When the signs are there, why risk another school tragedy?

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posted on May, 6 2014 @ 01:32 PM
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This has had me fired up for some time now, but now, I'm afraid it is putting not just the woman I love at risk but others as well. Some people may think schools are being too hard on kids for making guns out of pop tarts or fingers and in some cases, perhaps. But # just got real for my girlfriend yesterday...

She works as a "behavioral specialist" in a charter school. She is assigned a student we will call "Max". Max is in 6th grade. Her job is to keep Max on task with his work, keep him from disrupting others, and from hurting himself or others.
So far this year he has been kicked off the bus twice, choked a student (she wasnt there that day), threatened two people with scissors, and cussed out teachers too many times to count. He has only had one suspension.

In the past two weeks he has become increasingly defiant. Playing first person shooters that he found a way around the security software to play. His parents were called in and his dad blamed the school for his behavior saying he should have been held back a year. His test scores have regressed from a fifth grade level to a second grade level because he doesn't have any consequences. Even when he ignores his work for a period and wanders around on all fours and meow like a cat until the bell rings, then he acts as if nothing happened.

Now we get to yesterday...Max gets special privileges like taking home tests that his classmates must do in the room. Instead of doing the work, he tore it into little pieces, then tore up his science book. The school has a policy that when that happens, he can stay, but the rest of the class has to leave the room! The last time about a month ago, they did just that, calls his parents who told them to deal with it. So they did and called the police. Still, no suspension, nothing. Yesterday, nothing...

But the teacher took away his math work only to find he had drawn stick figures of himself labelled with various guns and about a dozen other stick figures with names and x's for eyes and bullets flying into them. She emailed it to his mother who said "Sorry about the dirty pictures Max drew". Nothing more.

With the rampant school violence and an obviously disturbed individual who may have access to weapons...shouldn't this be a red flag? People could be in real danger. It's a charter school, no metal detectors, on duty cop (they have an unarmed crossing guard in the morning and afternoon)...
So yeah. Im ranting. If this were a public school, he would have been expelled by January. But not only is his ass in the seat cash, they also get bonus money from the government since he has been labelled as ADHD which he can turn on and off like a switch. It's been seen. When does profit overrule safety? If half of the parents who send their children there KNEW?

Curiously, he was absent today. His reward for drawing killing students and teachers by name, is to get to stay home and play Xbox.

Here is the ironic part, his mom is a "behavioral specialist" at the public school down the street.




posted on May, 6 2014 @ 01:35 PM
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So maybe his mom, who is trained, recognizes he is not a threat.

That perhaps what you see as signs of danger, are semi normal child hood cooping mechanisms.

Not some dire psychopathic time bomb waiting to go off?


ETA:

Children tend to act out abuse perpetrated against them on others, that would be my first thought on this child, That he is suffering. NOT that he is a murderer just waiting to happen.
edit on 6-5-2014 by benrl because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 01:45 PM
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Wow. Could this be seen or interpreted by an outsider as a sort of competition between the specialists? Are the parents in denial of the ADHD? Is the lad taking his meds daily? And I'm curious as to why his mom would call them dirty pictures while your girlfriend sees potential violence in them? I don't wish to sound judgemental, because I'm only trying to help you analyze the problem. There are obviously two interpretations of his behaviour, and it can only be solved if both are on the same page, imo. Wishing your girlfriend all the best. I don't envy her job one little bit.



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 01:46 PM
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If your girlfriend thinks Max is a threat to herself or others I believe she has a duty to inform the proper authorities (and I have no idea who that is).



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 01:52 PM
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My question is what SSRI is Max on? We all know he's on some kind of prescription mass-murder pill--just like all the other documented mass murder/antidepressent connections, so we should start there.

Stop medicating the hell out of healthy children and we'll stop seeing kids go berserk. It's a pretty simple equation to balance, but for the billion+ dollar profit variable of big pharma, which keeps shoveling pills down the throats of our children regardless the cost in ruined lives.
edit on 6-5-2014 by JonButtonIII because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 01:58 PM
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originally posted by: benrl
So maybe his mom, who is trained, recognizes he is not a threat.

That perhaps what you see as signs of danger, are semi normal child hood cooping mechanisms.

Not some dire psychopathic time bomb waiting to go off?


Mom is a basket case. During the meeting, they discussed holistic ways to deal with Maxs behavior and that two Tastykakes and a Sno-Ball might be a bit much processed junk. ( Mom tried to sneak him to a psychiatrist/neurologist who wanted to medicate him, but Dad refused) Dad replied indignantly "We dont have that in our house!" Max told his main specialist that mom hides them from dad to give to him for lunch.
Dad is abusive, mom tries to make up for her shortcomings with pies. But I have a copy of ONE OF THE TWO that he drew...and yes. I'm not quick to judge and I wished I could post it, but after all of the incidents. This is about as graphic as an artistically challenged sixth grader could draw in Tarantino fashion.
The problem is the charter school letting him run wild like a baboon for so long without repercussions for his actions. No consistency with the behavioral modification at home nor at school, much to my gfs chagrin.
edit on 6-5-2014 by the owlbear because: (no reason given)


Eta to respond to your eta:

That's why my girlfriend WANTS to help. She can see he craves attention so much to the point that even negative attention is still focused on himself as star of his own show. She desperately tried to get her bosses to do something to address his needs but show consistency in rewarding good behavior and disciplining the not so good...
edit on 6-5-2014 by the owlbear because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 01:59 PM
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a reply to: the owlbear




If this were a public school, he would have been expelled by January. - See more at: www.abovetopsecret.com...


Not so sure about that, public schools get cash for the seats too. My madre has been a vice principle at a middle school for some time now, takes A LOT to get a kid expelled, especially if he is special needs.

I agree the picture is disturbing, but all it is a picture.
It could be the only way this kid knows how to express his anger he has

Hopefully nothing comes of it tho



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 02:02 PM
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originally posted by: Sremmos80
a reply to: the owlbear




If this were a public school, he would have been expelled by January. - See more at: www.abovetopsecret.com...


Not so sure about that, public schools get cash for the seats too. My madre has been a vice principle at a middle school for some time now, takes A LOT to get a kid expelled, especially if he is special needs.

I agree the picture is disturbing, but all it is a picture.
It could be the only way this kid knows how to express his anger he has

Hopefully nothing comes of it tho


He has a history of violent behavior. Well documented. And he is escalating by the day. If it were the pictures alone you wouldn't have seen this.



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 02:04 PM
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originally posted by: Elton
If your girlfriend thinks Max is a threat to herself or others I believe she has a duty to inform the proper authorities (and I have no idea who that is).


She has informed her boss, the head councillor.
That's all she can do.



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 02:06 PM
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originally posted by: JonButtonIII
My question is what SSRI is Max on? We all know he's on some kind of prescription mass-murder pill--just like all the other documented mass murder/antidepressent connections, so we should start there.

Stop medicating the hell out of healthy children and we'll stop seeing kids go berserk. It's a pretty simple equation to balance, but for the billion+ dollar profit variable of big pharma, which keeps shoveling pills down the throats of our children regardless the cost in ruined lives.


None.
His father refused to allow a psychiatrist/neurologist specializing in pediatrics to young adults prescribe anything.
Sometimes people are just rage monsters.



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 02:13 PM
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a reply to: the owlbear

Oh, then I guess I would suggest if you both think violence is likely that she should find a new job.


Crappy advice, but if her coworkers do not take it seriously then I don't see much alternative...



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 02:28 PM
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a reply to: the owlbear

Mankind has a history of violent behavior. Well documented, escalating day by day.

He is special needs, he probably gets very frustrated and that is the only way he can express him self.
Don't think that that is the warnings of a kid getting ready to shoot up the school or cause great bodily harm to the school

I understand the concern, just think this kid might be getting a very unfair label.

Hope the best for your friend and that nothing happens to her
edit on thTue, 06 May 2014 14:29:11 -0500America/Chicago520141180 by Sremmos80 because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 02:31 PM
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originally posted by: Elton
a reply to: the owlbear

Oh, then I guess I would suggest if you both think violence is likely that she should find a new job.


Crappy advice, but if her coworkers do not take it seriously then I don't see much alternative...


She was offered other students when his behavior began to escalate. But she was afraid that would upset him more. Luckily, only a month or so of school left. Thank you for the concern. I appreciate it.



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 02:32 PM
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a reply to: Elton

It's not crappy advice. At a certain point you need to exit the situation. Seems to me she did the right thing so far. She alerted her supervisors. If they are not going to pay attention, then they are putting everyone, staff and students alike, in jeopardy. You don't want to prove this by being a statistic. Perhaps part of her exit strategy should be to document this behavior in a letter to a primary school authority--or several--as she left, registered mail. At that point I really think she has fulfilled any obligation she may have to alert people to the situation.
edit on 5/6/2014 by schuyler because: (no reason given)



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 02:38 PM
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I'm somewhat dumbfounded over this story. You state the mother is also employed as a behavior specialist at a different school yet is a basketcase when dealing with her own son? She would be able to analyze him better than anyone. Unless she is in complete denial over the situation which would call her professional ability into question,I'm sure. Does she get hostility from colleagues over her son's acting out? As for the father...you would think being married to someone in that profession would make him more receptive and open to additional help,both he and his wife actually. I cannot even understand why a child with so many extra "needs",is not getting the help he requires. Agreed with the above post that drugging him is not the answer and I would seek naturopathic help for possible vitamin deficiencies as well as some type of psychological/ behavior therapy. Obviously whatever they are doing isn't working. Ever think he acts out and draws disturbing pictures because he is screaming for help and nobody is listening?



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 02:53 PM
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a reply to: the owlbear

I worked for many years with exactly the kind of kids you described and I'm sorry but if your GF feels uncomfortable then that isn't the job for her. It's ok bc it's a hard job and not everyone is cut out for it. The kid needs behavioral therapy. These are cases where in my state, if parents keep refusing treatment the state steps in. He might actually benefit from a residential program. Most of the kids I worked with came to us as early teens or Tweens just as growth spurts and puberty sets in bc that's when they get too out of hand for parents to handle, and if the parents did a poor job of control behavior when they're small they definitely won't be able to handle a hormone raging teen with behavior issues.

These things can be worked out fairly quickly with the appropriate behavior plan. My program averaged 3-6 months and was highly successful.

This kid will end up either in trouble or locked up if nothing is done. Negative attention seeking behavior doesn't just go away in these kids without being addressed.

All that said, I highly doubt you have a mass shooter on your hands. I can see how you might think that, but you would have aid the same about most of the kids I worked with and they were WAY worse than this kid.

I hope your GF cares enough to advocate for the child and try to get him the help he needs but like I said, if it's too much then she really does need to get out of that job.

Good luck.



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 02:55 PM
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a reply to: benrl

Read your response on your post about SSRIS...

I dont think it is being reactionary, but I appreciate your honesty and concern. The strange thing is, my girlfriend is so concerned because she cares about the well-being of this child and is afraid of what may come if this pattern continues unabated. His future (and perhaps that of others if he takes the next step) is in serious jeopardy unless he is reigned in and allowed the help he needs.
Just talked to her. Rumor has it Mom is taking off with him and his sister to Florida and leaving Dad. I hope for the best for everyone. Btw. Great thread. It's refreshing to see someone give an objective question to ponder and the responses have been quite informative and diverse.



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 02:59 PM
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a reply to: the owlbear


Even when he ignores his work for a period and wanders around on all fours and meow like a cat until the bell rings, then he acts as if nothing happened.


that is the key quote of this entire farce - and the solution to it



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 03:38 PM
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a reply to: SilverStarGazer

It's not that she feels uncomfortable...far from it. Her concern lies with the student and the rest of the students trying to learn.

I told her I posted this up on ATS and she was glad that I did. She loves outside input. She also told me that all of her accounts of his behavior which I told her to document (for her own safety, my ex is a teacher's union rep) were sent to among other people a worker for the county with the juvenile criminal justice department after he tried to stab someone with scissors (the FIRST time, there was another), he sat in on one of the many meetings and laughed and looked her in the eyes, after interviewing the kid, and said "I'm sorry...I get paid a lot more to deal with less. Looks like I'll be seeing him soon."
Luckily, the parents of the child who was stabbed didnt peruse charges. So, no. This isn't overreacting. We need to know if this kid has access to firearms, he's too small to stab someone.



posted on May, 6 2014 @ 04:03 PM
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a reply to: the owlbear

I can get that one. I'm not teacher or anything but one of my youngest's classmates is an actual diagnosed psychopath and he's a neighbor. He was still a toddler when he killed an entire litter. I love children but I can honestly that this kid scares the crap out of me. He's intensely manipulative and clearly believes that he is superior to everyone. I'm grateful for the fact that his parents know what is wrong with him and take measures. His mother is a train wreck. His dad is attentive but strict. I'll never forget the day that he was standing in my home and told me point blank that he wished I was his mother, which frightens me but also tells me that he doesn't detect my concerns over him. I'm doing a good job. I would like him to not be anywhere near my family, especially after he decided to target my son one night in an attempt to show how superior he was to my son. At the same time, I also have this awareness that his esteem for me makes it so that I have to be very cautious. Considering his life is tumultuous, having another stable person in it is probably a good thing.

I can totally relate to her fears. Child services did remove him from his home due to his mother for a good long while and that year was really, really nice. It's hard when you both love children but are confronted with a child with clearly scary issues. Takes nerves of steel. I'm both sorry and glad that your wife is there for this child.





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