It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

Group Preparing to Press Military for Atheist Chaplain

page: 2
9
<< 1    3  4  5 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on May, 12 2014 @ 02:47 PM
link   
a reply to: FlyersFan

From your source,


Asked for comment, the association referred FoxNews.com to its position in support of a prior bid to name a "humanist" chaplain.




posted on May, 12 2014 @ 02:48 PM
link   

originally posted by: aboyandhisdream
a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

Then why the hell do they get all bent out of shape when I bring it up? Or do they like to "cherry pick" too?


Only SOME atheists believe in spirituality. They do not all fit in a box.
I certainly cannot speak for the people you're talking to. Perhaps you should ask them.



posted on May, 12 2014 @ 02:48 PM
link   

originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic

originally posted by: seeker1963
But do they believe in Freedom and the Freedom of Speech?


The only thing atheists have in common is the lack of belief in a deity. So outside that, it's impossible to say what atheists as a group believe.



Grant you, Christianity is paying the price for their religion dictating government policies for years.


True, that.



However, how is this behavior any different?


They're not dictating anything. They're asking for equal treatment.


WOW! I think you and I finally agreed to a point on something!


But how about this?

How can they expect equal treatment without respecting those they are fighting against????

Respect for others beliefs goes a long way!



posted on May, 12 2014 @ 02:50 PM
link   
a reply to: Benevolent Heretic

It was a ridiculous post, I know, but you gotta admit it was funny! I see you smiling!



posted on May, 12 2014 @ 02:54 PM
link   

originally posted by: seeker1963
But how about this?

How can they expect equal treatment without respecting those they are fighting against????


I'm not sure what your question means. Atheists, in general, aren't "fighting against" anyone. Sure, you have your militant atheists who show their ass every chance they get, but most of us are respectful and decent people, who just want to get along.




Respect for others beliefs goes a long way!


See, I disagree with that. I respect people's right to believe what they want. I respect the RIGHT, but I cannot respect their beliefs, when those beliefs contradict my own. I don't have to respect your BELIEFS, but I DO respect your right to hold them.



posted on May, 12 2014 @ 03:01 PM
link   

originally posted by: Benevolent Heretic

originally posted by: seeker1963
But how about this?

How can they expect equal treatment without respecting those they are fighting against????


I'm not sure what your question means. Atheists, in general, aren't "fighting against" anyone. Sure, you have your militant atheists who show their ass every chance they get, but most of us are respectful and decent people, who just want to get along.




Respect for others beliefs goes a long way!


See, I disagree with that. I respect people's right to believe what they want. I respect the RIGHT, but I cannot respect their beliefs, when those beliefs contradict my own. I don't have to respect your BELIEFS, but I DO respect your right to hold them.


I think we can both agree that we also have "militant Christians"?

See that's what I am getting at. We have extremists in religion, politics, race, let's just run the gamut of every group out there why don't we?

The government knows that and both political parties uses it against us.

What's the difference of "Respecting a persons rights from respecting a persons beliefs"? Now your sounding like a lawyer! I don't care what anyone does or believes in as long as they are not hurting someone else in the name of what they believe in.

What's the difference if they are not hurting you or your family?
edit on 12-5-2014 by seeker1963 because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 12 2014 @ 03:07 PM
link   

originally posted by: seeker1963
I think we can both agree that we also have "militant Christians"?

See that's what I am getting at. We have extremists in religion, politics, race, let's just run the gamut of every group out there why don't we?


Absolutely!



The government knows that and both political parties uses it against us.


Absolutely!



What's the difference of "Respecting a persons rights from respecting a persons beliefs"?


Here's an analogy: Let's say I'm a mother of a 22 year old girl. She announces she's going to be married (to a guy I cannot stand). I support and respect her decision, but I don't love the guy. I can't say I respect HIM, but I respect her decision.

I should have been a lawyer, but alas...



I don't care what anyone does or believes in as long as they are not hurting someone else in the name of what they believe in.


We agree on so much today! Is there a conspiracy here? LOL
edit on 5/12/2014 by Benevolent Heretic because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 12 2014 @ 03:10 PM
link   
a reply to: FlyersFan

It sounds right on par to me. Not only do they take on ecclesiastical labels to define themselves, and play the church-invented role of the non-believer in the religious narrative, but it seems they also require other ecclesiastical institutions and honours as well.

All self-proclaimed atheists enjoy their own theology.
edit on 12-5-2014 by LesMisanthrope because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 12 2014 @ 03:11 PM
link   
a reply to: Benevolent Heretic


Here's an analogy: Let's say I'm a mother of a 22 year old girl. She announces she's going to be married (to a guy I cannot stand). I support and respect her decision, but I don't love the guy. I can't say I respect HIM, but I respect her decision.

I should have been a lawyer, but alas...


That answers my question, and yes! *sigh* I agree!

As far as you and I finally agreeing on something? I guess it just shows that if we can have enough discussion and be honest about it, we most likely as human beings find out we have much more in common than we think!


Not a conspiracy at all. I am just glad we were able to have a conversation and discover some things neither one of us had a clue we had in common!



posted on May, 12 2014 @ 03:14 PM
link   

originally posted by: HomerinNC
How about a 'nonreligious liaison' to handle the same things the Chaplains do, without subscribing to a particular belief system?

That would be the military psychologist. They already have those in place.



posted on May, 12 2014 @ 03:20 PM
link   
Ok, so athiests have their own "churches" now. They are demanding their own chaplains, and they are developing their own "prayers" to be delivered at Town Hall invocations.

They have all the trappings of religion.

At what point do we declare atheism another category of faith like all the others and stop letting them demand their way be the default in the public square, but insist that they have to share with all the rest? After all, apparently the lack of faith is now a faith the same as every other belief system in play as it seems to be adopting the trappings.



posted on May, 12 2014 @ 03:24 PM
link   
The thing is that the military already has secular counselors--psychiatrists, psychologists, financial, legal, family counseling, omnibudsman, and the good old fashioned "talk to your sergeant." That actually works...senior NCOs have seen it all and can provide good counsel.

In addition, chaplains are trained to and expected to listen to and advise atheists and those of all faiths and can give advise and support of a non-religious nature as well, so that's already covered too.

What we have here is what is known as "a solution in search of a problem" and is really just some real life trolling by malcontents.



posted on May, 12 2014 @ 03:26 PM
link   
a reply to: ketsuko
 





At what point do we declare atheism another category of faith like all the others and stop letting them demand their way be the default in the public square, but insist that they have to share with all the rest? After all, apparently the lack of faith is now a faith the same as every other belief system in play as it seems to be adopting the trappings.


I've declared them another category of faith long ago. "Lack of faith in deities" is rhetoric. They merely disagree with the propositions of theists, but for some reason call their disagreement "Lack of faith in deities", assuming there is such a thing as a deity to lack faith in.

They are theologists with a different opinion, nothing more. They have enough faith in their own opinions.


"The study of theology, as it stands in Christian churches, is the study of nothing; it is founded on nothing; it rests on no principles; it proceeds by no authorities; it has no data; it can demonstrate nothing; and it admits of no conclusion. Not anything can be studied as a science, without our being in possession of the principles upon which it is founded; and as this is the case with Christian theology, it is therefore the study of nothing."

Thomas Pain

edit on 12-5-2014 by LesMisanthrope because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 12 2014 @ 03:30 PM
link   

originally posted by: ketsuko
Ok, so athiests have their own "churches" now. They are demanding their own chaplains, and they are developing their own "prayers" to be delivered at Town Hall invocations.

They have all the trappings of religion.

At what point do we declare atheism another category of faith like all the others and stop letting them demand their way be the default in the public square, but insist that they have to share with all the rest? After all, apparently the lack of faith is now a faith the same as every other belief system in play as it seems to be adopting the trappings.


Dunno about that. From where I'm sitting, it looks like atheists just want to feel as special as any theist group. Maybe if Christians/Catholics/Mormons weren't all about being treated on a different level than the rest of society, atheists wouldn't be so hellbent on making a point.



posted on May, 12 2014 @ 03:31 PM
link   

originally posted by: FlyersFan
That would be the military psychologist. They already have those in place.


I wasn't aware that a psychologist was trained to counsel in moral, ethical and spiritual matters.



posted on May, 12 2014 @ 03:31 PM
link   

originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
a reply to: ketsuko
 





At what point do we declare atheism another category of faith like all the others and stop letting them demand their way be the default in the public square, but insist that they have to share with all the rest? After all, apparently the lack of faith is now a faith the same as every other belief system in play as it seems to be adopting the trappings.


I've declared them another category of faith long ago. "Lack of faith in deities" is rhetoric. They merely disagree with the propositions of theists, but for some reason call their disagreement "Lack of faith in deities", assuming there is such a thing as a deity to lack faith in.

They are theologists with a different opinion, nothing more. They have enough faith in their own opinions.



Then why do you not believe in unicorns and leprechauns? It's not like you can prove to me that there are none. I am not an atheist because "I have faith that there are no gods". I look around and see how people only believe in exactly those debatable entities which are convenient for them personally, and that tips me off right there. The universe is not so convenient as to cater to your tastes, Mr. Oh My God Wouldn't Do That. Oh really, so this god made the entire universe precisely according to your predesignated specifications? That mentality betrays the entire reason theism exists. So no, I don't "have faith in the nonexistence of a deity". I'm just far too aware of what mankind is willing to do to NOT face the facts.
edit on 12-5-2014 by AfterInfinity because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 12 2014 @ 03:38 PM
link   
a reply to: AfterInfinity

If that's what they think faith is all about, then they are missing the point.



posted on May, 12 2014 @ 03:41 PM
link   
a reply to: AfterInfinity




Then why do you not believe in unicorns and leprechauns? It's not like you can prove to me that there are none. I am not an atheist because "I have faith that there are no gods". I look around and see how people only believe in exactly those debatable entities which are convenient for them personally, and that tips me off right there. The universe is not so convenient as to cater to your tastes, Mr. Oh My God Wouldn't Do That. Oh really, so this god made the entire universe precisely according to your predesignated specifications? That mentality betrays the entire reason theism exists. So no, I don't "have faith in the nonexistence of a deity". I'm just far too aware of what mankind is willing to do to NOT face the facts.


I simply disagree with the proposition. I don't practice active "non-belief" as an atheist would. I don't consciously go out of my way to prove the non-existence of a nothing. Do you?



posted on May, 12 2014 @ 03:49 PM
link   

originally posted by: LesMisanthrope
I don't practice active "non-belief" as an atheist would.


LOL You crack me up!




I don't consciously go out of my way to prove the non-existence of a nothing. Do you?


I don't. I don't try to prove anything. I don't "practice an active non-belief"... But this "god" people talk about? (and the spaghetti monster, zombies, vampires, leprechauns, and fairies?) I don't believe in them. Being an atheist doesn't mean I'm trying to prove anything. It's just a label that lets people know where I'm coming from on the spiritual deity subject.

I'm also a woman, a wife, a dog-lover, an environmentalist, a gay advocate, a great cook and an artist. And an atheist. They are just words that describe who I am.



posted on May, 12 2014 @ 03:52 PM
link   
a reply to: LesMisanthrope


I simply disagree with the proposition. I don't practice active "non-belief" as an atheist would. I don't consciously go out of my way to prove the non-existence of a nothing. Do you?


As an exercise in critical thinking and rhetoric, I do enjoy it. Difficult questions, or even impossible ones, teach you how to solve problems. Even if you don't get the answer for one question, you are that much more ready to nail the next one. And if you ever face a philosophical conundrum in real life, then you know how to go about unraveling the tangles.

How is "non-belief" an active practice? I don't go around saying "Godless this, Godless that, all hail atheism!" If there's a prayer at a meal, I quietly abstain while contemplating my personal reasons for being thankful. If there is a discussion about Jesus, I might ask a question or two, but I generally abstain from those as well. If I do discuss it, it's as a fictional piece whose characters represent intriguing elements of an outdated philosophy whose components we observe in today's society, much like the Egyptians or the Vikings.

But I'm not a "practicing Atheist". I am an atheist. My beliefs are atheist in nature, because I have been given absolutely no scientifically corroborated evidence to suspect that there's a better chance of a god existing than there is of one not existing. It makes a good story, but so does Harry Potter and Lord of the Rings. And as much as I'd love to regard such tales as historical or nonfiction, I cannot. I cannot lie to myself like that. If I must live, I will live the truth, because anything less and I might as well just go to sleep until I die.



new topics

top topics



 
9
<< 1    3  4  5 >>

log in

join