Not One More !

a reply to: khnum

Illegal guns IS already part of their charters. In fact, that is the PRIMARY job of the ATF. Who was the biggest supplier of illegal guns to the Mexican cartels? The US government and the ATF.

originally posted by: khnum
So to stop criminals getting guns in their current numbers what do you do expand the BATF and FBI charters in the illegal gun department,wait we cant do that because the government is the potential énemy'...this is the sort of logic popping up here

No, they, and local and state law enforcement, need to enforce the numerous laws on the books.

Oh, and as the doc just said, stop selling guns to criminals.

a reply to: NavyDoc
Good suggestions ,yes particularly in Sydney and Melbourne there are major drug problems and gangs but generally they only shoot each other not innocent civilians but this is not always the case an innocent bystander was killed recently at an outlaw biker feud.We have the same social ills you do but the fact remains the most killed since the 35 at Port Arthur and the subsequent gun laws in a single incident is 2 people at a university in 2002,the massacres have stopped but yes indescriminate killing continues but most is not by gun Im more concerned about being king hit or knifed than shot.

originally posted by: khnum
We have the same social ills you do but the fact remains the most killed since the 35 at Port Arthur and the subsequent gun laws in a single incident is 2 people at a university in 2002,the massacres have stopped but yes indescriminate killing continues but most is not by gun Im more concerned about being king hit or knifed than shot.

Why are you so fixated on the amount or manner of people's homicides? The fact that they are being killed is the prime concern, or at least it should be.

I gave you major cities in 'gun loving' Texas that had lower per capita murder rates the gun-stifling Brisbane.

This is not a gun issue.

a reply to: khnum

As you said--you still have violence from drug gangs and your gun bans for the law abiding did not help one bit. Like you, the vast majority in violence here is with the illegal drug trade. Therein lies your cause and solution.

originally posted by: voyger2
The chances of surviving against a guy with a Gun are Very Different from a guy with a Knife!

Well, 3 out of 3 down from his knife, 3 out of 3 down from his firearm... looks identical to me.

But then knives lack the melodramatic flair and histrionics the control pimps need to make their emotional based "we have to change" statements. Everybody understands knives. Virtually every adult has, at one time or another, held a knife, sliced a sandwich, or chopped a carrot... kinda difficult for fear mongers to zero in on the jumpy nerve centers if they're trying to demonize something everybody uses without much thought. Firearms, however, oooh... take some schlub that grew up in preppy suburbia, never has held a firearm, never has seen one outside of the sensationalistic bullcrap out of the media and Hollywood. Take that same schlub whose grown up in the brainwashing horsecrap from the left that touts the evils of the gun and Dianne Feinsteins hypocritical ramblings and present him or her with a series of media sensationalized crimes featuring firearms and you got something. You've got a scared little segment of society who is all too eager to give up freedoms they don't even personally appreciate, for themselves and everyone else, in the name of a resumption of their false little sense of security.

The media and the government surely have a book somewhere. I'm guessing it's titled something like "The Tyrant Fear Monger's Cookbook", and they use it like a manual to both manipulate public sentiment and arrouse the exciteable into action. Almost without fail those exciteable few leave the whole nation stuck with worthlessness like the TSA... or Homeland Security... or the ever popular Patriot Act... Thank the Lord they haven't yet found a way to do the same with gun bans...

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

Leftists don't work with facts, they just work with feelings and what the media tells them to think.

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

In 1992 I was in San Francisco and a car backfired people fled into shops and down Bart entrances your society lives in fear because nutcases can get guns,not knives(thats China)or baseball bats or iron bars,but guns.

originally posted by: khnum
In 1992 I was in San Francisco and a car backfired people fled into shops and down Bart entrances your society lives in fear because nutcases can get guns,not knives(thats China)or baseball bats or iron bars,but guns.

So your entire basis for trying to take advantage of these poor people's murders is some pointless anecdotal story from a quarter century ago?

Again, why are you so fixated on the manner of their death when you should be really concerned about the increasing crime rate in your dear Brisbane and that cities in the wild west of Texas have lower homicide rates and they have the damn cartels as neighbors?

a reply to: khnum

Riiiight. I don't believe that because I lived there for several years a d never saw that once in spite of seeing back fires, and loud bangs from dropping stuff at the loading docks, and fireworks, and earthquakes, and nearby military training. You are now trying to make stuff up to sensationalize things when the facts are not in your favor.

In addition, SF has some of the strictest gun control in the country--CCW is impossible unless you are a connected politician. If this happened it us actually evidence that your premise is false.

a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

We have your bottom line the problem is not guns further discussion is pointless

a reply to: NavyDoc

Wrong I was there- it happened the manic street preacher,the homeless sleeping under cardboard over vents,the guy walking around mass with the eat at Joes sign,the guys walking down the street talking loudly and agressively to themselves I can understand tough gun laws there the place has more crazies per capita than anywhere else I know.

originally posted by: khnum
a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

We have your bottom line the problem is not guns further discussion is pointless

Now your getting it. Debating a anti-gun stance with some one who is pro-gun is a waste of time and visa-versa. But us pro-gun people still pick up the gauntlet because we want to educate people that guns are not inherently evil. It's the people who wield them. Any firearm is just a tool, like a hammer or a knife. Nothing more than that.

The majority of the citizens that own firearms are responsible people. Trying to paint the entire firearm community as "Gun nuts" ruffles feathers, as it should.

a reply to: khnum

So you have all of those nut jobs and you ASSUME that the behavior was because of legal gun ownership? It is obvious that your preconceived notions and prejudice clouds your perceptions. Hell, the could have thought it was the cops in their paddy wagon coming again.

originally posted by: khnum
a reply to: AugustusMasonicus

We have your bottom line the problem is not guns further discussion is pointless

He's right, though. The problem isn't guns. Its the people using them. If guns were the problem, homicide rates would be uniform throughout the United States and you would see a direct correlation between firearms ownership and homicides and violent crime. That's usually not the case, however, and many areas with very high rates of firearm ownership have very low rates of violent crime. This applies to most of the 70-80% of the geographic landmass of the country that is rural or semi-rural, as well as small and even midsized towns. The problems typically don't start until you begin looking at larger urban centers, and interestingly, those urban centers tend to have much tougher gun laws than the outlying small towns and rural areas.

a reply to: khnum

"Eat at Joes" sign? Be honest, the only thing you know about SF is watching movies and cartoons.

originally posted by: khnum
We have your bottom line the problem is not guns further discussion is pointless

It certainly was not with Rodgers, he stabbed as many people as he shot and ran another over. This was obviously a mental health issue.

If it were truly a gun issue why does gun-restricting Brisbane have higher per capita homicide rates than some cities in Texas?

And I am still waiting for an answer to my other question.

a reply to: NavyDoc

I was trying to communicate that the incident really did happen and that there are aspects of San Francisco that aren't Willy Wonka's Ghiradelli chocolate factory.

a reply to: NavyDoc

Well after being called a leftist a moron and now a liar Ill take myself elsewhere

Aa reply to: khnum

And I have demonstrated that your claimed incidence has nothing to do with law abiding gun owners. SF is incredibly strict on guns. You cannot legally buy guns or ammunition and outside if leftists politicians like Dianne Feinstein, you cannot legally carry one. Like I said, obviously your preconceived notions and irrational fear of America clouded your perception of an innocuous incident.

BTW, why do you refuse to address the fact that Brisbane has a higher homocide rate than gun living Texas cities?