Not One More !

a reply to: MOMof3

There's that possibility, too. ...and I wish you success with your writing.

I will admit to being curious as to why you would deny the right of women like yourself to defend themselves with a tool that would increase their chances of surviving just such an encounter?

It would seem to me that you'd be the opposite. But since I'm not a mind reader, I can't know.

originally posted by: voyger2
a reply to: thesaneone

I'm not doing anything to your rights:
UMass-Lowell survey shows most Americans support increased gun restrictions
«“The most striking finding in this survey is that the public appears to be far more supportive of reforming our gun laws than Congress appears willing or able to respond,” Dyck said.

“The policy window on reforming gun laws may have closed in the wake of a series of gun-violence tragedies in the last few years, but the support for change still strongly exists among the public,” he said.»

www.masslive.com...

This might be another example of not understanding our country.

It doesn't matter of 299mil Americans believe that something should be done. It is the individual that matters. Our system is designed to preclude "mob rule" and ensure individual rights.

I would be curious to know what regulations anyone can recommend that will have any bearing? Murder is already illegal. So what else do you propose? And, of what you propose....what will it do about murder? Because no amount of bait and switch's will overcome the fact that the term "gun violence" only denotes a difference in the manner of death. Murder is still the problem. If anyone is interested in THAT debate, I am all for it. And I have tons of stuff to recommend all ready to go.

a reply to: seagull

Why would I want to take a gun from others when I have guns? I live in Washington State (rural) and married into a family of wheat farmers and hunters.

One brother became a criminal. The other one was born "off" because my mom tried to abort him drinking lye. If we let him have a gun, bad things would happen. But he could go buy one if we did not control his money and monitored his day.

a reply to: RalagaNarHallas

So this guy was normal and sane that wanted to kill women because of sex? If that is normal, then I am indeed enlightened about men at last.

a reply to: MOMof3

I must have seriously misread your postings then...certainly misinterpreted them. If so, you've my apologies. I'll reread your posts, apparently I missed something somewhere along the way...

Wouldn't be the first time...

a reply to: seagull

I have a problem with giving guns to people who have mental illness. About the gun or weapon itself, I don't like how some americans seem to only have courage when they are packing. Just like criminals.

a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

Murder is the effect what are the causes remove those and you solve the problem...but thats a different thread to this one

a reply to: MOMof3

I see that now. So, you've my apologies for misreading you a bit... Sorry.

I don't like how some americans seem to only have courage when they are packing.

Now here is where we are going to part ways with great enthusiasm...

How is it cowardice, as you imply, to use a handgun to defend yourself from what could be an uneven struggle, in the event of an attack? I just don't understand your thoughts here. In my mind, there is nothing cowardly about using whatever means is available to defend ones self against an attacker...

a reply to: MOMof3

again you dodged my question but ill answer your straw man,no he seemed a bit off but he also seemed to give off plenty of warning signs like i said i dont think every one should be able to own a gun and we have laws that decide that currently, now on to the sex issue if this guy was an example of anything it was affluenza mixed with his own personal inadequacies and lack of confidence all combining into tragedy.if some one is going to kill people over not getting laid (im in a four year dry spell my self but yet no homicidal thoughts ) no amount of laws or legislation will stop them from their goals and as he killed some with the gun more were killed with the car and the knife it goes to show that if some one is intent on doing harm they will plot it out and use any and all tools at their disposal,they cant get a gun make a bomb or home made chemical weapon (surprisingly not hard with skills in chemistry) or the more readily available car .

i think your own bias on your personal issues with your brother could be clouding your judgement in this case as you seem to apply how you perceive your brother to be onto all of the mentally ill.

so ill ask again how do you propose legislation against a protected class of person? what level of mentally ill will qualify?ptsd? bipolar? adhd? anxiety? depression? sexual fetishes? gender identity? computer/internet addiction? where do you draw the arbitrary line and how far will it move either way as new terms are thought up to add more to the prohibited persons category.why is it fair to judge an entire subclass of society based on the actions of a few deranged individuals? why do you want to disarm a group that is statistically more likely to be the victim of a crime then the perpetrator of the crime?

perhaps its the same fear that clouds peoples logic when debating "assault weapons" laws based on cosmetic features something some people obviously have no knowledge of..... like seems to be the case for some and their views on the mentally ill as a culture

www.treatmentadvocacycenter.org...

One in four people with mental illness experiences violence of some type in a given year, a much higher rate than the rest of the population, according to a new analysis of research on the subject. The "meta-analysis" of 21 studies between 1990 and 2010 found the odds of physical, sexual or partner violence for people with a mental illness to be almost four times higher than for adults without any disability – and far higher than for individuals with other disabilities (“Mentally ill often targets of violence,” MedPage Today, Feb. 27).

news.ncsu.edu...

health.usnews.com...

THURSDAY, Feb. 27, 2014 (HealthDay News) -- People with mental illness are much more likely to be the victims of violence than the perpetrators of violent acts, a new study shows. Within a six-month period of time, nearly one-third of adults with a mental health disorder are victimized, the study revealed.

a reply to: khnum

Apparently not.

I refuse to separate "gun violence" from any other type of violence. To the victim, it doesn't matter. They just know the pain of the attack.

So if we are to say "Not one more", we need to refer to murder. To violent attacks. And ignore the means used to commit those crimes. Because it is those crimes that are atrocious, not the gun.

It is a bait and switch discussion. No one wants violence. If you remove all gun violence from the world, what do you do with the rest of the violence? Allow it, because it doesn't involve a gun?

a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

I was referring to murder in general and the societal ills that cause it,to some extent I see your point I have done many years of unarmed combat and martial arts so to me violence is just a tool,you can argue a gun is a tool too,I too have the mentality its better to be judged by 12 than carried by six and would not hesitate to kill to defend myself and my family,actually if your 20ft or less away from your assailant your better off with a knife than a gun Ive seen the FBI training tapes that prove this,but I digress.The problem is society is creating sociopaths with no moral compass that are totally selfish and self centred and that is the problem that has to be tackled.Whether its National Service,boot camps or whatever something needs to be done to stop creating these people.

depts.washington.edu...

Fact 4: The link between mental illness and violence is promoted by the entertainment and news media. "Characters in prime time television portrayed as having a mental illness are depicted as the most dangerous of all demographic groups: 60 percent were shown to be involved in crime or violence" (Mental Health American, 1999). "Most news accounts portray people with mental illness as dangerous" (Wahl, 1995). "The vast majority of news stories on mental illness either focus on other negative characteristics related to people with the disorder (e.g., unpredictability and unsociability) or on medical treatments. Notably absent are positive stories that highlight recovery of many persons with even the most serious of mental illnesses" (Wahl, et al., 2002).

think this plays into the topic at hand quite well as the media tends to go on 24-72 hour bombardment of these shooting stories in turn giving the deranged individuals the attention in death they could never achieve in life link has links to all sources sited in the article

markmanson.net... and more directly related to recent isla vista shooting

a reply to: RalagaNarHallas

By the time a child is 18 the media will have served them up 200 000 acts of violence and 40 000 murders it makes you wonder who the really 'sick' people are

a reply to: khnum

I do not believe it is "the ills of society" that are causing violence. Violence has always been with us. I do not believe it will ever be stopped.

Now, stuff like the whack job in California, or Sandy Hook, or Aurora? That stuff is not societal ill. That is something else. There are causative factors creating something we weren't seeing 50 years ago. I am suspecting an environmental factor/medical factor.

The fact is, as it currently stands violent crime is decreasing. Decreasing rapidly. There are correlations to decreasing lead contamination and the decrease in violent crime, very strong correlations.

So we have these huge outbursts of violence amid a landscape of decreasing violence.

Regardless, guns are not the cause.

a reply to: voyger2

My RIGHTS trumps their dead children.

a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

I suspect too your mass killers aren't natural but manufactured by what or whom is the question.Our most famous mass murderer was a retard with an iq of 70,anyway he was obsessed with the movie Childs Play where Chuckie the lifeless doll comes alive and goes on a murder spree,eventually life imitated art he killed 35 and injured 23 with a Car 15.A SAS Brigadier commented on the near satanic efficiency and feats of arms he accomplished; there were moving head shots,Beirut specials and other feats of arms only the elite are trained to do so if Bryant was the murderer what turned him from a barely functioning human into a killer of special forces calibre....possession by someone or something is the only logical conclusion I can make.

"You state you are not from the U.S, so maybe it's best if you let Americans decide what they want to do with their country and their laws?"

Exactly my friend, hit the nail on the head with that one.

I am a victim of gun violence. I was shot in the chest while i was the victim of an armed robbery. I nearly died from it and I am in constant pain to this day, even though it happened over two years ago. I was shot by a man who was only 20 years old, and I was in California when this happened. If you are unfamiliar, California restricts handgun purchases to people 21 and older.

So despite the law, this criminal still got his hands on a firearm ILLEGALY and nearly murdered me over nothing.

I put my trust in the American Justice System and pursued trying to find the culprit. After 6 months of painstaking pursuit of the police department, I was able to successfully identify the man who shot me and he was put behind bars and awaited trial.

AFTER OVER A YEAR OF TRIAL NONSENSE the criminal took a plea bargain from the DA and was sentenced to 3 years in prison, but only served half-time, of 18 months.

I was shot without medical insurance and my hospital bills were upwards of $1,200,000 dollars. Thats right, 1.2 million. I am financially wrecked for the rest of my life, and deal with chronic pain every day, while he is now free walking the streets, committing more crimes with his gangster buddies.

I should have shot back at him and attained my own justice, instead of having it robbed from me by the Judical system.

a reply to: DeadSeraph

a reply to: khnum

Ahh, you're an Aussie.

yes, that was an interesting case for conspiracy.

I don't foresee American's allowing a single act to catalyze full confiscations.

a reply to: bigfatfurrytexan

There are an estimated 250,000 long arms and 10000 pistols that are on the black market out there not to mention a lot of material buried in packing grease in pvc pipe by those who considered this a prudent measure,one thing about a dictatorship here,there just aren't enough people in uniform to enforce one but theres still plenty of weapons should someone try.

originally posted by: James1982

originally posted by: voyger2
a reply to: DeadSeraph

You should ask yourself, why do I even need to use a gun?

Pause ...

People leave in fear and because of that more fear they create around them.

Pause again please...

Listen to this fathers voice. Really listen to him. Do you believe in him? ... Do you recognize the truth on his voice?

I'm a little guy from a little country, that doesn't understand how can people live safely, when everyone on the street can have gun and start shooting, just because...

You should ask again, why do you even need a gun?

Maybe you have the luxury of living where there are no threats to your life, I do not, millions upon millions of Americans do not.

You talk about this father loosing his son, you fake concern and play on emotions, what about the life of my family, my children if their lives are threatened? You just don't care about them? As someone who had a potentially dangerous situation quashed due to a friend's concealed carry, as well as due to having a family member who defended their home from intruders with a old ruger 10/22, I'm going to keep my guns thank you, and defend anyone else who makes that choice and behaves responsibly with them.

Accidents happen. Nothing is ever going to stop that, ever. There are bad people, they will always be there, always. What you propose does nothing other than remove the ability of the common person to defend themselves when their life is on the line.

Me keeping guns in my home is NOT the cause of this man's loss. You falsely paint the picture as if it were so. It isn't. You are being dishonest, and in your dishonesty you attack good people who simply want to live their lives, be left alone, and defend themselves from the threats of life with everything they have.

You say you aren't from America, then why would you think you'd have any idea about the true nature of guns in America? Many Americans who live under these laws are fooled by media spin, you think it's better because you are overseas? Your governments and media spin the stories just the same, about crazy violent Americans and their guns. It's simply a lie you bought into.

I've never talked to a single person like you yet who is actually educated about guns in America. You go on so loudly proclaiming all these facts about guns in America, well it's time to put up or shut up. What do you know?

Do you know that fully-automatic weapons are NOT common by ANY means in America. There are very very few around, and that number will never go up, only down, as the current stock of full-auto guns is left over from being grandfathered in. Starting price for your bottom of the barrel full autos is near 10 grand. Few people can afford that. To purchase a fully automatic weapon to need to go through extensive background checks, applications, licensing, etc.

Do you know that up until relatively recently all manner of guns could be purchased through mail order catalogs? You could have actual off-the-battlefield guns, not just small arms either.

Do you know up until recently kids would bring their rifles to school WAY more than now. But instead of shooting up the place, they were meeting for their gun club? High school parking lots with cars displaying shotguns and rifles. No mass shootings. Responsible use.

Do you know that the laws that control guns are largely based on how they LOOK, not how they actually function or what they are actually capable of? Did you know there are strict regulations on barrel lengths, types of grips, etc?

Did you know that the Assault Weapons Ban (AWB) which went into effect under clinton banned guns that basically looked scary. The stuff now being called assault weapons. Did you know that under Bush this ban was allowed to expire?

Did you know that anti-gun zealots were crying about how the streets would run red with blood? About how America was going to come crashing down because the ban expired. Did you know after it expired, which allowed Americans to own MORE types and variety of guns, gun violence continued to FALL.

Did you know a "gunshow loophole" is a totally fake, nonexistent thing where anti-gun zealots claim felons can buy guns without any checks because it's a gun show. It's lies and tricks. Did you know every legal vendor at a gun show needs to do every check that any store would do, which means a background check, which can cause a denial for stuff as trivial as open victimless misdemeanors, causing you to wait a few weeks until the detailed check clears?

A normal person can sell a gun to another normal person in this country without having to do a background check. It doesn't matter if we are in a home, standing on the street, or in a gun show, private sales don't need background checks, but that has nothing to do with a gun show.

Did you know gun owners and proponents have been begging to access to this background check database for private sales, but the government doesn't allow it? That means private gun owners and sellers are trying to be responsible when selling firearms but the government won't allow it.

Did you know in America the cities with the strictest gun laws are also the worst cities for violence and gun crime? Did you know this is because unarmed civilians are much easier to beat, rape, and kill than armed ones, and the criminals know that. Do you?

What do you know if you are in your home with wife and child, the door comes crashing in, home invasion is now in your vocabulary. What do you do? Do you think real life is like the movies and you'll do some crazy chuck norris action moves and defend yourself? Do you think these criminals have any sort of honor about abusing women? You can talk about learning martial arts, or being in shape, these do not matter when it's you against three knife/pipe/bat/gun wielding dudes. To defend yourself against that you would need to dedicate your life to fighting, something completely and totally unreasonable and mostly impossible for people. You want everyone to be an MMA fighter? What about old people? Those in bad health? Small people and women?

Do you know that usually cops clean up the mess, not stop it from happening?

Did you know any of these things? What else do you know about guns in America? Please, please educate and tell us all the way things are!

I'm dumbfounded that you haven't received a 100 or more stars for this reply. Well said!