducing the surface area available. So cheers, maybe you should learn to read and comprehend. Rather than skimming something and saying "AHA!"

Now you have gone and confused yourself because of your lack of reading comprehension.

originally posted by: ErosA433
Heat transfer is more efficient, yes, bulk heat energy required = same.

No it is not the same.

To clarify we are talking about the energy required to melt pulverized glass, compared to chunky glass. Because of the air pockets in the chunky glass, it will take more time and energy to melt the glass for reasons already stated. Energy absorbed by the air, and not the glass, is a waste.

Wow, are you people serious here? Do I have to teach you everything?

originally posted by: AnarchoCapitalist
According to Blue Eagle Refiners Inc, they can produce up to 400oz of pure gold from 1 ton of empty beer bottles. Their process and rate of gold production far exceeds the production rates of the best gold mines.

Assuming these guys are legit, that pretty much puts the gold standard out of running contention for any future monetary system. A large part of what makes gold worth so much is its rarity. If it can be produced cheaper than nickle, say goodbye to its long term value.

Thank God we have Bitcoin and Darkcoin now.

vimeo.com...

Amazing Alchemical Gold Making Technology eclipses what is popularly known in science and produces gold from barren artificial seed ores under LENR conditions. Bottom line is the proof is in the metal and as a former sceptic myself I can appreciate that position. What has been surprising in sharing the development story is how many of these authoritative fools dismiss the possibility, without even looking at the data. Notwithstanding the objections from the conventional scientific perspective, we do in fact have a proven precious metal making technology, US Patent Pending, and we see an executable technology pathway to industrial smelter scale with precious metal production price points near that of Aluminum.

Kitco recently did an article on them here. Kitco is a HIGHLY REPUTABLE precious metals news website.

It's also worth noting that this discovery undermines the standard model of cosmological element production. However, it fits neatly within the framework of plasma cosmology.

Beer bottle to Gold? Um, excuse me for being extremely skeptical. Just in case, if this were true....Do ya think the price of silver would go up? This kind of reminds me of the Alchemical story from the 15th century when Helvetius was convinced that he turned base metal into pure gold.

Anyway, if this is any kind of gold, it is probably drunken fools gold. But I highly doubt it's that. Probably beer bottles from the 15th century that never got drunk. They're probably creating piss.

ATTENTION.. THIS IS A PUBLIC SERVICE ANNOUNCEMENT

We all need to take a breath and cool down a bit please.

When signing up to be a member on ATS you had to agree to adhere to "ALL" the Terms and Conditions (T&C's) of our website.

That means you agreed to discuss topics without any finger-pointing, name-calling, bad-mouthing, and/or spewing off how one is or isn't ignorant. If you can not do that then I'm going to recommend that this thread be closed, and that would be sad as I'm quite interested in hearing what everyone has to say on this topic. But we have to consider what's best for the membership of ATS, so please, relax, count to ten, then if you can respond in a 'diplomatic way', then please do so. If you can not do so, well then thank you for stopping by and please move to another thread that has caught your interest.

If you can not get past the "Someone is stupid on the internet because they don't agree with me" mindset, then you need to take a sabbatical.... If you can not show in a calm fashion why your thoughts and theories are correct, then you need to take a rest... If you believe your above the T&C's, then you are so sadly mistaken that you should simply do everyone a great favor and not let the door hit you as your leaving...

With that said, I hope we can now continue forward in a positive manner on this topic..


Thank You,
Johnny Anonymous (Moderator)
(A member of ATS Staff that doesn't really want to have to Moderate or report anyone on this thread)

Basic thermodynamics

The energy required physically, to heat 1 kg of broken glass is the same regardless of its form. What you did not comprehend was that the effectiveness of heat transfer does not change the total amount of heat required.

If it takes 1000 joules to warm a sample of glass to 200C, and you have a system that can only heat a small part of that, then the heat transfer is low, so it might be say... 20 watts but your heat source produces 200W, this means it takes you 50 seconds to warm up your glass to 200C,

In that 50 seconds you just spent 10,000 Joules of energy.

Now, increase the surface area that can be heated and now lets say you can transfer at 100 watts, this means you are done with your heating by the 10 second mark and you only expended 2000 Watts.


Point is, for example, it takes about 0.84 Joules to change the temperature of glass by 1 degree C, it doesn't matter if it is a chunk, powder, or grit.


SO If you read, i agreed with you, but wanted to point out that the way you posed it was wrong and what was causing the confusion. Yes it improves heat transfer, but not the total heat required.

originally posted by: Doodle19815
a reply to: rickymouse

But can't they just manufacture brown glass for this? We spit that stuff out like crazy anyhow for bottling, maybe this will open up some jobs in the manufacturing industry.

This is really cool. I hope it works out. That seems like an awful lot of glass for a small amount of gold though.


ETA - I love that they are doing this in a little shack. And, it seems like grinding a ton of glass by hand would be a REALLY big job.

If this were true, the entire world would start doing it, then the gold would be completely worthless and people would start getting laid off and the glass-gold industry would disappear just like the manufacturing industry.

So If you have any hope of getting a job in the gold-glass industry, enjoy it while you can because it won't be around very long. Gold would be so worthless we would just start buying it from Mexico, it would cost more to manufacture it then to just buy it.

a reply to: ErosA433
I don't understand why it even matters. A 1kw microwave can cost about $0.25 to run for a couple of hours. Even double that amount is pretty insignificant.

Add to that about $0.013 per bottle for scrap glass, $0.005 to grind a bottle, another $0.25 for the cupelling and probably a few cents for the "seed ore" and the call for investors is an obvious red flag.

With the equipment seen in the video he should be able to easily process 10 bottles a day. That would be $250K a year.

originally posted by: grubblesnert
Everyone needs to watch the vimeo.com videolink posted by the OP then ask this one question.

Why, If you can produce a minimum of 200 ounces of gold ( and are currently producing gold) with "kitchen microwave ovens" would you want OR need backers and/or investors?

Why not keep this to yourself, produce your gold, buy your own industrial microwaves and other desired equipment?

200 x 1200-1300 dollars an ounce will by a lot of stuff.

This question along with the other elements of this video leave me thinking this is not legit.

Yeah that's a good question, maybe the guy that's doing this is really that incredibly stupid.

originally posted by: faust833
maybe the guy that's doing this is really that incredibly stupid.

Actually, the incredibly stupid people are those that give them any money or believe the process!

originally posted by: hellobruce

originally posted by: faust833
maybe the guy that's doing this is really that incredibly stupid.

Actually, the incredibly stupid people are those that give them any money or believe the process!

I very much like my ATS brethren (and sisteren) and because I have that much respect for them, I have tried to warn them away from a scam that is very old and very well known. I hope that people do not give their hard earned money to these flim-flam men.

originally posted by: hellobruce

originally posted by: faust833
maybe the guy that's doing this is really that incredibly stupid.

Actually, the incredibly stupid people are those that give them any money or believe the process!

Exactly, and this is why it's a scam!

a reply to: NavyDoc

I was researching zero point or near zero point energy once and that is what brought me to ATS. I was probably a bit stubborn while debating I think mostly because I wanted to believe which is what I think is the case with a few posters here however once evidence and principles were brought to my attention on the subject that went against what I wanted to believe I had to change my position. I wound up with a little more education on the subject and I am glad for it.

I see now that there will be some that hold to their beliefs so strongly regardless of the amount of evidence against those beliefs that they will go so far as to completely fabricate reasons for their position. I don't hold a faith in anything that strongly in fact I thought strong faith of that magnitude was reserved for religion I see now that isn't the case.

So I get that you are trying to keep people from making a bad decision with reason but you should be clear about what you are really up against. Some people on things reason just isn't going to reach.

a reply to: AnarchoCapitalist

Oh ya sure puts a damper on that cosmological element production, and hey hopefully if it becomes easier to produce we will see a lot less craziness over the stuff, you know in some part of the world much like in the past people would kill and enslave for them shiny piece of metal. One thing they probably forgot to mention, if they can make gold from old beer bottles that means that guy who has been saving all those beer bottles and turning them in by the truck load may have a running start on his own personal business.

But that would be irrelevant as it also means that giant company glass makers would be a lot more smarter about there recycling bottles, there is one in my town I think its the largest glass bottle making company in the world, last I heard it was one of the few multi billion dollar companies out there in the state and globe, the others being Boeing and Microsoft. There waste products could literally be gold. Such bizarre things people place importance on.

a reply to: AnarchoCapitalist

There was a thread around here yesterday about an improved method for microprocessing using silicon photonics, so at least in computers and more hightech gadgets the cheep production of gold will come to late. Here it is. LINK! For higher tech gadgets such as cellphones or computers I see them going that route instead of the old wire route, be it copper or gold.

So yes if you can produce gold, for a bunch of other more basic gadgets and parts, and as mass wires to route powers and currents, it would be an efficient increase in power and power loss. Not to mention for things like a space shuttles and there wiring will drive down the cost a lot, even in mundane things like speakers, or for electrical parts in household appliances, this would be a bonus, which before was just way to costly to even think about. But as you know we will see, it will also put many business out of business if gold could be produced.

a reply to: ErosA433

Yes, I agree with you, 1kg of chunky glass will require the same amount of energy to melt as 1kg of pulverized glass. HOWEVER, that is only in a perfect world, if the energy is applied directly and equally to all the glass in both cases, and there are no other materials mixed in it, and you are only heating glass.

To put it differently...

How much energy does it take to heat and melt 1kg of glass which is mixed with 100 cubic centimeters of air?
How much energy does it take to heat and melt 1kg of glass which is mixed with 10 cubic centimeters of air?

It's not the same amount of energy... because some heat is absorbed by the air pockets and bubbles, and when some of the pockets of air escape during the process, some of the heat / energy escapes with it.

Chunky glass traps and contains and releases larger air pockets. Pulverized glass contains very small, almost non-existent air pockets. So there is more energy required when it is chunky, and less energy when it is pulverized.

Now do you understand?

It's good to know the math... you get a good ballpark estimate of the energy required to melt the glass. However, in the real world, there are other factors you must account for. It makes your equations a bit more complex.

The difference is minimal the difference is 1j/gk vs 0.84j/gk the mass of the air trapped is tiny. It would only matter for huge vats of material, for a small little crucible shown, it makes no difference, the total change will be of the order of say 0.85 j/gk compared to 0.84 j/g

My point really was that if you like to be taken seriously you need to be pedantic. I understand the difference between paper and reality. As stated, the systems i deal with on a day to day basis is a Cryogenic cooling system, working out heat loads and heat transfer is what I do on a fairly regular basis, it is not something alien to me.


As the above post says though, this doesn't really matter so much, it was just an attempt to gauge if you understood the kind of heat losses and if what you understood that the statements you made did not absolutely make sense in the context given. Claiming people don't know what they are talking about and then pointing fingers providing evidence that actually proves that the people you are against are actually correct, but still claim it as evidence for your cause doesn't really help so much.

Now on the seed ore, It is impossible that they do not contain trace elements. Why do i know this? Well I work on a Dark Matter experiment, and understanding trace element content of materials is extremely important. Rocks of any kind pretty much always contain trace quantities of Uranium and Thorium for example. Now we only have his word for it, but when he mumbles his way through it, and then claims that it is part of the process but doesn't contain gold, nope no gold... it doesn't really go far to suggest why it is there. Nothing says "Pay attention to me" like evasive action, one one side he is saying, look we are being open, but at the same time deflecting any questions with what to me is not a very reasonable statement. Rocks are typically between 40-70% silicates, that leaves 30-60% content as something else, that something else is where his none existent trace elements are contained.

No rock is truly barren except for processed slag.

I just want to add to this thread. Metal transmutation through LENR(cold fusion) has been known for a while.

Larsen’s theory that gold, platinum and several other metals can be created by his process is based on findings by Japanese physicist Prof. Hantaro Nagaoka who successfully transmuted tungsten into gold back in 1924. Nagaoka’s results have been verified by several institutions in recent independent experiments but so far there has been no effort to commercialize the process. “Now that the LENR transmutation process is well understood the use of nanotechnology may change all that”, believes Larsen.

www.kitco.com...

The problem with this glass melting is that there is no science behind it. If true we will need to form a credible theory to why this is happening.

a reply to: an0nThinker

heres the processes used www.microwavegoldkiln.com... but doesnt show where he is sneaking in the gold ore of course.
Hantaro used mercury in his experiment as only a neutron and a few electrons have to be removed
resulting in a few gold and platinum atoms and some free electrons and neutrons.

I don't think arguments about Burger's process matter much.

He says he has the money he needs so it's just a matter of time until he gets his production scaled up.

The proof will be in the pudding.

If he starts pumping out gold with the new plant, that will end all debate about who is right and who is wrong.

originally posted by: AnarchoCapitalist
I don't think arguments about Burger's process matter much.

He says he has the money he needs so it's just a matter of time until he gets his production scaled up.

The proof will be in the pudding.

If he starts pumping out gold with the new plant, that will end all debate about who is right and who is wrong.

Indeed it will. What do you forecast the gold price per ounce will be in, say, three years' time once all this new gold comes on stream?

originally posted by: Rob48
Indeed it will. What do you forecast the gold price per ounce will be in, say, three years' time once all this new gold comes on stream?

Assuming his process works as claimed, hopefully it will be worth as much as aluminum.

It will probably take a bit longer than 3 years for that to happen though.

It's also not clear if Burger will retain exclusive rights to this process, if he will licence it, if foreign nations will allow copycats to enter the market, etc..etc..

It all depends on how fast the global metals production industry will move to utilize the technology.