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Why are you a liberal?

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posted on May, 22 2014 @ 09:28 PM
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originally posted by: JohnnyCanuck
a reply to: smithjustinb
Let's try this, if you''re really interested:

“I’m proud to say I’m a liberal”: How conservatives vulgarized a term — and why the left must reclaim it FDR and JFK proudly called themselves "liberal" -- but then the right made it a slur. Why it must be embraced again

Salon

And just because I like props (but bear in mind I am a Canadian liberal)...



And what a good Canadian liberal you are! I was looking for that very Lawrence O"Donnell quote but you beat me to it. Thanks!

We're Liberal because it's the "right" thing to do. Plain & Simple.

To smithjustinb, I feel quite confident when I say it's clearly obvious that you are conservative because it's the "me" thing to do, as are most who claim the title.




posted on May, 22 2014 @ 09:29 PM
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originally posted by: JohnnyCanuck
a reply to: smithjustinb
Let's try this, if you''re really interested:

“I’m proud to say I’m a liberal”: How conservatives vulgarized a term — and why the left must reclaim it FDR and JFK proudly called themselves "liberal" -- but then the right made it a slur. Why it must be embraced again

Salon

And just because I like props (but bear in mind I am a Canadian liberal)...



Your little propaganda graphic contains many lies, my friend. This is called 'revisionist history'. Do some homework.



posted on May, 22 2014 @ 09:30 PM
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a reply to: smithjustinb


So, I just want to know why do people vote for people that are pretty much guaranteeing that they will take your freedoms away?


Conservatives have a longer track record of right suppression than liberals do.

The facts don't lie. Conservatives ROUTINELY legislate the removal of people's rights, or limiting access to fundamental programs and rights.

You're MUCH more likely to have your rights taken away by either political party, then not voting, or voting independent.

You've already decided what liberals are, how they think and what they are most likely to do, based on your OP.

Why ask when you already know the answer, and that nothing said here is likely to change your mind?

~Tenth
edit on 5/22/2014 by tothetenthpower because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 22 2014 @ 09:32 PM
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originally posted by: Grimpachi
a reply to: smithjustinb

The last time I voted for a presidential republican he sent me to Iraq and by the time I came back there were plenty of freedoms missing then as well plus spying on Americans was made legal. AKA Patriot act.

I don't think your party is any better than the other in that respect.


I'm not going to defend every republican who ever lived. I'm not going to sit here and say that those who claim to be republican do no wrong. I am going to say that there is a better chance that your rights will not be infringed if you vote republican. Im not saying your rights won't be infringed. I'm saying that there is a better chance. Voting liberal is like willingly giving away your rights. By voting conservative, you're voting for someone who at least advertises that they will protect your rights.



posted on May, 22 2014 @ 09:37 PM
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originally posted by: tothetenthpower
a reply to: smithjustinb


So, I just want to know why do people vote for people that are pretty much guaranteeing that they will take your freedoms away?


Conservatives have a longer track record of right suppression than liberals do.

The facts don't lie. Conservatives ROUTINELY legislate the removal of people's rights, or limiting access to fundamental programs and rights.

You're MUCH more likely to have your rights taken away by either political party, then not voting, or voting independent.

You've already decided what liberals are, how they think and what they are most likely to do, based on your OP.

Why ask when you already know the answer, and that nothing said here is likely to change your mind?

~Tenth


I was really wondering if liberals are mindful enough to admit that voting for a liberal candidate is equivalent to voting away your freedom willingly. I was wondering if liberals were even aware that to vote liberal is to vote away their freedoms willingly. From the looks of this thread, it seems that liberals don't even realize they are voting away their freedoms willingly. Because I can't imagine that someone would vote liberal despite knowing that they would be willingly voting away their freedoms. So, my intention for writing this thread, was to get in touch with the ones who are aware that by voting liberal they are willingly voting their freedoms away, and I was wondering why they would want to do that.



posted on May, 22 2014 @ 09:40 PM
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a reply to: smithjustinb

Liberals revolted against the queen of England!

Red states rank lowest in just about all categories, crime, incarceration rates, poverty, low education levels, poor, roads bridges and infrastructure, poverty, you name it there state governments are terrible. Performance is everything.

Republicans have held the white house for 28 years compared to 17 years for democrats since 1970 yet who do you blame for our problems?

Neo Cons, tea party, libertarians (but if they live in a red state then i understand there hatred of government)


01 GLENN BECK 02 SARAH PALIN 03 RUSH LIMBAUGH 04 GEORGE W. BUSH 05 ANN COULTER 06 MICHELLE MALKIN 07 THE TEA PARTY PATRIOT 08 DICK CHENEY 09 BILL O’REILLY 10 MICHELE BACHMANN 11 KARL ROVE 12 SEAN HANNITY 13 MATT DRUDGE 14 NEWT GINGRICH 15 ANDREW BREITBART 16 MARK LEVIN 17 LAURA INGRAHAM 18 ROGER AILES 19 CLARENCE THOMAS 20 RUPERT MURDOCH 21 JAMES O’KEEFE & HANNAH GILES 22 ANTONIN SCALIA 23 MITT ROMNEY 24 MARCO RUBIO 25 JIM DEMINT 26 MICHAEL SAVAGE 27 CHRIS CHRISTIE 28 BILL KRISTOL 29 JOHN ROBERTS 30 DONALD RUMSFELD 31 SCOTT BROWN 32 GROVER NORQUIST 33 PAT BUCHANAN 34 JAN BREWER 35 LIZ CHENEY 36 JOHN BOEHNER 37 THOMAS SOWELL 38 JAMES DOBSON 39 PAUL RYAN 40 JOHN BOLTON 41 DICK ARMEY 42 MICHAEL STEELE 43 SAMUEL ALITO 44 MIKE PENCE 45 JIM INHOFE 46 DAVID HOROWITZ 47 BOB MCDONNELL 48 CHARLES KRAUTHAMMER 49 ED MORRISSEY 50 ERIC CANTOR 51 MIKE HUCKABEE 52 TOM COBURN 53 RON PAUL 54 TONY PERKINS 55 DICK MORRIS 56 CONDOLEEZZA RICE 57 HUGH HEWITT 58 FRANK LUNTZ 59 DAVID PETRAEUS 60 MITCH MCCONNELL 61 JOHN STOSSEL 62 JONAH GOLDBERG 63 FRANKLIN GRAHAM 64 RAND PAUL 65 ALLAHPUNDIT 66 CHUCK NORRIS 67 BOBBY JINDAL 68 WAYNE LAPIERRE 69 RICK PERRY 70 HALEY BARBOUR 71 JON VOIGHT 72 TED NUGENT 73 MICHAEL MEDVED 74 TIM TEBOW 75 DON IMUS 76 RUDY GIULIANI 77 PHYLLIS SCHLAFLY 78 BILL BENNETT 79 MARC THIESSEN 80 TUCKER CARLSON 81 JEFF SESSIONS 82 GEORGE WILL 83 BRENT BOZELL 84 DENNIS PRAGER 85 KEN BLACKWELL 86 TIM PAWLENTY 87 PEGGY NOONAN 88 JEB BUSH 89 PHILIP ANSCHUTZ 90 MIKE GALLAGHER 91 WALTER WILLIAMS 92 STEVE FORBES 93 BERNIE GOLDBERG 94 ED FEULNER 95 JASON MATTERA 96 ERICK ERICKSON 97 ROY SPENCER 98 S.E. CUPP 99 JOHN FUND 100 MICHAEL BARONE

SomeRandomworst100conservativelist

George Walker Bush destroyed the America I knew and turned it into something else.



posted on May, 22 2014 @ 09:41 PM
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originally posted by: ScientiaFortisDefendit

originally posted by: JohnnyCanuck
a reply to: smithjustinb
Let's try this, if you''re really interested:

“I’m proud to say I’m a liberal”: How conservatives vulgarized a term — and why the left must reclaim it FDR and JFK proudly called themselves "liberal" -- but then the right made it a slur. Why it must be embraced again

Salon

And just because I like props (but bear in mind I am a Canadian liberal)...



Your little propaganda graphic contains many lies, my friend. This is called 'revisionist history'. Do some homework.

edit on 22-5-2014 by smithjustinb because: (no reason given)


I exposed those lies on page one. Its a long read, but I don't want anyone to over look it.
edit on 22-5-2014 by smithjustinb because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 22 2014 @ 09:42 PM
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originally posted by: smithjustinb
I was really wondering if liberals are mindful enough to admit that voting for a liberal candidate is equivalent to voting away your freedom willingly. I was wondering if liberals were even aware that to vote liberal is to vote away their freedoms willingly. From the looks of this thread, it seems that liberals don't even realize they are voting away their freedoms willingly. Because I can't imagine that someone would vote liberal despite knowing that they would be willingly voting away their freedoms. So, my intention for writing this thread, was to get in touch with the ones who are aware that by voting liberal they are willingly voting their freedoms away, and I was wondering why they would want to do that.


But if I vote republican then women may lose the right to be pro choice.



posted on May, 22 2014 @ 09:46 PM
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a reply to: smithjustinb


By voting conservative, you're voting for someone who at least advertises that they will protect your rights.


I don't believe them!!!!!!!


There are tons of issues on the table and ATM the conservative party is the antiscience party and that has been a dealbreaker for me before.

I would love to see another Reagan, but ATM he would be considered a RHINO. He did some nasty business with the Iran Contra thing, but I would take him over any of the recent yahoos. The problem is the conservative party seems to have gone bats%$t crazy in recent years doubling down on the very same things that made them lose the elections.

That has been the past trend with that party I am hoping they find someone worth my vote next big election. Localy though I am torn I liked Crist when he was a republican and Scott has been OK minus some stuff that was off the wall so it is to soon to tell.

Bottom line is if the conservative party wants to win an election they need to do a hell of a lot better than they hae been doing finding candidates. If it wasn't for that bat[snip] crazy Palin then McCain would have had my vote but Romney just wasn't going to cut it no matter what.
edit on 22-5-2014 by Grimpachi because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 22 2014 @ 09:52 PM
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a reply to: smithjustinb



By voting conservative, you're voting for someone who at least advertises that they will protect your rights.

And politicians never lie do they? They will tell you what you want to hear to get your vote. Anyone that has been paying attention since the 80's should be smart enough to know there is no difference between the parties. If you are not wealthy you mean nothing to them because you are nothing to them.



posted on May, 22 2014 @ 09:53 PM
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a reply to: smithjustinb

If funny that the leftist like to compare America to Germany n Sweden. Yet America spends a larger percentage n money on social programs then those countries. We have gone too far left that even some republicans find themselves on the left without knowing it.



posted on May, 22 2014 @ 10:00 PM
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a reply to: amfirst1

Try to keep in mind when you are comparing dollar amounts spent on programs by countries that you need to factor in the population densities. Otherwise, those numbers are meaningless.



posted on May, 22 2014 @ 10:02 PM
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originally posted by: smithjustinb
Lets keep it civil here. I'm genuinely interested in why liberals choose that political affiliation.

I see liberal ideology as one that is against individual sovereignty and freedom. This is how it gets represented by the legislators who claim to be liberal. I see liberalism as a progressive agenda who's means of attaining a "better America" involve the introduction of legislation upon legislation until there are so many laws that people can hardly breathe without breaking the law or without being taxed. Everything that a liberal claims to "accomplish" seems to be an act that violates the bill of rights in one aspect or another.

So, why do people support a political agenda that consistently violates our freedom?

Don't you know that all revolutions and uprisings are about the people wanting to be free? Eventually, if liberals have their way, America is going to become a country where the people are going to revolt because they've lost their freedom. Why not just put a stop to it now, and stop voting liberal?

Freedom is the greatest thing a person can have, imo. That's why I can't understand why people support a political agenda that consistently takes that away. Why do you support it?


would have made it easier if you would have posted some examples.

for example, i know conservatives are pro-pollution because they are anti-epa and pollution regulation.
i know conservatives are anti-poor because they would rather starve the poor by cutting their foodstamps while giving billions to people that make more in a day than many make in a year.
i know conservatives say they love the troops, yet just this feb they blocked a vets health bill.
i know conservatives base their decisions on fear because studies show their fear centers are larger and they perceive threats where none exist.

see, thats how you should have posted.

btw, feel free to counter my examples.



posted on May, 22 2014 @ 10:02 PM
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a reply to: smithjustinb

But your conclusion is not only generalized but WRONG.

i'll quote you to prove the hypocrisy:


I'm not going to defend every republican who ever lived. I'm not going to sit here and say that those who claim to be republican do no wrong.


and


I am going to say that there is a better chance that your rights will not be infringed if you vote republican. Im not saying your rights won't be infringed.


Lastly:


By voting conservative, you're voting for someone who at least advertises that they will protect your rights.


Everything you've said above I could say about liberals and it would be JUST AS TRUE.

The key word here is ADVERTISED. You're being lied to as much as the next liberal is, you're just too ideologically blind to realize it.

You've provided no evidence of your claims, just hyperbole and opinion.

Mind you I don't subscribe to either ideology. I'm more of a social libertarian, fiscal conservative.

~Tenth


edit on 5/22/2014 by tothetenthpower because: (no reason given)

edit on 5/22/2014 by tothetenthpower because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 22 2014 @ 10:09 PM
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originally posted by: smithjustinb

originally posted by: JaspersCheese
Can you give us some examples of what liberals claim to have accomplished?


Obamacare. (takes away freedom to choose to get health coverage).

Gun control. (if they had accomplished it would have taken away our ability to enforce our constitutional rights)

That's just a couple. There are many more.


edit: Ain't it interesting that the Canucks run here first?


seat belts took away your freedom to fly through the windshield.

total freedom is anarchy, and thats a very not good thing.

Why would that be interesting?



posted on May, 22 2014 @ 10:14 PM
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originally posted by: smithjustinb

originally posted by: ScientiaFortisDefendit

originally posted by: JohnnyCanuck
a reply to: smithjustinb
Let's try this, if you''re really interested:

“I’m proud to say I’m a liberal”: How conservatives vulgarized a term — and why the left must reclaim it FDR and JFK proudly called themselves "liberal" -- but then the right made it a slur. Why it must be embraced again

Salon

And just because I like props (but bear in mind I am a Canadian liberal)...



Your little propaganda graphic contains many lies, my friend. This is called 'revisionist history'. Do some homework.


I exposed those lies on page one. Its a long read, but I don't want anyone to over look it.


How did you 'expose' these lies? With a whole bunch of opinions? With some random quotes from Yahoo answers? I don't think that's going to make anyone sit up and say 'oh my God, I was wrong - I'm changing my affiliation to conservative immediately'.



posted on May, 22 2014 @ 10:15 PM
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a reply to: ScientiaFortisDefendit


Your little propaganda graphic contains many lies, my friend. This is called 'revisionist history'. Do some homework.


Please. Elucidate your protest? Which of those things didn't conservatives fight against?



posted on May, 22 2014 @ 10:16 PM
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originally posted by: smithjustinb

originally posted by: JohnnyCanuck
a reply to: smithjustinb
Let's try this, if you''re really interested:

“I’m proud to say I’m a liberal”: How conservatives vulgarized a term — and why the left must reclaim it FDR and JFK proudly called themselves "liberal" -- but then the right made it a slur. Why it must be embraced again

Salon

And just because I like props (but bear in mind I am a Canadian liberal)...



I just saw this on yahoo answers. Someone made my reply for me. Voted "Best Answer". Pretty much refutes every one of these claimed "accomplishments" and either shows that they are outright untrue or it exposes their weaknesses.


Let me start by making a few points about what you have written.
First, Social Security is the biggest ponzi scheme in the world. In less than 10 years, there will be 70 million baby-boomers that start collecting Social Security. Compare that with the fact that there will only be 125 million people in the workforce and we are looking at an enormous problem.
www.npg.org...

Second, Nasa was started under Eisenhower, who was a Republican.
en.wikipedia.org...

Medicare and Medicaid are all but broke, and are two of the entitlement programs that even Obama says are bankrupting the country.
www.washingtonpost.com...

The Clean Water Act was passed by Nixon (a Republican) in 1972.
en.wikipedia.org...

Anti-discrimination laws have been passed since 1871, and have been passed and enforced by both Republicans and Democrats.
en.wikipedia.org...
Furthermore most people agree that anti-discrimination laws like Affirmative Action do more to promote racism than nullify it.

The FDIC is part of the reason that the economy is in shambles right now- not to mention that the bailouts are happening because the FDIC is broke. If there were no Federal Reserve, there would be no need for an FDIC. Both are monstrosities of Economics.

Unemployment insurance is another scam by liberals that takes a fractional problem and turns it into a national problem. This is not an achievement. It is a scam.

And you are right that FDR helped win WWII, along with the help of Winston Churchill, who was a Conservative. Not to mention that FDR's isolationist stance let Germany take control of most of Europe before deciding to help...


OK now for Republican Achievements:
-I guess I can steal Nasa from you because it was created by Republicans.
-I guess I can steal the Clean Water Act from you because it was created by Republicans.
-Republicans freed the slaves.
-Republicans defeated the Soviets in the Cold War.
-Republicans ended Vietnam, which was started by Democrats.
-The Republicans in Congress went on to pass the nation’s first ever Civil Rights Act and I have a source to back it up.
www.politicalbase.com...
-Republicans passed the Constitutional Amendment that allowed Blacks to vote.
-Republicans passed the Constitutional Amendment that allowed women to vote.
-Republicans created the Tuskegee Institute
-Republicans repealed FDR's orders that Japanese Americans could be held, without habeas corpus, in internment camps


You want to give me thumbs down? Why don't you give me a source that refutes what I have written.
You want to rant and rave about how bad conservatives are and you will NEVER accept FACTS when they are right in your face.

For the record, I am NOT EVEN A REPUBLICAN. You need to stop spreading polarization and lies just because you can't accept facts that disprove the church of liberalism.

You are no different than a Creationist!


ah, silly rabbit, you just fell for the oldest trick in the book, confusing liberal and conservative with political party. you see, the republicans were the liberal party for quite some time. then they started the "southern strategy" and all the old, racist democrats of the south became republicans. thats when the parties switched ideology.



posted on May, 22 2014 @ 10:26 PM
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I skipped over this topic a few times because I didn't like the sound of "Mud-pit." But I'm wearing old, washable clothes. The OP offered the start of an interesting discussion, but it just couldn't be followed up on. There's been discussion over names and definitions, but really, isn't that a distraction?

From every source along the political spectrum, I hear that politics is becoming more polarized. Assuming that's true, then there are two sides, Liberal v. Conservative, or whatever other names you might have. There seems to be two questions here, what is the most clearly distinguishing belief, and why does the individual ATSer pick the side he has.

I'm hoping for correction from everybody, but my current opinion is that one side believes that decision making and control is best left in the hands of the few who have studied the issues through college and political experience. Through their abilities, they are more likely to make the correct decisions. This would include the pro-science v. anti-science discussion earlier. A form of meritocracy would emerge, making the "best and brightest" the controllers and deciders.

There are drawbacks to this position, including that it does not follow that the "best and brightest" make better decisions. Indeed, experience shows us that they tend to foul things up.

The other pole contains those who believe that decisions are best left in the hands of the people. The closer to the individual that the decision can be made, the better. This, of course, was the principle the country was started on. There are several reasons why I find this more appealing, but this position, too, has it's drawbacks. With everyone (or every town, county, or state) making their own decisions there are chances that they will reach the wrong decision for various reasons.

I don't find that persuasive. If one town makes a bad call, people can more easily change it than attempting to change a national law. Further, a town's mistake affects fewer people than a national mistake. Additionally, a town meeting gives everyone a say, while a Congressional hearing gives almost no one a say.

But rather than debate the merits in this post, I'd like to know if I've found the great dividing factor. If not, what do you think it is?



posted on May, 22 2014 @ 10:28 PM
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The original Liberalism of the 17th century declared the individual to be naturally free and beyond obligation to an unwanted government. The original liberalism is currently called "Classical Liberalism".

After a few generations, and the rise of democracy, the demagogues coopted the term liberal to mean freedom from want. Only a strong central government can supply freedom from want.

But as Thomas Jefferson wrote ": "A government big enough to give you everything you want, is a government big enough to take away everything you have."

The current use of the word liberal is almost the opposite of its original meaning.

The last indigenous classical liberals in the political system died of old age before World War One. In America, the last establishment classical liberal was William Graham Sumner, who died in 1910. World War One, which started in 1914, could not have happened under a laizzez-faire, classical liberal, individualistic, economic system.

Liberals confuse a guaranty of income with freedom.

edit on 22-5-2014 by Semicollegiate because: (no reason given)



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