The thought before a thought............

originally posted by: Joecroft
a reply to: veteranhumanbeing

vethumanbeing:
It is logical and explains how the spirit manifests into matter and visa versa; it explains how spirit (JESUS) became matter (through stages of development to become a heavy mass form) in this case working the top of the tree to the bottom. In our experience WE start at the bottom of the tree and through 'enlightenment' become lighter or loose the physical mass. We achieve 'out of body' or astral experience at Kether;

Joecroft: I don’t wish to derail this thread too much, but how does one achieve this QabalistiK (Tree of Life) “Enlighment”…?
I “out of bodied” without any knowledge of Quabala, Although I ‘m starting to think, that it was the entity I encountered, which pulled me out

Yes, probably; do you remember what this being appeared to you as symbolically? There are 10 distinct personages (human form) each representing the individual sephiroths that represent different levels of the tree (daath is hidden the 8th). Fingle wont think this as derailment it all applies to his subject OP. In answer to your question "how does one achieve enlightenment through study of the 'tree': each ball or 'sephira' on the tree represents a higher knowledge you have gained, therefore your body looses mass. You are becoming mind/spirit over body. This discipline is not confined to the Quabala, Swami Yogis use breathing techniques to achieve mind over matter to the extent they can levitate themselves. The point of studying the Tree is to gain access with your consciousness intact to the universal mind, because once out of body you can travel and explore (the same as you do after leaving this lifetime sans body); this is not easy but is formost printed on the human "to do in this lifetime while in body LIST". Jesus had it easy he just worked backwards from spirit to material (his task was to explain where HE came from the highest sephiroph "Kether or Crown" and how to get back there from Malkuth (the physical kingdom), the mantra: "THE KINGDOM IS WITHIN YOU" is backwards anyway, he should have said "the Kether or heaven is within you to achieve". No wonder no one understood him.

vethumanbeing: Jesus started at Kether and worked his way down the tree. There are stages one goes through (sephiroths bullet points) to achieve this; they are just higher and higher states of being as you climb the tree. This is what was studied so profoundly at Qumran, the Essenes were all over this. Start a thread on this; good call, I'd have to see if one exists already in the ATS library.

Joecoft: It would appear that each of the sephiroths, is a combination of an experience, an emotional centre, and a skill set/qualification within each spiritual state…How each element interacts with it’s intersecting counterpart, is where things become more complex…I would imagine

These are separate temples of the mind. Yes, I'm still working on Malkuth (kingdom material world) a greater ability to discriminate, health problems, 'greater self discovery, contact with elemental forms and beings of nature at deepest level vision of the Holy Guardian Angel, discovery of things hidden within the physical universe, prosperity and security" ibid Ted Andrews pg. 18, Pathworking. From here I go to the 32nd path that connects me with the next sephioph, Yesod (encompasses increased psychic perception, astral projection, overcoming idleness, visions of the universe and how it works, recognizing the DEVINE PLAN).
Understand this, I want to know what Jesus knew and this was one of his methods studied to understand his nature of being, how and why he arrived in the manner he did (there were others involving Hindu teaching).

Joecroft: Thanks for book recommendation…There are some interesting mp3 lectures on the Quabala and the tree of life, on the Gnostic Radio Website; well worth a listen…IMO

Now, why in the world would these teachings be available on the "GNOSTIC RADIO WEBSITE", because the Essenes were Gnostics and they studied the Quabala? snicker (fingers are not crossed behind my back).

vethumanbeing: Bending the rules is my jump off point. You think I am going to accept old dusty failed archetypes (placed on the human throughout all history) as my own?

Joecroft: Your not obliged to accept any kind of archetypes, that you don’t wish to accept; whatever those archetypes maybe (scratches head)…

EXACTLY (definitely not going to invent another dozen for personal entertainment value), still deconstructing at least five existing.

vethumanbeing:
Rules state 'no memory' if you don't remember what you were assigned/tasked to do when you incarnated. I remembered my instructions; as MOST do not.

Joecroft: You remember your instructions…wow…you’re like a thread, just waiting to happen…I’m curious now…I wonder what your instructions were/are…other than, “find Joecroft on ATS”… lol

To begin with find Joecroft; then where he resides (ATS); then that compact ball of yarn began to unwind as if 'HELLO KITTY GOD" was playing with it.

vethumanbeing; This is a key point for any human in this lifetime; first, to understand you are eternal and second what you were schooled over and over again before you incarnated as to your life path here (rectifying past Karma etc.) AS YOU PLANNED THIS LIFE (you just forgot). That is a most hilarious business, because you swore up and down "I WILL REMEMBER" but you don't those are the rules of incarnation. So I have prior memory of being in spirit and planning ALL OF THIS.

Joecroft: “I understand I am eternal”…Check “Being schooled before incarnation”…No Memory, as of yet…

That first one is huge in revelation; get to work on the second one.

vethumanbeing: It depends on what level your spirit resides after you leave this 3d realm. Infinite potentials and possibilities exist; you cannot imagine how free you are to create ANYTHING for yourself. It truly is heaven; you can manifest all your heart desires. The 3D experience you volunteered for was just a game/much harder than what awaits on the other side of physicality.

Joecroft: It could be argued that a reality where you have to strive for your hearts desires, is a more rewarding one, when you achieve it etc… as opposed to a world/reality, where everything just comes easy; but then again, everyone deserves what their heart desires, along with the occasional well needed break, from time to time, to refresh batteries etc…- JC

Sure, your hearts desires or happiness is of course a major concern as those things prolong a healthy life. I'm not in agreement with you that everything material (the gains) comes easily as one works much harder than necessary to achieve it. There are ways to accomplish this without having to struggle. The UNIVERSE is your main ally; ITS ONLY job is to reward you as you are IT (made of the same substances); for some reason people do not ask for its help or cooperation; perhaps they mistake God as something other than the universe (just a binary code with a lot of strong and weak forces attached).

originally posted by: Fingle
a reply to: veteranhumanbeing

Fingle: It is our solitude in separation, that seeks, the something, that is permanent to disguise the truth, which we know, so we may interpret the confusion of our division with the will of thought before…

Solitude being the/our separation from a 'god source'? Are we trying to understand the reason for our being alone without guidance; what defines the permanence or solidifies the notion we actually exist with or without a god source? Fairly certain we know we exist, just do not understand WHY? The only thing that disguises the truth is ones own ignorance (or laziness) in seeking and discovering the mystery of being (why am I here). What is a 'will of thought', to my mind there is only 'free will' and 'self will'.

2.0121 It would, so to speak, appear as an accident, when to a thing
that could exist alone on its own account, subsequently a state
of affairs could be made to fit. If things can occur in atomic facts, this possibility must already lie in them

Ludwig Wittgenstein (1889—1951) Tractatus Logico-Philosophicus
www.gutenberg.org...

No thing having self awareness can exist alone as it has no reference points to determine its existence, it could very easily be imaginary (delusional thinking). Identical atomic particles exist in different places at the same time (my twin exists in the fifth dimension). There are no accidents; there is only the huge force human imagination contributing as a causal to force change upon any or all forms of common/static thinking. I don't force things to fit a perceived referendum; I assume one exists that I may fit into.

a reply to: vethumanbeing

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
Yes, probably; do you remember what this being appeared to you as symbolically? There are 10 distinct personages (human form) each representing the individual sephiroths that represent different levels of the tree (daath is hidden the 8th). Fingle wont think this as derailment it all applies to his subject OP.

I’m referring to the shadow entity, that I mentioned to you a while back.

Symbolically…well, I used to have these recurring and seriously realistic cat dreams, about twice a year without fail, but I haven't had them now for about 4 years. The dreams were so real that at times I didn’t even realize they were dreams. I don’t know for certain but I think there may have been some kind of connection between the cat dreams and the entity I encountered. The large cats ranged from Black Pumas, Lions, Tigers, Leopards, Jaguars etc…so Symbolically, maybe a Big Cat…

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
These are separate temples of the mind. Yes, I'm still working on Malkuth (kingdom material world) a greater ability to discriminate, health problems, 'greater self discovery, contact with elemental forms and beings of nature at deepest level vision of the Holy Guardian Angel, discovery of things hidden within the physical universe, prosperity and security" ibid Ted Andrews pg. 18, Pathworking.

From here I go to the 32nd path that connects me with the next sephioph, Yesod (encompasses increased psychic perception, astral projection, overcoming idleness, visions of the universe and how it works, recognizing the DEVINE PLAN).

What are these 32 paths to get to Yesod…?

The Yesod is apparently the Quabbalistic counter part, of the Christian Holy Spirit. I kind of went though my own inner enlightenment path a while back when I received the Holy Spirit after a long search/journey. Although I now believe in different aspects to what I believed in entirely, at the time I received it. In other word’s, some aspects I think were more important, where as other beliefs/ideas (some of which I’ve let go of now) were not necessary… I kind of accepted truth and lies at the same time, and it was only the truthful parts that got me there…I only ironed out the falsities later on, as I increased my knowledge etc…

Originally posted by Joecroft
Thanks for book recommendation…There are some interesting mp3 lectures on the Quabala and the tree of life, on the Gnostic Radio Website; well worth a listen…IMO

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
Now, why in the world would these teachings be available on the "GNOSTIC RADIO WEBSITE", because the Essenes were Gnostics and they studied the Quabala? snicker (fingers are not crossed behind my back).

I agree, the Essenes, were the proto Christian Gnostics…IMO

According to R. Bultmann, there is strong Scholarly evidence which suggests, that the Essenes were the forerunners, of the Christian Gnostic movement. There is a clear parallel in phraseology and terminology, between Christian Gnostic texts and the Dead Sea Scrolls.

"a pre-Christian Judaism of Gnostic character [gnostisierendes Judentum] which hitherto could be inferred only from later sources is now attested to by the newly discovered Dead Sea Scrolls”

(R. Bultmann, Theologie des Neuen Testaments, 1951, p. 361).

The above extract is referenced on page 3, in (Jewish Gnosticism Merkabah Mysticism and Talmudic Tradition)

Originally posted by Joecroft
You remember your instructions…wow…you’re like a thread, just waiting to happen…I’m curious now…I wonder what your instructions were/are…other than, “find Joecroft on ATS”… lol

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
To begin with find Joecroft; then where he resides (ATS); then that compact ball of yarn began to unwind as if 'HELLO KITTY GOD" was playing with it.

It would be funny, if all that were really true… the find Joecroft part I mean…”your mission, should you chose to accept it” and all that Jazz…followed by the funky music…

Originally posted by Joecroft
“I understand I am eternal”…Check “Being schooled before incarnation”…No Memory, as of yet…

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
That first one is huge in revelation; get to work on the second one.

Yes, a huge revelation, although I think I got there in a rather unique fashion; minus the Quabbala…

As to the second one, I’ think I’m supposed to go through either Hod, or Daath hmmm not sure which…

Originally posted by Joecroft
It could be argued that a reality where you have to strive for your hearts desires, is a more rewarding one, when you achieve it etc… as opposed to a world/reality, where everything just comes easy; but then again, everyone deserves what their heart desires, along with the occasional well needed break, from time to time, to refresh batteries etc…

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
Sure, your hearts desires or happiness is of course a major concern as those things prolong a healthy life. I'm not in agreement with you that everything material (the gains) comes easily as one works much harder than necessary to achieve it.

My reference to a world where “everything just comes easy”, was in connection to a different realm or material world choice, that someone may have chosen, instead of Earth school. But like I was saying above, everyone’s pre-incarnation freewill choice destination is their own…Although IMO this choice is also influenced by the HF’s guidance…


For example; in this realm (Earth) you work hard to achieve something, and therefore it’s more rewarding, than living in an Alice in wonderland utopia, with free tea and biscuits every week, down at the Mad Hatters tea party. Although having said that, option number 2 maybe what ones heart desires, or maybe like I was saying before, they may deserve a well earned break…


- JC

originally posted by: Joecroft
a reply to: veteranhumanbeing

Joecroft: I’m referring to the shadow entity, that I mentioned to you a while back.
Symbolically…well, I used to have these recurring and seriously realistic cat dreams, about twice a year without fail, but I haven't had them now for about 4 years. The dreams were so real that at times I didn’t even realize they were dreams. I don’t know for certain but I think there may have been some kind of connection between the cat dreams and the entity I encountered. The large cats ranged from Black Pumas, Lions, Tigers, Leopards, Jaguars etc…so Symbolically, maybe a Big Cat…

They may not have been dreams at all but astral travel; were you ever hurt or eat/smell anything during these 'realistic dreams'? Ten of the sephiroths have a human attached to them as your magical image of yourself. The hidden 11th (death) has none, that might be your shadow figure. Daath exists in the abyss; or between the lower 7 and upper 3. Its a bridgepoint from the lower more physical planes of consciousness to the higher ethereal planes. As far as a cat image is concerned I've no idea. In my grandmothers culture "Maya" the panther is a demi-god.

vethumanbeing:
These are separate temples of the mind. Yes, I'm still working on Malkuth (kingdom material world) a greater ability to discriminate, health problems, 'greater self discovery, contact with elemental forms and beings of nature at deepest level vision of the Holy Guardian Angel, discovery of things hidden within the physical universe, prosperity and security" ibid Ted Andrews pg. 18, Pathworking.
From here I go to the 32nd path that connects me with the next sephioph, Yesod (encompasses increased psychic perception, astral projection, overcoming idleness, visions of the universe and how it works, recognizing the DEVINE PLAN).

Joecroft: What are these 32 paths to get to Yesod…?
The Yesod is apparently the Quabbalistic counter part, of the Christian Holy Spirit. I kind of went though my own inner enlightenment path a while back when I received the Holy Spirit after a long search/journey. Although I now believe in different aspects to what I believed in entirely, at the time I received it. In other word’s, some aspects I think were more important, where as other beliefs/ideas (some of which I’ve let go of now) were not necessary… I kind of accepted truth and lies at the same time, and it was only the truthful parts that got me there…I only ironed out the falsities later on, as I increased my knowledge etc…

There is only one path to Yesod, the 32nd. This is the path that opens the material to the astral. This is where the evolution of material consciousness opens one to the astral or subconscious plane. "It is the path of ascent to the higher self where we face our fears, there is where our higher self emerges. This path awakens the promise of a new path." ibid Ted Andrews pg 133 "Pathworking".

vethumanbeing:
Now, why in the world would these teachings be available on the "GNOSTIC RADIO WEBSITE", because the Essenes were Gnostics and they studied the Quabala? snicker (fingers are not crossed behind my back).

Joecroft: I agree, the Essenes, were the proto Christian Gnostics…IMO
According to R. Bultmann, there is strong Scholarly evidence which suggests, that the Essenes were the forerunners, of the Christian Gnostic movement. There is a clear parallel in phraseology and terminology, between Christian Gnostic texts and the Dead Sea Scrolls.

"a pre-Christian Judaism of Gnostic character [gnostisierendes Judentum] which hitherto could be inferred only from later sources is now attested to by the newly discovered Dead Sea Scrolls”

(R. Bultmann, Theologie des Neuen Testaments, 1951, p. 361).

The above extract is referenced on page 3, in (Jewish Gnosticism Merkabah Mysticism and Talmudic Tradition)

Thank you; that is meaningful as with your scholarship my (occasional rants of a lunatic nature) "insight" regarding what I KNOW to be true are bolstered; almost tipping the teeder todder of believablily in my favor.

Joecroft:
You remember your instructions…wow…you’re like a thread, just waiting to happen…I’m curious now…I wonder what your instructions were/are…other than, “find Joecroft on ATS”… lol

vethumanbeing:
To begin with find Joecroft; then where he resides (ATS); then that compact ball of yarn began to unwind as if 'HELLO KITTY GOD" was playing with it.

Joecroft: Yes, a huge revelation, although I think I got there in a rather unique fashion; minus the Quabbala…
As to the second one, I’ think I’m supposed to go through either Hod, or Daath hmmm not sure which…
It could be argued that a reality where you have to strive for your hearts desires, is a more rewarding one, when you achieve it etc… as opposed to a world/reality, where everything just comes easy; but then again, everyone deserves what their heart desires, along with the occasional well needed break, from time to time, to refresh batteries etc…

You don't have a choice, you can't hop skip the sephirophs. Each one builds upon the one preceding it, although I skipped to Daath first; and now must go back to understand why I was shown this consciousness FIRST (right out of the gate the hardest and most dangerous one to fathom as it attaches to all others).You did get there without knowledge of the "Tree of Life"; now you yourself are coming into an understanding of what happened to you. Sometimes the critical jumpstart timing does not wait for training/learning (that comes later in the form of enlightenment). If the magickal insert (shadow) that party crashes your life had to wait for you playing catch up; it would never happen (I think its a trigger to push you toward that path of enlighenment). Believe me I know, its happened to me as well.

Joecroft: My reference to a world where “everything just comes easy”, was in connection to a different realm or material world choice, that someone may have chosen, instead of Earth school. But like I was saying above, everyone’s pre-incarnation freewill choice destination is their own…Although IMO this choice is also influenced by the HF’s guidance…
For example; in this realm (Earth) you work hard to achieve something, and therefore it’s more rewarding, than living in an Alice in wonderland utopia, with free tea and biscuits every week, down at the Mad Hatters tea party. Although having said that, option number 2 maybe what ones heart desires, or maybe like I was saying before, they may deserve a well earned break…
- JC

EVERY ENTITY living beyond the 3rd dimension wants "The Earth School Experience". You are already famous (a celebrity) in the higher realms just by having experienced it, (everyone is watching your progress BTW) how did you manage it!, with bribes or pay offs? influential teachers or parents/a legacy job; a scholarship perhaps? I like your Alice reference. There is in so much great literature, Freemasonry and cartoons (childs play) where the "hidden" knowledge is revealed right before your unseeing eyes.

a reply to: Joecroft
The consciousness of (material kingdom Malkuth) on the path to Yesod (increased intuition and psychic abilities astral projection emotional health, regognition of a divine plan at work) :
Path working Benefits: overcoming depression, awakening intuition, dream work, strengthening the light body, astral projection.
Spiritual Experience: Vision of the Holy Guardian Angel and Vision of the Machinery of the Universe.
Life Path Keynote: Awakening to the Spirit.
Hebrew Letter: Tau (the cross).
Astrological Influence: Saturn.
Tarot Designation: The world card(or Universe((Egyptian)) tarot card.
Colors: Indigo and Black
Magickal gifts: The Cauldron and the Girdle.
Tales and Myths: All descent myths, Orpheus and Eurydice, ALICE AND THE LOOKING GLASS (pay attention); Persephone and Pluto; Madagascar tale of Sand Children.
Strengths Achieved: Discrimination, independence, motivation facing fears, common sense, self-discipline, groundedness.
Weaknesses Revealed: Greed, idleness, depression, lack of discipline, hidden fears, lack of feeling, depression. Ibid Ted Andrews Pg 135 "Pathworking".
This system of belief? (or true knowledge) is categorized as being 'western' in thought/development and includes to a great degree the tarot, astrology and a complex He-bray-ick numbers systems attached to that alphabet. This (really hidden) Mystery School is SUPER WILD; NO? What were those rascally Essenes up to exactly besides existing in a state of total GNOSIS.

What I believe is going on in this life is a learning to better understand balance.

There is a natural equilibrium that is always trying to manifest itself.

When the body can no longer maintain homeostasis and dies, it is distributed into the everything.

Everything is nothing and nothing is pure potential.

I should go to sleep....

a reply to: Fingle

a reply to: vethumanbeing

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
They may not have been dreams at all but astral travel; were you ever hurt or eat/smell anything during these 'realistic dreams'? Ten of the sephiroths have a human attached to them as your magical image of yourself. The hidden 11th (death) has none, that might be your shadow figure. Daath exists in the abyss; or between the lower 7 and upper 3. Its a bridgepoint from the lower more physical planes of consciousness to the higher ethereal planes. As far as a cat image is concerned I've no idea. In my grandmothers culture "Maya" the panther is a demi-god.

No, I was never actually harmed in any of my cat dreams…I was just pursued by various big cats; felt pretty scary though at times…as it would, if you didn’t realise you were dreaming, and suddenly a tiger started strolling down your passage way, towards you etc…Oh, and I never ate anything or smelt anything that I can recall…

As for the shadow figure, I think they’re from a lower vibrational realm; I don’t think they have any connection to myself…

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
There is only one path to Yesod, the 32nd. This is the path that opens the material to the astral. This is where the evolution of material consciousness opens one to the astral or subconscious plane. "It is the path of ascent to the higher self where we face our fears, there is where our higher self emerges. This path awakens the promise of a new path." ibid Ted Andrews pg 133 "Pathworking".

I’ve never heard of this “32nd”, before, but I did manage to find this online below…

The 32 Paths of Wisdom

Seems there are some key differences between the Western Tradition version and the Jewish tradition version…

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
Thank you; that is meaningful as with your scholarship my (occasional rants of a lunatic nature) "insight" regarding what I KNOW to be true are bolstered; almost tipping the teeder todder of believablily in my favor.

Yeah; your not the “raving crazy”, that most people think you are lol…there’s actual evidence behind what you say…but then again, I already knew that! (boo!)

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
You don't have a choice, you can't hop skip the sephirophs. Each one builds upon the one preceding it, although I skipped to Daath first; and now must go back to understand why I was shown this consciousness FIRST (right out of the gate the hardest and most dangerous one to fathom as it attaches to all others).

“you can’t hop skip the sephorophs”

dam, I was hoping to do a knight move from Netzach straight to Keter (through Chesed/Gedulah and Chochmah)…

How did you go straight to daath…? Don’t you have to acquire the knowledge en-route, before you can get to the knowledge…? Hey, “the thought before the thought” lol springs to Mind…

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
You did get there without knowledge of the "Tree of Life"; now you yourself are coming into an understanding of what happened to you. Sometimes the critical jumpstart timing does not wait for training/learning (that comes later in the form of enlightenment). If the magickal insert (shadow) that party crashes your life had to wait for you playing catch up; it would never happen (I think its a trigger to push you toward that path of enlighenment). Believe me I know, its happened to me as well.

When you say “it happened to you as well”, do you mean you had an encounter with a shadow being…or do you mean you were thrust into knowledge/enlightenment, and only later put the pieces together…?

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
EVERY ENTITY living beyond the 3rd dimension wants "The Earth School Experience". You are already famous (a celebrity) in the higher realms just by having experienced it, (everyone is watching your progress BTW) how did you manage it!, with bribes or pay offs? influential teachers or parents/a legacy job; a scholarship perhaps?

No bribes or pay offs I’m afraid, and nothing to do with my parents either, even if one was in the, you know what; and no legacy job either…I turned the MOD job down lol

Influential teachers; well the higher ups guided me too ATS, and I’ve interacted with a few critical minds on this website since I arrived. But great minds can’t make you come to know or believe something to be true, you still have to do the leg work, and go through the motions, in order to get to the truth etc…

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
I like your Alice reference.
There is in so much great literature, Freemasonry and cartoons (childs play) where the "hidden" knowledge is revealed right before your unseeing eyes.

Thanks, there’s a lot of Gnostic thought in those Alice in Wonderland books, which is rather strange, coming from a preachers son…

I haven't seen much hidden knowledge in cartoons though, unless you have something specific in mind…

- JC

originally posted by: Joecroft
a reply to: veteranhumanbeing

vethumanbeing:
They may not have been dreams at all but astral travel; were you ever hurt or ate/smell anything during these 'realistic dreams'? Ten of the sephiroths have a human attached to them as your magical image of yourself. The hidden 11th (death) has none, that might be your shadow figure. Daath exists in the abyss; or between the lower 7 and upper 3. Its a bridgepoint from the lower more physical planes of consciousness to the higher ethereal planes. As far as a cat image is concerned I've no idea. In my grandmothers culture "Maya" the panther is a demi-god.

Joecroft: No, I was never actually harmed in any of my cat dreams…I was just pursued by various big cats; felt pretty scary though at times…as it would, if you didn’t realise you were dreaming, and suddenly a tiger started strolling down your passage way, towards you etc…Oh, and I never ate anything or smelt anything that I can recall…
As for the shadow figure, I think they’re from a lower vibrational realm; I don’t think they have any connection to myself[

Fear factor is all; you will never actually be 'harmed'. I'm not convinced these are 'dreams' either. When astral traveling you will (if you pay attention) smell, eat, have sex; fall from the top of a wall and feel yourself hitting the ground/ as you are in the in between the 3rd 4th and still have mass. Not a spiritual body and not totally a physical one either. Who told you shadow figures were from a lower vibrational realm? I was speaking of "Daath" consciousness possibly representing itself that way as it has NO human archetype (it overlays the other 10 sephirophs) and probably wouldn't have one because it represents your subconscious mind *which is why it is dangerous* to contemplate. There is a difference between eastern and western conceptualization of the Qabala, one as the Egyptian original form that includes the tarot, astrology and number systems that the Hebrew borrowed from. THINK GYPSY and where that root comes from; The Rosy Cross, the Freemasons, the Essenes (WESTERN). Eastern thought would be the Chakra energy systems that overlay the tree of life perfectly.

vethumanbeing:
There is only one path to Yesod, the 32nd. This is the path that opens the material to the astral. This is where the evolution of material consciousness opens one to the astral or subconscious plane. "It is the path of ascent to the higher self where we face our fears, there is where our higher self emerges. This path awakens the promise of a new path." ibid Ted Andrews pg 133 "Pathworking".

Joecroft: I’ve never heard of this “32nd”, before, but I did manage to find this online below…
The 32 Paths of Wisdom

It is the direct path from Malkuth to Yesod what is the problem.

vethumanbeing
You don't have a choice, you can't hop skip the sephirophs. Each one builds upon the one preceding it, although I skipped to Daath first; and now must go back to understand why I was shown this consciousness FIRST (right out of the gate the hardest and most dangerous one to fathom as it attaches to all others).

Joecroft: “you can’t hop skip the sephirophs” dam, I was hoping to do a knight move from Netzach straight to Keter (through Chesed/Gedulah and Chochmah)…How did you go straight to daath…? Don’t you have to acquire the knowledge en-route, before you can get to the knowledge…? Hey, “the thought before the thought” lol springs to Mind.

Well; I wish it were more like chess moves (but then I may win with an unfair advantage in a game I know how to play). I went straight to death to show me how it manipulates the other sephirophs as the unconscious overlay. You acquire knowledge in route as you said. You do want to experience Jesus's becoming material? You are just BACKWARDS traveling to his starting point. He came from spirit to material (down stepping).

vethumanbeing: You did get there without knowledge of the "Tree of Life"; now you yourself are coming into an understanding of what happened to you. Sometimes the critical jumpstart timing does not wait for training/learning (that comes later in the form of enlightenment). If the magickal insert (shadow) that party crashes your life had to wait for you playing catch up; it would never happen (I think its a trigger to push you toward that path of enlighenment). Believe me I know, its happened to me as well.

Joecroft: When you say “it happened to you as well”, do you mean you had an encounter with a shadow being…or do you mean you were thrust into knowledge/enlightenment, and only later put the pieces together?

Yes exactly; I put it together in a TIC-TACK-TOE fashion years later (had to have the reference/experience bullet points) first to know what this information was and how to put it together and make reasonable sense.

vethumanbeing:
EVERY ENTITY living beyond the 3rd dimension wants "The Earth School Experience". You are already famous (a celebrity) in the higher realms just by having experienced it, (everyone is watching your progress BTW) how did you manage it!, with bribes or pay offs? influential teachers or parents/a legacy job; a scholarship perhaps?

Joecroft: No bribes or pay offs I’m afraid, and nothing to do with my parents either, even if one was in the, you know what; and no legacy job either…I turned the MOD job down lol Influential teachers; well the higher ups guided me too ATS, and I’ve interacted with a few critical minds on this website since I arrived. But great minds can’t make you come to know or believe something to be true, you still have to do the leg work, and go through the motions, in order to get to the truth etc.

Its all on you and your powers of observation/ultimate discrimination (Malkuth kingdom first platform).

vethumanbeing: I like your Alice reference.
There is in so much great literature, Freemasonry and cartoons (childs play) where the "hidden" knowledge is revealed right before your unseeing eyes.

Joecroft: Thanks, there’s a lot of Gnostic thought in those Alice in Wonderland books, which is rather strange, coming from a preachers son…I haven't seen much hidden knowledge in cartoons though, unless you have something specific in mind.

Heres an easy one; how is it 'Yogi the Bear' came to be named; because he has to mentor something called a "Boo-Boo"? Instead of carrying around a 'begging bowl' and relying upon the charity of others in the Himalayas; OR *within monestary walls* lives off of toasted buttered barley and milk; YOGI (Hindu in namesake not a Buddhist just its twin is the trip up here) stole PICNIC BASKETS from innocent National Yosemite Park tourists. You see no irony here? Who is Ranger Smith exactly. Why are 'Pick and Nick' baskets named so; (credit to Charles Dickens given here) because you can nick the baskets of those that are unaware.

a reply to: vethumanbeing

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
Fear factor is all; you will never actually be 'harmed'. I'm not convinced these are 'dreams' either. When astral traveling you will (if you pay attention) smell, eat, have sex; fall from the top of a wall and feel yourself hitting the ground/ as you are in the in between the 3rd 4th and still have mass. Not a spiritual body and not totally a physical one either.

Sounds like a cartoon world…this, between the 3rd 4th place. I don’t think these were dreams either, funny thing is I stopped having them around about the same time as my Pineal Gland activation, and Holy Spirit/Chakra activation etc…any thoughts…?

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
Who told you shadow figures were from a lower vibrational realm? I was speaking of "Daath" consciousness possibly representing itself that way as it has NO human archetype (it overlays the other 10 sephirophs) and probably wouldn't have one because it represents your subconscious mind *which is why it is dangerous* to contemplate.

“Who told you shadow figures were from a lower vibrational realm?”

No one…it’s was just a hunch…based on witness testimonies and experiences etc…

I’m not much of an expert of the Quabilic “Tree of Life” but I read somewhere that “Daath” was only a conceptual sephiroph, because it represents all the sephirot united together, as one…

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
There is a difference between eastern and western conceptualization of the Qabala, one as the Egyptian original form that includes the tarot, astrology and number systems that the Hebrew borrowed from. THINK GYPSY and where that root comes from; The Rosy Cross, the Freemasons, the Essenes (WESTERN). Eastern thought would be the Chakra energy systems that overlay the tree of life perfectly.

Hmm the etymology of the word gypsy was originally “gipcyan”, which is short for Egyptian!…interesting…all the fun of the fair, is taking on a whole new meaning…

Originally posted by Joecroft
I’ve never heard of this “32nd”, before, but I did manage to find this online below…
The 32 Paths of Wisdom

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
It is the direct path from Malkuth to Yesod what is the problem.

No problem’s here…I just wasn’t sure why it was called the “32nd”…

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
Well; I wish it were more like chess moves (but then I may win with an unfair advantage in a game I know how to play).

I beat a GM once, who was rated 2595 Fide…do you still think you have an unfair advantage…? lol

Do you Remember my Hal vs Tal joke, and my “the threat is stronger than the execution” Nimzowitsch quote…Those were subtle hints, that I know more about the game, than just historical background data!!!

Anyway; I like to think that Chess has taught me a thing or two about life, logic, an how to structure my thought processes…which I’m hoping can be equally applied to the Quabbalic “Tree of Life”…

Your move lol…

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
Yes exactly; I put it together in a TIC-TACK-TOE fashion years later (had to have the reference/experience bullet points) first to know what this information was and how to put it together and make reasonable sense.

But didn’t you get some guidance and help from the/a “fraternity”…?

Originally posted by Joecroft
Thanks, there’s a lot of Gnostic thought in those Alice in Wonderland books, which is rather strange, coming from a preachers son…I haven't seen much hidden knowledge in cartoons though, unless you have something specific in mind.

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
Heres an easy one; how is it 'Yogi the Bear' came to be named; because he has to mentor something called a "Boo-Boo"?

I think if Yogi and Boo-Boo were discussing it…it would go a little something like this…


Boo-Boo…“Ever wonder how you got the name Yogi, Yogi…?

Yogi Bear…”Why gee Boo-Boo, it’s because I was named after Yogi Berra, the famous baseball star!! (who incidentally sued Hanna-Barbera for defamation)

Boo-Boo…“Come on Yogi; his real name was Lawrence Peter Berra, he only got the nickname Yogi, because of the way he used to sit (arm and legs crossed, like a hindu holy man) during his matches…

Yogi Bear…”Well waduya know, I was named after someone else's nickname; aint that something Boo-Boo…?”

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
Instead of carrying around a 'begging bowl' and relying upon the charity of others in the Himalayas; OR *within monestary walls* lives off of toasted buttered barley and milk; YOGI (Hindu in namesake not a Buddhist just its twin is the trip up here) stole PICNIC BASKETS from innocent National Yosemite Park tourists. You see no irony here? Who is Ranger Smith exactly.

Yes, I see; they’ve certainly flip turned the tables around on that one. I’m starting to see that show, in a whole new light now…thanks to you Vet….

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
Why are 'Pick and Nick' baskets named so; (credit to Charles Dickens given here) because you can nick the baskets of those that are unaware.

The word picnic contains two syllables, “Pic” and “nic” etc…Could just be a “play on words”… it’s a common comedic device to engineer little chuckles from the audience; who sometimes neglect to laugh…lol


- JC

a reply to: Fingle

cool topic
but all i kept thinking was "test all things, hold fast to that which is good"



i like the way your mind works joecroft..
maybe it's a reference to 32 bones in the spinal column
and the skull is the 33rd
/shrugs

originally posted by: Joecroft
a reply to: veteranhumanbeing

vethumanbeing:
Fear factor is all; you will never actually be 'harmed'. I'm not convinced these are 'dreams' either. When astral traveling you will (if you pay attention) smell, eat, have sex; fall from the top of a wall and feel yourself hitting the ground/ as you are in the in between the 3rd 4th and still have mass. Not a spiritual body and not totally a physical one either.

Joecroft: Sounds like a cartoon world…this, between the 3rd 4th place. I don’t think these were dreams either, funny thing is I stopped having them around about the same time as my Pineal Gland activation, and Holy Spirit/Chakra activation etcany thoughts?

What makes you think this reality is anything other than a pixel cartoon binary 1s and 0s experience? How did you know your third eye activated? For me its a constant dime sized spinning disk that interrupts the way I normally see. Oh yes, and that 6th chakra opening (pain in the rear end regards eye tests, you will be told you have a stigmatism and need glasses).

Vethumanbeing: “Who told you shadow figures were from a lower vibrational realm?”

Joecroft: No one…it’s was just a hunch…based on witness testimonies and experiences etc,
I’m not much of an expert of the Quabilic “Tree of Life” but I read somewhere that “Daath” was only a conceptual sephiroph, because it represents all the sephiroth united together, as one.

You are correct, Daath overlays all of the other ten; but it has or is within the realm to be the doppleganger or evil twin to all; as it represents the worst evaluation or the bad extreme of each. As though looking at the best of what each represents you will as a dichotomy experience the "less than better half" of it. Duality of nature is all, polarities are natural but not DESIRED as are disruptive and SCARY.

vethumanbeing: There is a difference between eastern and western conceptualization of the Qabala, one as the Egyptian original form that includes the tarot, astrology and number systems that the Hebrew borrowed from. THINK GYPSY and where that root comes from; The Rosy Cross, the Freemasons, the Essenes (WESTERN). Eastern thought would be the Chakra energy systems that overlay the tree of life perfectly.

Joecroft: Hmm the etymology of the word gypsy was originally “gipcyan”, which is short for Egyptian!…interesting…all the fun of the fair, is taking on a whole new meaning/

Depends, were there coconuts involved in the FAITE; and a tent set up with someones grandmother posing as the "Gypsy Tarot card reader'? Personally, I prefer the "Thoth" tarot card version (Egyptian). It actually tells the truth both good and evil (no sugar coating) some find it HARSH.

Joecroft: No problem’s here…I just wasn’t sure why it was called the “32nd”

Because its the startpoint from Malkuth to Yesod. Should be 33; but is not.

vethumanbeing:
Regarding direct paths; I wish it were more like chess moves (but then I may win with an unfair advantage in a game I know how to play).

Joecroft: I beat a GM once, who was rated 2595 Fide…do you still think you have an unfair advantage?

Do you Remember my Hal vs Tal joke, and my “the threat is stronger than the execution” Nimzowitsch quote…Those were subtle hints, that I know more about the game, than just historical background data!!!Anyway; I like to think that Chess has taught me a thing or two about life, logic, an how to structure my thought processes…which I’m hoping can be equally applied to the Quabbalic “Tree of Life”.
Your move.

Oh I don't know; I've never been beaten at backgammon. My unfair advantage is that God refuses to reveal itself to me unless I pay the piper/price of hours of meditation and introspection (without pay or reward)(if so its subtle and called "FAITH"). Tell me how you beat a GM rated; I have ultimate advantage as I know how the game was devised and works because I designed it. Chess is all about outsmarting your twin soul opponent (not an adversary). The Quabala is the ULTIMATE MYSTERY SCHOOL. This is what the Freemasons guard as sacred; and Jesus/the Essenes were all about (not meant for the faint hearted); this is a serious look into the TRUTH of ALL OF IT; what is behind all that you think you see/perceive.

vethumanbeing:Yes exactly; I put it together in a TIC-TACK-TOE fashion years later (had to have the reference/experience bullet points) first to know what this information was and how to put it together and make reasonable sense.

Joecroft: But didn’t you get some guidance and help from the/a “fraternity”…?

Yup, I did; then they left me to hang out to dry. Its their nature to leave one upon its own devices to process the information given. No guarantees you see, its just information to be GROKED if your smart enough to GROK IT.

Joecroft :
Thanks, there’s a lot of Gnostic thought in those Alice in Wonderland books, which is rather strange, coming from a preachers son…I haven't seen much hidden knowledge in cartoons though, unless you have something specific in mind.

vethumanbeing:
Heres an easy one; how is it 'Yogi the Bear' came to be named; because he has to mentor something called a "Boo-Boo"?

Joecroft: I think if Yogi and Boo-Boo were discussing it…it would go a little something like this…Boo-Boo…“Ever wonder how you got the name Yogi, Yogi…?
Yogi Bear…”Why gee Boo-Boo, it’s because I was named after Yogi Berra, the famous baseball star!! (who incidentally sued Hanna-Barbera for defamation)Boo-Boo…“Come on Yogi; his real name was Lawrence Peter Berra, he only got the nickname Yogi, because of the way he used to sit (arm and legs crossed, like a hindu holy man) during his matches…
Yogi Bear…”Well waduya know, I was named after someone else's nickname; aint that something Boo-Boo…?”

Nice; I wasn't going for the obvious, but why not both. There are so many obvious hidden.

Vethumanbeing:
Instead of carrying around a 'begging bowl' and relying upon the charity of others in the Himalayas; OR *within monestary walls* lives off of toasted buttered barley and milk; YOGI (Hindu in namesake not a Buddhist just its twin is the trip up here) stole PICNIC BASKETS from innocent National Yosemite Park tourists. Who is Ranger Smith exactly.

Joecroft: Yes, I see; they’ve certainly flip turned the tables around on that one. I’m starting to see that show, in a whole new light now thanks to you Vet

vethumanbeing:
Why are 'Pick and Nick' baskets named so; (credit to Charles Dickens given here) because you can nick the baskets of those that are unaware.

Joecroft: The word picnic contains two syllables, “Pic” and “nic” etc…Could just be a “play on words”… it’s a common comedic device to engineer little chuckles from the audience; who sometimes neglect to laugh.

OK; we can NICK PICK these ideas or mince them: "mices to pieces"; and recombine all playfullness into a God form as an original cartoon ACME product. I can only hope my audience response is not "canned" but NATURAL laugher.

a reply to: UNIT76

Originally posted by UNIT76
i like the way your mind works joecroft..

Thanks…so do I…

Nice signature you have there too!

Originally posted by UNIT76
maybe it's a reference to 32 bones in the spinal column
and the skull is the 33rd

Yes, most definitely a reference to the Spinal vertebrae…Vets the expert on this one…

- JC

a reply to: vethumanbeing

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
What makes you think this reality is anything other than a pixel cartoon binary 1s and 0s experience?

Nothing actually lol…with a couple of 1’s thrown in lol…

Funnily enough, I strongly lean towards the possibility. My only dilemma, is whether this 3D universe/world actually exists, and is made up of 3 Dimensional 1s and 0s etc…; or whether only 2D exists, and where all plugged into it, giving us the illusion of 3D; Matrix style…It’s Agent Smith greets Ranger Smith, and NO Boo Boo’s aloud lol

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
How did you know your third eye activated?

I think it may have been the intense tingling sensation in the center of my forehead, (after much deep contemplation, of various scriptures) which happened 3 separate times, over a 3-week period…

Once while reading a book, another while out and about town, and lastly the most intense one, was when I woke up, in the middle of the night, with the sensation in my Pineal gland being so intense, that I couldn’t stop laughing out loud; It was as if someone had a magic feather and was tickling the inside of my Pineal gland…Btw - Not sure if any of this classifies as third eye activation…

ECP was the only person I could find, who explained the process I experienced, to the letter.

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
For me its a constant dime sized spinning disk that interrupts the way I normally see. Oh yes, and that 6th chakra opening (pain in the rear end regards eye tests, you will be told you have a stigmatism and need glasses).

“Dime Sized spinning disk”

How on earth can you function, with something like that tagging along…?

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
Depends, were there coconuts involved in the FAITE; and a tent set up with someones grandmother posing as the "Gypsy Tarot card reader'? Personally, I prefer the "Thoth" tarot card version (Egyptian). It actually tells the truth both good and evil (no sugar coating) some find it HARSH.

Not exactly; this “run down shack” couldn’t afford coconuts, they used tin cans…(containing much laughter) instead…

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
Because its the startpoint from Malkuth to Yesod. Should be 33; but is not.

So too paraphrase the above…

“Yes, it should be 33, but they call it 32…”

Can you guess my next question lol…if not, then try this one…

So from Malkuth you learn the 31, or the 32, or the 33, and then move onto Yesod…Am I close…?

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
Tell me how you beat a GM rated;

You sure you wana go through this lol

Ok, here goes…

Well; I had the white pieces; The opening was a Spanish, also known as the “Ruy Lopez” opening. My opponent played the Marshall gambit move order, which I side stepped, by using the Anti Marshall 8a4 system, (which was heavily popularized by Kasparov, in his World Championship match, with Nigel Short)

The game followed some 13 moves of opening theory… I then played a Novelty on move 14 which I personally believe gives white a slight advantage (although maybe unclear, is a fairer assessment)…

After a few slight inaccuracies by my opponent, I gained a nice space advantage on the queenside, as well active potential attacking possibilities/chances on the kingside…

I prefer attacking the king, as opposed to positional play on the queenside, so I opted for a potential building up, of a piece offensive, directed towards me opponents king i.e. on the kingside… with moves such as Bc2, Ra3 (preparing to swing the rook to g3) and Knight h2 to g4, eyeing/attacking the h6 square/pawn…

The kingside tactical threats became insurmountable for my opponent, but being a GM, he found a resourceful exchange sacrifice to keep himself on the board (in the game). Although in hindsight, I missed a much more decisive tactical blow prier, which would have ended the game much sooner. Still, the move I chose was still winning, it just wasn’t as accurate as it should have been.

After the complications had settled down, and the position had stabilized…I now needed a new plan to realize my advantage, i.e. of being an exchange up (e.g. Rook for Knight)…

My opponent had one pawn for being the exchange down, and also had a few new weak pawns to target in my own camp, for his counter play…unfortunately for him, his kingside was slightly damaged from my earlier attacking efforts.

I eventually found a resourceful continuation, which involved forcing off my opponents last remaining defending bishop (which was helping to hold his kingside together) for my own… albeit at the cost of losing another of my own pawns…

One advantage lost, but another one gained. My opponent now had 2 pawns for being the exchange down; which in normal circumstances, would be sufficient, to be either slightly better (most cases), or have at least equal chances.

Unfortunately, the defending bishop I just exchanged off, left my opponents king/kingside extremely vulnerable. With my Queen and Rook, verses his Queen and knight, I was then able to mount a successful attack on his open king position, before his extra pawns could get rolling, so to speak…

The mating threats to his open king, became unbearable and my opponent was forced to sacrifice his knight, to avoid being checkmated. I was now a whole rook up, and the rest of the game, was just a matter of technique…as they say…

Well…you did ask lol

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
I have ultimate advantage as I know how the game was devised and works because I designed it.

“You designed it”….ha ha lololol

Perhaps you’ve been walking around those fraternity, chequered floor Halls, for far too long, and it’s gone to your head…lol

Remember what the door mouse said…

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
Chess is all about outsmarting your twin soul opponent (not an adversary). The Quabala is the ULTIMATE MYSTERY SCHOOL....
...

Well, in a round about way yes, Chess is much about mastering oneself; trusting believing that your following the right course, especially when things become unfathomable and complex etc…you have to combine experience and knowledge and learn to trust your instincts i.e. gut feel about a position…

One part of you says, “this can’t work (twin soul opponent) and it’s the wrong way forward etc”…but your good soul aspect, says “no, this could work, I’ll keep on trying, looking for a way etc…”

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
Yup, I did; then they left me to hang out to dry. Its their nature to leave one upon its own devices to process the information given. No guarantees you see, its just information to be GROKED if your smart enough to GROK IT.

Grok, what is Grok… have you ever Groked a Lemur lol

By Grok, do you mean to experience something and not just know or figure out something, (not that the latter doesn’t take place as well etc..) In other words, to know by experiencing a thing, which then brings with it knowledge; as opposed to having knowledge of a thing, but without any experience of it whatsoever…?


- JC

originally posted by: Joecroft
a reply to: veteranhumanbeing

vethumanbeing:
What makes you think this reality is anything other than a pixel cartoon binary 1s and 0s experience?

Joecroft: Nothing actually lol…with a couple of 1’s thrown in.
Funnily enough, I strongly lean towards the possibility. My only dilemma, is whether this 3D universe/world actually exists, and is made up of 3 Dimensional 1s and 0s etc…; or whether only 2D exists, and where all plugged into it, giving us the illusion of 3D; Matrix style…It’s Agent Smith greets Ranger Smith, and NO Boo Boo’s aloud.

I wonder why so many clues are left (popular culture references its hard to miss). 2D does exist here; in the form of trees or flora, the 1D would be rocks. All 9 exist here; but without training you can only perceive the 3rd.

vethumanbeing regarding 3rd eye:
its a constant dime sized spinning disk that interrupts the way I normally see. Oh yes, and that 6th chakra opening you will be told you have a stigmatism and need glasses.

Joecroft: “Dime Sized spinning disk”How on earth can you function, with something like that tagging along?

Its not easy, eye tests even harder to explain to the opthamologyst ; but no matter what prescription or surgery given does not rid the problem.

vethumanbeing:
Because its the startpoint from Malkuth to Yesod. Should be 33; but is not.

Joecroft: So too paraphrase the above…
“Yes, it should be 33, but they call it 32…”Can you guess my next question lol…if not, then try this one…
So from Malkuth you learn the 31, or the 32, or the 33, and then move onto Yesod Am I close

No you work backwards from 32 to 11 (not saying this system is perfect other than in order to hinder/hide very useful information) which is part of the reason its considered to be a "mystery school" (you really have to work at it).

vethumanbeing:
Tell me how you beat a GM rated;

Joecroft:

Well; I had the white pieces; The opening was a Spanish, also known as the “Ruy Lopez” opening. My opponent played the gambit move order, which I side stepped, by using the Anti Marshall 8a4 system, (which was heavily popularized by Kasparov, in his World Championship match, with Nigel Short)The game followed some 13 moves of opening theory I then played a Novelty on move 14 which I personally believe gives white a slight advantage (although maybe unclear, is a fairer assessment)…
After a few slight inaccuracies by my opponent, I gained a nice space advantage on the queenside, as well active potential attacking possibilities/chances on the kingside
I prefer attacking the king, as opposed to positional play on the queenside, so I opted for a potential building up, of a piece offensive, directed towards me opponents king i.e. on the kingside… with moves such as Bc2, Ra3 (preparing to swing the rook to g3) and Knight h2 to g4, eyeing/attacking the h6 square/pawn…
The kingside tactical threats became insurmountable for my opponent, but being a GM, he found a resourceful exchange sacrifice to keep himself on the board (in the game). Although in hindsight, I missed a much more decisive tactical blow prier, which would have ended the game much sooner. Still, the move I chose was still winning, it just wasn’t as accurate as it should have been.
After the complications had settled down, and the position had stabilized…I now needed a new plan to realize my advantage, i.e. of being an exchange up (e.g. Rook for Knight)…

My opponent had one pawn for being the exchange down, and also had a few new weak pawns to target in my own camp, for his counter play…unfortunately for him, his kingside was slightly damaged from my earlier attacking efforts.
I eventually found a resourceful continuation, which involved forcing off my opponents last remaining defending bishop (which was helping to hold his kingside together) for my own… albeit at the cost of losing another of my own pawns…
One advantage lost, but another one gained. My opponent now had 2 pawns for being the exchange down; which in normal circumstances, would be sufficient, to be either slightly better (most cases), or have at least equal chances.
Unfortunately, the defending bishop I just exchanged off, left my opponents king/kingside extremely vulnerable. With my Queen and Rook, verses his Queen and knight, I was then able to mount a successful attack on his open king position, before his extra pawns could get rolling, so to speak.The mating threats to his open king, became unbearable and my opponent was forced to sacrifice his knight, to avoid being checkmated. I was now a whole rook up, and the rest of the game, was just a matter of technique.

OUTSTANDING; causes me to want to go through your match move by move with my chess board/pieces and Satan sitting on my shoulder giving me hints. How many anticipated moves do you see before making a decision?

vethumanbeing:
I have ultimate advantage as I know how the game was devised and works because I designed it.

Joecroft: “You designed it”ha ha lolPerhaps you’ve been walking around those fraternity, chequered floor Halls, for far too long, and it’s gone to your head… Remember what the door mouse said

I didn't design chess!; I was referring to backgammon. The chequer board floors only become very interesting in places like the Vatican where the pattern changes in oddball fashion; fell into too many pillars climbing after Job (concussion related I suppose).

vethumanbeing:
Chess is all about outsmarting your twin soul opponent (not an adversary). The Quabala is the ULTIMATE MYSTERY SCHOOL

Joecroft: ...yes Chess is much about mastering oneself; trusting believing that your following the right course, especially when things become unfathomable and complex etc you have to combine experience and knowledge and learn to trust your instincts i.e. gut feel about a position.One part of you says, “this can’t work (twin soul opponent) and it’s the wrong way forward etc”…but your good soul aspect, says “no, this could work, I’ll keep on trying, looking for a way etc”

So who of the opponents ever falls upon their own sword (or do they) during a match in an act of graciousness? Am I to understand no one ever becomes angry regarding a loss.

vethumanbeing:
Yup, I did; then they left me to hang out to dry. Its their nature to leave one upon its own devices to process the information given. No guarantees you see, its just information to be GROKED if your smart enough to GROK IT.

Joecroft: Grok, what is Grok… have you ever Groked a Lemur By Grok, do you mean to experience something and not just know or figure out something, (not that the latter doesn’t take place as well etc..) In other words, to know by experiencing a thing, which then brings with it knowledge; as opposed to having knowledge of a thing, but without any experience of it whatsoever?

Sure, the lemur is the first mammal that bridges the dinosaur age to the modern and YES Grok just means "one is in total understanding of" without actually having a past/present physical experience of; an innate truth born with you; sometimes have to remember those gems of knowledge (WHAT? that makes no sense).

Are we missing something in analysis of the thought before thought, is it not light, that propositions thought? Maybe 10.000 times faster than the speed of light, to form thought in the entanglement.

what if by some means an individual can, to some degree control the influences or messages, that pass between light particles, although we may have forgotten or lost the ability to truly interpret the true resonance of the real communication, so that it becomes entangled with our/ego/will ?

a reply to: vethumanbeing

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
I wonder why so many clues are left (popular culture references its hard to miss). 2D does exist here; in the form of trees or flora, the 1D would be rocks. All 9 exist here; but without training you can only perceive the 3rd.

How does one apply for the training…let me guess; follow the white rabbit down a side alley, get dragged into a secret basement; eat a red pill and be transformed….

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
Its not easy, eye tests even harder to explain to the opthamologyst; but no matter what prescription or surgery given does not rid the problem.

Seems like a real pain…what does this gift give you…other than a trip to the
Ophthalmologist, once every couple of weeks…

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
OUTSTANDING; causes me to want to go through your match move by move with my chess board/pieces and Satan sitting on my shoulder giving me hints. How many anticipated moves do you see before making a decision?

Thanks… that game I described, was played a long time ago…I don’t play anymore….

But too answer your question…

“One move further than my opponent”… lol

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
I didn't design chess!; I was referring to backgammon. The chequer board floors only become very interesting in places like the Vatican where the pattern changes in oddball fashion; fell into too many pillars climbing after Job (concussion related I suppose).

You designed backgammon… one of the oldest games known to man…??? This “getting to know you" stuff..is tricky…lol

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
So who of the opponents ever falls upon their own sword (or do they) during a match in an act of graciousness? Am I to understand no one ever becomes angry regarding a loss.

By fall on their sword, I assume you mean resign the game…

At a high level players will resign when they have lost significant amounts of material, or in some cases, when they have a strategically lost game, or in some rare cases, when they see that a winning combination, will just win for their opponent;… just being one piece down for no compensation, is enough for players to resign the game etc…There have been some crazy examples where players have resigned in a drawn position, and even rarer still, in a winning position!!!

As for getting angry, yes it can happen, a lot depends on the manner of the victory…for example, if you were just totally winning and had outplayed your opponent for most of the game, but then blundered, towards the end of the game, which led to you losing the game… this can be difficult psychologically to handle…

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
Sure, the lemur is the first mammal that bridges the dinosaur age to the modern and YES Grok just means "one is in total understanding of" without actually having a past/present physical experience of; an innate truth born with you; sometimes have to remember those gems of knowledge (WHAT? that makes no sense).

So what you mean is no experience in this lifetime, but that which somehow draws upon experience from past incarnations etc…i.e. to gain knowledge, by bringing forth innate/past knowledge…?


- JC

originally posted by: Joecroft
a reply to: veteranhumanbeing

vethumanbeing:
I wonder why so many clues are left (popular culture references its hard to miss). 2D does exist here; in the form of trees or flora, the 1D would be rocks. All 9 exist here; but without training you can only perceive the 3rd.

Joecroft: How does one apply for the training…let me guess; follow the white rabbit down a side alley, get dragged into a secret basement; eat a red pill and be transformed.

You have no idea how close you are; not the red one Alice; the jawbreaker hidden in White Rabbits watch pocket; once opened/broken open reveals the 'rainbow' colors of the quabala. There is no application; for me it was to study what Jesus studied in Qumran. I want to know what he knows is all; those teachings of the 'White Brotherhood' (resulting in Rosicrusionism/Freemasonry); white meaning the highest form of enlightenment (no racial connotations).

vethumanbeing regarding CHESS:
OUTSTANDING; causes me to want to go through your match move by move with my chess board/pieces and Satan sitting on my shoulder giving me hints. How many anticipated moves do you see before making a decision?

Joecroft: Thanks… that game I described, was played a long time ago…I don’t play anymore….
But too answer your question…
“One move further than my opponent".

Ah Ha should have seen that answer coming a mile away involving three left turns (how do you find home?).

vethumanbeing:
I didn't design chess!; I was referring to backgammon. The chequer board floors only become very interesting in places like the Vatican where the pattern changes in oddball fashion; fell into too many pillars climbing after Job (concussion related I suppose).

Joecroft: You designed backgammon… one of the oldest games known to man…??? This “getting to know you" stuff..is tricky…lol

Its a game of rock play is all; have never lost a match--one of those 'oh yes I remember this circumstance of creation'.

Joecroft: By fall on their sword, I assume you mean resign the game…

At a high level players will resign when they have lost significant amounts of material, or in some cases, when they have a strategically lost game, or in some rare cases, when they see that a winning combination, will just win for their opponent;… just being one piece down for no compensation, is enough for players to resign the game etc…There have been some crazy examples where players have resigned in a drawn position, and even rarer still, in a winning position!!!

Doubted themselves? and in a moment of panic/indecision gave up? I so admire the skills required in this play; I'm a fair opponent but dislike the aftermath of winning; the anger or pouting, for me loosing is just as troublesome; it brings out juvenile emotions I do not want to experience.

vethumanbeing:
Sure, the lemur is the first mammal that bridges the dinosaur age to the modern and YES Grok just means "one is in total understanding of" without actually having a past/present physical experience of; an innate truth born with you; sometimes have to remember those gems of knowledge (WHAT? that makes no sense).

Joecroft: So what you mean is no experience in this lifetime, but that which somehow draws upon experience from past incarnations etc…i.e. to gain knowledge, by bringing forth innate/past knowledge…?

Yes. No practical experience in this lifetime; but an understanding of the whole (as an overlay umbrella) that is innate; sometimes has to be triggered (that's not a foul that's normal). One cannot expect to understand all prior lifetime learning at once in this singularity (your present incarnation). Jesus on the other hand had no prior lifetimes and in TOTAL understanding knew all that is or ever was; a truly remarkable being as was fully 3D solid. Id like to say Mohammed and Buddha were the same in awareness/comprehension. So many enlightened ones have been sent here to help over the eons; but no one has come for 2000 years, time is speeding up (critical) yet no life buoy thrown.

a reply to: vethumanbeing

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
Ah Ha should have seen that answer coming a mile away involving three left turns (how do you find home?).

Well, if your travelling in a straight line and do three left turns (going the same distance each turn), you'll be back to square one…having produced a square in the process! Thus you’d be back home…lol

Your question about how many moves does one look/see ahead…is a common question…

The best answer to the question is “it depends”. Although it first helps to clarify, the different types of “looking ahead”, in chess…

There are two types of looking ahead IMO, there’s strategic planning, where your just envisioning a plan/concept idea in the future, and then there’s tactical calculation, (which generally requires accuracy)…Of course both of these are inextricably linked to each other, in most cases, but not always…

General long term planning/strategic thinking, may not require any specific tactical calculations, but sometimes it might…and it’s the same with calculating long tactical combinations, because some elements of it might be strategically in nature, but sometimes there may be no strategic elements to weigh up/evaluate, at all…hope that clears it up lol

The reply “One move further than my opponent", was actually said by famous grandmaster I think…and although it sounds like a tongue in cheek reply, it actually throws back a subtle deeper philosophical question, back at the enquirer…

For example, if you could somehow develop (an advanced technological Implant perhaps lol) the ability to see 25 moves ahead at every turn, on each move, would you do it; and if so, then why not make it 26 or 27 or 28 moves ahead etc…Better yet, what if you could see 100 moves ahead, each move; would you do it, and if so, then why not 101 or 102 moves etc..? see the dilemma…


Kasparov said it best in his book “How Life Imitates Chess”…check out the pages 53,54,55…which can be found here

To sum up...here are the key highlights…

“The Total number of positions in a game of chess, is greater than the number of atoms in the universe”…

“The further ahead you look, the less accurate your calculations will be”…In a practical sense, of course…

“It doesn’t matter how far you can see ahead, if you don’t understand what you’re looking at”…

“You must have a sense of when to stop calculating!!!”…which may seem counter intuitive, to most…



A conversation between Alice and the Cheshire cat, would go a little something like this…

“Then why bother playing at all, if you can’t see everything”… said Alice…

“On the contrary, if you could see everything, then there would be NO point, to playing at all lol…replied the Cheshire cat…


In a bazar sort of way, this is all connected to the “thought before the thought”…so thanks for asking the question…

Originally posted by Joecroft
So what you mean is no experience in this lifetime, but that which somehow draws upon experience from past incarnations etc…i.e. to gain knowledge, by bringing forth innate/past knowledge…?

Originally posted by vethumanbeing
Yes. No practical experience in this lifetime; but an understanding of the whole (as an overlay umbrella) that is innate; sometimes has to be triggered (that's not a foul that's normal). One cannot expect to understand all prior lifetime learning at once in this singularity (your present incarnation).

Jesus on the other hand had no prior lifetimes and in TOTAL understanding knew all that is or ever was; a truly remarkable being as was fully 3D solid.

Id like to say Mohammed and Buddha were the same in awareness/comprehension. So many enlightened ones have been sent here to help over the eons; but no one has come for 2000 years, time is speeding up (critical) yet no life buoy thrown.

Think I’ll respond to the above on your own thread…”Has God exhausted itself…”


- JC

Is it, that the thought before thought, is that, we have been tricked into a belief that we are not that which we are, but a propensity to believe that we are, to evaluate and constantly question that, that should not exist in this density, or is the propensity real and that is the trick, the ultimate deception? of the self, the fact, that we are the free will to choose our sense of being, within this density and exercise our free-will, to become the sum of ourselves and express all that is within and confront our self/ego to further propel the infinite nature of our macro micro cell expansion to eliminate the resistance of our self destructive and enable the balance within and cease the pain by expressing the love withheld within and in doing so truly understand what love really is …………………………………..

originally posted by: Fingle
Is it, that the thought before thought, is that, we have been tricked into a belief that we are not that which we are, but a propensity to believe that we are, to evaluate and constantly question that, that should not exist in this density, or is the propensity real and that is the trick, the ultimate deception?

Not so much tricked; unless you don't realize you had this all in hand before incarnating (the contract factor you made with your higher self YOU PROMISE TO ReMemBeR Karmic obligations) and feel the trickery is this: you were never meant to remember in the first place; and were not told 'afterhand'. This density is a false scenario, heavy; as in you can not manipulate it as easily as when living within the higher lighter ones. This is why 3rd density is problematic (you cannot instantly create to your whim).

Fingle: of the self, the fact, that we are the free will to choose our sense of being, within this density and exercise our free-will, to become the sum of ourselves and express all that is within and confront our self/ego to further propel the infinite nature of our macro micro cell expansion to eliminate the resistance of our self destructive and enable the balance within and cease the pain by expressing the love withheld within and in doing so truly understand what love really is...

That's the point; does the experiencer recognize itself as ONE (connected to 'all that is' Absolute Unbounded Oneness) actually having the ability to change the world/whorl/whole with so simple a thing as a pointed observation? YES. You are given 'individuality' for a reason; self expression is a major contributor to the miasma/plasma. The balance between Self destruction and PRESERVATION; Dr. Doolittle style: the PushMe-PullYou Llama. Ease the pain in understanding this; Love is a Force, not a human emotion.