US plans death camp

THE US has floated plans to turn Guantanamo Bay into a death camp, with its own death row and execution chamber.

Prisoners would be tried, convicted and executed without leaving its boundaries, without a jury and without right of appeal, The Mail on Sunday newspaper reported yesterday.

The plans were revealed by Major-General Geoffrey Miller, who is in charge of 680 suspects from 43 countries, including two Australians.

news.com.au...

OMG. Things keep getting worse and worse dont they.

I am not in denial of what has been reported, just how it was done. Maybe not everyone here agrees with Thomas and I, but it is our opinion that the shadow government that we supposedly have is not native to our land. In fact that shadow government that casts a dark gloom over our beautiful land is really none other than the Cabal that is based in London.

I don't want to make this about the Cabal, but I would like to point out the obvious propaganda ploy in this piece. In that news clip they made every effort possible to exlude British involvement, all the while this whole operation is most likely coming from their shores. I seriously doubt that it is in the interests of any sane individual to want kill these terrorists without proper and due justice. For these men are more important that any other criminal out there. Why is that???

Well because un-like all the other criminals out there, terrorists are a target of our military. We have declared a 'war on terrorism'. So these people we have in X-ray are warriors. They should be treated like prisoners of war. They should be used for their intel and for their assets. They can be more useful than any other prisoners we have out there in this world. So why have such an urgent need to do away with their lives???

Why else would we want them dead so quickly unless we had something to hide. Doesn't it seem strange that the military is in such a desperate need to kill these harmless men???

For what could these men possibly being doing that is so bad???

Why is it so neccasary to kill these men???

Regardless of their crimes they should be used to find the others. If there are even any others at all.



Abraham

[Edited on 26-5-2003 by Abraham Virtue]

That's a bit harsh AV.

The Mail On Sunday is a right wing tabloid newspaper. I wouldn't take anything that they say to be the truth.
They were very unreliable during the Iraq conflict and many of their stories turned out to be false. I'm not saying that the report is false but please bear in mind that this IS the tabloid media.

And as for blaming everything on us Brits? Dude, we're just your diplomatic mouthpiece. We have more experience of diplomacy so sometimes we're just the guys who leak the news. It sounds better to the rest of the world coming from us.

There is something absolutely wrong with this picture. Have the prisoners of war in Cuba even been granted a trial yet? How about lawyers and all the other good stuff promised to us by the Constitution?

If they're going to off these prisoners without a trial they know something they shouldnt know.

There is something absolutely wrong with this picture. Have the prisoners of war in Cuba even been granted a trial yet? How about lawyers and all the other good stuff promised to us by the Constitution? Posted by Illmatic67

The problem with what you say is that these people are not US citizens, but "enemy combatants"... that means they can be held in "detention" indeffinitely, with no trial, no judicial review, no regard to any kind of human rights whatsoever. They can also be executed with no right to appeal whatsoever. And they will be.

Now, if you think that is a disturbing thought, stop and consider this: Thanks to a law stemming from WWII, which Bush is using, anyone proven to have any contacts with a foreign power can be claimed to be an "enemy combatant" (remember the US citizens who were found to have fought for Al Quaida in Afghanistan?), and are subject to the same lack of rights, trial, judicial review, and can be executed, in direct violation of the constitution, just like these guys...

Now, stop and wonder just who it is that makes the decision if you are an "enemy combatant" and what exactly the criteria is.... because there isnt any.

I am not labeling Britian as the nexus of evil. All I am saying is that assets of the Cabal are in great strength in England, London especially. That has nothing to do with the people of Britian, or of London for that matter.

My point is this:

That this so-called 'news' can't really be trusted because of the fact that we know that people in the Cabal like to start conflicts so to futher split and seperate the people in order to be better able to control them. The Cabal uses massive protests and uproars to it's own benefit. That is when they get to 'fix' everything so to speak.

All I am trying to point out is that this report has obvious attempts at covering something up. Making that something look neat and clean. What is that particular something???

Britian.

Am I right or am I wrong???

Now my point is this:

That something is not always going to be Britian. That something maybe very right-wing as you put it. But that doesn't matter to the Cabal. The Cabal has no limits. They know no boundries in the political spectrum. For they make the political spectrum. They don't have to worry about a party line. They draw those party lines.


You See???

This is set up to avoid bringing prisoners into the United States where they would then be protected under our judicial system. The military wants to avoid the bureacracy of our system. In addition, think about it.. if Saddam or osama is caught, do we want them tried in our system and this vermin to escape what's due them? (death).

BTW.. this is because of a lesson learned with Noriega.

Originally posted by ArcAngel
This is set up to avoid bringing prisoners into the United States where they would then be protected under our judicial system. The military wants to avoid the bureacracy of our system. In addition, think about it.. if Saddam or osama is caught, do we want them tried in our system and this vermin to escape what's due them? (death).

BTW.. this is because of a lesson learned with Noriega.

The US has already made it very clear that they will not seek the death penalty for these men. It is too much of a deathwish for these men. Both Bin Laden and Hussein want to be murdered by the West. They consider the West to be Satanist devil worshipers, so they welcome the martyrdom that would come. That is something that our men have considered when reviewing the circumstances upon capture and trial. They realize as the Israelis do with Arafat, that these men of terror want to be destroyed by the terror stoppers. They see that as their ultimate destiny, and all of these men have stated publicly that they will be avenged by the wrath of Allah upon the murder of their innocent souls by the foreign aggressors of Satan. They have all expressed those sentiments. Maybe not in the same fashion or tone, but in that same way they all wish to be killed. That will be their ultimate blessing and our ultimate downfall.

Do you understand???


Abraham

[Edited on 26-5-2003 by Abraham Virtue]

Hey AV. If the news report is true we have to break the news to our people. There is a very large population of Muslims here. They have whole communities of their own. Some of them like to riot now and again. We also have people as prisoners in Guantanemo Bay. We need to break the news gently to our Muslims, otherwise we will have major problems over here.

If it is true, and it was the US who broke the news and told the world, some people would be sorely p!ssed in this country. They would see the UK as a silent puppet unaware of what the US is doing behind it's back. In their minds it would make it look as bad as the US.
And we Brits are very, very vulnerable at this time.

If it is true. We broke the story because it was in our own national interest to do so.

dragonrider said:
The problem with what you say is that these people are not US citizens, but "enemy combatants"... that means they can be held in "detention" indeffinitely, with no trial, no judicial review, no regard to any kind of human rights whatsoever. They can also be executed with no right to appeal whatsoever. And they will be.

That's not exuse, just because their not American doesnt give us the right to treat them like dogs. I'm sure American prisoners in France get treated like French prisoners, get what I'm saying?

Originally posted by Illmatic67
dragonrider said:
The problem with what you say is that these people are not US citizens, but "enemy combatants"... that means they can be held in "detention" indeffinitely, with no trial, no judicial review, no regard to any kind of human rights whatsoever. They can also be executed with no right to appeal whatsoever. And they will be.

That's not exuse, just because their not American doesnt give us the right to treat them like dogs. I'm sure American prisoners in France get treated like French prisoners, get what I'm saying?

I am not challenging you, I am just not sure what you mean. Could you explain a little bit more. Cause I have heard that French prisons were some of the worst in the world. Then again I must have been listening to some French hating propagandist at the time, because I haven't ever been able to confirm this belief. Is it true???

The point is AV, that they get the same treatment.
It doesn't matter what the prison is like in this context.

Originally posted by Leveller
The point is AV, that they get the same treatment.
It doesn't matter what the prison is like in this context.

Exactly...

Just to let you know.




Sorry. I am ignorant of this.


So let us go back to the discussion, which would be where???

The point is equal treatment. If an American tourist in Europe or wherever gets arrested and put in prison, he should be treated like the prisoners from Europe. He shouldnt get unfair treatment just because he's an American in a foreign land, get what I mean?

The only thing that is not clear, is where this discussion should be headed???


Anyone got any thoughts?????

BTW--Thank you for clearing that up.

Has anyone tired to veryfy the source of this tabloid information in respect to an article???

I did try....

www.dailymail.co.uk...

www.seabirds.org...

www.mediauk.com...

www.thegameoftheirlives.com...

Leveller how long has the tabloid been in print?

That last link reminds me of Make cash online though the topic seems serious enough (Connie if your reading this I am just kidding)

This other one steals the show

www.peterhitchens.com...



[Edited on 27-5-2003 by Toltec]

That's not exuse, just because their not American doesnt give us the right to treat them like dogs. I'm sure American prisoners in France get treated like French prisoners, get what I'm saying? Posted by Illmatic67

Yes I do, and you are absolutely correct. Indeed, an "average" criminal from another country, arrested in the US is protected by the US constitution. However, in these circumstances, the administration is taking advantage of the fact that these people were NOT arrested on US territory, and as ArcAngel said, they DONT WANT them to set foot on US territory, where our laws would apply.

The term "enemy combatant" is very important here. Notice that they are not labeled as enemy soldiers or Prisoners of War, in which case they would be protected by the Geneva Convention. However, they still maintain the idea that these are people who have or are interested in performing hostile acts against the US.

Also, irrespective of if this is from a tabloid or not, the fact of the matter is that the US still has the legal ability to do this.

U.S. Circumvents Courts With Enemy Combatant Tag

(New York, June 12, 2002) President Bush's unilateral designation of Abdullah al-Mujahir as an "enemy combatant" creates a dangerous loophole that threatens basic criminal justice guarantees, Human Rights Watch said today.

www.hrw.org...

Casting fundamental constitutional guarantees aside, the Bush administration is pressing forward with its policy of detaining people indefinitely, and without charges or access to legal counsel, as part of its so-called war on terrorism. Despite growing opposition to its policy, the Bush administration is preparing to expand the practice by allocating additional cells in military prisons and camps for detainees, including US citizens.

www.wsws.org...

Originally posted by dragonrider

The term "enemy combatant" is very important here. Notice that they are not labeled as enemy soldiers or Prisoners of War, in which case they would be protected by the Geneva Convention. However, they still maintain the idea that these are people who have or are interested in performing hostile acts against the US.

The Geneva Convention is for the soldiers, not for the terrorists. A soldier is a man or a woman who belong to an official army. And that official army have to belong to an official nation.

A terrorist is *just* a criminal , not a soldier.